My nephew is in Iraq. Id much rather he be fighting in Afghanistan. At least then if he died it would be easier to accept.
The Taliban attacked us here at home. I will never say leave until they are all dead or surrender. I tried to go to Afghanistan. I went to the recruiter and told him I wanted to reenlist again, but he had to guarantee me Id go to Afghanistan.
He said he couldn't then told me I was too old to go back in the Infantry!
I wouldn't want to be anything but Infantry, and I wont support the Iraq war period, so I told him to kiss my old ass and left!

We should pull all troops from Iraq, start the draft, and send at least 500,000 troops to Afghanistan. The biggest part of them Grunts. I would even accept 50,000 American dead in that fight!
Im not a pacifist I just dont believe in wasting the lives of my brothers fighting an illegal war!

What are we doing in Afghanistan?
Not enough!

We would not lose if they would quit kissing Pakistani ass!
If they didnt act to stop the Taliban on their side of the border Id do it for them!

Ok ... enough of the grandstanding.

Tell me what you think they are doing in Afghanistan

Osama bin Laden is dead.
The news first came from sources in Afghanistan and Pakistan almost six months ago: the fugitive died in December [2001] and was buried in the mountains of southeast Afghanistan. Pakistan's president, Pervez Musharraf, echoed the information. The remnants of Osama's gang, however, have mostly stayed silent, either to keep Osama's ghost alive or because they have no means of communication.

With an ego the size of Mount Everest, Osama bin Laden would not have, could not have, remained silent for so long if he were still alive. He always liked to take credit even for things he had nothing to do with. Would he remain silent for nine months and not trumpet his own survival? [New York Times. July 11, 2002]

To everything there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
A time to KILL and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up....
-- Ecclesiastes 3: 1-3 (KJV)


If Someone attacks you, you can't expect to survive in this world if you do not ever retaliate. This is the mentality of those we are against now. I agree not enough thought has been given prior to our attack on either Iraq, or Afghanistan, and war is hell, and should be avoided until violence is threatened. But sometimes in this world you have to do what you have to do.

These are basic survival instincts, its how any species survives. By nature if we never picked up a weapon for any purpose, and did not defend ourselves when in danger, our species would no survive.

I urge you to take what i say into consideration and exercise some critical thinking. In this world assumptions can be detrimental.

So, are you saying that the US/UK are in Afghanistan for self-defence?

I still don't believe it. I have heard the rumors too.

I don't believe that Iraq was justified at all. At least Afghanistan was closer to bin laden if we HAD to justify the war there. Iraq however is completely illegal, there is no legal justification to be there at all.

Honestly i don't even think we need the draft. We should publicly warn the taliban to stop what they are doing, because we are fed up. If they attack again, every troop in iraq gets redeployed to Afghanistan. Seal off the country and systematically go from house to house, cave to cave, until everything gets searched. Owners of larger amounts of propaganda, and/or illegal weapons gets investigated and tried. Anyone who resists gets dealt with. War would be over in a few months. When we are done, then we could clean up our mess in Iraq, in my opinion, if we do the same thing over there right after, they would have a working government within a year, or two at max. Then we withdraw from everywhere, focus on building up our own country/economy, stay out of everyone's business. If we get attacked again we do the same thing. This would send a message to the world saying, "stay out of our business, and we will stay out of yours". What do you think Fanta? Iraq, after being in civil war for a year or two would probably welcome our return. And the fact that we actually have a plan would earn us more support from everyone.

I never brought up Iraq in this conversation Dragoness. In order for me to make an opinion on the matter i would have to know more then either of us do at the time. Militarily we chose a bad time to invade when we actually did, since we already were in Afghanistan.

Unless the conspiracy theorists are correct about the leaders of most of the world's countries, to include our own, actually orchestrating 9/11, then yes, we were there for self defense. Well, more like offensives self defense, which is very necessary when dealing with extremists. You have to be irrational, just like the politics in these countries are irrational. Make it not worth attacking us, and they will at least cut back. Especially if we stay out of everyone's business afterward.

Well, you may doubt what you know but there is no doubt for me at all. But you already know that.

I find having an open mind cuts back on assumptions, which in turn, cuts back on errors. I'm trying to exercise some more critical thinking, instead of just being defensive.

Explain the use of click and paste before or after you explain how voice recognition experts have confirmed his voice on recent audio recordings.
Even his closest relatives say he is still alive. One report from a French Journalist doesn't confirm diddly belushi!

Even if, lets say this lone French Journalist is correct, didn't you just report 9 Americans were killed by Taliban militants?
Have they surrendered?

I said dead or surrendered. Osama is a goal, but its not just him its all the Taliban that we battle.

I was not being defensive at all, stating facts as I see them. Unless you were referring to you being defensive then that is up to you on that one.

If there were "justifiable" reasons for the war in Iraq we would have heard them by now. People are seeing the lies that were used to manipulate as just what they were now.

I actually was talking about myself when i mentioned being defensive Dragoness. However, sometimes reasons may be more justifiable at one time than they are at others. Especially when it comes to making strategic judgment calls. There are lies being manipulated on both agendas dragoness. Both those against Bush, and those for Bush. It's really hard to make judgment calls. This is why i keep an open mind. Hell maybe 9/11 was orchestrated by our government. But, Obama and McCain supposedly support the North American union, and globalization, and under the same theory, The Clintons and Bushes are supposedly buddies. It's really hard to be sure of anything nowadays. If you have reliable sources i would REALLY like to see them. I do seek the truth, and the full one. Not just the two truths that point to the lies.

You are right about my use of the cut and paste, but this is one article of many saying that there have been witnesses to his death from liver failure.
... and this was only used as a sub-discussion with Dragonness
Plus President Musharraf of Pakistan has also confirmed Osama is dead. So that's two. How many do you want?

... and of course his relatives say he is alive. It is a way of keeping the rank and file true to the cause.

As soon as the King is dead the troops defect or give up.
Standard classical tactic




But the problem is that the Taliban is like the Irish problem we had.
Every man of an age to fight can say that he is Taliban for this week and then change his mind.
It is not cut and dried who the Taliban is.

If you cut off the head of the monster, like Hydra, it will just spread.

All you are doing is continuing the cycle of hate.

how can they or the US grieve when it is never ending?

.. and that preposterous idea of going house to house and mountain to search out the Taliban is as non-sensical as the ability to root out Osama himself

The only thing worth dying for is living

The lives, and freedom of my family, close friends, and those fighting along side of me.