That's it....I'm getting my gun....!!!

I kinda figured that.

That can be hard to tell from your writing. Pardon if I misunderstood.
Most of the measures we have in place are based on punishing the immigrant. Many of the border states are implementing local laws that are even more harsh as well.. Texas being one of them. None seem to be doing much of anything about actually reducing the job market that draws them in.. Corporations, businesses and private citizens who employ them are generally fined if caught.. and hardly caught at all... Almost like there is an unwritten understanding of 'Don't ask, Don't tell' going on... Just a big game of slap and tickle.

Again I ask your opinion.

Why do you think that is?

There is a secret society of the wealthy that are striving to create a New World Order. It would incorporate Mexico, America and Canada as one united economic force. Same currency, same laws. Do you know about this? I will give you all the details if not. Anyway this is the reason our government is not interested in taking the action you have suggested.

http://blog.reidreport.com/2006/06/making-mexamericanada.html

For the sake of discussion lets just assume this to be the case...

So wouldn't you agree that our focus as a Nation is pointed the wrong direction? That no matter what takes place.. the laws we pass.. Amnesty or not.. fence or not.. prisons or not.... The problem is not gonna go away until we fix the problem rather then attack the symptom?

http://www.pbs.org/weta/washingtonweek/voices/200608/0809edit0.htm

Read it.

If you build the fences you nip all of this in the bud.

I'm familiar with the concept. Thanks for the link though.

I'm very familiar with the various trappings of N.A.F.T.A. and all that it implies.. I've wasted many hours of my professional life filling out papers and trying to understand the process of doing business over both of our borders as well as overseas.

I'm of the opinion that there is not enough concrete and steel, enough natural resources to make it either... to fix our problem.

It will be our very own really long, really unmanageable and highly ineffective Berlin Wall...

Centuries from now... it will be one of the architectural wonders of the world, that sociologists will ponder over...Trying to figure out what war or conflict caused the Kingdom of the Americans to do it.

It does not take much effort to look back in history and see how this actually works out in practice compared to theory. China did it.. Rome did it... Berlin..

Apparently we will too.

"Again I ask your opinion.

Why do you think that is?"

What was the answer you were looking for?

You gave it.

Really? I just took a stab in the dark.

I wasn't looking for a specific answer.. Just your opinion.

You gave that.

What is your solution?

I implied that pages ago...

Rather then try to attack the symptom.. which is much like trying to protect our coastlines from tsunamis... Take the 90 billion we are planning on spending on walls, legislation and man power... and make it attractive to hire legal workers at living wages. Take that money and subsidize the wages and benefits of companies that are willing to be fully accountable to government oversight. In conjunction with making those who choose to profit from the illegal market accountable. Raising the risk to profit factor to where it is unreasonable to choose an illegal work force.

Enhance our borders with the latest in electronic surveillance. A technology that can effectively cover hundreds of miles from a single station, rather then rely on patrols and a physical structure that is difficult to maintain and always easily challenged.

I'm guessing that this will cost roughly half what our government is willing to throw at the problem.

Jist what you say here is key.

I remember a cat we had who delivered 9 kittens. Her love was fierce for those kittens. She would do ANYTHING to keep her strength up in order to nurse them. She would ravage our trash repeatedly even though she KNEW it was going to get her disciplined just to get more of what she needed. At the time we didn't understand her 'disobedience' but we sure do now.

If an animal will do 'whatever it takes' how much more a human being who fiercely loves and lives. End of story.

mrtxstar asked if we had his vote. well, not mine .. but heck Dave does

I take it we are talking about illegal immigrants, hmmm?

Legal immigrants DO pay taxes.

So the whole illegal immigrant thing, they DO need to go back en file legally. It is not fair to all of the other people in their country standing in line the right way en it sure creates havoc here. Have to agree with Fred Thompson on this one. En it is not just our borders....fake documents are being issued and they are FLYING over here...no problem.

Immigrants taking your job???

As far as i know they come here to take a

Chance of the opportunities

So if they take a job is cuz YOU don't want it

Plain and simple ... They DO pay taxes

My feeling exactly.

Verb

I have said this before and I will say it again, lol...

The best thing we could do at this point is a multi-faceted approach. Most problems in life are entangled with three or more other problems to begin with.

First and foremost, we need to brign every single one of our reserve and antional guardsmen back home. I do nt care where they are at, or what they are doing, they need to come home and we need to send regular military (active duty) over to replace them, as it should have been done in the first place.
Once they are all home, we need to close our borders temporarily to ALL travel in or out of the United States (except military). Again this is only tmeporary.
As far as trade goes, lets use canada as an example. We take our trucks to the border, and the driver gets out of the vehicle. the vehicle is inspected. So far its the same right? Well now, the inspector gets behind the wheel and takes it into a neutral area where their canadian counterpart is doing the same. They swap vehicles and bring the new one back to their own side to sign over to their counterpart.

Second, we need to offer amnesty TO EVERY SINGLE LAST ILLEGAL IMIGRANT HERE NO MATTER WHEN THEY GOT HERE OR WHY THEY GOT HERE. This is very important. As others have noted in the end it is our own fault they are coming over, as we, the american people, are greedy and selfish, and also lazy (people not wanting to work for minimum wage). So why punish them for trying to take advantage of our faults? Give them amnesty. And this is ONLY forthose already here. They will not be able to move thir family members over until the borders are opened back up, adn tehn they have to go through legalization like it is supposed to be.

By amnestizing everyone, they will come out in the open themselves (yes there wills till be a few that dont, but htat will be a very few). Thus we have tax-paying citizens all around instead of illegal immigrants. There are several other things tthat have to happen after this, like forced language classes on ALL non-american english speaking persons. This is after all, America where we speak English. if they want to speak something else in their own homes that is fine, but in public they need to respect the country and speak the Countrys language.
Now, while all this is going on, we need to use our part time military (national guard and reserve) for border patrol/control and airport security as well as port security. They all have to do 2 weeks of training a year every year, there is no reason they can not do it on the border or where immigration can take place, such as airports and seaports.

As we are offering amnesty, we also have to tighten the laws about employing illegal immigrants. Businesses should have to do so many audits per time frame (personally two or three a year in some places) in order to show, exactly how they are doing business and who they are paying, etc. If they are found to be in non-complaince with the law, fine them HEAVILY the first time, and give them a specific time frame in which to pay that fine or go to prison. If they are caught a second time, knowinbgly violating the law, fine them again, give them so much community service and revoke their business license(s), Revoking the license will not clsoe a business as many people think. Not automatically anyway. It will simply remove the owner(s) and overseers and replace them, keeping the business going.

These are just a few things that need to happen to fix our complacency problems. It isn ot everything, and none of these are perfect (what is). They will cost money and resources, but ehy will also help decrease illegal immigration, as well as fix other issues.

Well.. thank you for your support!
Unfortunately that would never happen. Not in my lifetime anyway. Anyone who is solution oriented in this will never hold office, let alone be on a ballot. The Good 'ol Boys club will never allow it. It simply does not make 'business' sense. The walls, laws, playing on prejudices of our population, manifesting divisions in our streets... All that, in its impracticality and ineffectiveness does. At least in the short term.

I'm sure that at some point 'We the People' will have enough of being played.. but we aren't any where close yet. Maybe when our economy and living conditions are more like the third world peoples we are trying so hard to keep out... We will have had enough. By then.. the only thing we will be throwing over the border will be ~ Politicians, legislators, lawyers and Corporate Presidents... by gun point.

Fortunately we will have a really cool wall to keep them out.

Just put mines on the border, they are extremely cheap. Make sure to put a sign in Spanish and English, just in case they can actually speak English, and that SHOULD deter people from trying to cross the border.

However, if someone is actually able to get past the minefield and enter the country then they should be given citizenship because that took some serious balls to get through a minefield to live here.

lol, I'm kidding, almost completely :D

I don't feel like adding a serious point to the topic, I have debated this so many times over.