Topic: Va. House Approves Ban on Smoking
nogames39's photo
Wed 02/11/09 10:02 AM


The thing that bugs me is non-smokers (and ANTI-smokers) whining that they are "forced" to inhale smoke. Well, what's preventing THEM from going somewhere else? Why is the smoker the "bad guy", and forced to leave? Is the person who doesn't smoke somehow better than the one who does?

Seems awfully one-sided to me.



The majority of Americans do not smoke. Why should a minority interest such as smokers decide this issue. Havings there own place to smoke is not discrimination but reasonable accomodation.



No, it is not.

An accommodation is done freely. This, is simply a fascism, and you are happy, because currently, you are happen to be staying above the trench with a gun, and not otherwise. It is only the minority. You see, you must execute some minority first, before you can look at your work and see that it had reached a majority.

nogames39's photo
Wed 02/11/09 10:05 AM
singmesweet,

Then it isn't a nice change.

I hope VA smokers have some self respect and will go to bars less. Just like some did in California.

Mr_Music's photo
Wed 02/11/09 10:06 AM
Edited by Mr_Music on Wed 02/11/09 10:07 AM
The majority of Americans do not smoke. Why should a minority interest such as smokers decide this issue. Havings there own place to smoke is not discrimination but reasonable accomodation.


The majority of Americans are not gay, either, so why do THEY get to demand any rights, AND are listened to? Also, your "reasonable accomodation" will last only as long as it takes to have it overthrown, and you know it. Your argument holds no water.

WarElephant's photo
Wed 02/11/09 10:11 AM
Tyranny at its finest.

no photo
Wed 02/11/09 10:14 AM

singmesweet,

Then it isn't a nice change.

I hope VA smokers have some self respect and will go to bars less. Just like some did in California.


If they choose not to go to a bar because they canot freely smoke in any area of the bar, rather than smoking in the designated area, that's their choice.

It hasn't affected business in neighboring states around here.

Giocamo's photo
Wed 02/11/09 12:34 PM
Edited by Giocamo on Wed 02/11/09 12:35 PM
drinker

I am a non-smoker and have always been a non-smoker.

I think these laws are crap!

Smoking is a legal activity that consenting and now surely informed (you'd have to be living under a rock to not understand the possible dangers of smoking) adults may choose to engage in.

Please don't give me that crap about second hand smoke. If the government really cared about environmental dangers (second hand smoke is an environmental danger) to adults and children they'd be much more worried about cleaning up industrial pollutants in the food supply, air and water than second hand smoke.

These laws are just another case of parent government imposing it's will on a citizenry they figure is too stupid (humm maybe we are) to take care of themselves.

Do smokers cost the rest of us more money in health care? Perhaps but following that logic so do over weight persons, drug users and drinkers. Bet many are thinking...well that's fine they should stop that too. But follow it some more and so do people with genetic dispositions to cancer, people who have more than one child, people who are chronically ill...the list goes on.

I cannot wait till the government decides to legislate against all those things too under the guise of "protecting us" There might be some howling then but gosh...what will there be to point to? This issue...the first step (okay maybe not the first) on the slippery slope to the government managing our private lives in our own best interest (sarcasm on) for the financial benefit of our employers and insurers.

People sitting back taking this and worse yet being happy about it makes me more ill than someone lighting up to smoke while I am eating. (Rude)



drinker drinker drinker drinker drinker drinker drinker drinker drinker drinker ...and not to mention a little thing called " private property rights "...

nogames39's photo
Wed 02/11/09 07:09 PM


If they choose not to go to a bar because they canot freely smoke in any area of the bar, rather than smoking in the designated area, that's their choice.


Yeah? How would you like them to force you to breathe smoke by law?



It hasn't affected business in neighboring states around here.


In Kali, many bar owners wish they could have some property rights, right about now, seeing their business going down the drain.


...and not to mention a little thing called " private property rights "...


There is no such thing in socialism. All these "free people" who can't stand smoke, just can't voice their dislike to a bar owner, prompting him to make a private decision. If they did that, then there definitely would be non-smoking bars to accomodate the demand. But then again, that would be freedom. We can't have that.

So, they go to the mommy state and make a law.

no photo
Thu 02/12/09 05:33 AM

Yeah? How would you like them to force you to breathe smoke by law?


In the past, if any non-smoker wanted to go to a bar around here, you couldn't do it without sitting there and not breathing in smoke. Sure, we had the "choice" to go to a non-smoking place, but where were they? There weren't any. Of course, it was a choice for me to go out, though. Just like it's a choice for the smokers to go out.


In Kali, many bar owners wish they could have some property rights, right about now, seeing their business going down the drain.


A smoking ban in Maryland and DC had been passed a while ago. Not much has changed, since then.

nogames39's photo
Thu 02/12/09 09:37 AM

In the past, if any non-smoker wanted to go to a bar around here, you couldn't do it without sitting there and not breathing in smoke. Sure, we had the "choice" to go to a non-smoking place, but where were they? There weren't any. Of course, it was a choice for me to go out, though. Just like it's a choice for the smokers to go out.


First of all, you always had a right to complain to an owner. But you never did respect the owner. To you, he is nothing, but the government, is everything. You wanted the people with guns to come and force everyone to what you want.

Secondly, no, it isn't the same.
Before, it wasn't by law that you had to smoke in a bar. People just chose to.

Now, thanks to folks like you, who just can't live with others in peace, there is a law. There is no more choice.


A smoking ban in Maryland and DC had been passed a while ago. Not much has changed, since then.


The reason that the country is in dire straits, is because of folks like you. I don't want to go as far as to suggest that you desire to ruin the united states.

However, it is precisely the removal of choice in every matter, be it employment or entertainment, consumption or production, that is tightening the rope around this country's neck.

What you do not realize, is that in absolute, when you force everyone to live as you like, it is going to be only you left there to live. Everyone else will be forced of this planet, so that you can fully enjoy it the way you like.

no photo
Thu 02/12/09 09:38 AM


In the past, if any non-smoker wanted to go to a bar around here, you couldn't do it without sitting there and not breathing in smoke. Sure, we had the "choice" to go to a non-smoking place, but where were they? There weren't any. Of course, it was a choice for me to go out, though. Just like it's a choice for the smokers to go out.


First of all, you always had a right to complain to an owner. But you never did respect the owner. To you, he is nothing, but the government, is everything. You wanted the people with guns to come and force everyone to what you want.

Secondly, no, it isn't the same.
Before, it wasn't by law that you had to smoke in a bar. People just chose to.

Now, thanks to folks like you, who just can't live with others in peace, there is a law. There is no more choice.


A smoking ban in Maryland and DC had been passed a while ago. Not much has changed, since then.


The reason that the country is in dire straits, is because of folks like you. I don't want to go as far as to suggest that you desire to ruin the united states.

However, it is precisely the removal of choice in every matter, be it employment or entertainment, consumption or production, that is tightening the rope around this country's neck.

What you do not realize, is that in absolute, when you force everyone to live as you like, it is going to be only you left there to live. Everyone else will be forced of this planet, so that you can fully enjoy it the way you like.


You do realize smoking bans are a worldwide thing, right? Not just a US thing.

nogames39's photo
Thu 02/12/09 09:48 AM
Edited by nogames39 on Thu 02/12/09 09:48 AM


You do realize smoking bans are a worldwide thing, right? Not just a US thing.


Yeah, so is murder and rape. What does that mean for us?

nogames39's photo
Thu 02/12/09 09:53 AM

Q: What prevented you from not visiting those places where owner didn't restrain his smoking patrons?

A: Nothing. I had the choice of whether to go or not. Just like the smokers have a choice of whether to go or not.


See, you just don't want to discuss anything. Are you going to keep repeating the same over and over until I am tired? Even here, where you come supposedly to talk, you prefer to simply have it your way, no matter what, be it right or wrong.

I asked you a simple question. You answer it and immediately turn it over to suggest that the situation didn't change. But it did. There was no physical force before. Now, there is. The treat of violence that you approve.

Nobody was forced to smoke, before.

Everybody is forced not to smoke now.

You simply reserved the restaurants and bars for yourself.

no photo
Thu 02/12/09 10:03 AM
Edited by becca777 on Thu 02/12/09 10:31 AM
This is ridiculous
the fact is that smoking IS bad
whether you smoke it from the stick
inhale it second hand
or even off the clothes of smokers
the ban is good
and i also agree that it should be the smokers who are forced to go elsewhere to smoke.
non smokers don't increase cancer risks nor do they increase the risk of death or heart disease.
it doesn't matter what the initial arguments were to GET the bans enforced.
and it doesn't matter that they infringe on the 'rights' of smokers.
i smoked....quit 6 years ago...best think i ever did. hardest too.

BUT when i DID smoke i respected others around me and would again if need be.

*sits back and covers head waiting for the lashes*

no photo
Thu 02/12/09 10:03 AM
Edited by becca777 on Thu 02/12/09 10:03 AM
oops
double post

WarElephant's photo
Thu 02/12/09 10:30 AM
Telling people what they can or can't do is an abuse of government power. Banning smoking opens the door for banning drinking, etc.

And don't anyone DARE come in and say "that would never happen," because history proves you wrong.

no photo
Thu 02/12/09 10:32 AM
maybe that's why the laws about drinking are getting tighter also

spkeck's photo
Thu 02/12/09 10:36 AM

This is ridiculous
the fact is that smoking IS bad
whether you smoke it from the stick
inhale it second hand
or even off the clothes of smokers
the ban is good
and i also agree that it should be the smokers who are forced to go elsewhere to smoke.
non smokers don't increase cancer risks nor do they increase the risk of death or heart disease.
it doesn't matter what the initial arguments were to GET the bans enforced.
and it doesn't matter that they infringe on the 'rights' of smokers.
i smoked....quit 6 years ago...best think i ever did. hardest too.

BUT when i DID smoke i respected others around me and would again if need be.

*sits back and covers head waiting for the lashes*


ur right smoking cigarettes is bad for you. so you shoudl respect others around you. but it should no be banned. if people want to smoke they should be allowed to, in their car, in a bar where smoking is permitted- and a sign to let people know if u dont like smoking- dont ****ing come in and start complaining go to a bar where there is none.

i dont smoke cigarettes anymore either because theyre bad for you, but ****, they dont ban alcohol and thats bad for you.

and it doesn't matter that they infringe on the 'rights' of smokers.---- it always matters when you infringe on the rights of others- ALWAYS.

no photo
Thu 02/12/09 10:40 AM
Edited by becca777 on Thu 02/12/09 10:40 AM
in a bar where smoking is permitted- and a sign to let people know if u dont like smoking- dont ****ing come in and start complaining go to a bar where there is none.


all bars, all restaurants, basically any public place ...
i honestly don't think it's such a bad thing

are there smokers that are SO addicted that they can't wait to smoke until they get some place away from others?

spkeck's photo
Thu 02/12/09 10:42 AM

in a bar where smoking is permitted- and a sign to let people know if u dont like smoking- dont ****ing come in and start complaining go to a bar where there is none.


all bars, all restaurants, basically any public place ...
i honestly don't think it's such a bad thing

are there smokers that are SO addicted that they can't wait to smoke until they get some place away from others?


yes there are smokers like that lol. how much do u get out?
what im saying is, if a bar decides it wants to allow smoking it should be up to the owner, and if u dont like it then go to a bar where the owner doesnt allow it- and if there isnt- ur **** out of luck

no photo
Thu 02/12/09 10:46 AM
nah...i'd agree with the 'designated rooms' for smokers, but not the whole place.

in NY you can still smoke in the 'members only' bars, i've been there a few times and feel like i've smoked a pack myself.
are there still places in VA that allow this also?