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| Topic: What is sin, really? | |
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sounds like one personal issue out of thousands.. But it doesn't have to be. If people wouldn't push for such conformity in things, and allow for individuality, you wouldn't have these problems. The person would be much more free to make their own decisions that way than they otherwise are. you cant have only individuality in a society, more than one person is going to require some degree of conformity to function as a team...or a family, or a class, or a company, or a community,,,etc,,,, To a certain extent, but you don't wanna wound people so tight that there is NO room for individuality at all. And by expecting everyone to believe what you believe in religion and be damned if they don't, that is what you end up doing. ID say christians are as individual as anyone else, its false logic to assume that because we get 'laws' from one book of words (bible), that we are any less individual from those who get their 'laws' from another document or from men(the constitution and the congress) The bottom line is simply this, how can we be free to be who we are or wish to become, when according to you we HAVE to go in one direction to have any life past this one? That simply does not work, I don't care how you try to twist it. There is NO room for individuality if you have to conform to something or someone to stay alive. Period. Besides, what would be the point of God making us the way He did, with the ability to do anything we want to do, to make of our lives whatever we wish to make them only to say: "Oh but you must do this this and this or you'll die". It makes not a bit of sense! If God wanted obedient slaves he'd have made us that way. He didn't though. We are made as we are for a reason, and bowing down to some being in the sky isn't it. what is the point of being able to travel if I Have to go WEst to reach california... thats what the question seems like to me I do have the choice, in my life or in my car, of which paths to take, but I dont have the choice of where the paths lead,, they lead where they lead But see the whole thing is, there's a HUGE difference between that and this. If you don't wanna go to California, nothing is holding you back from not going. You are totally free to go somewhere else, and there's no death threats over your head if you do that. The same can not be said of the Bible God. The thing is entirely fear based and I refuse to believe that a loving God would use fear. No that's all man. Also as a sidenote, when you travel somewhere, there are always different ways to get to where you want. You are not limited to one way. Why should God be any different? Why can't all paths go back to the source? And no a book saying different doesn't count as proof of your side either. You're gonna need more than that. |
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Edited by
esebulldog
on
Mon 08/29/11 07:29 PM
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I do have the choice, in my life or in my car, of which paths to take, but I dont have the choice of where the paths lead,, they lead where they lead food for thought |
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Edited by
CowboyGH
on
Mon 08/29/11 07:34 PM
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sounds like one personal issue out of thousands.. But it doesn't have to be. If people wouldn't push for such conformity in things, and allow for individuality, you wouldn't have these problems. The person would be much more free to make their own decisions that way than they otherwise are. you cant have only individuality in a society, more than one person is going to require some degree of conformity to function as a team...or a family, or a class, or a company, or a community,,,etc,,,, To a certain extent, but you don't wanna wound people so tight that there is NO room for individuality at all. And by expecting everyone to believe what you believe in religion and be damned if they don't, that is what you end up doing. ID say christians are as individual as anyone else, its false logic to assume that because we get 'laws' from one book of words (bible), that we are any less individual from those who get their 'laws' from another document or from men(the constitution and the congress) The bottom line is simply this, how can we be free to be who we are or wish to become, when according to you we HAVE to go in one direction to have any life past this one? That simply does not work, I don't care how you try to twist it. There is NO room for individuality if you have to conform to something or someone to stay alive. Period. Besides, what would be the point of God making us the way He did, with the ability to do anything we want to do, to make of our lives whatever we wish to make them only to say: "Oh but you must do this this and this or you'll die". It makes not a bit of sense! If God wanted obedient slaves he'd have made us that way. He didn't though. We are made as we are for a reason, and bowing down to some being in the sky isn't it. what is the point of being able to travel if I Have to go WEst to reach california... thats what the question seems like to me I do have the choice, in my life or in my car, of which paths to take, but I dont have the choice of where the paths lead,, they lead where they lead But see the whole thing is, there's a HUGE difference between that and this. If you don't wanna go to California, nothing is holding you back from not going. You are totally free to go somewhere else, and there's no death threats over your head if you do that. The same can not be said of the Bible God. The thing is entirely fear based and I refuse to believe that a loving God would use fear. No that's all man. Also as a sidenote, when you travel somewhere, there are always different ways to get to where you want. You are not limited to one way. Why should God be any different? Why can't all paths go back to the source? And no a book saying different doesn't count as proof of your side either. You're gonna need more than that. What are you talking about? There are no fear threats, no threats even. We do not worship, praise, and believe out of fear. We have a RELATIONSHIP with God our father. And besides that, there is nothing holding you back from not going to heaven. Heaven is a certain destination, as in your example California. If you do not follow the path that goes to California, you will not get there. If you do not follow the path to heaven, you will not get there. God has only made one route to Heaven. Doesn't make it any less important, doesn't demean it in any way, doesn't make it any bit less then if there was 5 different routes. And once again because you are entirely stuck on it. THERE IS NO FEAR. THERE IS NO THREATS. People don't believe out of fear, because there would be nothing to fear in the first place if one didn't believe. So your believing out of fear totally falls apart right there. |
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sounds like one personal issue out of thousands.. But it doesn't have to be. If people wouldn't push for such conformity in things, and allow for individuality, you wouldn't have these problems. The person would be much more free to make their own decisions that way than they otherwise are. you cant have only individuality in a society, more than one person is going to require some degree of conformity to function as a team...or a family, or a class, or a company, or a community,,,etc,,,, To a certain extent, but you don't wanna wound people so tight that there is NO room for individuality at all. And by expecting everyone to believe what you believe in religion and be damned if they don't, that is what you end up doing. ID say christians are as individual as anyone else, its false logic to assume that because we get 'laws' from one book of words (bible), that we are any less individual from those who get their 'laws' from another document or from men(the constitution and the congress) The bottom line is simply this, how can we be free to be who we are or wish to become, when according to you we HAVE to go in one direction to have any life past this one? That simply does not work, I don't care how you try to twist it. There is NO room for individuality if you have to conform to something or someone to stay alive. Period. Besides, what would be the point of God making us the way He did, with the ability to do anything we want to do, to make of our lives whatever we wish to make them only to say: "Oh but you must do this this and this or you'll die". It makes not a bit of sense! If God wanted obedient slaves he'd have made us that way. He didn't though. We are made as we are for a reason, and bowing down to some being in the sky isn't it. what is the point of being able to travel if I Have to go WEst to reach california... thats what the question seems like to me I do have the choice, in my life or in my car, of which paths to take, but I dont have the choice of where the paths lead,, they lead where they lead But see the whole thing is, there's a HUGE difference between that and this. If you don't wanna go to California, nothing is holding you back from not going. You are totally free to go somewhere else, and there's no death threats over your head if you do that. The same can not be said of the Bible God. The thing is entirely fear based and I refuse to believe that a loving God would use fear. No that's all man. Also as a sidenote, when you travel somewhere, there are always different ways to get to where you want. You are not limited to one way. Why should God be any different? Why can't all paths go back to the source? And no a book saying different doesn't count as proof of your side either. You're gonna need more than that. What are you talking about? There are no fear threats, no threats even. We do not worship, praise, and believe out of fear. We have a RELATIONSHIP with God our father. Uh ACCEPT MY RELIGION OR DIE IS A THREAT! You'd have to be biased to prove it not, to not see that. |
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sounds like one personal issue out of thousands.. But it doesn't have to be. If people wouldn't push for such conformity in things, and allow for individuality, you wouldn't have these problems. The person would be much more free to make their own decisions that way than they otherwise are. you cant have only individuality in a society, more than one person is going to require some degree of conformity to function as a team...or a family, or a class, or a company, or a community,,,etc,,,, To a certain extent, but you don't wanna wound people so tight that there is NO room for individuality at all. And by expecting everyone to believe what you believe in religion and be damned if they don't, that is what you end up doing. ID say christians are as individual as anyone else, its false logic to assume that because we get 'laws' from one book of words (bible), that we are any less individual from those who get their 'laws' from another document or from men(the constitution and the congress) The bottom line is simply this, how can we be free to be who we are or wish to become, when according to you we HAVE to go in one direction to have any life past this one? That simply does not work, I don't care how you try to twist it. There is NO room for individuality if you have to conform to something or someone to stay alive. Period. Besides, what would be the point of God making us the way He did, with the ability to do anything we want to do, to make of our lives whatever we wish to make them only to say: "Oh but you must do this this and this or you'll die". It makes not a bit of sense! If God wanted obedient slaves he'd have made us that way. He didn't though. We are made as we are for a reason, and bowing down to some being in the sky isn't it. what is the point of being able to travel if I Have to go WEst to reach california... thats what the question seems like to me I do have the choice, in my life or in my car, of which paths to take, but I dont have the choice of where the paths lead,, they lead where they lead But see the whole thing is, there's a HUGE difference between that and this. If you don't wanna go to California, nothing is holding you back from not going. You are totally free to go somewhere else, and there's no death threats over your head if you do that. The same can not be said of the Bible God. The thing is entirely fear based and I refuse to believe that a loving God would use fear. No that's all man. Also as a sidenote, when you travel somewhere, there are always different ways to get to where you want. You are not limited to one way. Why should God be any different? Why can't all paths go back to the source? And no a book saying different doesn't count as proof of your side either. You're gonna need more than that. What are you talking about? There are no fear threats, no threats even. We do not worship, praise, and believe out of fear. We have a RELATIONSHIP with God our father. Uh ACCEPT MY RELIGION OR DIE IS A THREAT! You'd have to be biased to prove it not, to not see that. No, there's no where you'll find it say anything like that. Eternal life is a GIFT, it is a reward for our obedience. Death is automatically the end of one's life. Just God offers eternal life if one wishes to accept it. |
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Edited by
MorningSong
on
Mon 08/29/11 09:51 PM
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EXCEPT God thru the Holy Spirit first DRAW man unto
Him, NO MAN WILL BELIEVE. We don't and simply CAN'T on our own strength,just believe out of the blue(if we could just believe on our own, then we would be doing and getting all the credit for the the work ....and not the Holy Spirit). God DRAWS us and PREPARES our heart ... FIRST...that is how we finally come to believe...thru FAITH that comes from God.....but again, God first WOOOOS us unto Him. God is our Saviour...we cannot DECIDE WHEN to get saved....it is actually God drawing us, and finally completing the work in us. |
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See I don't buy into that anymore, all that does is strip us of the power we hold as human beings. Religion makes us less than we really are. We are not sinners, destined for death or hell without God, we are not people who are not capable of good on our own, these are all lies of man to keep us down. What good parent would ever tell their kids ideas like these? None would, and if we know better God surely does as well.
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sounds like one personal issue out of thousands.. But it doesn't have to be. If people wouldn't push for such conformity in things, and allow for individuality, you wouldn't have these problems. The person would be much more free to make their own decisions that way than they otherwise are. you cant have only individuality in a society, more than one person is going to require some degree of conformity to function as a team...or a family, or a class, or a company, or a community,,,etc,,,, To a certain extent, but you don't wanna wound people so tight that there is NO room for individuality at all. And by expecting everyone to believe what you believe in religion and be damned if they don't, that is what you end up doing. ID say christians are as individual as anyone else, its false logic to assume that because we get 'laws' from one book of words (bible), that we are any less individual from those who get their 'laws' from another document or from men(the constitution and the congress) The bottom line is simply this, how can we be free to be who we are or wish to become, when according to you we HAVE to go in one direction to have any life past this one? That simply does not work, I don't care how you try to twist it. There is NO room for individuality if you have to conform to something or someone to stay alive. Period. Besides, what would be the point of God making us the way He did, with the ability to do anything we want to do, to make of our lives whatever we wish to make them only to say: "Oh but you must do this this and this or you'll die". It makes not a bit of sense! If God wanted obedient slaves he'd have made us that way. He didn't though. We are made as we are for a reason, and bowing down to some being in the sky isn't it. what is the point of being able to travel if I Have to go WEst to reach california... thats what the question seems like to me I do have the choice, in my life or in my car, of which paths to take, but I dont have the choice of where the paths lead,, they lead where they lead But see the whole thing is, there's a HUGE difference between that and this. If you don't wanna go to California, nothing is holding you back from not going. You are totally free to go somewhere else, and there's no death threats over your head if you do that. The same can not be said of the Bible God. The thing is entirely fear based and I refuse to believe that a loving God would use fear. No that's all man. Also as a sidenote, when you travel somewhere, there are always different ways to get to where you want. You are not limited to one way. Why should God be any different? Why can't all paths go back to the source? And no a book saying different doesn't count as proof of your side either. You're gonna need more than that. What are you talking about? There are no fear threats, no threats even. We do not worship, praise, and believe out of fear. We have a RELATIONSHIP with God our father. Uh ACCEPT MY RELIGION OR DIE IS A THREAT! You'd have to be biased to prove it not, to not see that. No, there's no where you'll find it say anything like that. Eternal life is a GIFT, it is a reward for our obedience. Death is automatically the end of one's life. Just God offers eternal life if one wishes to accept it. But your God kills the soul, so yes again that IS a threat. It's not like you're being told: "You can do that......but be warned of what is there if you go that road" because in that type of case you are not the one actively making the consequence happen, you're merely warning the person of the consequence or potential consequence. But when YOU are making the consequence happen, it's different, and very much a threat. You are not gonna be able to convince me different. |
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Kleisto...God gently CONVICTS..God never Condemns.....
Get away from anything or anyone that is making you feel beaten down. Religion does that. NOT God . |
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Edited by
Kleisto
on
Mon 08/29/11 11:42 PM
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Kleisto...God gently CONVICTS..God never Condemns..... Get away from anything or anyone that is making you feel beaten down. Religion does that. NOT God . Yes I know this, and it's why I don't believe in any religion anymore, and that includes Christianity. Since I left it all, I've felt very very different about things. It's changed me for the good, as I see myself, others, and life as a whole in a whole other way. |
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sounds like one personal issue out of thousands.. But it doesn't have to be. If people wouldn't push for such conformity in things, and allow for individuality, you wouldn't have these problems. The person would be much more free to make their own decisions that way than they otherwise are. you cant have only individuality in a society, more than one person is going to require some degree of conformity to function as a team...or a family, or a class, or a company, or a community,,,etc,,,, To a certain extent, but you don't wanna wound people so tight that there is NO room for individuality at all. And by expecting everyone to believe what you believe in religion and be damned if they don't, that is what you end up doing. ID say christians are as individual as anyone else, its false logic to assume that because we get 'laws' from one book of words (bible), that we are any less individual from those who get their 'laws' from another document or from men(the constitution and the congress) The bottom line is simply this, how can we be free to be who we are or wish to become, when according to you we HAVE to go in one direction to have any life past this one? That simply does not work, I don't care how you try to twist it. There is NO room for individuality if you have to conform to something or someone to stay alive. Period. Besides, what would be the point of God making us the way He did, with the ability to do anything we want to do, to make of our lives whatever we wish to make them only to say: "Oh but you must do this this and this or you'll die". It makes not a bit of sense! If God wanted obedient slaves he'd have made us that way. He didn't though. We are made as we are for a reason, and bowing down to some being in the sky isn't it. what is the point of being able to travel if I Have to go WEst to reach california... thats what the question seems like to me I do have the choice, in my life or in my car, of which paths to take, but I dont have the choice of where the paths lead,, they lead where they lead But see the whole thing is, there's a HUGE difference between that and this. If you don't wanna go to California, nothing is holding you back from not going. You are totally free to go somewhere else, and there's no death threats over your head if you do that. The same can not be said of the Bible God. The thing is entirely fear based and I refuse to believe that a loving God would use fear. No that's all man. Also as a sidenote, when you travel somewhere, there are always different ways to get to where you want. You are not limited to one way. Why should God be any different? Why can't all paths go back to the source? And no a book saying different doesn't count as proof of your side either. You're gonna need more than that. Not really, If I start in Nevada, I have to go West to get to California,, I can go North and then west, or South and then west, or I can take a longer route, but eventually , I will need to head back in a westerly direction. And I am not afraid of death so I dont see the reality of death as a threat. If what you got from 'a book' was fear, that was your experience and your reason for believing what you do. It was nothing close to what I got from ' a book' though. |
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There is a lot of Religiousity out there , being
presented under the "quise" of Christianity. I would run from it too. Be at Peace and Be Blessed Now, Kleisto. |
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sounds like one personal issue out of thousands.. But it doesn't have to be. If people wouldn't push for such conformity in things, and allow for individuality, you wouldn't have these problems. The person would be much more free to make their own decisions that way than they otherwise are. you cant have only individuality in a society, more than one person is going to require some degree of conformity to function as a team...or a family, or a class, or a company, or a community,,,etc,,,, To a certain extent, but you don't wanna wound people so tight that there is NO room for individuality at all. And by expecting everyone to believe what you believe in religion and be damned if they don't, that is what you end up doing. ID say christians are as individual as anyone else, its false logic to assume that because we get 'laws' from one book of words (bible), that we are any less individual from those who get their 'laws' from another document or from men(the constitution and the congress) The bottom line is simply this, how can we be free to be who we are or wish to become, when according to you we HAVE to go in one direction to have any life past this one? That simply does not work, I don't care how you try to twist it. There is NO room for individuality if you have to conform to something or someone to stay alive. Period. Besides, what would be the point of God making us the way He did, with the ability to do anything we want to do, to make of our lives whatever we wish to make them only to say: "Oh but you must do this this and this or you'll die". It makes not a bit of sense! If God wanted obedient slaves he'd have made us that way. He didn't though. We are made as we are for a reason, and bowing down to some being in the sky isn't it. what is the point of being able to travel if I Have to go WEst to reach california... thats what the question seems like to me I do have the choice, in my life or in my car, of which paths to take, but I dont have the choice of where the paths lead,, they lead where they lead But see the whole thing is, there's a HUGE difference between that and this. If you don't wanna go to California, nothing is holding you back from not going. You are totally free to go somewhere else, and there's no death threats over your head if you do that. The same can not be said of the Bible God. The thing is entirely fear based and I refuse to believe that a loving God would use fear. No that's all man. Also as a sidenote, when you travel somewhere, there are always different ways to get to where you want. You are not limited to one way. Why should God be any different? Why can't all paths go back to the source? And no a book saying different doesn't count as proof of your side either. You're gonna need more than that. What are you talking about? There are no fear threats, no threats even. We do not worship, praise, and believe out of fear. We have a RELATIONSHIP with God our father. Uh ACCEPT MY RELIGION OR DIE IS A THREAT! You'd have to be biased to prove it not, to not see that. man has labeled 'religions', it is not in the bible that we must believe 'a religion'. IT is in the bible that we will all experience a MORTAL death, not a threat, a reality. IT is also explained that there is one through which we can live beyond our 'mortal' death into an 'immortal' eternity as I said, if what you got was 'believe this religion or die', that explains why you dont choose to believe it I got that death comes to us all, our earthly bodies return to the earth no matter what we believe. But that if we seek the one that is Beyond the grave and if he judges us worthy, we can receive spiritual eternity once our earthly existence has passed. |
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All sin r equal der is no big sin none small sin,he dat stol ample is d same as he who rape or kidnap.God dos not rate sin.But d only sin dat cannot b 4gven is d sin against d holy spirit which canot b 4gven.
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Not really, If I start in Nevada, I have to go West to get to California,, I can go North and then west, or South and then west, or I can take a longer route, but eventually , I will need to head back in a westerly direction. not so in the least, mh. we live on a sphere. i can and have flown east, never taking up a westerly heading, flown around the world from oakland and my last refuling stop was honolulu which is 2200 nautical miles west of the point i began my journey. my compass always read northeast, east or southeast but never a westerly heading. try this one though. you're at the north pole. which heading would you steer to reach oakland? which heading to paris, austrailia? all are directly to the south are they not? but which south do you steer to get to oakland? |
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Not really, If I start in Nevada, I have to go West to get to California,, I can go North and then west, or South and then west, or I can take a longer route, but eventually , I will need to head back in a westerly direction. not so in the least, mh. we live on a sphere. i can and have flown east, never taking up a westerly heading, flown around the world from oakland and my last refuling stop was honolulu which is 2200 nautical miles west of the point i began my journey. my compass always read northeast, east or southeast but never a westerly heading. try this one though. you're at the north pole. which heading would you steer to reach oakland? which heading to paris, austrailia? all are directly to the south are they not? but which south do you steer to get to oakland? That's an interesting question. You should either have to have a global positioning system or else travel by the stars or position of the sun. |
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Not really, If I start in Nevada, I have to go West to get to California,, I can go North and then west, or South and then west, or I can take a longer route, but eventually , I will need to head back in a westerly direction. not so in the least, mh. we live on a sphere. i can and have flown east, never taking up a westerly heading, flown around the world from oakland and my last refuling stop was honolulu which is 2200 nautical miles west of the point i began my journey. my compass always read northeast, east or southeast but never a westerly heading. try this one though. you're at the north pole. which heading would you steer to reach oakland? which heading to paris, austrailia? all are directly to the south are they not? but which south do you steer to get to oakland? You're speaking of a direction on a spherical plain though. The path to God is not spherical, it's a straight one way path. One can either take this path, or not. |
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JB is right, using navigational references in regard to the sphere of the earth and 'magnetic' north
I wasnt really speaking along those lines, so much as thinking in terms of a flat map its all relative, kind of like our spiritual interpretation of the bible,,, |
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JB is right, using navigational references in regard to the sphere of the earth and 'magnetic' north I wasnt really speaking along those lines, so much as thinking in terms of a flat map its all relative, kind of like our spiritual interpretation of the bible,,, Exactly, spherical directions can not be used, for the path to Heaven is straight. Matthew 7:14 14Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. |
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sounds like one personal issue out of thousands.. But it doesn't have to be. If people wouldn't push for such conformity in things, and allow for individuality, you wouldn't have these problems. The person would be much more free to make their own decisions that way than they otherwise are. you cant have only individuality in a society, more than one person is going to require some degree of conformity to function as a team...or a family, or a class, or a company, or a community,,,etc,,,, To a certain extent, but you don't wanna wound people so tight that there is NO room for individuality at all. And by expecting everyone to believe what you believe in religion and be damned if they don't, that is what you end up doing. ID say christians are as individual as anyone else, its false logic to assume that because we get 'laws' from one book of words (bible), that we are any less individual from those who get their 'laws' from another document or from men(the constitution and the congress) The bottom line is simply this, how can we be free to be who we are or wish to become, when according to you we HAVE to go in one direction to have any life past this one? That simply does not work, I don't care how you try to twist it. There is NO room for individuality if you have to conform to something or someone to stay alive. Period. Besides, what would be the point of God making us the way He did, with the ability to do anything we want to do, to make of our lives whatever we wish to make them only to say: "Oh but you must do this this and this or you'll die". It makes not a bit of sense! If God wanted obedient slaves he'd have made us that way. He didn't though. We are made as we are for a reason, and bowing down to some being in the sky isn't it. what is the point of being able to travel if I Have to go WEst to reach california... thats what the question seems like to me I do have the choice, in my life or in my car, of which paths to take, but I dont have the choice of where the paths lead,, they lead where they lead But see the whole thing is, there's a HUGE difference between that and this. If you don't wanna go to California, nothing is holding you back from not going. You are totally free to go somewhere else, and there's no death threats over your head if you do that. The same can not be said of the Bible God. The thing is entirely fear based and I refuse to believe that a loving God would use fear. No that's all man. Also as a sidenote, when you travel somewhere, there are always different ways to get to where you want. You are not limited to one way. Why should God be any different? Why can't all paths go back to the source? And no a book saying different doesn't count as proof of your side either. You're gonna need more than that. Not really, If I start in Nevada, I have to go West to get to California,, I can go North and then west, or South and then west, or I can take a longer route, but eventually , I will need to head back in a westerly direction. You're missing the point. There are several different routes you can take that will lead you to where you want to go, you are not limited to just one. What makes you think an unlimited being would make things any different? |
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