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Topic: Is 'faith' a gift?
creativesoul's photo
Sun 01/06/08 09:34 AM
Edited by creativesoul on Sun 01/06/08 09:51 AM
Faith being an unquestioning belief that does not require proof or evidence.

Is it a gift?

This question could be held under a scope for sure... equally persuasive from both sides... using empirical comparison...

What is required in order to achieve or maintain it? Nothing?

How is it even possible for one to believe in anything without their proof or evidence...

Believers in Christianity usually do have some empirical 'evidence' of why they hold to the belief. Most will, in fact, witness what they have experienced which they attribute to the higher power in testament.

That is not faith by definition. It is supported with empirical evidence.

If one had no reason to believe how could they?

Does anyone actually have deep faith without some type of evidence? Is it even possible?



SquizTheClown's photo
Sun 01/06/08 09:37 AM
I think that faith DOES require some sort of evidence on a personal level. What that is will vary for different people. I have witnessed everyday miracles in people's lives as they recover from addiction and alcoholism with the help of a Higher Power. That is enough to keep my faith going :smile:

creativesoul's photo
Sun 01/06/08 09:49 AM
Edited by creativesoul on Sun 01/06/08 09:53 AM
I completely agree.

I think everyone I have spoken with about their 'faith' has indeed spoken of why they believe. Always testifying to an event or sets of events...

But is that faith? Is that truly faith?

While often interchanged, are not faith and belief two separate notions?

Belief is the term with the broadest application in this comparison, and it implies mental acceptance of something as true, even though absolute certainty may be absent; faith implies complete unquestioning acceptance even in the absence of proof and especially of something not supported by reason.


Who can claim 'faith' without a reason or evidence?

kaylas1515's photo
Sun 01/06/08 09:53 AM
I will admit....i have faith...but i am still not quite sure if it is because i was raised to belive...or if it is because of some other happening...that is yet something i am still trying to figure out

Differentkindofwench's photo
Sun 01/06/08 09:55 AM
Belief and faith are listed as synonyms. Faith and trust can also be used synonymously.

SquizTheClown's photo
Sun 01/06/08 09:56 AM

I completely agree.

I think everyone I have spoken with about their 'faith' has indeed spoken of why they believe. Always testifying to an event or sets of events...

But is that faith? Is that truly faith?

While often interchanged, are not faith and belief two separate notions?

Belief is the term with the broadest application in this comparison, and it implies mental acceptance of something as true, even though absolute certainty may be absent; faith implies complete unquestioning acceptance even in the absence of proof and especially of something not supported by reason.


Who can claim 'faith' without a reason or evidence?


When you read in the bible, even the disciples required proof and evidence before they would display their faith

Presto's photo
Sun 01/06/08 09:57 AM
This is how our Creator defines "faith":

"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works." (James 2:17-18)

"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." (Heb. 11:1)

It is by our works that reveal we have faith. In other words, if we believe in something strong enough then it will motivate us to do something about it even if we can not visually see the evidence, however the substance will come in due time.

creativesoul's photo
Sun 01/06/08 10:00 AM
I used to believe that I had faith...

However, I wonder if it is faith or belief...

Can faith and reason exist within someone.

Is this the conundrum which brings forth the notion of man not understanding God's ways?


Differentkindofwench's photo
Sun 01/06/08 10:05 AM
To me that conundrum of people not understanding Gods ways would be your saying grace and starving people existing at the same time in another location of the world. Why do the starving people stay where they are starving?

chuck366's photo
Sun 01/06/08 10:06 AM
its a choice to receive a gift

creativesoul's photo
Sun 01/06/08 10:10 AM
Wench:

Could you clarify your statement/question. I am not sure I am understanding you.

flowerforyou

Differentkindofwench's photo
Sun 01/06/08 10:13 AM

Wench:

Could you clarify your statement/question. I am not sure I am understanding you.

flowerforyou


Which part Creative?

creativesoul's photo
Sun 01/06/08 10:18 AM
Ummm... all of it, really.

Deana64's photo
Sun 01/06/08 10:21 AM
Edited by Deana64 on Sun 01/06/08 10:23 AM
I know that there is more to just us
And a reason why we go through different life situations.
the evidence is all around us and we see it every day
it is life and the threads they weave in the connections and paths we all take
it involves the small world theory and that everything happens for a reason thing.
I know it sounds abstract but if anyone stops and thinks about it
We are here for more than just getting up going to work, and living our day to day.
if it wasn't why would we feel what we do? or react like we do in different situations.
With native teachings we are taught that we are all connected in some form or another not just Native Americans but all life
each one of us is a thread of that life
I know we came from so much more than just bacteria reacting to a big bang
for me nothing else make any sense
I do have faith in something so much bigger or more than us as we are in this form on earth


to me the evidence is you and me and everyone here and each person we come into contact with good or bad that is my evidence and I have always thought this since I was a child

chuck366's photo
Sun 01/06/08 10:21 AM

Ummm... all of it, really.


mataphoric

Differentkindofwench's photo
Sun 01/06/08 10:34 AM

I used to believe that I had faith...

However, I wonder if it is faith or belief...

Can faith and reason exist within someone.

Is this the conundrum which brings forth the notion of man not understanding God's ways?



In another thread you were talking about people saying Grace for the food they were about to eat and why would God feed one group or individual and not another. My response was in reference to that thread and your above conundrum comment. The part about people who are starving and why Do they stay where they are starving? Was me wondering out loud.

creativesoul's photo
Sun 01/06/08 11:08 AM
Of course, a notion of the absence of 'personal' divine intervention is required to understand the impersonal nature of that thread's topic.

I do not believe that God 'meddles' in human affairs... either way... good or bad...






chuck366's photo
Sun 01/06/08 11:14 AM
Thats some deep stuff, No comment.....but i'll watch

Differentkindofwench's photo
Sun 01/06/08 11:20 AM
I realize you don't. People being born in certain circumstances in order to learn certain things makes sense to me. Would that be God meddling - depends on your belief of where you actually come from.

chuck366's photo
Sun 01/06/08 11:22 AM

I realize you don't. People being born in certain circumstances in order to learn certain things makes sense to me. Would that be God meddling - depends on your belief of where you actually come from.


He knows how much you can take kinda thing before you go through it, ya mean?

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