Topic: Could Israel Be Charged With War Crimes? | |
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Could Israel Be Charged With War Crimes?
By Mel Frykberg, IPS News. Posted January 7, 2009. The repeated bombing of clearly marked civilian buildings is a flagrant violation of international law. RAMALLAH, Jan 7 (IPS) -- Israel has committed war crimes and should be prosecuted in an international court, says Raji Sourani, head of the Palestinian Center for Human Rights (PCHR) in Gaza. "The repeated bombing of clearly marked civilian buildings, where civilians were sheltering, crosses several red lines in regard to international law," Sourani told IPS. Palestinian Authority (PA) delegate to Britain Professor Manuel Hassassian has said the PA will launch legal proceedings against Israeli leaders it says are responsible for war crimes in Gaza, according to a Palestinian news report. Another 22 Palestinians were killed Wednesday morning in bombing and shelling as Israel's Operation Cast Lead entered day 11. The dead included four people killed in the shelling of a children's playground near a mosque in the Sheikh Radwan neighborhood of Gaza city. Six Israelis were treated for shock as several rockets from Gaza hit Israel. Hassassian's comment came in the wake of Israeli shelling of a UN school in Jabaliya refugee camp Tuesday afternoon which killed over 40 Palestinians. Several other UN schools in the Gaza Strip were also hit in the last few days, resulting in a number of casualties. The UN called for an investigation, stating that prior to the current operation the Israelis were given the precise coordinates of all UN institutions in Gaza. The International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) has already condemned an Israeli attack on two members of the Palestinian Red Crescent (PRC) last week. The ICRC said the medics were wearing fluorescent jackets, their ambulances were clearly marked, and their flashing lights were on. Nihal Al-Akras, chairman of the Palestinian Health Care Committees, asked the international community to pressure Israel to stop firing on medical facilities and workers in the Gaza Strip. Akhras's comments followed Tuesday's bombing of the Ad-Dura hospital in the Rimal neighbourhood of Gaza city. Three mobile clinics provided by a Danish NGO, DanChurchAid, were also destroyed. "We've been able to help the wounded and suffering so far because our vehicles have been present and ready inside Gaza. This possibility of emergency aid is now in ruins," said Henrik Stubkjær, secretary general of DanChurchAid. "We are deeply shocked that the Israeli air strikes directly prevent the humanitarian aid effort," he added. According to DanChurchAid the clinics were clearly marked with red crosses and were parked in the Union of Healthcare headquarters. "One Palestinian doctor and three medics have been killed during Israel's bombing campaign which began on December 27," Sammy Hassan, spokesman for Gaza's Shifa Hospital told IPS. While Israel has denied that it deliberately targets civilians, reading between the lines of reports in the Israeli media and admissions by military leaders would suggest that the lives of Palestinian civilians are secondary to saving Israeli soldiers. Several senior Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) officers have admitted that the IDF strategy is to use tremendous firepower on the ground to protect Israeli soldiers during fighting in civilian areas, a senior officer explained to journalists on Tuesday. "For us, being cautious means being aggressive," said one officer. "From the minute we entered, we've acted like we're at war. That creates enormous damage on the ground. "When we suspect that a Palestinian fighter is hiding in a house, we shoot it with a missile and then with two tank shells, and then a bulldozer hits the wall. It causes damage but it prevents the loss of life among soldiers." The IDF suffered significant military casualties during the 2006 Lebanon war, and the top brass realized that a repeat of this would erode public morale and the country's political will. The Israeli cabinet took all this into account prior to the ground operation into Gaza. Additionally, limited global reaction -- due to the lack of international media on the ground in Gaza following an Israeli ban -- to several of the more serious incidents of civilian casualties has emboldened Israel to a certain degree. Even during the Lebanon War following similarly serious attacks by Israel on Lebanese civilians, a ceasefire took weeks to be enforced. However, Israel has not been completely immune from the world's outrage. Following international pressure on the escalating humanitarian crisis, Israel has agreed to establish a humanitarian corridor near Gaza city. Israeli military operations will be halted for three hours every day to allow humanitarian aid to reach Gaza's besieged population through this corridor. "The idea is for the Israeli military to lay down its weapons every day from 1 pm to 4 pm starting today (Wednesday) in the area of the city of Gaza," an Israeli source was quoted as saying. Israeli leaders met in Tel Aviv Wednesday morning to discuss expanding the ground offensive during a period when most of the aims of the operation have been reached, according to a number of Israeli analysts. Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, Foreign Minister Tzipi Livni, Defense Minister Ehud Olmert -- the war cabinet's troika — reportedly discussed an even more intensive campaign in Gaza's towns and cities. Israel is hoping to inflict as much damage as possible to Hamas's personnel and infrastructure. |
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UN, Red Cross curtail Gaza aid, criticize Israel
UN, Red Cross curtail Gaza aid, criticize Israel By IBRAHIM BARZAK and STEVE WEIZMAN, Associated Press Writers Ibrahim Barzak And Steve Weizman, Associated Press Writers. JERUSALEM – The U.N. and the Red Cross curtailed aid shipments in the Gaza Strip on Thursday after accusing Israeli forces of firing on their drivers, killing one. The threat of a wider conflict arose when militants in Lebanon fired two rockets into northern Israel. One rocket crashed into a retirement home, but there were no serious injuries. Israel responded with mortar shells. During a three-hour pause in the fighting to allow in food and fuel and let medics collect the dead, nearly three dozen bodies were found beneath the rubble of bombed out buildings in Gaza City. Many of the dead were in the same neighborhood where the international Red Cross said rescuers discovered young children too weak to stand who had stayed by their dead mothers. The aid group accused Israel of an "unacceptable" delay in allowing workers to reach the area. Relations between Israel and humanitarian organizations have grown increasingly tense as civilian casualties have mounted. The United Nations demanded an investigation after Israel earlier this week fired shells at a target next to a U.N. school filled with Gazans seeking refuge from fighting that has left nearly 750 Palestinians dead, according to Palestinian hospital officials and human rights workers. Israel said militants had launched an attack from the area, and then ran into a crowd of civilians for cover. Nearly 40 Palestinians died. "We've been coordinating with them (Israeli forces) and yet our staff continue to be hit and killed," said a U.N. spokesman, Chris Gunness, announcing the suspension. The U.N. is the largest aid provider in Gaza. Israeli police, meanwhile, said militants in the Gaza Strip fired 24 rockets into Israel on Thursday, injuring four people, one of them seriously. Militants fired larger numbers of rockets in the early days of the conflict. The Israeli military said one soldier attached to a tank battalion was killed by gunfire in the Gaza Strip on Thursday. Twelve Israelis, including nine soldiers, have died since the Dec. 27 beginning of the offensive against the Hamas militants in charge of Gaza, meant to halt years of Palestinian rocket attacks on southern Israel. But with roughly half the Palestinian dead believed to be civilians, international efforts to broker a cease-fire have been gaining steam. Israeli envoys traveled to Egypt on Thursday to discuss the proposal being brokered by France and Egypt and now backed by the U.S. French President Nicolas Sarkozy said any time lost will play into the hands of those who want war. "The weapons must go quiet, the escalation must stop, Israel must obtain security guarantees and leave Gaza," he said in Paris. The U.N. provides food aid to around 750,000 Gaza residents — about half of Gaza's population — and runs dozens of schools and clinics throughout the territory. They have some 9,000 locally employed staffers inside Gaza, and a small team of international staffers who work there. Elena Mancusi Materi, UNRWA's spokeswoman in Geneva, said the suspension concerned all truck movement in Gaza. "If someone comes to one of our food distribution centers, we will give that person food," she said. "If people come to our clinics with injuries, we will treat them." For a second straight day, Israel suspended its Gaza military operation for three hours to allow in humanitarian supplies. Shortly before the pause took effect, however, the U.N. said one of its aid trucks came under fire from a gunner on an Israeli tank, killing the driver. U.N. spokesman Adnan Abu Hasna said the U.N. coordinated the delivery with Israel, and the vehicle was marked with a U.N. flag and insignia when it was shot in northern Gaza. The Israeli army said it was investigating. In Geneva, the international Red Cross said it would restrict its aid operations to Gaza City for at least one day after one of its convoys came under Israeli fire at the Netzarim crossing during the three-hour lull in fighting Thursday. One driver was lightly injured. Dr. Moaiya Hassanain of the Palestinian Health Ministry said 35 bodies were discovered Thursday during the three-hour pause in fighting in several areas around Gaza City that have seen fierce fighting between Israeli troops and Hamas militants. He said it was unclear how many militants were killed because the remains were in poor condition, but that women and children were among the dead. Hassanain said 746 Palestinians have died in Israel's 13-day offensive. Many of the dead found Thursday were in Gaza City's Zeitoun neighborhood, where the international Red Cross said it found four small children alive next to their mothers' bodies in the rubble of a home hit by Israeli shelling. The aid group says a total of 15 dead were recovered from two houses in the Zeitoun neighborhood of Gaza City on Wednesday. A Red Cross spokesman says rescuers had been refused permission by Israeli forces to reach the site for four days. It said the delay in allowing rescue services access was "unacceptable." The Red Cross statement was a rare public criticism from the aid group, which normally conducts confidential negotiations with warring parties. The Israeli military said in a statement that Hamas militants used Palestinian civilians as human shields, and that Israeli forces work closely with international aid groups to help civilians during the fighting in Gaza. In other Gaza violence, Israel killed at least 12 people, including the U.N. driver and three people who were fleeing their homes, according to Palestinian medical officials. The rockets from Lebanon raised the specter of renewed hostilities on Israel's northern frontier, just 2 1/2 years after Israel battled the Hezbollah guerrilla group to a 34-day stalemate. War broke out between Hezbollah and Israel in 2006 as Israel battled Palestinian militants in Gaza, on Israel's southern borders. No group claimed responsibility. Lebanon's government condemned the attack, and Hezbollah — which now plays an integral role in Lebanon's government — denied any responsibility for the rocket fire, which lightly injured two Israelis at a retirement home. "The rocket entered through the roof, hurling the water heaters into the air. It went through bedrooms upstairs and then into the kitchen," said Henry Carmelli, the home's manager. Israel has repeatedly said it was prepared for a possible attack on the north since it launched its bruising campaign against Hamas militants in Gaza, to the south. Israel has mobilized thousands of reserve troops for such a scenario, and leaders have warned Hezbollah of dire consequences if it enters the fighting. "We are prepared and will respond as necessary," Defense Minister Ehud Barak told reporters. The Israeli offensive has reduced Palestinian rocket fire, but not stopped it altogether. Several barrages were reported Thursday, including one strike that damaged a school and sports center in the southern city of Ashkelon, police said. Both buildings were empty. For Israel to accept a proposed cease-fire deal, "there has to be a total and complete cessation of all hostile fire from Gaza into Israel, and ... we have to see an arms embargo on Hamas that will receive international support," said government spokesman Mark Regev. For its part, Hamas said it would not accept a truce deal unless it includes an end to the Israeli blockade of Gaza — something Israel says it is not willing to do. Israel and Egypt have maintained a stiff economic embargo on Gaza since the Hamas takeover. The Palestinian Authority controls the West Bank while Hamas rules Gaza — two territories on opposite sides of Israel that are supposed to make up a future Palestinian state. Hamas took control of Gaza from forces loyal to Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas in June 2007. ___ Weizman reported from Jerusalem and Barzak from Gaza City. Associated Press writer Sam F. Ghattas contributed to this report from Beirut, Lebanon. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090108/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_palestinians ------------------------------------------------- Give me a break, bombing schools, mosques and now shooting at Red Cross aid workers? Can someone give me one good reason why this is okay? |
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I really hope that the Palestinians get what are coming to them in this one. And I don't mean that in a negative way. Israel has no right to exist where it does and the United States government has put unneeded support into the region for strategic reasons.
Yes, the Holocaust was a terrible tragedy, but giving the most disputed territory in history to a religious institution, especially to the religious minority that the Jews are, was an incredibly reckless move. It would be one thing if we gave them an uninhabited landmass or somewhere from within our own borders. Instead, we displaced an entire race of people in favor of a religious organization, which goes against the very principles of the United States Constitution in my opinion. The land does not belong to those people because a book says that it does. If other novels were as popular as the Bible or the Torah then would we follow what they said? Would anyone send their ten year old to a strange school to learn magic? How about New York City? Does NYC really need any protection when the Fantastic Four are just a call away? People have been fighting over the "Holy Land" for generations, centuries even. Why we just added fifteen tons of C4 to that fire, I don't know. All in all, I hope the state of Israel is disbanded and that the Palestinians are finally given a fighting chance. I hope that those people who were displaced from their homes and forced into refugee camps because of the workings of a madman in Germany may one day occupy the land that is rightfully theirs. Gaza is the smaller portion of Palestine, and Israel's attack on the weakest part of the nation and their attempts to cut off UN aid is truly a sign of cowardice. Zion will fall. And when it does maybe humanity will rise above this petty faith in a higher being to guide them and will instead begin to rationally reason with one another and come to a peaceful solution. |
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The question here should be "Will Israel be charged with War Crimes?" Which is ..no.
Could they be...doubtful. Should they be..without doubt |
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I think it's time for Americans to get the whole story, not just what one side wants us to accept as the truth. Until we do nothing will change and we will continue to support things we should not in many areas of life.
I doubt in this climate that they would be charged, even if it was the right thing to do. Look at Bush... |
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I really hope that the Palestinians get what are coming to them in this one. And I don't mean that in a negative way. Israel has no right to exist where it does and the United States government has put unneeded support into the region for strategic reasons. Yes, the Holocaust was a terrible tragedy, but giving the most disputed territory in history to a religious institution, especially to the religious minority that the Jews are, was an incredibly reckless move. It would be one thing if we gave them an uninhabited landmass or somewhere from within our own borders. Instead, we displaced an entire race of people in favor of a religious organization, which goes against the very principles of the United States Constitution in my opinion. The land does not belong to those people because a book says that it does. If other novels were as popular as the Bible or the Torah then would we follow what they said? Would anyone send their ten year old to a strange school to learn magic? How about New York City? Does NYC really need any protection when the Fantastic Four are just a call away? People have been fighting over the "Holy Land" for generations, centuries even. Why we just added fifteen tons of C4 to that fire, I don't know. All in all, I hope the state of Israel is disbanded and that the Palestinians are finally given a fighting chance. I hope that those people who were displaced from their homes and forced into refugee camps because of the workings of a madman in Germany may one day occupy the land that is rightfully theirs. Gaza is the smaller portion of Palestine, and Israel's attack on the weakest part of the nation and their attempts to cut off UN aid is truly a sign of cowardice. Zion will fall. And when it does maybe humanity will rise above this petty faith in a higher being to guide them and will instead begin to rationally reason with one another and come to a peaceful solution. Im with you brother! |
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I really hope that the Palestinians get what are coming to them in this one. And I don't mean that in a negative way. Israel has no right to exist where it does and the United States government has put unneeded support into the region for strategic reasons. Yes, the Holocaust was a terrible tragedy, but giving the most disputed territory in history to a religious institution, especially to the religious minority that the Jews are, was an incredibly reckless move. It would be one thing if we gave them an uninhabited landmass or somewhere from within our own borders. Instead, we displaced an entire race of people in favor of a religious organization, which goes against the very principles of the United States Constitution in my opinion. The land does not belong to those people because a book says that it does. If other novels were as popular as the Bible or the Torah then would we follow what they said? Would anyone send their ten year old to a strange school to learn magic? How about New York City? Does NYC really need any protection when the Fantastic Four are just a call away? People have been fighting over the "Holy Land" for generations, centuries even. Why we just added fifteen tons of C4 to that fire, I don't know. All in all, I hope the state of Israel is disbanded and that the Palestinians are finally given a fighting chance. I hope that those people who were displaced from their homes and forced into refugee camps because of the workings of a madman in Germany may one day occupy the land that is rightfully theirs. Gaza is the smaller portion of Palestine, and Israel's attack on the weakest part of the nation and their attempts to cut off UN aid is truly a sign of cowardice. Zion will fall. And when it does maybe humanity will rise above this petty faith in a higher being to guide them and will instead begin to rationally reason with one another and come to a peaceful solution. Bud you are so far off on the map it will take you years to get back on track.There is records of Jews living in Israel at least 3,400 years ago.More to the point Jews have never left Israel. In September 1947 the United Nations Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) recommended partition in Palestine, a suggestion ratified by the UN General Assembly on November 29, 1947.The result envisaged the creation of two states,one Arab and one Jewish, with the city of Jerusalem to be under the direct administration of the United Nations. Your opinion on giving land(Israel)to the Jews and saying it was a reckless move and putting them on a uninhabited land mass or island)sounds more like something I would have heard from a Nazi speech.That is not what America is about Sir.America has always stood up for good and always helped people when they are in need.America does not forget its own including the Jews.I don't even want to hear your opinion on the constitution. Israel is a legitimate nation.There is nothing Illegal about it.The only people who say it is illegal is the terrorist and the Jew hating liberals. Your right Israel has been fought over again and again and Israel has always won.Your idiotic logic to disban Israel to give it to a terrorist origination makes no sense what so ever.Not only is Israel a peaceful and prosperous country it is also a powerful ally of the United states and would glady back us in time of war.There is one thing I do hope Israel gives the people who want to destroy it,and that is alot of lead! Israel will never fall.People have tried to kill the Jews off in every possible way imaginable. The Jews are invincable!Israel also has nuclear weapons and the United states will never let Israel be destroyed even if the United states is the lone warrior(as it is now). There is one thing I know I can count on.Alot of dead Muslims who think they can destroy Israel. |
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In September 1947 the United Nations Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) recommended partition in Palestine, a suggestion ratified by the UN General Assembly on November 29, 1947.The result envisaged the creation of two states,one Arab and one Jewish, with the city of Jerusalem to be under the direct administration of the United Nations.
This is after the Zionist movement and not entire in its suggestion of equality. The mandate by the UN divided the land 70-30! 70% for the formation of the NEW State of Israel which was only 30% of the population at the time. 30% of the land to the Palestinians who had been living there and were 70% of the population! Real fair aye! Tell me one point of that which you believe is a fair split. Tell us all which part of that would you agree to if you were one of the legal residents of the area! (Palestine) Please! Dont debate the facts. They are real. Just tell me! |
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I believe that Israel should be held for their actions and for the genocide that they have inflicted for their fellow cousins..........how can we as people let people bulldoze others for the fact that they used to be in the Holocaust............thats freakin bull and someone should do the same to them of what they are doing for others...................
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In September 1947 the United Nations Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) recommended partition in Palestine, a suggestion ratified by the UN General Assembly on November 29, 1947.The result envisaged the creation of two states,one Arab and one Jewish, with the city of Jerusalem to be under the direct administration of the United Nations. This is after the Zionist movement and not entire in its suggestion of equality. The mandate by the UN divided the land 70-30! 70% for the formation of the NEW State of Israel which was only 30% of the population at the time. 30% of the land to the Palestinians who had been living there and were 70% of the population! Real fair aye! Tell me one point of that which you believe is a fair split. Tell us all which part of that would you agree to if you were one of the legal residents of the area! (Palestine) Please! Dont debate the facts. They are real. Just tell me! I take your responses about as serious as I take you photo.You say I am debating facts but do you even bother to read them to begin with because you are way off.Here is a quiz for you. CAN YOU PASS THE ISRAEL-PALESTINE QUIZ? 3. Who, in 1919, wrote the following, in a secret memorandum submitted to the British cabinet? “For in Palestine we do not propose even to go through the form of consulting the wishes of the present inhabitants of the country [i.e., we do not accept the principle of self-determination for the Arabs of Palestine] … the four great powers are committed to Zionism. And Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, is rooted in age-long traditions, in present needs, in future hopes, of far profounder import than the desires and prejudices of the 700,000 Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land …” Lord Balfour: As British Foreign Secretary, he was responsible for the Balfour Declaration in 1917 which promised Zionists a national home in Palestine. 4. According to Mandatory Palestine's first modern census, conducted in 1922, approximately what percentage of the total population were Jews? 11%. 5. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's inhabitants were Jews in 1947? 37%. 6. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was allocated for the Jewish state by the 1947 United Nations Partition Plan (which supported the division of Palestine into a Jewish state and an Arab state)? 56% 7. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was owned by Jews at the time of the 1947 UN Partition Plan? 7%: Perhaps Arab rejection of the Partition Plan is more understandable when it is recognized that 37% of the population was given 56% percent of the land of which they owned only 7%. 8. Which state, the Jewish State or Arab State, was to include Jerusalem according to the 1947 UN Partition Plan? Neither. To answer you question...Israel was given to the Jews by God.It has always been there's and always will be.I don't care about the split because it don't belong to the Palestines to begin with.The Jews were also legal residents long before the Palestines came.You need to research more. |
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In September 1947 the United Nations Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) recommended partition in Palestine, a suggestion ratified by the UN General Assembly on November 29, 1947.The result envisaged the creation of two states,one Arab and one Jewish, with the city of Jerusalem to be under the direct administration of the United Nations. This is after the Zionist movement and not entire in its suggestion of equality. The mandate by the UN divided the land 70-30! 70% for the formation of the NEW State of Israel which was only 30% of the population at the time. 30% of the land to the Palestinians who had been living there and were 70% of the population! Real fair aye! Tell me one point of that which you believe is a fair split. Tell us all which part of that would you agree to if you were one of the legal residents of the area! (Palestine) Please! Dont debate the facts. They are real. Just tell me! I take your responses about as serious as I take you photo.You say I am debating facts but do you even bother to read them to begin with because you are way off.Here is a quiz for you. CAN YOU PASS THE ISRAEL-PALESTINE QUIZ? 3. Who, in 1919, wrote the following, in a secret memorandum submitted to the British cabinet? “For in Palestine we do not propose even to go through the form of consulting the wishes of the present inhabitants of the country [i.e., we do not accept the principle of self-determination for the Arabs of Palestine] … the four great powers are committed to Zionism. And Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, is rooted in age-long traditions, in present needs, in future hopes, of far profounder import than the desires and prejudices of the 700,000 Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land …” Lord Balfour: As British Foreign Secretary, he was responsible for the Balfour Declaration in 1917 which promised Zionists a national home in Palestine. 4. According to Mandatory Palestine's first modern census, conducted in 1922, approximately what percentage of the total population were Jews? 11%. 5. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's inhabitants were Jews in 1947? 37%. 6. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was allocated for the Jewish state by the 1947 United Nations Partition Plan (which supported the division of Palestine into a Jewish state and an Arab state)? 56% 7. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was owned by Jews at the time of the 1947 UN Partition Plan? 7%: Perhaps Arab rejection of the Partition Plan is more understandable when it is recognized that 37% of the population was given 56% percent of the land of which they owned only 7%. 8. Which state, the Jewish State or Arab State, was to include Jerusalem according to the 1947 UN Partition Plan? Neither. To answer you question...Israel was given to the Jews by God.It has always been there's and always will be.I don't care about the split because it don't belong to the Palestines to begin with.The Jews were also legal residents long before the Palestines came.You need to research more. Jerusalem is the mecca to all religions........judaism, christianity, and islam............Jews do not have a right to occupy the territory because they know that it isnt theres to be begin with.............I have a Jewish daughter so when I say this I say it with sorrow that Jews have used the HOLOCAUST CARD AND KNOW THEY HAVE MAXIMIZED IT................ |
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Edited by
karmafury
on
Fri 01/09/09 01:43 AM
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In September 1947 the United Nations Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) recommended partition in Palestine, a suggestion ratified by the UN General Assembly on November 29, 1947.The result envisaged the creation of two states,one Arab and one Jewish, with the city of Jerusalem to be under the direct administration of the United Nations. This is after the Zionist movement and not entire in its suggestion of equality. The mandate by the UN divided the land 70-30! 70% for the formation of the NEW State of Israel which was only 30% of the population at the time. 30% of the land to the Palestinians who had been living there and were 70% of the population! Real fair aye! Tell me one point of that which you believe is a fair split. Tell us all which part of that would you agree to if you were one of the legal residents of the area! (Palestine) Please! Dont debate the facts. They are real. Just tell me! I take your responses about as serious as I take you photo.You say I am debating facts but do you even bother to read them to begin with because you are way off.Here is a quiz for you. CAN YOU PASS THE ISRAEL-PALESTINE QUIZ? 3. Who, in 1919, wrote the following, in a secret memorandum submitted to the British cabinet? “For in Palestine we do not propose even to go through the form of consulting the wishes of the present inhabitants of the country [i.e., we do not accept the principle of self-determination for the Arabs of Palestine] … the four great powers are committed to Zionism. And Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, is rooted in age-long traditions, in present needs, in future hopes, of far profounder import than the desires and prejudices of the 700,000 Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land …” Lord Balfour: As British Foreign Secretary, he was responsible for the Balfour Declaration in 1917 which promised Zionists a national home in Palestine. 4. According to Mandatory Palestine's first modern census, conducted in 1922, approximately what percentage of the total population were Jews? 11%. 5. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's inhabitants were Jews in 1947? 37%. 6. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was allocated for the Jewish state by the 1947 United Nations Partition Plan (which supported the division of Palestine into a Jewish state and an Arab state)? 56% 7. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was owned by Jews at the time of the 1947 UN Partition Plan? 7%: Perhaps Arab rejection of the Partition Plan is more understandable when it is recognized that 37% of the population was given 56% percent of the land of which they owned only 7%. 8. Which state, the Jewish State or Arab State, was to include Jerusalem according to the 1947 UN Partition Plan? Neither. To answer you question...Israel was given to the Jews by God.It has always been there's and always will be.I don't care about the split because it don't belong to the Palestines to begin with.The Jews were also legal residents long before the Palestines came.You need to research more. So far you both are so way off the mark. A.. Does it matter if Israel is an 'illegal' state?.....NO So many of the nations 300 years old and younger are just as illegal for the same reasons. a..started by acts of terrorism, b..occupy land taken by force. Example...USA - I'm sure the British had some choice terms (terrorist perhaps) for those 'cowardly colonists who hide behind fences and hedgerows to shoot at troops'. Land taken and occupied by force that was not theirs by several treaties with the 'nations' of the various native tribes. Natives have continued to have a presence. Now back to OP The point that has the international community upset is the disproportionate response. Without copying out what has been in who knows how many threads there have been breaches of international law (on both sides) with the greater number of civilian casualties being Palestinian and most of those under the age of 15. There are current breaches of the Geneva Convention Regarding the Safety and Care of Civilians. Again at the cost of Palestinian civilians and again by both sides (the Israelis for indiscriminate attacks in civilian areas and by Hamas for using some of the facilities to hide). Should there be charges placed against Israel....YES with charges also placed against Hamas for the same reasons...... TOTAL LACK OF CONCERN FOR NON-COMBATANTS, A COMPLETE DISREGARD FOR SEVERAL ARTICLES OF THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS TO WHICH ISRAEL IS A SIGNATORY AND TO WHICH PALESTINE (under PLO) AGREED TO AND HAS NOT YET SIGNED. .......................................................... This arguemnt that Israel is an illegal state is pointless. Will North America be returned to the natives....I doubt it. The idea that it is legal because God gave it to Israel also has no standing. Manitou gave his people (Native Americans) the land to care for. |
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In September 1947 the United Nations Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) recommended partition in Palestine, a suggestion ratified by the UN General Assembly on November 29, 1947.The result envisaged the creation of two states,one Arab and one Jewish, with the city of Jerusalem to be under the direct administration of the United Nations. This is after the Zionist movement and not entire in its suggestion of equality. The mandate by the UN divided the land 70-30! 70% for the formation of the NEW State of Israel which was only 30% of the population at the time. 30% of the land to the Palestinians who had been living there and were 70% of the population! Real fair aye! Tell me one point of that which you believe is a fair split. Tell us all which part of that would you agree to if you were one of the legal residents of the area! (Palestine) Please! Dont debate the facts. They are real. Just tell me! I take your responses about as serious as I take you photo.You say I am debating facts but do you even bother to read them to begin with because you are way off.Here is a quiz for you. CAN YOU PASS THE ISRAEL-PALESTINE QUIZ? 3. Who, in 1919, wrote the following, in a secret memorandum submitted to the British cabinet? “For in Palestine we do not propose even to go through the form of consulting the wishes of the present inhabitants of the country [i.e., we do not accept the principle of self-determination for the Arabs of Palestine] … the four great powers are committed to Zionism. And Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, is rooted in age-long traditions, in present needs, in future hopes, of far profounder import than the desires and prejudices of the 700,000 Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land …” Lord Balfour: As British Foreign Secretary, he was responsible for the Balfour Declaration in 1917 which promised Zionists a national home in Palestine. 4. According to Mandatory Palestine's first modern census, conducted in 1922, approximately what percentage of the total population were Jews? 11%. 5. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's inhabitants were Jews in 1947? 37%. 6. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was allocated for the Jewish state by the 1947 United Nations Partition Plan (which supported the division of Palestine into a Jewish state and an Arab state)? 56% 7. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was owned by Jews at the time of the 1947 UN Partition Plan? 7%: Perhaps Arab rejection of the Partition Plan is more understandable when it is recognized that 37% of the population was given 56% percent of the land of which they owned only 7%. 8. Which state, the Jewish State or Arab State, was to include Jerusalem according to the 1947 UN Partition Plan? Neither. To answer you question...Israel was given to the Jews by God.It has always been there's and always will be.I don't care about the split because it don't belong to the Palestines to begin with.The Jews were also legal residents long before the Palestines came.You need to research more. Jerusalem is the mecca to all religions........judaism, christianity, and islam............Jews do not have a right to occupy the territory because they know that it isnt theres to be begin with.............I have a Jewish daughter so when I say this I say it with sorrow that Jews have used the HOLOCAUST CARD AND KNOW THEY HAVE MAXIMIZED IT................ If you have a Jewish daughter I really wonder why you would support a terrorist origination hell bent on destruction of every Jew on this planet instead of Israel.What do you tell you Jewish daughter when she asks why Israel is being attacked by rockets every day? For your info...The Jews didn't play the holocaust card.They rejected the land offer and were invaded.They fought the war and won fair and square.You also seem to forget that the Jews were living in Israel long,long before the Palestinians were even a race.So it's fair to say that the Palestinians are living on Jewish soil. |
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.You also seem to forget that the Jews were living in Israel long,long before the Palestinians were even a race.So it's fair to say that the Palestinians are living on Jewish soil.
Now I'm no biblical scholar but seems to me that there are other peoples named back then other than Jews. Palestinian is a relatively new term give to those who come from a geographic area called Palestine. I'm somehow sure that their ancestors were there as well. Almost forgot. Palestine is the Anglicized term for Philistine. Ring any bells about mention in Bible? |
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Edited by
Thomas3474
on
Fri 01/09/09 01:59 AM
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In September 1947 the United Nations Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) recommended partition in Palestine, a suggestion ratified by the UN General Assembly on November 29, 1947.The result envisaged the creation of two states,one Arab and one Jewish, with the city of Jerusalem to be under the direct administration of the United Nations. This is after the Zionist movement and not entire in its suggestion of equality. The mandate by the UN divided the land 70-30! 70% for the formation of the NEW State of Israel which was only 30% of the population at the time. 30% of the land to the Palestinians who had been living there and were 70% of the population! Real fair aye! Tell me one point of that which you believe is a fair split. Tell us all which part of that would you agree to if you were one of the legal residents of the area! (Palestine) Please! Dont debate the facts. They are real. Just tell me! I take your responses about as serious as I take you photo.You say I am debating facts but do you even bother to read them to begin with because you are way off.Here is a quiz for you. CAN YOU PASS THE ISRAEL-PALESTINE QUIZ? 3. Who, in 1919, wrote the following, in a secret memorandum submitted to the British cabinet? “For in Palestine we do not propose even to go through the form of consulting the wishes of the present inhabitants of the country [i.e., we do not accept the principle of self-determination for the Arabs of Palestine] … the four great powers are committed to Zionism. And Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, is rooted in age-long traditions, in present needs, in future hopes, of far profounder import than the desires and prejudices of the 700,000 Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land …” Lord Balfour: As British Foreign Secretary, he was responsible for the Balfour Declaration in 1917 which promised Zionists a national home in Palestine. 4. According to Mandatory Palestine's first modern census, conducted in 1922, approximately what percentage of the total population were Jews? 11%. 5. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's inhabitants were Jews in 1947? 37%. 6. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was allocated for the Jewish state by the 1947 United Nations Partition Plan (which supported the division of Palestine into a Jewish state and an Arab state)? 56% 7. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was owned by Jews at the time of the 1947 UN Partition Plan? 7%: Perhaps Arab rejection of the Partition Plan is more understandable when it is recognized that 37% of the population was given 56% percent of the land of which they owned only 7%. 8. Which state, the Jewish State or Arab State, was to include Jerusalem according to the 1947 UN Partition Plan? Neither. To answer you question...Israel was given to the Jews by God.It has always been there's and always will be.I don't care about the split because it don't belong to the Palestines to begin with.The Jews were also legal residents long before the Palestines came.You need to research more. So far you both are so way off the mark. A.. Does it matter if Israel is an 'illegal' state?.....NO So many of the nations 300 years old and younger are just as illegal for the same reasons. a..started by acts of terrorism, b..occupy land taken by force. Example...USA - I'm sure the British had some choice terms (terrorist perhaps) for those 'cowardly colonists who hide behind fences and hedgerows to shoot at troops'. Land taken and occupied by force that was not theirs by several treaties with the 'nations' of the various native tribes. Now back to OP The point that has the international community upset is the disproportionate response. Without copying out what has been in who knows how many threads there have been breaches of international law (on both sides) with the greater number of civilian casualties being Palestinian and most of those under the age of 15. There are current breaches of the Geneva Convention Regarding the Safety and Care of Civilians. Again at the cost of Palestinian civilians and again by both sides (the Israelis for indiscriminate attacks in civilian areas and by Hamas for using some of the facilities to hide). Should there be charges placed against Israel....YES with charges also placed against Hamas for the same reasons...... TOTAL LACK OF CONCERN FOR NON-COMBATANTS, A COMPLETE DISREGARD FOR SEVERAL ARTICLES OF THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS TO WHICH ISRAEL IS A SIGNATORY AND TO WHICH PALESTINE (under PLO) AGREED TO AND HAS NOT YET SIGNED. .......................................................... This arguemnt that Israel is an illegal state is pointless. Will North America be returned to the natives....I doubt it. The idea that it is legal because God gave it to Israel also has no standing. Manitou gave his people (Native Americans) the land to care for. Are you telling me that when people fight wars and win that we should just walk away and forget everything???That is the most absurd notion I have ever heard.When you have victory in a war you have to right to take over that country.Yes the Native Americans lost the war and lost their land.Countries go to war to conquer and take over.This current war between Israel is no different. You keep saying over and over and over that Israel is illegal.Why do you keep saying that?How many times have I provided facts?Do you need glasses?Insted of saying Israel is illegal for the 109th time why don't you first.... provide some history that Israel is illegal. provide some facts that Israel is illegal. provide court cases or lawsuits regarding Israel being illegal. You can't because you know it is a lie.The only people that say it is illegle is the people who want the Jews destroyed. As far as your logic against Britian.If you would have done some basic War history you would have learned that George Washington beat the British.Because of this we now owned what is currently the USA.I seriously doubt you understand the concept of modern warfare.I know Canadians are not known for their intelligence but come on! As far as your Geneva conventions nonsense... Article 28 of the 4th Geneva Convention of 1949 is simple and clear. It says: " The presence of a protected person may not be used to render certain points or areas immune from military operations." Hamas violates this provision daily. It is due to Hamas violations of this provision that civilians are being killed. International law has three major prohibitions .... One forbids deliberate attacks on civilians. Another prohibits hiding forces in civilian areas, thereby turning civilians into "human shields." A third prohibition, the proportionality restriction that Israel is accused of violating, involves a complicated and controversial balancing test. Ignoring the fact that Israel has warned citizens to flee the combat zones dozens of times, given the manner in which Hamas has hidden both itself and its weapons among civilians,it is impossible to assert,let alone prove,that Israel is deliberately attacking civilians.But it is clear that Hamas has turned the civilian population into human shields. Not to mention.Hamas isn't even remotely playing by the Geneva conventions!!!!!!!! |
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If Bush and Blair havent been charged with war crimes, then the Israelis are very safe!!!
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Edited by
karmafury
on
Fri 01/09/09 03:06 AM
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You keep saying over and over and over that Israel is illegal.Why do you keep saying that?
Now show me once where I have stated that Israel is an illegal state. Never have I stated that nor sided with that argument!!! I stated that it is NO MORE ILLEGAL than several nations using the example of one that gained independence and land through same methods. Had you read your OWN history you would know that prior to the Army of the Continental Congress it was civilian militias, individual to each State, fighting the British. As well Washington is a hero instead of a traitorous terrorist because the Americans won, had they lost the leaders would have been tried and hung as treasonous, terrorist rebels. I know Canadians are not known for their intelligence but come on!
Intelligent enough to be respected around the world. Intelligent enough that our troops are respected around the world as professionals. Intelligent enough not to have gotten ourselves mixed up a mess in Iraq. Intelligent enough to have Universities and colleges that draw Americans. Intelligent enough that a French Canadian uses better vocabulary and grammar in English than many Americans. Intelligent enough to read a post and understand what is there and not what we choose to see. Intelligent enough to have a higher standard of education. The fourth Geneva Convention (1949) and two Additional Protocols (1977) belatedly extended protection to civilians during wartime - * Civilians are not to be subject to attack. This includes direct attacks on civilians and indiscriminate attacks against areas in which civilians are present. Article 33 No protected person may be punished for an offence he or she has not personally committed. Collective penalties and likewise all measures of intimidation or of terrorism are prohibited. SECTION III: OCCUPIED TERRITORIES Article 59 If the whole or part of the population of an occupied territory is inadequately supplied, the Occupying Power shall agree to relief schemes on behalf of the said population, and shall facilitate them by all the means at its disposal. Such schemes, which may be undertaken either by States or by impartial humanitarian organizations such as the International Committee of the Red Cross, shall consist, in particular, of the provision of consignments of foodstuffs, medical supplies and clothing. All Contracting Parties shall permit the free passage of these consignments and shall guarantee their protection. A Power granting free passage to consignments on their way to territory occupied by an adverse Party to the conflict shall, however, have the right to search the consignments, to regulate their passage according to prescribed times and routes, and to be reasonably satisfied through the Protecting Power that these consignments are to be used for the relief of the needy population and are not to be used for the benefit of the Occupying Power. Read what is there and not what you choose. Israel has retaliated with indiscriminate fire causing civilian casualties. They have refused the free access of required civilian supplies. (Not just during this conflict) I also stated that Palestinians should also be charged. Hi Belushi....Welcome to the party. |
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In September 1947 the United Nations Special Committee on Palestine (UNSCOP) recommended partition in Palestine, a suggestion ratified by the UN General Assembly on November 29, 1947.The result envisaged the creation of two states,one Arab and one Jewish, with the city of Jerusalem to be under the direct administration of the United Nations. This is after the Zionist movement and not entire in its suggestion of equality. The mandate by the UN divided the land 70-30! 70% for the formation of the NEW State of Israel which was only 30% of the population at the time. 30% of the land to the Palestinians who had been living there and were 70% of the population! Real fair aye! Tell me one point of that which you believe is a fair split. Tell us all which part of that would you agree to if you were one of the legal residents of the area! (Palestine) Please! Dont debate the facts. They are real. Just tell me! I take your responses about as serious as I take you photo.You say I am debating facts but do you even bother to read them to begin with because you are way off.Here is a quiz for you. CAN YOU PASS THE ISRAEL-PALESTINE QUIZ? 3. Who, in 1919, wrote the following, in a secret memorandum submitted to the British cabinet? “For in Palestine we do not propose even to go through the form of consulting the wishes of the present inhabitants of the country [i.e., we do not accept the principle of self-determination for the Arabs of Palestine] … the four great powers are committed to Zionism. And Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, is rooted in age-long traditions, in present needs, in future hopes, of far profounder import than the desires and prejudices of the 700,000 Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land …” Lord Balfour: As British Foreign Secretary, he was responsible for the Balfour Declaration in 1917 which promised Zionists a national home in Palestine. 4. According to Mandatory Palestine's first modern census, conducted in 1922, approximately what percentage of the total population were Jews? 11%. 5. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's inhabitants were Jews in 1947? 37%. 6. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was allocated for the Jewish state by the 1947 United Nations Partition Plan (which supported the division of Palestine into a Jewish state and an Arab state)? 56% 7. Approximately what percentage of Mandatory Palestine's land was owned by Jews at the time of the 1947 UN Partition Plan? 7%: Perhaps Arab rejection of the Partition Plan is more understandable when it is recognized that 37% of the population was given 56% percent of the land of which they owned only 7%. 8. Which state, the Jewish State or Arab State, was to include Jerusalem according to the 1947 UN Partition Plan? Neither. To answer you question...Israel was given to the Jews by God.It has always been there's and always will be.I don't care about the split because it don't belong to the Palestines to begin with.The Jews were also legal residents long before the Palestines came.You need to research more. Jerusalem is the mecca to all religions........judaism, christianity, and islam............Jews do not have a right to occupy the territory because they know that it isnt theres to be begin with.............I have a Jewish daughter so when I say this I say it with sorrow that Jews have used the HOLOCAUST CARD AND KNOW THEY HAVE MAXIMIZED IT................ If you have a Jewish daughter I really wonder why you would support a terrorist origination hell bent on destruction of every Jew on this planet instead of Israel.What do you tell you Jewish daughter when she asks why Israel is being attacked by rockets every day? For your info...The Jews didn't play the holocaust card.They rejected the land offer and were invaded.They fought the war and won fair and square.You also seem to forget that the Jews were living in Israel long,long before the Palestinians were even a race.So it's fair to say that the Palestinians are living on Jewish soil. I may have a jewish daughter but im also christian and i have islam relatives so should i tell her this attack is honorable..........no I think my daughter is a new generation of Jews who know that things arent what they seem..........for you to think that only the Jewish people have a right in Israel if erronous and it doesnt make sense..........what I will do is tell the truth and the Jews that I know think the samething..........its ridiculous to believe that Palestinians have no right to their country then you know what then Americans should lay claim to a place that now they think its a birthright to them..........lets really get over the rhetoric that divides and realize that Jews should be accountable for the GENOCIDE that they are inflicting on their own cousins...........can you even tell which is who unless you are told no because that shows your their leinage is the same and that they are relatives that should do more than bomb each other...........what happened to civilized ideals those went down the drain with this ridiculous war that shows us that we as humans havent really evolved at all............I cant tell my daughter this war is right because its so wrong that it goes against the civilized world..............if they were at right then wouldnt everyone be on their side...............but no its because this sh!t has become ridiculous and hypocritical in every aspect of world civility.............. |
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Edited by
s1owhand
on
Fri 01/09/09 04:23 AM
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What Hamas does - War Crimes 1. Firing rockets with the sole intention of targeting civilians and maximizing casualties? 2. Using innocent civilians as human shields. 3. Storing live munitions in homes, schools, hospitals, and mosques. 4. Executing civilians for uncorroborated suspicions of cooperation with Fatah. What Israel does - Self Defense 5. Attacking militarily the ones firing rockets at your civilians while warning as best you can that civilians in the area leave the area. Israel daily faces false accusations of "war crimes" but these carry no weight due to their obvious hypocrisy. Everyone including the moderate arab regimes realize the pointlessness of Hamas' fanatical terrororism. Everyone will be glad to see Hamas and their ilk defeated and disarmed except for terrorists and Iran who arms them. |
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Edited by
karmafury
on
Fri 01/09/09 05:02 AM
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From Geneva Conventions
These protections include the right to be free from attacks, reprisals, acts meant to instill terror, and indiscriminate attacks. Civilian populations must not be used as civilian shields. (Protocol I, Art. 51) ............................. Art 51. - Protection of the civilian population 1. The civilian population and individual civilians shall enjoy general protection against dangers arising from military operations. To give effect to this protection, the following rules, which are additional to other applicable rules of international law, shall be observed in all circumstances. 2. The civilian population as such, as well as individual civilians, shall not be the object of attack. Acts or threats of violence the primary purpose of which is to spread terror among the civilian population are prohibited. 3. Civilians shall enjoy the protection afforded by this section, unless and for such time as they take a direct part in hostilities. 4. Indiscriminate attacks are prohibited. Indiscriminate attacks are: (a) those which are not directed at a specific military objective; (b) those which employ a method or means of combat which cannot be directed at a specific military objective; or (c) those which employ a method or means of combat the effects of which cannot be limited as required by this Protocol; and consequently, in each such case, are of a nature to strike military objectives and civilians or civilian objects without distinction. 5. Among others, the following types of attacks are to be considered as indiscriminate: (a) an attack by bombardment by any methods or means which treats as a single military objective a number of clearly separated and distinct military objectives located in a city, town, village or other area containing a similar concentration of civilians or civilian objects; and (b) an attack which may be expected to cause incidental loss of civilian life, injury to civilians, damage to civilian objects, or a combination thereof, which would be excessive in relation to the concrete and direct military advantage anticipated. 6. Attacks against the civilian population or civilians by way of reprisals are prohibited. 7. The presence or movements of the civilian population or individual civilians shall not be used to render certain points or areas immune from military operations, in particular in attempts to shield military objectives from attacks or to shield, favour or impede military operations. The Parties to the conflict shall not direct the movement of the civilian population or individual civilians in order to attempt to shield military objectives from attacks or to shield military operations. ........................................................ As the massive amount of high explosive expended in the area where there are, may be or suspect that there are Hamas fighters by the Israelis. Rendering Hamas equally guilty of war crimes I did state that both parties were guilty. |
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