I know not all dad's are deadbeats; (in fact, I personally know some who
definitely go the extra mile, while the mother becomes the deadbeat).
However, what do we do to strengthen laws and punishment against men who
duck out after they find out they have impregnated someone? What do we
do to those who quit job after job and move from town to town, leaving
more fatherless children in their wake? What do we do to prevent them
from "diddling and ditching"? A scarlet letter, perhaps? So we can
identify those who tell the same lies to women over and over again?
Maybe a big "C" in the middle of their foreheads for "Chicken****"? What
should they be responsible for BEYOND childsupport in the financial
sense? Health and dental? Transportation to and from appointments,
extracurricular activities, etc.? Clothing for those constant and quick
growth spurts? Invitations, treats, cake , decorations, presents for
their birthday parties? Presents for friends who have invited them to
their birthday parties? Gift exchanges at school? Club and sport uniform
and supplies? Bicycle tires? Valentine cards for the class? Dye for
Easter eggs? Compensation for the days a mother takes off from work to
nurture a sick child?
What about morally, spiritually, ethically? How should those
responsiblities be defined? When jail, suspension of drivers license and
garnishment don't do it, what next? Should these guys be "fixed"? If
they don't want the responsibility of being a father, yet they don't
want to be "sterilized," should they be made to never have sex again?

wow... thats heavy stuff.

I know where you are coming from Lily. Raised my daughter by myself
from the age of 5, no luxury of child support, etc. Dad was an
alcoholic who promised her everything but delivered on nothing, really
messed up her head. Now that she is grown and a mother, she has gotten
over some of the damage, but it does take its toll. In our case, she
would have been better off not ever knowing him, would have had fewer
psychological problems growing up.
I don't know that there is a fix, castration sounds good, but guess it
is a little harsh. You can't legally force someone to have a vasectomy,
anymore than you can force them to grow some morals and become a decent
human-being.

I understand your frustration but don't know the answer. Went through
it before they cracked down on the guys, so he got off scott-free. Even
had support enforcement tell me they weren't going to bother chasing
him, too much trouble. That was in the early 80s, so the laws are a lot
different now.

yes. but i know alot of UNFIT mothers as well!

Very true 4fun. I agree 100%, it goes both ways. I even know of women
who use abortions as birth control, which is totally sick, one I knew
had at least 12 abortions, didn't want to take the pill or other birth
control. Makes me sick to think about her doing that, and she is an
unfit mother also (drugs, alcohol, the works) who now has 5 kids the
last time I heard.

There is no easy answer to this question.

yep.. i hear ya 55.... hows it going this morning/

Okay, just tired - should be in bed actually, the holidays were a lot of
work, did a lot of babysitting of grandkids, had a house full of people
yesterday, was good, but ready for a vacation now I think.

How are you doing? Guess I should warn you I don't like the holidays,
bad memories, and just want them over with.

i hate to say it but my father would fall into the list. i love em but
its true. personally, im glad i had gone through the **** that i did
when i young , always wondering why he never bothered to call on my
birthday, and then ***** to me when i was little about how my mother was
a lazy leech due to the child support he had to pay. ( which by the way
was only 70 dollars a month.) b/c i know with every ounce of my being I
WILL NEVER come close to reaching the level he was at. If i had a child
if it be planed or an unplaned happening i will do everything and
anything for that child. im proud to say i learned through his mistake.
so i guess you could say there can be some good out of it, came with a
price, but was well worth it to me.

That is true Kami - my daughter is a good mother. You sound like you
will make a great mom when it is your turn. Take care and have a good
night.

goodnite 55.

thanks for the kind words only problem im a guy hehe but i know what ya
mean none the less =P

Oh oh, sorry, I should have pulled up your profile before responding,
that was dumb, sorry. But, in all seriousness, I am glad you learned
from your dad on what not to do and grew from the experiences. Lots of
times the tradition is carried on through the children, and I am glad
you are not going to do that. Congratulations on breaking the mold.

Take care, and again, I am sorry.

hehe its all good =) thanks again, and have a good night

You too. Take care.

hi all, lily wouldn't most of what you describe fall under child
support? i know i'm going to feel the heat for this...lol

Slow - I would think so, but there are a lot of extra things that need
doing that are time consuming. I think some of what she describes (and
I can't speak for her) could be helped if the father were more involved
and helped out with some of the running around and appointments, and
that kind of thing. But, yes, I do think they expect that child support
covers most of it. I think custody and the parents getting along to
raise the child together is a big part of it. It is really hard when
you don't have any support from the absentee father or mother.

Enough said, it is past my bedtime. Have a good night. Take care.

that is true marie, goodnight. this is a debate for the ages.

Okay....let's see here....how far does $158/mo. go? $360?.....$450?
Let's say that anyone of those amounts is for more than one child. Rent
for mother and children $600/month, utilities, i.e. gas, electric,
trash, sewer, about $380/month, fuel for vehicle, $2.37/ gallon, car
insurance and maintenance $200/month, groceries for a 3 person family
per month, $320, laundry detergent, dish soap, bandaids, toothbushes and
paste, carpet bags, trash bags, shampoo, body wash, dental floss,
personal hygiene products, replacement school necessities,deodorant etc.
(name your price, if ya like).....let's say these are the basics per
month. Now, club and sports memberships/equiptment, school projects and
parties, friends b-day parties, movies, shoes, music lessons,
allowances, jeans, shirts, panties, bras, school trips...etc., etc. How
far do you think that $150-$500 per month goes depending upon amount and
# of children. What if there is an order, but no one being held
accountable to pay? What if you simply can't afford Xmas presents, or
your kids are ridiculed because they've gotten taller since school
started and there pants are "highwaters", or their feet have grown and
their shoes pinch and leave blisters? How far does child support go and
how much falls back on the shoulders of the custodian?

Well I can realate to this subject try getting $150.00 a month for two
and he still thought that was too much what can we do well the system
has come along way the laws are getting tougher even tho they will not
help for those that have already been there. I raised 2 kids on my own
for 15 years yeah it was hard but the only thing you can do is move
forward and do the best you can do. Don't dwell on the ex's actions
cause it will just cause more hate, instead just love your children and
make there lives at least as happy as you can. This problem does not
just retain to men only there are a lot of dead beat moms too. But yes
the biggest percentage are the Dad's. But if you let it eat you up it
will reflect back on the kids then you have caused just as much damage
as they did. So do what you have to in order to raise them in a loving
home let them know each and every day you love them. Not only will they
repay you in love themselves but you will know that you did the best you
could. The rewards you receive from your kids will be greater than any
treasure you could have!

What really pisses me off is when and IF the fathers or the mothers pay
the support, SOME of them worry that the money will go for the ex
-spouse....pleaseeeeeeeee.....the cost of raising a child, IF you ONLY
pay for that child's needs, goes way way beyond the little tiny bit of
child-support!!!!! I have dated some guys that ARE paying and when I
hear them gripe about the child susport, I kick their asses to the curb!