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Topic: When the Bible is discredited...
Dragoness Joined Wed 10/17/07 Posts: 23320	Mon 07/04/11 11:55 AM
Um ... OK ... People that don't believe in the Bible have been saying this for decades. Have yet to see anyone prove anything false in the Bible. Actually, I have a few stories of people that went out to prove it false and ended up being Christian in the process. Where are the people and evidence you suggest exists???? You made a wild claim that Abraham WILL be proven to be a fictional character. No evidence, just a BELIEF that will be true at some random point in the future. You know I just don't get these people either. I just spent a week of my time telling them how they can study and find out if this is true or not and as soon as I turn my back they are back to bashing (in the name of love). I'm afraid they are losing credibility with me bigtime. You know I find that funny, cause I see a lot of Christians bashing in the same way, in the name of their version of love. That's about the definition of the pot calling the kettle black if you ask me. Further, maybe some people HAVE studied, and just came to a different conclusion than you did. Just because they don't believe what you believe, doesn't mean they're wrong. This I find fascinating. Those that argue against Christianity are fairly angry, or at least appear to be, towards Christians. They get mad at Christians for being exclusionary and say that Christians hate. The Christian response is generally, just open your heart and accept people for who they are. Then these same people that beat up Christians, congratulate each other on how loving and accepting they are towards everyone, (except Christians but they never mention that.) No, we have no problem with you, EXCEPT when you shove your beliefs down our throats when we don't care to hear it. If you wanna believe what you do, that's fine, no one is going to tell you can't, even if we don't agree with it. But when you start to say your belief is for everyone, that's where you cross the line. It's a line many Christians cross, whether they realize it or not. So don't even tell me, that Christians accept people as they are, because if they did, they wouldn't push their ideas of change onto people who don't think or live their lives the way they do. Granted not all Christians may do that, but I'd bet a good portion of them do, be it consciously or subconsciously. Um, actually, the OP in this thread is saying I shouldn't believe in it and I am wrong to do so. But when you start to say your belief is for everyone, that's where you cross the line. Seriously? Your belief is for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Atheism is a for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Islam is for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Buddhism is for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Apparently, Christianity is not allowed in this category. Seems today's prevailing attitude is: "You can be Christian if you are now. That is OK. But you aren't allowed to infest others or your children with it." Poor victimized Christians, have had it their way so long they can't see the advantages they have had. Now it time to level the playing field and they are "being mistreated"...lol When you see the bible verse on the government building I bet you don't think, "how come there isn't a verse from all of these texts:" Ancient Greece Homeric Hymns Theogony [edit] Asatru Havamal Eddas [edit] Atenism Great Hymn to the Aten [edit] Ayyavazhi The Akilathirattu Ammanai The Arul Nool [edit] Bahá'í Faith The Kitáb-i-Aqdas Kitáb-i-Íqán other Bahá'í literature including works from other faiths [edit] Bön Bon Kangyur and Tengyur [edit] Buddhism Ancient style of scripture used for the Pāli Canon See also: Buddhist texts Theravada Buddhism The Tipitaka or Pāli Canon Vinaya Pitaka Sutta Pitaka Digha Nikaya, the "long" discourses. Majjhima Nikaya, the "middle-length" discourses. Samyutta Nikaya, the "connected" discourses. Anguttara Nikaya, the "numerical" discourses. Khuddaka Nikaya, the "minor collection". Abhidhamma Pitaka East Asian Mahayana The Chinese Diamond Sutra, the oldest known dated printed book in the world, printed in the 9th year of Xiantong Era of the Tang Dynasty, or 868 CE. British Library. The Chinese Buddhist Tripiṭaka, including Diamond Sutra and the Heart Sutra Shurangama Sutra and its Shurangama Mantra Pure Land Buddhism Infinite Life Sutra Amitabha Sutra Contemplation Sutra other Pure Land Sutras Tiantai, Tendai, and Nichiren Lotus Sutra Shingon Mahavairocana Sutra Vajrasekhara Sutra Tibetan Buddhism Tibetan Kangyur and Tengyur [edit] Cheondoism The Donghak Scripture The Songs of Yongdam The Sermons of Master Haeweol The Sermons of Revered Teacher Euiam[4] [edit] Christianity Further information: Christian biblical canons Christian Bible, 1407 handwritten copy The Bible. For all branches of Christianity - Catholicism, Protestantism and Orthodox - 66 canonical books of the Bible is the main scripture. In addition, Catholicism includes the Deuterocanonical books, the Orthodox Church includes the Anagignoskomena and Antilegomena (the Ethiopian Orthodox Church adds The Book of Enoch). Cerdonianism and Marcionism Gospel of Marcion (similar to the Gospel of Luke) Pauline epistles Nag Hammadi texts Gnosticism Nag Hammadi library and other Gnostic texts (not from the Bible) Some books of the Old Testament and New Testament Cover page of The Book of Mormon from an original 1830 edition, by Joseph Smith, Jr. (Image from the U.S. Library of Congress Rare Book and Special Collections Division.) Latter Day Saint movement See also: Standard Works The Bible in King James' version The Book of Mormon The Pearl of Great Price The Doctrine and Covenants [edit] Confucianism The Five Classics The Four Books The Thirteen Classics [edit] Discordianism The Principia Discordia [edit] Druze Rasa'il al-hikmah (Epistles of Wisdom) [edit] Ancient Egyptian religion Pyramid texts from Teti I's pyramid. Old Kingdom Pyramid Texts First Intermediate Period & Middle Kingdom Coffin Texts Second Intermediate Period The Book of the Dead Book of Caverns Book of Gates Amduat Book of the Heavenly Cow Litany of Re [edit] Etruscan religion The Cippus of Perugia, 3rd or 2nd century BCE Cippus Perusinus Liber Linteus Pyrgi Tablets Tabula Cortonensis [edit] Hermeticism Hermetica, Emerald Tablet and associated writings [edit] Hinduism Main article: Hindu texts The Bhagavad Gita is Lord Krishna's counsel to Arjuna on the battlefield of the Kurukshetra. Śruti Vedas Rig Veda Sama Veda Yajur Veda Atharva Veda Brahmanas Aranyakas Upanishads Smriti Itihāsas Mahābhārata (including the Bhagavad Gita) Bhagavad Gita Ramayana Puranas (List) Bhagavata Purana Tantras Sutras (List) Stotras Ashtavakra Gita Gherand Samhita Gita Govinda Hatha Yoga Pradipika Yoga Vasistha In Purva Mimamsa Purva Mimamsa Sutras In Vedanta (Uttar Mimamsa) Brahma Sutras of Vyasa In Yoga Yoga Sutras of Patanjali In Samkhya Samkhya Sutras of Kapila In Nyaya Nyāya Sūtras of Gautama In Vaisheshika Vaisheshika Sutras of Kanada In Vaishnavism Vaikhanasa Samhitas Pancaratra Samhitas In Saktism Sakta Tantras In Kashmir Saivism 64 Bhairavagamas 28 Shaiva Agamas Shiva Sutras of Vasugupta Vijnana Bhairava Tantra In Pashupata Shaivism Pashupata Sutras of Lakulish Panchartha-bhashya of Kaundinya (a commentary on the Pashupata Sutras) Ganakarika Ratnatika of Bhasarvajna In Shaiva Siddhanta 28 Saiva Agamas Tirumurai (canon of 12 works) Meykandar Shastras (canon of 14 works) In Gaudiya Vaishnavism Brahma Samhita Jayadeva's Gita Govinda Krishna-karnamrita Chaitanya Bhagavata Chaitanya Charitamrita Prema-bhakti-candrika Hari-bhakti-vilasa In Kabir Panth poems of Kabir In Dadu Panth poems of Dadu [edit] Islam 11th Century North African Qur’an in the British Museum Main article: Islamic holy books Qur'an (also referred to as Kuran, Koran, Qur’ān, Coran or al-Qur’ān) Hadith (oral traditions of the words and deeds of Muhammad) [edit] Jainism Main article: Jain Agamas Svetambara 11 Angas Secondary 12 Upangas, 4 Mula-sutras, 6 Cheda-sutras, 2 Culika-sutras, 10 Prakirnakas Digambara Karmaprabhrita, also called Satkhandagama Kashayaprabhrita Nonsectarian/Nonspecific Jina Vijaya Tattvartha Sutra GandhaHasti Mahabhashya (authoritative and oldest commentary on the Tattvartha Sutra) [edit] Judaism A Sefer Torah opened for liturgical use in a synagogue service Rabbinical Judaism The Tanakh (Hebrew Bible) Torah (teachings) Nevi'im (prophets) Ketuvim (writings) The Talmud Mishnah Gemara Karaite Judaism The Tanakh Beta Israel The Tanakh with several apocrypha [edit] LaVeyan Satanism The Satanic Bible The Satanic Bible (primary text) The Satanic Rituals (contains additional rituals) [edit] Lingayatism Siddhanta Shikhamani Vachana sahitya Mantra Gopya Shoonya Sampadane 28 Agamas Karana Hasuge Basava Purana [edit] Mandaeanism The Ginza Rba Book of the Zodiac Qolusta, Canonical Prayerbook Book of John the Baptizer Diwan Abatur, Purgatories 1012 Questions Coronation of Shislam Rba Baptism of Hibil Ziwa Haran Gawaita [edit] Manichaeism The Evangelion (Greek, Coptic: Ευαγγελιον, meaning roughly "good news"). Also known as the Gospel of Mani and The Living Gospel the Treasure of Life the Pragmateia (Coptic: πραγματεία) the Book of Mysteries the Book of Giants the Epistles the Psalms and Prayers. A Coptic Manichaean Psalter, discovered in Egypt in the early 1900s, was edited and published by Charles Allberry from Manichaean manuscripts in the Chester Beatty collection and in the Berlin Academy, 1938-9. The Shabuhragan The Arzhang The Kephalaia (Κεφαλαια), "Discourses", found in Coptic translation. [edit] Meher Baba Cover of God Speaks God Speaks [edit] New Age religions Various New Age religions may regard any of the following texts as inspired: A Course in Miracles Conversations with God Oahspe The Urantia Book Isis Unveiled [edit] Orphism Orphic Poems [edit] Rastafari movement The Bible the Holy Piby the Kebra Negast The speeches and writings of Haile Selassie I Royal Parchment Scroll of Black Supremacy [edit] Ravidassia The Amritbani Guru Ravidass Ji [edit] Samaritanism The Samaritan Torah [edit] Scientology Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health List of Scientology texts [edit] Shinto The Kojiki The Nihon Shoki or Nihongi [edit] Sikhism Illuminated Guru Granth folio with Mul Mantar(basic religion mantra) with signature of Guru Gobind Singh. Main article: Sikh scriptures The Guru Granth Sahib The Dasven Padshah Da Granth [edit] Spiritism The Spirits Book The Book on Mediums The Gospel According to Spiritism Heaven and Hell The Genesis According to Spiritism [edit] Sumerian The Barton Cylinder [edit] Swedenborgianism The Bible The works of Emanuel Swedenborg [edit] Taoism Tao Te Ching Zhuangzi (book) Daozang [edit] Tenrikyo The Ofudesaki The Mikagura-uta The Osashizu [edit] Thelema Holy Books of Thelema especially The Book of the Law [edit] Unification Church Divine Principle [edit] Wicca Book of Shadows Charge of the Goddess Threefold Law [edit] Yazidi Yazidi Black Book Yazidi Book of Revelation [edit] Zoroastrianism Yasna 28.1 (Bodleian MS J2) Primary religious texts, that is, the Avesta collection: The Yasna, the primary liturgical collection, includes the Gathas. The Visperad, a collection of supplements to the Yasna. The Yashts, hymns in honor of the divinities. The Vendidad, describes the various forms of evil spirits and ways to confound them. shorter texts and prayers, the Yashts the five Nyaishes ("worship, praise"), the Sirozeh and the Afringans (blessings). There are some 60 secondary religious texts, none of which are considered scripture. The most important of these are: The Denkard (middle Persian, 'Acts of Religion'), The Bundahishn, (middle Persian, 'Primordial Creation') The Menog-i Khrad, (middle Persian, 'Spirit of Wisdom') The Arda Viraf Namak (middle Persian, 'The Book of Arda Viraf') The Sad-dar (modern Persian, 'Hundred Doors', or 'Hundred Chapters') The Rivayats, 15th-18th century correspondence on religious issues For general use by the laity: The Zend (lit. commentaries), various commentaries on and translations of the Avesta. The Khordeh Avesta, a collection of everyday prayers from the Avesta. Or how about swearing you in court. How come these books are not used since all religions are equal in this country? When there is a prayer at the ball game how come there isn't one said for all religions? When someone in the government speaks of god, how come they don't say god, gods and goddesses or whatever you believe in, instead of just saying one god for the Christian god? Poor poor Christians, having to concede some of their advantage in order to be fair. Sad days indeed.

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 11:56 AM
encourage the young men to be self-controlled. 7 In everything set them an example by doing what is good. In your teaching show integrity, seriousness 8 and soundness of speech that cannot be condemned, so that those who oppose you may be ashamed because they have nothing bad to say about us

Dragoness Joined Wed 10/17/07 Posts: 23320	Mon 07/04/11 11:58 AM
Don’t have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels. 24 And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful. 25 Opponents must be gently instructed, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth, 26 and that they will come to their senses But they are not qualified to teach. That is the problem. They have too much to learn before they are able to teach. Bible verses although interesting, are not the truth and light in no way.

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 11:59 AM
But avoid foolish controversies and genealogies and arguments and quarrels about the law, because these are unprofitable and useless. 10 Warn a divisive person once, and then warn them a second time. After that, have nothing to do with them.

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 12:03 PM
You need milk, not solid food! 13 Anyone who lives on milk, being still an infant, is not acquainted with the teaching about righteousness. 14 But solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil.

Dragoness Joined Wed 10/17/07 Posts: 23320	Mon 07/04/11 12:04 PM
Trying to beat them down with the bible again huh? Figures. When all else fails just keep repeating the same things from a book of fables until everyone stops listening and shuts down so you can be rid of the nay sayers who threaten the mind training that has been done.

Abracadabra Joined Thu 04/12/07 Posts: 17851	Mon 07/04/11 12:05 PM
29 Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen. Christians may consider others disbelief in the biblical fables to be 'unwholesome', but that's nonsense. There is nothing unwholesome about questioning nasty ideals put forth as though they have something to do with some God. 30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. Now he's just proselyting his belief in a religion that based on sin and redemption. 31 Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice. 32 Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, We can do that without religion. Also to question ancient superstitions is in no way "bitterness, rage, or anger and slander", or anything at all like that. It's just a genuine challenging of unhealthy superstitions. just as in Christ God forgave you. Again, beating home a very negative religious view that everyone is in dire need of being forgiven by some highly judgmental God who would hurt people if they don't obey him without question. It's clear that Paul himself believed in those negative concepts. And that's understandable. Paul had a lot of guilt. He was a very troubled man. He felt a dire need for "forgiveness" because even he recognized the dastardly nature of his own previous behavior. So it shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone that this man would eventually turn to a religion that promises salvation for his previously horrible behavior. If everyone had been like Paul, then maybe there could be some valid arguments given for this religion. But clearly that's not the case. Everyone wasn't as nasty as Paul was when he was Saul. Saul was a desperate man who was evidently so ashamed of his own behavior that he even changed his name to Paul to try to rid himself of his past.

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 12:08 PM
Give careful thought to your ways. 6 You have planted much, but harvested little. You eat, but never have enough. You drink, but never have your fill. You put on clothes, but are not warm. You earn wages, only to put them in a purse with holes in it.”

msharmony Joined Mon 08/31/09 Posts: 61041	Mon 07/04/11 12:12 PM
Um ... OK ... People that don't believe in the Bible have been saying this for decades. Have yet to see anyone prove anything false in the Bible. Actually, I have a few stories of people that went out to prove it false and ended up being Christian in the process. Where are the people and evidence you suggest exists???? You made a wild claim that Abraham WILL be proven to be a fictional character. No evidence, just a BELIEF that will be true at some random point in the future. You know I just don't get these people either. I just spent a week of my time telling them how they can study and find out if this is true or not and as soon as I turn my back they are back to bashing (in the name of love). I'm afraid they are losing credibility with me bigtime. You know I find that funny, cause I see a lot of Christians bashing in the same way, in the name of their version of love. That's about the definition of the pot calling the kettle black if you ask me. Further, maybe some people HAVE studied, and just came to a different conclusion than you did. Just because they don't believe what you believe, doesn't mean they're wrong. This I find fascinating. Those that argue against Christianity are fairly angry, or at least appear to be, towards Christians. They get mad at Christians for being exclusionary and say that Christians hate. The Christian response is generally, just open your heart and accept people for who they are. Then these same people that beat up Christians, congratulate each other on how loving and accepting they are towards everyone, (except Christians but they never mention that.) No, we have no problem with you, EXCEPT when you shove your beliefs down our throats when we don't care to hear it. If you wanna believe what you do, that's fine, no one is going to tell you can't, even if we don't agree with it. But when you start to say your belief is for everyone, that's where you cross the line. It's a line many Christians cross, whether they realize it or not. So don't even tell me, that Christians accept people as they are, because if they did, they wouldn't push their ideas of change onto people who don't think or live their lives the way they do. Granted not all Christians may do that, but I'd bet a good portion of them do, be it consciously or subconsciously. Um, actually, the OP in this thread is saying I shouldn't believe in it and I am wrong to do so. But when you start to say your belief is for everyone, that's where you cross the line. Seriously? Your belief is for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Atheism is a for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Islam is for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Buddhism is for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Apparently, Christianity is not allowed in this category. Seems today's prevailing attitude is: "You can be Christian if you are now. That is OK. But you aren't allowed to infest others or your children with it." Poor victimized Christians, have had it their way so long they can't see the advantages they have had. Now it time to level the playing field and they are "being mistreated"...lol When you see the bible verse on the government building I bet you don't think, "how come there isn't a verse from all of these texts:" Ancient Greece Homeric Hymns Theogony [edit] Asatru Havamal Eddas [edit] Atenism Great Hymn to the Aten [edit] Ayyavazhi The Akilathirattu Ammanai The Arul Nool [edit] Bahá'í Faith The Kitáb-i-Aqdas Kitáb-i-Íqán other Bahá'í literature including works from other faiths [edit] Bön Bon Kangyur and Tengyur [edit] Buddhism Ancient style of scripture used for the Pāli Canon See also: Buddhist texts Theravada Buddhism The Tipitaka or Pāli Canon Vinaya Pitaka Sutta Pitaka Digha Nikaya, the "long" discourses. Majjhima Nikaya, the "middle-length" discourses. Samyutta Nikaya, the "connected" discourses. Anguttara Nikaya, the "numerical" discourses. Khuddaka Nikaya, the "minor collection". Abhidhamma Pitaka East Asian Mahayana The Chinese Diamond Sutra, the oldest known dated printed book in the world, printed in the 9th year of Xiantong Era of the Tang Dynasty, or 868 CE. British Library. The Chinese Buddhist Tripiṭaka, including Diamond Sutra and the Heart Sutra Shurangama Sutra and its Shurangama Mantra Pure Land Buddhism Infinite Life Sutra Amitabha Sutra Contemplation Sutra other Pure Land Sutras Tiantai, Tendai, and Nichiren Lotus Sutra Shingon Mahavairocana Sutra Vajrasekhara Sutra Tibetan Buddhism Tibetan Kangyur and Tengyur [edit] Cheondoism The Donghak Scripture The Songs of Yongdam The Sermons of Master Haeweol The Sermons of Revered Teacher Euiam[4] [edit] Christianity Further information: Christian biblical canons Christian Bible, 1407 handwritten copy The Bible. For all branches of Christianity - Catholicism, Protestantism and Orthodox - 66 canonical books of the Bible is the main scripture. In addition, Catholicism includes the Deuterocanonical books, the Orthodox Church includes the Anagignoskomena and Antilegomena (the Ethiopian Orthodox Church adds The Book of Enoch). Cerdonianism and Marcionism Gospel of Marcion (similar to the Gospel of Luke) Pauline epistles Nag Hammadi texts Gnosticism Nag Hammadi library and other Gnostic texts (not from the Bible) Some books of the Old Testament and New Testament Cover page of The Book of Mormon from an original 1830 edition, by Joseph Smith, Jr. (Image from the U.S. Library of Congress Rare Book and Special Collections Division.) Latter Day Saint movement See also: Standard Works The Bible in King James' version The Book of Mormon The Pearl of Great Price The Doctrine and Covenants [edit] Confucianism The Five Classics The Four Books The Thirteen Classics [edit] Discordianism The Principia Discordia [edit] Druze Rasa'il al-hikmah (Epistles of Wisdom) [edit] Ancient Egyptian religion Pyramid texts from Teti I's pyramid. Old Kingdom Pyramid Texts First Intermediate Period & Middle Kingdom Coffin Texts Second Intermediate Period The Book of the Dead Book of Caverns Book of Gates Amduat Book of the Heavenly Cow Litany of Re [edit] Etruscan religion The Cippus of Perugia, 3rd or 2nd century BCE Cippus Perusinus Liber Linteus Pyrgi Tablets Tabula Cortonensis [edit] Hermeticism Hermetica, Emerald Tablet and associated writings [edit] Hinduism Main article: Hindu texts The Bhagavad Gita is Lord Krishna's counsel to Arjuna on the battlefield of the Kurukshetra. Śruti Vedas Rig Veda Sama Veda Yajur Veda Atharva Veda Brahmanas Aranyakas Upanishads Smriti Itihāsas Mahābhārata (including the Bhagavad Gita) Bhagavad Gita Ramayana Puranas (List) Bhagavata Purana Tantras Sutras (List) Stotras Ashtavakra Gita Gherand Samhita Gita Govinda Hatha Yoga Pradipika Yoga Vasistha In Purva Mimamsa Purva Mimamsa Sutras In Vedanta (Uttar Mimamsa) Brahma Sutras of Vyasa In Yoga Yoga Sutras of Patanjali In Samkhya Samkhya Sutras of Kapila In Nyaya Nyāya Sūtras of Gautama In Vaisheshika Vaisheshika Sutras of Kanada In Vaishnavism Vaikhanasa Samhitas Pancaratra Samhitas In Saktism Sakta Tantras In Kashmir Saivism 64 Bhairavagamas 28 Shaiva Agamas Shiva Sutras of Vasugupta Vijnana Bhairava Tantra In Pashupata Shaivism Pashupata Sutras of Lakulish Panchartha-bhashya of Kaundinya (a commentary on the Pashupata Sutras) Ganakarika Ratnatika of Bhasarvajna In Shaiva Siddhanta 28 Saiva Agamas Tirumurai (canon of 12 works) Meykandar Shastras (canon of 14 works) In Gaudiya Vaishnavism Brahma Samhita Jayadeva's Gita Govinda Krishna-karnamrita Chaitanya Bhagavata Chaitanya Charitamrita Prema-bhakti-candrika Hari-bhakti-vilasa In Kabir Panth poems of Kabir In Dadu Panth poems of Dadu [edit] Islam 11th Century North African Qur’an in the British Museum Main article: Islamic holy books Qur'an (also referred to as Kuran, Koran, Qur’ān, Coran or al-Qur’ān) Hadith (oral traditions of the words and deeds of Muhammad) [edit] Jainism Main article: Jain Agamas Svetambara 11 Angas Secondary 12 Upangas, 4 Mula-sutras, 6 Cheda-sutras, 2 Culika-sutras, 10 Prakirnakas Digambara Karmaprabhrita, also called Satkhandagama Kashayaprabhrita Nonsectarian/Nonspecific Jina Vijaya Tattvartha Sutra GandhaHasti Mahabhashya (authoritative and oldest commentary on the Tattvartha Sutra) [edit] Judaism A Sefer Torah opened for liturgical use in a synagogue service Rabbinical Judaism The Tanakh (Hebrew Bible) Torah (teachings) Nevi'im (prophets) Ketuvim (writings) The Talmud Mishnah Gemara Karaite Judaism The Tanakh Beta Israel The Tanakh with several apocrypha [edit] LaVeyan Satanism The Satanic Bible The Satanic Bible (primary text) The Satanic Rituals (contains additional rituals) [edit] Lingayatism Siddhanta Shikhamani Vachana sahitya Mantra Gopya Shoonya Sampadane 28 Agamas Karana Hasuge Basava Purana [edit] Mandaeanism The Ginza Rba Book of the Zodiac Qolusta, Canonical Prayerbook Book of John the Baptizer Diwan Abatur, Purgatories 1012 Questions Coronation of Shislam Rba Baptism of Hibil Ziwa Haran Gawaita [edit] Manichaeism The Evangelion (Greek, Coptic: Ευαγγελιον, meaning roughly "good news"). Also known as the Gospel of Mani and The Living Gospel the Treasure of Life the Pragmateia (Coptic: πραγματεία) the Book of Mysteries the Book of Giants the Epistles the Psalms and Prayers. A Coptic Manichaean Psalter, discovered in Egypt in the early 1900s, was edited and published by Charles Allberry from Manichaean manuscripts in the Chester Beatty collection and in the Berlin Academy, 1938-9. The Shabuhragan The Arzhang The Kephalaia (Κεφαλαια), "Discourses", found in Coptic translation. [edit] Meher Baba Cover of God Speaks God Speaks [edit] New Age religions Various New Age religions may regard any of the following texts as inspired: A Course in Miracles Conversations with God Oahspe The Urantia Book Isis Unveiled [edit] Orphism Orphic Poems [edit] Rastafari movement The Bible the Holy Piby the Kebra Negast The speeches and writings of Haile Selassie I Royal Parchment Scroll of Black Supremacy [edit] Ravidassia The Amritbani Guru Ravidass Ji [edit] Samaritanism The Samaritan Torah [edit] Scientology Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health List of Scientology texts [edit] Shinto The Kojiki The Nihon Shoki or Nihongi [edit] Sikhism Illuminated Guru Granth folio with Mul Mantar(basic religion mantra) with signature of Guru Gobind Singh. Main article: Sikh scriptures The Guru Granth Sahib The Dasven Padshah Da Granth [edit] Spiritism The Spirits Book The Book on Mediums The Gospel According to Spiritism Heaven and Hell The Genesis According to Spiritism [edit] Sumerian The Barton Cylinder [edit] Swedenborgianism The Bible The works of Emanuel Swedenborg [edit] Taoism Tao Te Ching Zhuangzi (book) Daozang [edit] Tenrikyo The Ofudesaki The Mikagura-uta The Osashizu [edit] Thelema Holy Books of Thelema especially The Book of the Law [edit] Unification Church Divine Principle [edit] Wicca Book of Shadows Charge of the Goddess Threefold Law [edit] Yazidi Yazidi Black Book Yazidi Book of Revelation [edit] Zoroastrianism Yasna 28.1 (Bodleian MS J2) Primary religious texts, that is, the Avesta collection: The Yasna, the primary liturgical collection, includes the Gathas. The Visperad, a collection of supplements to the Yasna. The Yashts, hymns in honor of the divinities. The Vendidad, describes the various forms of evil spirits and ways to confound them. shorter texts and prayers, the Yashts the five Nyaishes ("worship, praise"), the Sirozeh and the Afringans (blessings). There are some 60 secondary religious texts, none of which are considered scripture. The most important of these are: The Denkard (middle Persian, 'Acts of Religion'), The Bundahishn, (middle Persian, 'Primordial Creation') The Menog-i Khrad, (middle Persian, 'Spirit of Wisdom') The Arda Viraf Namak (middle Persian, 'The Book of Arda Viraf') The Sad-dar (modern Persian, 'Hundred Doors', or 'Hundred Chapters') The Rivayats, 15th-18th century correspondence on religious issues For general use by the laity: The Zend (lit. commentaries), various commentaries on and translations of the Avesta. The Khordeh Avesta, a collection of everyday prayers from the Avesta. Or how about swearing you in court. How come these books are not used since all religions are equal in this country? When there is a prayer at the ball game how come there isn't one said for all religions? When someone in the government speaks of god, how come they don't say god, gods and goddesses or whatever you believe in, instead of just saying one god for the Christian god? Poor poor Christians, having to concede some of their advantage in order to be fair. Sad days indeed. we have the freedom to speak for ourself, not EVERYONE else, nor does everyone else have the right to dictate whom we speak for the logic here is like griping about why we choose to print literature primarily in english(hint, english is the predominant language spoken) or why we print 'e pluribus unum' on our coins instead of uno formato da diversi de muchos, un aus vielen, ein ,, or any other number of things that would have had the SAME MESSAGE ,, it seems the message is to be discarded if it can be tied in any way to literature which is 'religious',, which is a sad way of censoring some valid and relevant lessons and messages

Dragoness Joined Wed 10/17/07 Posts: 23320	Mon 07/04/11 12:14 PM
Or maybe it is to reassure the mind control that the repetacism is needed.

Abracadabra Joined Thu 04/12/07 Posts: 17851	Mon 07/04/11 12:21 PM
Or maybe it is to reassure the mind control that the repetacism is needed. And to distract away from the real issues. They know that they can't argue against the obvious absurdities that are in the Bible, so they start shoving the brainwashing tactics of the dogma itself in the faces of others in the hope that it might actually work on other people like it worked on them. The whole brainwashing technique is to try to make it appear that anyone who questions these religious teachings is just a negative troublemaker. It's just supporting religious bigotry using a false notion of "love" as a weapon. Basically the most underhanded brainwashing technique ever devised by mankind.

Dragoness Joined Wed 10/17/07 Posts: 23320	Mon 07/04/11 12:23 PM
Um ... OK ... People that don't believe in the Bible have been saying this for decades. Have yet to see anyone prove anything false in the Bible. Actually, I have a few stories of people that went out to prove it false and ended up being Christian in the process. Where are the people and evidence you suggest exists???? You made a wild claim that Abraham WILL be proven to be a fictional character. No evidence, just a BELIEF that will be true at some random point in the future. You know I just don't get these people either. I just spent a week of my time telling them how they can study and find out if this is true or not and as soon as I turn my back they are back to bashing (in the name of love). I'm afraid they are losing credibility with me bigtime. You know I find that funny, cause I see a lot of Christians bashing in the same way, in the name of their version of love. That's about the definition of the pot calling the kettle black if you ask me. Further, maybe some people HAVE studied, and just came to a different conclusion than you did. Just because they don't believe what you believe, doesn't mean they're wrong. This I find fascinating. Those that argue against Christianity are fairly angry, or at least appear to be, towards Christians. They get mad at Christians for being exclusionary and say that Christians hate. The Christian response is generally, just open your heart and accept people for who they are. Then these same people that beat up Christians, congratulate each other on how loving and accepting they are towards everyone, (except Christians but they never mention that.) No, we have no problem with you, EXCEPT when you shove your beliefs down our throats when we don't care to hear it. If you wanna believe what you do, that's fine, no one is going to tell you can't, even if we don't agree with it. But when you start to say your belief is for everyone, that's where you cross the line. It's a line many Christians cross, whether they realize it or not. So don't even tell me, that Christians accept people as they are, because if they did, they wouldn't push their ideas of change onto people who don't think or live their lives the way they do. Granted not all Christians may do that, but I'd bet a good portion of them do, be it consciously or subconsciously. Um, actually, the OP in this thread is saying I shouldn't believe in it and I am wrong to do so. But when you start to say your belief is for everyone, that's where you cross the line. Seriously? Your belief is for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Atheism is a for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Islam is for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Buddhism is for everyone - if they choose to accept it. Apparently, Christianity is not allowed in this category. Seems today's prevailing attitude is: "You can be Christian if you are now. That is OK. But you aren't allowed to infest others or your children with it." Poor victimized Christians, have had it their way so long they can't see the advantages they have had. Now it time to level the playing field and they are "being mistreated"...lol When you see the bible verse on the government building I bet you don't think, "how come there isn't a verse from all of these texts:" Ancient Greece Homeric Hymns Theogony [edit] Asatru Havamal Eddas [edit] Atenism Great Hymn to the Aten [edit] Ayyavazhi The Akilathirattu Ammanai The Arul Nool [edit] Bahá'í Faith The Kitáb-i-Aqdas Kitáb-i-Íqán other Bahá'í literature including works from other faiths [edit] Bön Bon Kangyur and Tengyur [edit] Buddhism Ancient style of scripture used for the Pāli Canon See also: Buddhist texts Theravada Buddhism The Tipitaka or Pāli Canon Vinaya Pitaka Sutta Pitaka Digha Nikaya, the "long" discourses. Majjhima Nikaya, the "middle-length" discourses. Samyutta Nikaya, the "connected" discourses. Anguttara Nikaya, the "numerical" discourses. Khuddaka Nikaya, the "minor collection". Abhidhamma Pitaka East Asian Mahayana The Chinese Diamond Sutra, the oldest known dated printed book in the world, printed in the 9th year of Xiantong Era of the Tang Dynasty, or 868 CE. British Library. The Chinese Buddhist Tripiṭaka, including Diamond Sutra and the Heart Sutra Shurangama Sutra and its Shurangama Mantra Pure Land Buddhism Infinite Life Sutra Amitabha Sutra Contemplation Sutra other Pure Land Sutras Tiantai, Tendai, and Nichiren Lotus Sutra Shingon Mahavairocana Sutra Vajrasekhara Sutra Tibetan Buddhism Tibetan Kangyur and Tengyur [edit] Cheondoism The Donghak Scripture The Songs of Yongdam The Sermons of Master Haeweol The Sermons of Revered Teacher Euiam[4] [edit] Christianity Further information: Christian biblical canons Christian Bible, 1407 handwritten copy The Bible. For all branches of Christianity - Catholicism, Protestantism and Orthodox - 66 canonical books of the Bible is the main scripture. In addition, Catholicism includes the Deuterocanonical books, the Orthodox Church includes the Anagignoskomena and Antilegomena (the Ethiopian Orthodox Church adds The Book of Enoch). Cerdonianism and Marcionism Gospel of Marcion (similar to the Gospel of Luke) Pauline epistles Nag Hammadi texts Gnosticism Nag Hammadi library and other Gnostic texts (not from the Bible) Some books of the Old Testament and New Testament Cover page of The Book of Mormon from an original 1830 edition, by Joseph Smith, Jr. (Image from the U.S. Library of Congress Rare Book and Special Collections Division.) Latter Day Saint movement See also: Standard Works The Bible in King James' version The Book of Mormon The Pearl of Great Price The Doctrine and Covenants [edit] Confucianism The Five Classics The Four Books The Thirteen Classics [edit] Discordianism The Principia Discordia [edit] Druze Rasa'il al-hikmah (Epistles of Wisdom) [edit] Ancient Egyptian religion Pyramid texts from Teti I's pyramid. Old Kingdom Pyramid Texts First Intermediate Period & Middle Kingdom Coffin Texts Second Intermediate Period The Book of the Dead Book of Caverns Book of Gates Amduat Book of the Heavenly Cow Litany of Re [edit] Etruscan religion The Cippus of Perugia, 3rd or 2nd century BCE Cippus Perusinus Liber Linteus Pyrgi Tablets Tabula Cortonensis [edit] Hermeticism Hermetica, Emerald Tablet and associated writings [edit] Hinduism Main article: Hindu texts The Bhagavad Gita is Lord Krishna's counsel to Arjuna on the battlefield of the Kurukshetra. Śruti Vedas Rig Veda Sama Veda Yajur Veda Atharva Veda Brahmanas Aranyakas Upanishads Smriti Itihāsas Mahābhārata (including the Bhagavad Gita) Bhagavad Gita Ramayana Puranas (List) Bhagavata Purana Tantras Sutras (List) Stotras Ashtavakra Gita Gherand Samhita Gita Govinda Hatha Yoga Pradipika Yoga Vasistha In Purva Mimamsa Purva Mimamsa Sutras In Vedanta (Uttar Mimamsa) Brahma Sutras of Vyasa In Yoga Yoga Sutras of Patanjali In Samkhya Samkhya Sutras of Kapila In Nyaya Nyāya Sūtras of Gautama In Vaisheshika Vaisheshika Sutras of Kanada In Vaishnavism Vaikhanasa Samhitas Pancaratra Samhitas In Saktism Sakta Tantras In Kashmir Saivism 64 Bhairavagamas 28 Shaiva Agamas Shiva Sutras of Vasugupta Vijnana Bhairava Tantra In Pashupata Shaivism Pashupata Sutras of Lakulish Panchartha-bhashya of Kaundinya (a commentary on the Pashupata Sutras) Ganakarika Ratnatika of Bhasarvajna In Shaiva Siddhanta 28 Saiva Agamas Tirumurai (canon of 12 works) Meykandar Shastras (canon of 14 works) In Gaudiya Vaishnavism Brahma Samhita Jayadeva's Gita Govinda Krishna-karnamrita Chaitanya Bhagavata Chaitanya Charitamrita Prema-bhakti-candrika Hari-bhakti-vilasa In Kabir Panth poems of Kabir In Dadu Panth poems of Dadu [edit] Islam 11th Century North African Qur’an in the British Museum Main article: Islamic holy books Qur'an (also referred to as Kuran, Koran, Qur’ān, Coran or al-Qur’ān) Hadith (oral traditions of the words and deeds of Muhammad) [edit] Jainism Main article: Jain Agamas Svetambara 11 Angas Secondary 12 Upangas, 4 Mula-sutras, 6 Cheda-sutras, 2 Culika-sutras, 10 Prakirnakas Digambara Karmaprabhrita, also called Satkhandagama Kashayaprabhrita Nonsectarian/Nonspecific Jina Vijaya Tattvartha Sutra GandhaHasti Mahabhashya (authoritative and oldest commentary on the Tattvartha Sutra) [edit] Judaism A Sefer Torah opened for liturgical use in a synagogue service Rabbinical Judaism The Tanakh (Hebrew Bible) Torah (teachings) Nevi'im (prophets) Ketuvim (writings) The Talmud Mishnah Gemara Karaite Judaism The Tanakh Beta Israel The Tanakh with several apocrypha [edit] LaVeyan Satanism The Satanic Bible The Satanic Bible (primary text) The Satanic Rituals (contains additional rituals) [edit] Lingayatism Siddhanta Shikhamani Vachana sahitya Mantra Gopya Shoonya Sampadane 28 Agamas Karana Hasuge Basava Purana [edit] Mandaeanism The Ginza Rba Book of the Zodiac Qolusta, Canonical Prayerbook Book of John the Baptizer Diwan Abatur, Purgatories 1012 Questions Coronation of Shislam Rba Baptism of Hibil Ziwa Haran Gawaita [edit] Manichaeism The Evangelion (Greek, Coptic: Ευαγγελιον, meaning roughly "good news"). Also known as the Gospel of Mani and The Living Gospel the Treasure of Life the Pragmateia (Coptic: πραγματεία) the Book of Mysteries the Book of Giants the Epistles the Psalms and Prayers. A Coptic Manichaean Psalter, discovered in Egypt in the early 1900s, was edited and published by Charles Allberry from Manichaean manuscripts in the Chester Beatty collection and in the Berlin Academy, 1938-9. The Shabuhragan The Arzhang The Kephalaia (Κεφαλαια), "Discourses", found in Coptic translation. [edit] Meher Baba Cover of God Speaks God Speaks [edit] New Age religions Various New Age religions may regard any of the following texts as inspired: A Course in Miracles Conversations with God Oahspe The Urantia Book Isis Unveiled [edit] Orphism Orphic Poems [edit] Rastafari movement The Bible the Holy Piby the Kebra Negast The speeches and writings of Haile Selassie I Royal Parchment Scroll of Black Supremacy [edit] Ravidassia The Amritbani Guru Ravidass Ji [edit] Samaritanism The Samaritan Torah [edit] Scientology Dianetics: The Modern Science of Mental Health List of Scientology texts [edit] Shinto The Kojiki The Nihon Shoki or Nihongi [edit] Sikhism Illuminated Guru Granth folio with Mul Mantar(basic religion mantra) with signature of Guru Gobind Singh. Main article: Sikh scriptures The Guru Granth Sahib The Dasven Padshah Da Granth [edit] Spiritism The Spirits Book The Book on Mediums The Gospel According to Spiritism Heaven and Hell The Genesis According to Spiritism [edit] Sumerian The Barton Cylinder [edit] Swedenborgianism The Bible The works of Emanuel Swedenborg [edit] Taoism Tao Te Ching Zhuangzi (book) Daozang [edit] Tenrikyo The Ofudesaki The Mikagura-uta The Osashizu [edit] Thelema Holy Books of Thelema especially The Book of the Law [edit] Unification Church Divine Principle [edit] Wicca Book of Shadows Charge of the Goddess Threefold Law [edit] Yazidi Yazidi Black Book Yazidi Book of Revelation [edit] Zoroastrianism Yasna 28.1 (Bodleian MS J2) Primary religious texts, that is, the Avesta collection: The Yasna, the primary liturgical collection, includes the Gathas. The Visperad, a collection of supplements to the Yasna. The Yashts, hymns in honor of the divinities. The Vendidad, describes the various forms of evil spirits and ways to confound them. shorter texts and prayers, the Yashts the five Nyaishes ("worship, praise"), the Sirozeh and the Afringans (blessings). There are some 60 secondary religious texts, none of which are considered scripture. The most important of these are: The Denkard (middle Persian, 'Acts of Religion'), The Bundahishn, (middle Persian, 'Primordial Creation') The Menog-i Khrad, (middle Persian, 'Spirit of Wisdom') The Arda Viraf Namak (middle Persian, 'The Book of Arda Viraf') The Sad-dar (modern Persian, 'Hundred Doors', or 'Hundred Chapters') The Rivayats, 15th-18th century correspondence on religious issues For general use by the laity: The Zend (lit. commentaries), various commentaries on and translations of the Avesta. The Khordeh Avesta, a collection of everyday prayers from the Avesta. Or how about swearing you in court. How come these books are not used since all religions are equal in this country? When there is a prayer at the ball game how come there isn't one said for all religions? When someone in the government speaks of god, how come they don't say god, gods and goddesses or whatever you believe in, instead of just saying one god for the Christian god? Poor poor Christians, having to concede some of their advantage in order to be fair. Sad days indeed. we have the freedom to speak for ourself, not EVERYONE else, nor does everyone else have the right to dictate whom we speak for the logic here is like griping about why we choose to print literature primarily in english(hint, english is the predominant language spoken) or why we print 'e pluribus unum' on our coins instead of uno formato da diversi de muchos, un aus vielen, ein ,, or any other number of things that would have had the SAME MESSAGE ,, it seems the message is to be discarded if it can be tied in any way to literature which is 'religious',, which is a sad way of censoring some valid and relevant lessons and messages Not the same analogy anyway but no matter, if we are to respect all religions, we need to respect and acknowledge them all. If we cannot do that in order to respect them all we need to remove them from any public arena and all government period. We cannot just acknowledge/practice/show homage to one when we are aware of hundreds. And all religious books hold the same importance. So if we are to have them printed on things then we need to include them all or none if we cannot do that. Spoiled Christians sure have a hard time seeing outside of their advantage, that is for sure.

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 12:30 PM
I so love the Bible. Not having it would seem so shallow. I guess for myself I see so much good and think "I could spend easily a life time on all the peace parts of the books". I would never get to the parts that people claim as cruel or bigot. Maybe it's just my nature to want to reap what is good from something. For myself it's like this, if your the kind of person that looks for bad in life you will find it. If your the kind that looks for good you will find it. Hopefully the responses that you put up in response to me simply quoting scripture will give you some idea of what type of person you are. Do you look at bad, or do you see good. have a blessed day

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 12:33 PM
Trying to beat them down with the bible again huh? Figures. When all else fails just keep repeating the same things from a book of fables until everyone stops listening and shuts down so you can be rid of the nay sayers who threaten the mind training that has been done. You must have me confused with maybe someone else you have talked to in the past. my name is michael, hope you are well

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 12:39 PM
Look at the watch, your getting very sleepy, your eyes are getting tired, soon I will be injecting you with a bunch of great writings, you must listen, now except and go tell the world. how was that lol

Dragoness Joined Wed 10/17/07 Posts: 23320	Mon 07/04/11 12:41 PM
Or maybe it is to reassure the mind control that the repetacism is needed. And to distract away from the real issues. They know that they can't argue against the obvious absurdities that are in the Bible, so they start shoving the brainwashing tactics of the dogma itself in the faces of others in the hope that it might actually work on other people like it worked on them. The whole brainwashing technique is to try to make it appear that anyone who questions these religious teachings is just a negative troublemaker. It's just supporting religious bigotry using a false notion of "love" as a weapon. Basically the most underhanded brainwashing technique ever devised by mankind. Agreed. I can't help but be reminded of those who are mentally challenged and when they feel threatened or uncomfortable they go into a repeating dialog for example in Rainman, Dustin Hoffman playing the autistic repeated a Costello excerpt to calm himself. But repeating it doesn't make it more valid. Proof of validity does. And using the item itself to prove validity very seldom shows any proof of anything. If the bible were to be passed off as a book of fables that has some life lessons in it, I would be more likely to consider the information in it. But because it is passed off as some kind of be all end all, it loses its validity and becomes a method of control which should be rejected until it is put back into context of being a book written by men for men. And literally for Men chauvinistic men . It is not a book that has much good information or encouragement for women at all. It is a control mechanism for men to control women and should be discarded by any woman who really wants to claim her rights and live a valued life.

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 12:45 PM
Come here you!! Let me hit you with this bible! Take that you you Innocent by stander. And don't come back till you repent! Repent I say for I'm wearing sandals and carry this big book. Please do people even do that any more? Is that what people think Christians are? how funny

Dragoness Joined Wed 10/17/07 Posts: 23320	Mon 07/04/11 12:53 PM
Context is everything. If the bible were presented as just a read for men, chauvinistic men then it would be just a book, like it is. But it is presented in the context of the proof (unverifiable)that all non Christians are wrong and that the Christians are the golden children. Of which the bible is not proof of anything other than men have thoughts/imagination and write them down once in a while.

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 12:58 PM
Maybe you should take a look at who I am and what I did before jumping into the hate pool for Christians demise mode again. I am quoting the bible as a cool book that I would hate to live without. Your fights with others are up to you but they have little to do with me unless you are picking a fight directly with me on some issue. Do you have a problem with me directly? Seems like I have to keep going there with people because they have become so reactive up here on these forums. Bigotry my dear is when you put someone in a camp and then judge them, which ,as I confronted Abra of this before, is exacting with you are doing with me. not cool If you, like Abra was so kind enough to do, find a working relationship with me as a person you might find that there is a world to talk about and still have different beliefs.

mg1959 Joined Thu 04/05/07 Posts: 7872	Mon 07/04/11 01:02 PM
Or maybe it is to reassure the mind control that the repetacism is needed. And to distract away from the real issues. They know that they can't argue against the obvious absurdities that are in the Bible, so they start shoving the brainwashing tactics of the dogma itself in the faces of others in the hope that it might actually work on other people like it worked on them. The whole brainwashing technique is to try to make it appear that anyone who questions these religious teachings is just a negative troublemaker. It's just supporting religious bigotry using a false notion of "love" as a weapon. Basically the most underhanded brainwashing technique ever devised by mankind. Certainly you know not to judge me in with any "them". Don't be a bigot dude, we've been through this. It's me talking about parts of a book I love and nothing else. Don't make it in to something that it is not again.