Well, it just may work!!
Finally Utopia!!!

u·to·pi·a (y-tōpē-ə)
n.


1.

a. often Utopia An ideally perfect place, especially in its social, political, and moral aspects.
b. A work of fiction describing a utopia.

2. An impractical, idealistic scheme for social and political reform.

BTW Welcome back Fanta. You were greatly missed

Obama was promoted by the propoganda machine. There is an organization called CFR (Counsel on Foreign Relations) that is pretty much owned by our federal reserve bank and controls most our TV stations, Newspapers, etc. We have. They promoted Obama from the beginning. The people didn't stand up against anything, they voted for the "status quo". He is looking out for the same people Bush was looking out for. Look at his healthcare policies for instance. It would mean bigger pockets for the pharmacuetical companies to pick. Look at how he praised this "bailout" idea, and how he already voted to reinstate the patriot act.

If we really want the "change we need" we have to start listening to the congressmen/women who are standing up against corruption. The same people that warned us of this "economic crisis" 5 years ago are now telling us that Obama is no different from Bush. These are the same people that warned us about iraq, and are trying to throw out the patriot act. Maybe we should start listening to these people when they warn us?

Ok then as long as we're dreaming - what changes do YOU ALL THING could be made to accomodate everyone? What changes could be made having a good affect for all?

Oh - I know, we could just have the Fed create all the money we need ... oh wait, that wouldn't work because then no one would value money anymore. Oh my, we are in a predicament, money we just can't seem to be happy with it but can't live without it.

The more prohibitions and rules, the poorer people become. The sharper people's weapons, the more they riot. The more skilled their techniques, the more grotesque their works. The more elaborate the laws, the more they commit crimes.

Right. The more money the FED prints, the less your money is worth. This is called an inflation tax. Economists are predicting a a 10 to 15% increase in this tax, on everyone of every income, in the next year or two.

I firmly believe in Dr. Ron Paul's perspective when dealing with "changes". We as Americans need to revisit what the role of government ought to be. In Dr. Paul's words; "If we think our government should police the world, and you think it should hold all our hands from cradel to grave, then we are happy with what is going on right now, and want no change". Or we could start giving responsibility back to the people.

In other words, if you really look into things you will find that the department of education is causing most of our education problems, the FDA is causing most of our health problems, and market regulation is taking away our free market and causing most of our economic problems. The answer:

1. Eliminate the department of education, lets schools compete for their students.

2. Do away with most market regulations, revamp the FDA and bring into question why they eliminated almost every noninvasive, cheap medical procedure. This would bring down the cost of healthcare drastically.

3. Bring troops home from everywhere (to include europe, Korea, Japan, etc.) and sell that land back to the respective countries so we can put that money against our deficit, which is where most of our taxes are headed. This is part of a larger plan for a noninterventive foreign policy in which we actually but the hell out. Withdraw from the U.N. and NATO to help make this happen.

4. The troops can handle our own security making the department of homeland security a 40 billion dollar a year waste. Abolish it. We could combine this with actual enforcement of immigration laws.

6. GOLD STANDARD, or some kinda of standard. In our constitution it clearly states that gold and silver are the only legal currency. This also makes our government regulate its own spending.

7. As part of number six, the Federal Reserve bank has to be abolished completely if America is expected to survive another generation. I didn't know until a few months ago, but the FED is actually a private bank. It's not even run by our government.
Did you know it's not even possible to get a decen business loan unless you outsource (x) amount of your labor? This is the source of many of our problems right here. Almost all our corruption stems from the FED, and besides, a central bank is again, against our constitution.

8. Legalize marijuana. We spend billiions combating a drug that has no more side affect than alcohol. Prohibition has never worked and it makes criminals more opportunity to gain a profit. Legalize it. Free up some prison space, while diverting our attention to much more serious matters (like rapes, murders, etc.) I Think that would be money more wisely spent.

Lets see, we just solved our healthcare problem, our economic problems, our education problems, and we did it while cutting almost 3 trillion a year from our budget.

Private schools and Colleges compete for students – The best tool at their disposal is the scholarship (a free ride). What is the incentive in the free ride scholarship? Cost! But there are too few scholarships to alleviate the cost. Why is there a charge to learn? Many of the greatest minds in history were self taught. Today, a college education, a piece of paper, becomes the greatest tool for making money, no matter the mind behind it. I guess we could say the corporations, Industry and the government support the great expense of a college education. That same education that should be free and equally provided/allowed to everyone regardless of how much it COSTS. Money!



Most Doctors have PAID a hefty price to become a doctor; the cost of education. They must charge accordingly. Further charges just for being in practice have created a greater need for higher charges. Insurance is the only alternative. The drug companies, and the insurance companies are large and wealthy, their influence is powerful; MONEY. The FDA is controlled by those with the greatest influence. How do you revamp a system that was created and survives on one underling feature; money?



How many military are being supported by their JOBS. Bring them all home, all at once, dismiss them from service and how many do you thing would find jobs? We are in a recession, the highest unemployment rate since the depression. Your suggestion is to put more in poverty in order to put MORE in the pockets of the government. So the cost of poverty is to pay back a deficit, created by the system that benefits from the monetary system, and that’s not ‘the people’.



Where is the break, the leak that needs to be fixed by so many? Is it Terrorism? Who is in our waters and threatening invasion of our shores? Think now, where is the real threat, who created it and what good, what purpose would all that military serve, here, now?



MONEY is now a world economy. We don’t have the ability to change the world in that way. And to change our country would limit our ability to deal with the rest of the world. The ways of the Federal Reserve, have spread far and wide. WE are no longer in control of that. This also addresses your # 7.



You want to abolish the Federal Reserve, but then you come up with a way to make more money, for what purpose? MORE money in a CLOSED monetary system is an oxymoron.



You have done nothing, you have made no proposals worth a single gold piece. Back to college for you - PAY for that education…..

Don't think you were paying attention my dear. I believe in a voucher system for students. I apologize for leaving this out. The department of education has hurt our education. Eliminate it. Look at our "no child left behind" theory and many others like it. It doesnt work. Let teachers do what they do best without tying their hands.

About doctors, i am studying to become a doctor, my costs for education are around $250,000. It sucks, i wont lie. The people getting the biggest lump sum of money are the pharmacuetical companies. They control the FDA and as a result, the FDA makes most noninvasive, cheap procedures illegal. I would rather see no FDA, seeming how they fail to regulate food from china, than to see the one we have. My proposal is to eliminate it. Or shrink the comittee.

Troops, never once did i ever say eliminate the military. Please reread what i wrote. I said bring them home, and stop starting wars. Did you know we put Saddam in power? We financed him, trainted and supplied his troops to ensure his power. Now we went to war with him. We also started the taluiban in Afganistan to get Russia out of there? How is this smart? Bring them home, and our defense budget gets cut severely while troops stay employed by protecting our country. Combine this with eliminating the department of homeland security and you have saved us a trillion dollars a year.

The threat i was talking about at our borders is illegal immigration dear. It is a threat to our security and our jobs. There is no arguing this. If we stop starting wars, there will be little threat from terrorists. And those terrorists would be stopped at the borders. (Or deported)

About our money. This monetary system is crashing hard. Largely due to inflation caused by printing money. Inflation makes your money, in your pocket worth less. Why would you want more money printed? In a global economy it devalues our money against everyone elses. Why do you think gas prices went down? Not just because people were conserving, mostly because everyone else's economy is hurting with ours.

I agree with the FED spreading. But do some homework please. You will find that the FED's ways are causing our current financial crisis as well as eliminating jobs from our country. Regardless of how deeply imbedded the fed is, it needs to be stopped, NOW. The longer it exists the worse off we will be.

Legalising marijuana had litttle to do with "making money". It's about saving money my dear. You cut back on unnecessary programs. Our overspending in this government is also largely to blame for our economic crisis. Keep more money in the pockets of the people, you have fewer financial problems. Understand? With less government spending comes less taxes. Not just a few hundred dollars less, but thousands.

Once again, do some research. You will find that these proposals have solved almost every major crisis we are having.

Problem = government overspending/overregulating

Solution = cut back on government spending/overregulating

Peace

Drivinmenutz, I will not condescent to you, I expect your level of intelligence will be able to comprhend my repies to you.



I don’t believe in a voucher system for students, I believe everyone is entitled to the highest level of education they can achieve not afford. I also don’t believe that level can be attained in the strict confines of a classroom, lecture hall, or lab of a building.

If education were totally free but there was no pay difference between those who become the nuclear physicists and those who can only do simple math, do you think people would abandon education or stop trying to achieve? Do we seek knowledge because it means more money and power? Is that what you think education is for?



If at the end of your studies you become a leader in your field, would you expect more money and power? Or would you do it because that’s what you have chosen? Would you study any less, or would your aspirations be diminished if all you ever got out of it, were the same things that everyone got, no more or less?

I respect those who study and work hard to be the very best they can be, without greater reward than any one else who does the same, no matter their level of achievement.

I also agree the FDA is not living up to their function, nor is any administration under the banner of Federal Government.



If we don’t eliminate them, they must serve a purpose – is not the purpose of a military supposed to be ‘defense’? Are the people coming across our borders to be met with a force created to deal with terrorism, and warfare? How many terrorist acts have you seen committed by illegal aliens in the last 100 years, how many could have been stopped?

Why are the aliens coming here? What jobs are they taking that our people want to do? We had crops go to waste because no one here wanted to do the work. What is a fare wage? To me a fare wage is one that allows every person access to everything that one desires. No wage is fare when one earns millions while another earns thousands.

People trained to kill and accept being killed in a war atmosphere are not a police force we should be comfortable with. Read the following and see the “plans” for the new uses of military force, within our own territory. First response units in times of disaster, I don’t think so, thank-you. Is this a ploy meant to get us comfortable with seeing military “guarding” our towns and cities? Or is this yet another “function” of government, to do the jobs we just can’t be bothered with? When there is disaster in our own country are we all so pathetic that we require the assistance of a PAID force to take care of it? Here YOU are asking the Federal Government for MORE, But later you complain that they have not properly dealt with anything we've asked them to do. You want to take away their power over us (our money) but you don't want to accept responsibility.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/30/AR2008113002217_pf.html




I agree, bring them home, but if you think we save all that money, think again. If we EXPECT their services to replace those of first responders, border patrols, and riot control and who knows what else they would be asked to do or who they would replace, then we're asking for drones of another kind, not killers. Imagine the expense of these newly trained outfits not to mention if we EXPECT the roles to be filled, we will also expect the government to provide EVERYTHING, in terms of relief to every possible victim. We ask so much of our government, no wonder it has grown so large and out of control.




I say print enough money so that everyone becomes equalized. If the richest man in America and the poorest American have the exact same amount of money, what would that mean?

You worry about the value of a dollar – but who or what gives it value? So there are people dying of curable disease and illness and hunger and poverty,and the only reason is because there is more value placed on the dollar than on the necessities of life. So we spend our time fighting for a piece of paper becasue it's replaced what is really valuable, our health and happiness. If food and medicine and shelter are not scarce enough to cause poverty, are you afraid your money would be worth less? Yet we have been programmed to accept poverty and the suffering of others, because true value is in the dollar, not in poeple.



I understand what you are claiming, what I’m saying is that you offer nothing but a complaint. If there is homework to be done, it needs to be on a massive scale and you and I can both be better educated. If the Fed is done away with, there is no possible natural resource that could be used as a standard; reasons for this vary. Include a natural resource and there will be more war attempting to gain and guard that resource. Exclude natural resources and you initiate nothing more than another Federal Reserve.

Any other suggestions?



The overspending of this government stems from one thing – what “we the people” have expected this government to supply. This government, at the federal level was meant to be a minimal expense to the people. It was meant to oversee, foreign policy and the military. It was meant to protect the Constitution, to see to it that all people were properly covered under its blanket of equality. The rest was meant to be in the hands of the States. Yet we expect our government to see that everyone has health insurance – why health insurance why not health care? We expect our government to save for our futures, what made us so irresponsible that we can’t see to our own futures? We expect our government to oversee business, what happened to free enterprise? What happened to state regulated and chartered corporations?

We have a monster on our hands and we have created it. We are the source of this countries ills, stop blaming everyone else.




You have made no proposals. A proposal would include exactly how to implement the changes you have suggested. A proposal would include the costs of making those changes and the affects of those changes on other areas of concern.




Then quit asking them to save you, to spend more, to make changes when those changes would threaten their existence, their power.



We were the ones who requested the regulating. We were the ones that thought FDR was saving the united states by implementing social security and the Federal Reserve, and allowing them to grow so out of hand. We are the ones who allow corporate America to be the power behind the puppeteers in government. We allow it by working for them, by purchasing from them, standing by and watching as they “devalue” our almighty dollar and our lives.

Peace - to you as well, I wish you the very best in your studies, we need good doctors, especially those who WANT to be doctors, and not just rich.

Instead of trying to live in a dream why dont we just practice reality.

Obama offers a chance for Americans to regain our rite to a government of the people. A President who knows what its like to be at the bottom of American society. An American who had to take out student loans to go to college. An American who knows how to play the system and beat it, rising to the top against all odds.
I mean when was the last time you heard about a President who orders the white house staff not to clean his daughters rooms.

Ok Redykeulous, I just had to get in on this...

You asked "Why is there a charge to learn?" Well, I'll tell you why...it takes money to pay teachers and administrators, janitors and librarians, cafeteria workers and counselors. Resources, such as paper and copy machines, computers and chalk, toilet paper and books, even water and electricity cost money as well. How could a school pay for these things if they didn't charge for the services they rendered?

You seem to believe that education should be free, which is an ideal that I can get behind. But it's not realistic. It's a basic principle that we are forced to learn, a kind of out-of-the "classroom, lecture hall, or lab of a building" lesson you probably weren't talking about(lol): you can't get something for nothing.

Let's take a sheet of paper, for example. You can't expect to get even something as simple as that for free. Someone has to chop down the wood. Someone has to haul it to the factory. Someone has to work the machines in that factory, as well as pay for the electricity, etc. Even if the gasoline and that electricity and every other resource that goes into the creation of that sheet of paper were somehow free, you would have to pay the people for their labor. Because, really, who would want to spend their day cutting down the tree, driving to the factory, working that machine when, for the same amount of money (none), and probably waaaay more pleasure they could spend the day at home with their family, or read a good book, or go to the beach, or...well, anything else more enjoyable than work. In the end, everything costs, because somewhere along the line someone had to put in the effort to create it for you.

You can list your ideals all you want, but in the end you and Drivin are having two different conversations. At least on this topic. You're talking about making something free that never could be...and he's giving realistic ideas to improve the system at hand. A voucher system makes sense. Free education for everyone does not. A voucher system doesn't change the amount of money going in to the system, it simply allows you to have a choice in where your child goes to school. That creates competition, which gives schools a real incentive to be better. More money.

And another thing...

You said "If...there was no pay difference between those who become the nuclear physicists and those who can only do simple math, do you think people would abandon education or stop trying to achieve? Do we seek knowledge because it means more money and power? Is that what you think education is for?"

Let me answer, though it was not me you asked: Hell yes I think we seek knowledge because it means more money and power! Do you think Thomas Edison invented the things that he did simply because he was curious? You don't think he intended to make as much money as possible? How long after early man used his first spear to kill an animal (money, in a way) do you think it took him to use it against his fellow man (power)?

I'm sure most people who go into medicine truly have a passion for science and helping people, but I do not believe, even if you took away all the costs of the education (which I think I have explained already why you can't do that, lol, but for arguments sake let's say that you can), that most would still pursue the job if you got no more recognition or pay than they guy who mopped the hallway.

For one thing, even if the education itself were free, you would still have to invest all those years of your life. It's like I was saying in my prior post: labor has a cost. How long does it take to teach the janitor his job? Probably not seven years (I would hope ).

Then there is the actual job, and all that it entails. Many doctors work crazy hours, with crazy pressure. Make the wrong diagnosis? Cut a centimeter too far? You could kill someone. That guy mopping the floor? I really don't think he has to deal with that day-to-day.

And what if you do make that wrong diagnosis? Or you do kill someone? Well...doctors have been sued for a lot less. This country seems lawsuit crazy sometimes, and that's reflected in the outrageous cost of malpractice insurance...which the doctor has to pay (at least in part, if not completely, I believe) for. Kind of hard on a janitor's salary.

I do think that we, as a species, sometimes pursue knowledge simply for knowledge's sake. But most everything one chooses to learn or achieve or be educated in has a purpose other than just enrichment. To make us better than the other guy; to give us a leg up in the world; to put us in a position of power or relative comfort. If it was not in our nature to be competitive and strive for more, more, more...well, we'd probably still be living in caves. I think the person who wears the stethoscope has earned the right to more money than the guy holding the mop, no matter his reasons for pursuing the title of "Dr."

Well you can get rid of govenment all together and then what???Sooner or later someone is going to have to run the power plants and the people will have to hire and pay these people.Sooner or later you will have to form a military and police unit.Sooner or later you will have to form a school system.I'm trying to understand your logic for this topic unless you are saying we should just dump everything that makes the world go around and live in mud houses with no electricity or laws?

Why do you think humans have to be subjegated and mastered? Without this bondage that is the idea of governement, IMO you would see the most advancement this world has ever known. I dont think it would be nothing but chaos, i think the basic ideals that are human are decent, and we would see more if we wernt being taken advantage of by a parasitic government!

Only a virtuous people are capable of freedom. As nations become more corrupt and vicious, they have more need of masters.

-Benjamin Franklin

Wow Red, just....Wow. Ok, the life you describe is very communistic. This is a good idea in theory but has been proven to not work in life. Without a payoff for working harder people will not work harder. Why would someone attend 12 years of college instead of just working at mcdonalds right out of highschool if the payoff is the same? This is the downfall of these societies.

As for everything else, i have given very realistic, tried and proven ideas that haved worked for us. The big problems began when we decided to expand the government and consolidate power.

The troops are never to be our police. But they are to focus on DEFENSE, not offense. We defend our borders. If a country directly threatens us then we attack. Plain and simple. I am a veteran of war, i know how the army works. I spent some time in the front lines.

I don't think you know exactly how this works. We had a system that was working before. We had the information that 9/11 was going to happen before it happened. We need to fix the bugs, not start a 40 billion dollar a year branch of government.

And BTW more than half of the 9/11 hijackers were here on expired visas. You see why immigration is an issue?

I'm not sure what you've been witness to in the country. Our people are divided, corrupt, evil, hate-filled, racist, sexist, violent, and that's just the begining. This country isn't a shining example of what could be an attempt at Utopia. Whish IS what your suggesting. You're ideals are blinded by the fact that you believe that all people are honest, trusting, caring, open-minded, and loyal. Without a government in place it would be total chaos. Now don't get me wrong, there are good people out there. But not enough to implement what your suggesting. It's just insane.

You have been so right on so many things Fanta. It's good to see you back. But be careful.

Obama is much like Clinton. What he says sounds good but carries no substance. He may know how to play the system, and i pray that he was lying to us most of the time to do just that. He managed to gain corporate interests/sponsors and the backing of many corrupt individuals. He praised this whole bailout package, that alone should tell us all that he is crooked, or perhaps lying to gain the trust of the corrupt.

If you look at his website with an open Critical Thinking text book in front of you you will find a man that is another of what we have seen the last couple decades. Don't ignore that he is hiring most of Clinton's old cabinet.

Don't get me started on his foriegn policy, or economic plans.

If you want we can discuss this through e-mails instead...

I may just have high expectations after hearing a few of Dr. Ron Paul's speeches...

Once again, welcome back my brother

"Some men see things as they are and say why.
I dream things that never were and say why not."-RFK


Has the idea of an absoultly free nation ever been tried? Absoultly not!


Do you really think evil can sustain itself forever if it has no host to feed itself? I dont think so because unlike goodness, it has to feed on anothers soul, and if mankind learned that harm has no place on this earth, Not anything that u speak of could ever survive

There is wisdom in Brandon's words my friend. "Government in it's best state is but a necessary evil. In it's worst state it's an intolerable one." - Thomas Jefferson

90% of people are at least somewhat honest. There are a handful that aren't. Unfortunately a government run by the same human beings is subject to the same mannerisms. They just have more power. People can self govern. If you took away all government regulations and there was a sick person that cam into a hospital that could not afford the bill, i am willing to bet doctors would still take care of this individual.

This can be applied to many situations. We do need some regulation. We need some law enforcement. But laws passed "for your own good" and regulations tacked on to the "free market" hurt us all more than it helps us. If we were to have a free, socialized medicine you would find that to be true in the medical field as well.

There are few places the government needs to get involved. Our forefathers saw this, and tried to explain it to us; "I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them."
-Thomas Jefferson


In the end there should be some form of government, i agree with you on that. Mostly for protection purposes from those individuals you mentioned...