Krim at Beach

You have to know what truth is before you can make the claim that someone is "fighting" it.

No, believe EXACTLY what you have been shown and don't add a bunch of other stuff to it that comes from dogma.

You asked if God was real. God answered Yes, by showing you a bunch of butterflies. Take that as a YES answer, but that does not mean that you turn around and pick up any religious dogma that talks about God and then decide that this too must be true. (In your case you picked up Christianity.)

You are not believing only what you have been shown in that case. You are filling in the gaps with dogma because you lack the faith in what God has personally shown you.

I AM STILL WAITING FOR AN ANSWER FROM ANYONE ON THIS ONE.

IF YOU BELIEVE IN THE GENESIS CREATION STORY, HOW DID GOD DO IT?





Feralcatlady,

You say that it logically just makes no sense. Are you truly looking for logic?

Okay, then lets assume you are right and God made mankind from the mud of the earth. Let's just say for a minute.. that this is a fact.

How did God do that?

Get down to the nitty gritty on a quantum level or even magick and tell me how you think God did that?

No matter how miraculous anything is, there has to be a method or means by which the thing was done. What was the technology that accomplished that feat... LOGICALLY. Remember, it MUST BE LOGICAL in order to make sense.

I'm serious about this question. You apparently require logic in order to make sense of information. Where is your logic in the story that God created mankind from the mud?

What does that mean to you? How did God do that?

JB

See again I think people half the time don't read what I write. I am a Christian for the following reasons: And it's not something I picked up like going to the store and getting a gallon of milk. I did a lot of searching and for me this fit into what God was showing me. And again I won't apologize for being me...

Fellowship

Instruction

Corporate Prayer

Effective Outreach

Worship

Dicipline

Obiedience

Now as far as knowing the truth. When we do these forums we can only base it on what we know, or our truth. So as I see it then that most who don't believe either have been hurt by church, people of the church, etc. So that is what I mean by fighting it. Now my proof is in speaking to many people right her on mingle where I have noted the above to be true. Now should this take away from their personal relationship with Christ....No because I have done the same and left the church or the people and never waved from my relationship with Christ Jesus.

Now again which I have said on many occasions, God did not just show me only with the butterfly incident, but daily why He is real,and Glorious and even when answering prayer. I am blessed truly because I do for the most part have my prayers answered. And I will not let anyone put that down or call me names or even for a second think that "I" think that I am god...Because that is the furthest thing from the truth that there is. A lot of people get prayers answered not just me.


And believe me when I say that my relationship with my church or my pastor is not filling any gaps. This church again gives more then it will ever receive and I know because I also do the accountancy work. We are a family in the truest sense of the word, and upon reading Acts all of it if you care to, with me and my life I am exactly where God wants me in all aspects of my life. I believe in God I believe in the paths "He" leads me on PERIOD. My church is for exactly what is written above, no more no less.


No lack of Faith here ever baby.....You have to look at it more like putting the pieces of the puzzle together for "MY" life and again I am exactly where I am supposed to be for this time in my life...Even with Mingle all of it is planed of God for God and that is that.

God is God.....He says or does and it is. That simple......Now as much as again you don't want to believe in the Bible I do all of it from Genesis to Revelation. That for me Genesis is how God did it. Why did God do it.....simple Because he loved us and wanted to.

For me it just is....for you....you want to put God in a box and treat him like a science experiment or be able to put a theory to his creation. YOU CAN NOT.....HE IS GOD...And whether to me you believe in whatever God does not take the fact away that you can't even begin to understand the complexity of God. You can't ever in a trillion year ever know all that God does. And you either have to have Faith that "HE IS" or you don't.....again your choice.

And this is the key....logic to whom.....to explain creation....to you......who are you? in the whole scheme of the world you are nothing but a bit player and for all of humanity God does not have to explain the how or why he did anything.


Now again just for me....Because I do believe the Bible is the inspired word of God. Now you take that as the example and go with me here for a minute. If you right now picked up the Bible and with an open heart and mind.....And said ok God show me your stuff...And you read cover to cover and God showed you. What then? Would you ignore? Would you say oh that is just rubbish....Because again you can't say something isn't if you haven't even bothered to do it for yourself...Now you can take scripture and butcher it like you do and say this and that and it's not real. But have you ever just read it for what it is with an open mind.


I think for me the biggest thing is I don't ever question God....I listen to God.

I am not asking you to apologize for being you. I am just trying to understand why people take their personal spiritual experiences and weave it into the dogma of a religion.

Okay I interpret the above as saying that the Church and your affiliation with that group of people is part of what fulfills your life on the whole. (Fellowship) You like belonging to that 'club.' It probably satisfies your social needs too.

Instruction: In how to live your life I am guessing.

Corporate prayer: Group energy.

Effective Outreach: Non clear on this one.

Worship: Gratitude

Dicipline: Self discipline?

Obiedience: To the Church or Biblical doctrine?? (Ten commandments?)


So do you have a NEED to be obedient to someone? Do you have a need for someone to tell you what is right and wrong and keep you on the right track?

Don't you also seek approval? (From others, and from God)

Don't you also seek forgiveness?

JB

Fellowship- is hanging out with people who love God as much as me and whom I truly enjoy spending time with

Instruction- is my teachings with pastor, with other teahers. Right now I am studying the Book of Acts. Which is perfect for this because it was the start of the church. And see this is the key I could spend from now until I am 90 reading and studying and get more and more the more I do.

Corporate Prayer - Is praying for the country, the people.

Effective Outreach - Ministries, in India, Mexico, and even the ministries I have locally and even here on mingle.

Worship - Is where I praise the Lord, sing to His Holy exalted Name....It's a time just for him.

Dicipline - Is not giving into the wordly ways of the world, but living as Christ taught and following that path.

Obiedience - To the Lord God Almighty


I HATE THAT WORD DOGMA


It is crap, it is an excuse by all....I and people that truly follow Christ have a personal relationship with Christ PERIOD.

My obedience is to the Lord....I don't always succeed because i am Human but I try.

No one tells me anything...you of all people should know this by now. My Obedience is to the Lord because I Anoint Him, I live my life for him...Not because of any other reason then because I Love the Lord. This is what makes all the aspects of my life better, fulling, richer, fuller. With God I want for nothing for he will always see me through.

I do not seek approval from God. I give my heart, my soul, my mind to him. Why because I have the utmost Faith in the Lord. I thank Him every day for dying on the cross and taking the burdens of our sin. I thank His Father God for loving us so much that he gave his only begotten Son so that all who ask in His Son's name will have salvation.

"I HATE THAT WORD DOGMA"


Yes that word has gotten a bad rap. Probably because of how it is used.

I found a book once that was written by a Famous Mason called Albert pike called "Morals and Dogma" It is a philosophical work, created by an individual who was an extraordinarily prolific writer even for an age when prolific writing was the norm.

So apparently the word "Dogma" was not always a "bad word."

I think it just means "teachings" in a philosophical sense.

WOW 'feral'!

I will pass my turn.

If I were to answer this truthfully and sincerely, I would get expelled from 'mingle' forever' !

I'll say this much though,

Since no one can tell you anything,
'... No one tells me anything. You of all people should know this by now...',
and since you only listen to your god, I will respect your wish and not waste my time writing to you directly, and

... I'll exceptionally pray to YOUR god such that he pays 'particular attention' to you.

P.S.: Mingle forums are meant for open-minded debates as much as possible. Proselytizing is everything but 'open-minded debating' form, and should voluntarily not be practiced on this threads. It's simply not cool to proselytize on 'mingle' 'feral'. It is downright hypocretical.

In other words, in spite of the fact that this is a debating and open-minded ideas and opinions exchange forum, you 'feral' disregard that fact outright ('... No one tells me anything. You of all people should know this by now...'),
... and you come here stricly to '... Effective Outreach - Ministries, ... even here on mingle...'

As I said, I'll exceptionnally pray YOUR god, so that he keeps an eye on you!

Technically all proselytizing is strictly forbidden on the General Religion forum now. That is not just singling out the Christians either. It’s ANY type of proselytizing. So a Muslim or a Jew or a Wiccan could not do it either. The reason is everyone was given their own forums to create such threads and GR is supposed to be open to pure debate and criticism of religious matters. It was intended to alleviate some of the fighting and was actually an accommodation made for the Christians yet it has still caused a lot of commentary and argument.

Well Feralcatlady, your agenda has been exposed.

No one tells you anything...and yet you do listen to your pastor don't you? ... and yet you do go to church for "instruction" so that can't be true either Feral. Unless you don't listen to them either. If you don't listen to them, then why do you go?

Well thanks fr that information 'krimsa'!

I didn't realize it was strictly forbidden.

Boy, I hope 'feral' is not going to get reported and expelled from the 'mingle' forums forever!

That would be ironic, I thought I might get expelled for telling her that 'proselytizing was downright hypocrytical' !!!

OK, so here's the deal!

'feral' will immediately stop her 'local prosilitysing 'ministry' ' on mingle, and no one will report her to the mods.

Deal?!?!?

Well if a person is of the mind that no one can tell her or him anything because she(or he) is not open to listening to the other side, no matter how logical or reasonable it is and no matter how much proof or evidence is presented, then they are not here to debate anything.

Therefore, there would be little reason to engage in a debate with them. The best one can do is small talk and a hello now and then, but when it comes to the subject of God or religion, it would now appear to be pointless to engage.

That does not mean we can't be friends of course.

I wouldnt report her. Technically someone could. All they ever do is move the thread over to "Christian Singles" and they warn them about it.

At this point, since it's the OP that has stated such, it's time to just let this thread die. No point in keeping it going when the OP isn't open to debate.(of course, one might even ask, Why even start the thread, if you aren't open to debate?)

What does proselytizing mean? I might be guilty of it too. I have gotten in heated discussion trying to convert Christians into born-again atheists and humanists!

Hi, new to the community, saw this topic, thought I'd add my two cents as a church worker, Christian and scholar.

Evolution and the Bible are compatible in that they were never meant to be compatible. They deal with two entirely different things: evolution with science, the Bible with faith and the revelation of God. The truths present in the Bible are of a different nature than scientific truths. The Bible present spiritual truths revealed through story and science offers "hard facts" that only further reveal (if you are a person of faith) the beauty and complexity of the world God has gifted us.

Then again, my understanding is based upon my belief that the Bible is the inspired (not inerrant) Word of God and that the humanness of its various authors and communities is very much interwoven in its texts.

Perhaps this has already been said. I haven't read all the posts. Apologies if I'm simply repeating another point.

That is a very good question. It makes one wonder why anyone debates anything.

I have actually learned a lot on this club. A LOT.

In fact I think I probably KNOW IT ALL NOW.

There may not be anymore to learn on this club.

I may have to find another club with some smarter people.

(Just joking of course.)

You Atheists! You are obsessed with nothing! You are always ramming nothing down someone’s throat!

Spangles29,

You sound very knowledgeable and you put that very well. So well in fact, that I am not sure if I even understood it.

Now I was just thinking about finding a club with some smarter people on it because I thought I had learned all I could learn on this one.

Now I see I must remain here so I can pick your brain.

I would advise that you do not read this entire thread, it might compel you to run screaming from the room having discovered you are in an insane asylum.

all in good humor of course.