AB,

Perhaps I'm not understanding this fully but doesn't the immigration
bill refer only to persons/workers in immigration or worker visa status
and not U.S. citizens? If this is the case then it would provide
justification for the development and implementation of the Alien
Employment Management System.

I'm not sure it's the best way to do things but I don't believe it's a
secondary method to track U.S. citizens. It does however make sense to
have those employers hire only legal immigrants and pay them a fair
wage. It seems to protect jobs for U.S. Citizens and protect immigrant
workers from exploitation.

Let me know what you think. Jerry

I'm glad you added that last part about it being the humane society. I
damn near called.

Redy,

Those are nice thoughts and you have clearly carved out a nice
environment for yourself and family but I have to disagree with some
aspects of your post.

You describe your family units as different when I would simply call
them effective and loving family units. To me, it doesn't matter if a
family is composed of two women, two men or one each. Maternal vs
Paternal instincts vary among individuals. We all know good and bad
examples with each sex. Being a woman doesn't make you more loving or
compassionate.

What you see daily in your environment may be one thing but what I see
from both men and women is entirely different. Like men, women can be
the most vindictive, violent, unloving, jealous creatures that ever
walked the earth. The opposite is also true but making women the glory
of society will never assure freedom for every culture just as making
men the leader will not.

I believe women have the same capacity as men to be great leaders which
is what this world needs. But their strength will come from their
ability to master a multitude of leadership skills rather than their
sex.

anyway, my .02.

Great post!!! I can see why this message wasn't received very well.
The truth hurts...

Good point. Wasted money, childish behavior, etc... I wonder what's
next? We really need to pick and choose our representatives or hopefuls
a little better.

I've never seen a direct connection between Ruby Ridge and the Freemen
movement but haven't given it any real time. However, from what I have
read, they both share a lot of the same anti govenment, White
Supremecist, Religeous and Conspiracy Theory rhetoric.

Oceans, Freemen are often tied together with different militia groups
in the U.S. and I believe outside the U.S. as well. For example, the
Montana Freeman. Some also associate the freemen with other groups such
as those in Ohio, Texas and many other survivalists type organizations.
It's a rather complex movement but the basic premise is the distrust of
the government and their ability to govern properly. They've been
around for a long time. Some, like the Montana freemen have went as far
as developing their own currency and checking system. This got them
arrested. They feel as thought they can create regions within the U.S.
and create their own rules and laws.

Good Questions... One could argue the Dems attempted to keep their
promises but their efforts were thwarted by the Pres. One could also
say they were smart enough to know their efforts would never see the
results they promised. I tend to believe the 2nd option. It's party
politics and grand standing, and has done nothing except waste a lot of
time.

I don't think there will be a lot of fallout for 3 of the presidential
hopefuls but I would guess the one who voted for the bill is finished
and finished by those in their own political party. This is rather
ironic to me because I would personally look for someone who was smart
enough to know when they were beating a dead horse and be willing to
work across party lines especially in regards to this particular issue.

Hey Oceans,

I saw your earlier question regarding the UCMJ and the troop's following
blindly of (illegal) orders. While you didn't direct it to me I wish to
give my thoughts on this.

In short and very basically, anyone who participates in torture, murder
or anything else outlined in the Law of Armed Conflict (LOAC) or
violates any other law is punishable under the punitive alticles (77 -
134) of the UCMJ. If given an order by a superior to commit a crime,
the individual has an obligation to not only refuse it but to report it.
All of this is very basic and taught throughout the U.S. Armed Forces as
part of basic training. It is also required refresher training
throughout each person's career.

The issue of the military's necessity to have the troops respond to
orders without question or debate is completely different. In simple
terms, we need people to follow orders. This is especially true in
combat opeations for obvious reason. The reason people are "broken down"
(I hate this term) in basic training is to make them into a team vice a
group of individuals. Of course there are many other reasons but that
wasn't part of your question so I'll stop.

Anyway, I believe most of our troops clearly understand the difference
between right & wrong, Legal and illegal orders.
The only problem is that we are dealing with humans that in the course
of complete chaos are capable of doing their jobs well, making honest
mistakes or committing horrible crimes. We've already seen examples of
all three. The ones that commit crimes/don't follow the LOAC or UCMJ
are punished as they should be. Unfortuantely, the media feasts on
turmoil so we hear about this very small percentage of criminals or
criminal behavior more than any other aspect of the war.

OK, I'm done. It's nice to see you again.. Take care Jerry

Interesting question. Speaking as one who believes and trusts in God I
would like to think God sees us as a work in progress with potential for
great things. If God were the vengeful, hell fire and brimstone God
portrayed by some, our time on this planet or at least mine would have
already ended.

By the way, nice to see you again AB. I always enjoy your posts

Jerry

Isn't it sad how this poor little rich girl has dominated the media.
They have wasted enough of our time with this and I'm sure there are
much more important things they could be reporting on like David
Hasselhoff (Sp) or Alec Balwin. Sheeesh, no wonder we are so easily
fooled by our politicians with our minds focused on thought provoking
things like this. Let's boycott TV...

Another one bites the dust... I haven't a clue as to what I did but here
I am. I shall simply dust them off and press on with life.

Hey Tom, I knew right where I would find you. Good to see you (Former
Jerry5353)