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| Topic: Does God even care? | |
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ShiningArmour wrote: Now the belief that you think there is no God...is your belief. It may or may not be true. And just because you say it does not make it so. Well considering that is not my belief, nor have I have even remotely suggested that it is, I suppose there isn't much sense in attempting to converse with you any further. Have a great day!  Perhaps I misunderstood what you meant by religious fables then. Oh well. If you do not wish to converse then I wish you a great day as well. 
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ShiningArmour wrote: Now the belief that you think there is no God...is your belief. It may or may not be true. And just because you say it does not make it so. Well considering that is not my belief, nor have I have even remotely suggested that it is, I suppose there isn't much sense in attempting to converse with you any further. Have a great day! Perhaps I misunderstood what you meant by religious fables then. Oh well. If you do not wish to converse then I wish you a great day as well. I was speaking specifically to the biblical fables of the Mediterranean and Middle East region. Greek Mythology, Biblical Mythology, and the many other simlar god legends of that geographic region. Recognizing that those particular legends are indeed man-made myths in no way translates into a disbelieve in spirituality in general. On the contrary, the Eastern Mystical philosophies which are clearly not mythologies hold far more merit as being the most likely representation of any possible spiritual essence to reality. So all I'm really saying is that well-thought-out religious philosophies like Eastern Mysticism most likely have far more merit and usefulness to us than religious mythologies and fables of jealous godheads that came from the Middle Eastern part of the world where such man-made myths were clearly commonplace.
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Now the belief that you think there is no God...is your belief. It may or may not be true. And just because you say it does not make it so. But Shining, this is a circular argument! Just because a person says there is a god does not make it so, eh? Recognizing that those particular legends are indeed man-made myths in no way translates into a disbelieve in spirituality in general. On the contrary, the Eastern Mystical philosophies which are clearly not mythologies hold far more merit as being the most likely representation of any possible spiritual essence to reality. So all I'm really saying is that well-thought-out religious philosophies like Eastern Mysticism most likely have far more merit and usefulness to us than religious mythologies and fables of jealous godheads that came from the Middle Eastern part of the world where such man-made myths were clearly commonplace. It is my opinion that the vast majority of Christians are Christian because their parents, grandparents, and so on, were Christians. They rarely seriously examine their belief in the Bible or whether Jesus is truly "god." This holds true of other religions, as well. The reason why they argue so vociferously about the historical validity of the Bible is because if it is proven to be untrue, what happens to their beliefs? Mind you, I mean fundies: there are liberal Christians who view the Bible as largely symbolic. An atheist would call me silly, but Taoism makes more sense than does Christianity; reincarnation also makes more sense than either an eternal place of bliss or torture. I had a student in a mythology class who had been in a very serous car accident and lost all of her memory. She had to relearn EVERYTHING. She didn't even recognize her parents. She and I were talking about myth and religion, and she said that her parents told her that she had been raised as a Christian and had attended Sunday School. She then said that she found the idea of god "ridiculous"; she could hardly believe that once she had bought into Christian ideology. I found that VERY interesting! |
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Tue 01/11/11 11:11 PM
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Now the belief that you think there is no God...is your belief. It may or may not be true. And just because you say it does not make it so. But Shining, this is a circular argument! Just because a person says there is a god does not make it so, eh? Recognizing that those particular legends are indeed man-made myths in no way translates into a disbelieve in spirituality in general. On the contrary, the Eastern Mystical philosophies which are clearly not mythologies hold far more merit as being the most likely representation of any possible spiritual essence to reality. So all I'm really saying is that well-thought-out religious philosophies like Eastern Mysticism most likely have far more merit and usefulness to us than religious mythologies and fables of jealous godheads that came from the Middle Eastern part of the world where such man-made myths were clearly commonplace. It is my opinion that the vast majority of Christians are Christian because their parents, grandparents, and so on, were Christians. They rarely seriously examine their belief in the Bible or whether Jesus is truly "god." This holds true of other religions, as well. The reason why they argue so vociferously about the historical validity of the Bible is because if it is proven to be untrue, what happens to their beliefs? Mind you, I mean fundies: there are liberal Christians who view the Bible as largely symbolic. An atheist would call me silly, but Taoism makes more sense than does Christianity; reincarnation also makes more sense than either an eternal place of bliss or torture. I had a student in a mythology class who had been in a very serous car accident and lost all of her memory. She had to relearn EVERYTHING. She didn't even recognize her parents. She and I were talking about myth and religion, and she said that her parents told her that she had been raised as a Christian and had attended Sunday School. She then said that she found the idea of god "ridiculous"; she could hardly believe that once she had bought into Christian ideology. I found that VERY interesting! humans are interesting in their ability to adapt to their environment and their experiences,,, I think it is most amazing anytime people debate 'reality' given how limited any one persons reality is in the grand scheme of things it happens both ways, that those who go through life not believing have some experience that serves as a catalyst for their belief to be initiated (and then continuously reinforced by their experiences) its all a very interesting circle of emotion, reality, and experience and how they all intertwine but thats a topic for a different day 
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Edited by
wux
on
Wed 01/12/11 12:23 AM
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Now the belief that you think there is no God...is your belief. It may or may not be true. And just because you say it does not make it so. But Shining, this is a circular argument! Just because a person says there is a god does not make it so, eh? Recognizing that those particular legends are indeed man-made myths in no way translates into a disbelieve in spirituality in general. On the contrary, the Eastern Mystical philosophies which are clearly not mythologies hold far more merit as being the most likely representation of any possible spiritual essence to reality. So all I'm really saying is that well-thought-out religious philosophies like Eastern Mysticism most likely have far more merit and usefulness to us than religious mythologies and fables of jealous godheads that came from the Middle Eastern part of the world where such man-made myths were clearly commonplace. It is my opinion that the vast majority of Christians are Christian because their parents, grandparents, and so on, were Christians. They rarely seriously examine their belief in the Bible or whether Jesus is truly "god." This holds true of other religions, as well. The reason why they argue so vociferously about the historical validity of the Bible is because if it is proven to be untrue, what happens to their beliefs? Mind you, I mean fundies: there are liberal Christians who view the Bible as largely symbolic. An atheist would call me silly, but Taoism makes more sense than does Christianity; reincarnation also makes more sense than either an eternal place of bliss or torture. I had a student in a mythology class who had been in a very serous car accident and lost all of her memory. She had to relearn EVERYTHING. She didn't even recognize her parents. She and I were talking about myth and religion, and she said that her parents told her that she had been raised as a Christian and had attended Sunday School. She then said that she found the idea of god "ridiculous"; she could hardly believe that once she had bought into Christian ideology. I found that VERY interesting! Yes, it's interesting, and MsHarmony can tell you that I ain't shy when it comes to god-bashing, esp. Christian-god bashing, but when someone tells me a story of a person who had lost "all memory" then my attention pricks up when I hear she said this or that. All memory is all memory, and that involves stored language, since lingual ability is hard-wired into humans, but specific language is programmed for and by each individual baby by repetitive memorization processes. |
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For me it is hard for me not to believe in a God. I know he exists, but does he care? I don't know. Sometimes I'm like where was God when ths or that happened? Why doesn't God give me the life I want? They say it's all in God's time. Well I think God has a sick sense of humor.
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For me it is hard for me not to believe in a God. I know he exists, but does he care? I don't know. Sometimes I'm like where was God when ths or that happened? Why doesn't God give me the life I want? They say it's all in God's time. Well I think God has a sick sense of humor. I believe God cares. I think that often times what is in our spiritual best interest is not the thing that makes our flesh happy, much like when we were children and didnt get the things we wanted from our parents,, there was a greater knowledge to be gained for our future use. |
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Maybe so, but I often wonder what does he want or what is he doing to me. I used be religious but when crap keeps happening in my life I'm like who cares? Does God?
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Maybe so, but I often wonder what does he want or what is he doing to me. I used be religious but when crap keeps happening in my life I'm like who cares? Does God? yeah, I understand. I have had times when I felt so alone, but it takes coming out of those times to know that I am not. God bless the child who has his own, is often a plea to us to be there for ourselves and God will help us do for ourselves when I feel like where is God, I ask where am I, what am I doing and what could I do to change this situation,,,what have I done that may have contributed to the situation,,,,how much worse might it be if God wasnt there,,,etc,,, |
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msharmony wrote: heartsfire 81 rote: For me it is hard for me not to believe in a God. I know he exists, but does he care? I don't know. Sometimes I'm like where was God when ths or that happened? Why doesn't God give me the life I want? They say it's all in God's time. Well I think God has a sick sense of humor. I believe God cares. I think that often times what is in our spiritual best interest is not the thing that makes our flesh happy, much like when we were children and didnt get the things we wanted from our parents,, there was a greater knowledge to be gained for our future use. That's make the idea and truth abt god so simple that if god read it would laugh like crazy Here the question is : how do we know that God really care abt us and is only one answer - no one knows and we hope only . Because we ppl use god like our TV program in our level - when we need god - we switch it on the program " god pls help me" , when we feel good we don't care what we gonna do and usually we do since /according to holly books/ God exists and he is not what we like to be - our donor for a good life. |
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Spider you have a little something I call confirmation Bias and I still can't believe you have read all types od science and still believe the bible word for word have you ever seen these miracles ??? an illusionist once said given enough preparation he could recreate every single illusion or so called miracle in the bible, walking on water turning water to wine for example I have never seen a miracle of the type performed by Jesus. I know that many claim to have performed these miracles and my immediate reaction is skepticism. I feel the same way towards any claim of the supernatural. I'll explain my reasoning if you care to read it. Miracles are more subtle and rare now than they were in the Biblical days. 1) Faith. God wants to be worshiped through faith. Those who know that God undeniably exists are much more likely to obey God. But those who only *believe* that God exists and still obey God, those are his true followers. Those who in their heart of hearts have doubts, but they still choose to worship out of faith that God exists show that they are truly worthy. Adam and Eve would never have eaten the Apple if God were present. God wants a new family of Adam's and Eve's who obey God even when He is not present. By faith we know that God, while not physically present, is intimately aware of our actions and sins. 2) Plausible undeniably. People in the past had a limited understanding of the universe, magic seemed possible and miracles could be disregarded as magic or the work of Satan. Few people would believe that today. If a truly sick man were cured by a touch, it would not be easily rejected as magic or the work of evil spirits. Such miracles would lower the threshold of faith. Making it easier for the skeptical to believe in God and skewing things, so that they believed because of a miracle they witnessed rather than because they have faith in God. Also, people might commit the same mistake as the people did of Elijah. They believed that the power was in Elijah, so when Elisha took his place, they laughed at him and mocked him. Elisha's ministry was marked by his repeatedly trying to teach people that it was God who gave them their power. |
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"Miracles are more subtle and rare now than they were in the Biblical days."
Balderdash... WE are more sophisicated now then in biblical days... Miracles are not 'more subtle' and 'rare'... They are exactally the same... If it is not possible, it was not possible... Therefore it is a fable... This in no way takes away the truth in the bible or other 'holy' books from ancient times... It merely means one must carefully examine what one takes from those books... Because hucksters have had their own input upon the 'word of god'... (if they exist now they also existed then) |
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Maybe so, but I often wonder what does he want or what is he doing to me. I used be religious but when crap keeps happening in my life I'm like who cares? Does God? This is a prime example of what Satan is doing. As you said you were a religious kind of person, then all this crap happened. Satan does this to give you the state of thinking you currently have/had.... does God care? If so, why do these thing happen? ect ect. Is it your fault that something bad happens to one of your children? Is it your parents fault that something bad happened to you? No of course not. So why even have the thought when something bad happens it was cause of God our father? Through life we must go through tribulations and different heart aches. It's not that God doesn't love us. I beg of you, please don't let Satan win what he has started here. |
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"Miracles are more subtle and rare now than they were in the Biblical days." Balderdash... WE are more sophisicated now then in biblical days... Miracles are not 'more subtle' and 'rare'... They are exactally the same... If it is not possible, it was not possible... Therefore it is a fable... This in no way takes away the truth in the bible or other 'holy' books from ancient times... It merely means one must carefully examine what one takes from those books... Because hucksters have had their own input upon the 'word of god'... (if they exist now they also existed then) Miracles happen now just as they happened then and will tomorrow. It's more about giving credit where credit is due. A starving family gets put back on their feet because of some organization. Nowadays the credit usually goes to the organization not God. Yes the organization was whom did physically give the family food, but gotta keep in mind God works through people. Give credit where credit is due and it'll open your eyes to all the miracles that happen every day. |
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"Miracles are more subtle and rare now than they were in the Biblical days." Balderdash... WE are more sophisicated now then in biblical days... Miracles are not 'more subtle' and 'rare'... They are exactally the same... If it is not possible, it was not possible... Therefore it is a fable... This in no way takes away the truth in the bible or other 'holy' books from ancient times... It merely means one must carefully examine what one takes from those books... Because hucksters have had their own input upon the 'word of god'... (if they exist now they also existed then) Miracles happen now just as they happened then and will tomorrow. It's more about giving credit where credit is due. A starving family gets put back on their feet because of some organization. Nowadays the credit usually goes to the organization not God. Yes the organization was whom did physically give the family food, but gotta keep in mind God works through people. Give credit where credit is due and it'll open your eyes to all the miracles that happen every day. Raise the dead... Food for thousands of people falling from the sky... feeding hundreds of people from a bucket of fish and a loaf of bread... Making the blind see and the lame walk... Aye... River revival techniques of the huckster... Jesus would be ashamed of the stories that have been embellished about him... And those stories take away from the purity of his message. (purely for the reasons of men). |
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"Miracles are more subtle and rare now than they were in the Biblical days." Balderdash... WE are more sophisicated now then in biblical days... Miracles are not 'more subtle' and 'rare'... They are exactally the same... If it is not possible, it was not possible... Therefore it is a fable... This in no way takes away the truth in the bible or other 'holy' books from ancient times... It merely means one must carefully examine what one takes from those books... Because hucksters have had their own input upon the 'word of god'... (if they exist now they also existed then) Miracles happen now just as they happened then and will tomorrow. It's more about giving credit where credit is due. A starving family gets put back on their feet because of some organization. Nowadays the credit usually goes to the organization not God. Yes the organization was whom did physically give the family food, but gotta keep in mind God works through people. Give credit where credit is due and it'll open your eyes to all the miracles that happen every day. Raise the dead... Food for thousands of people falling from the sky... feeding hundreds of people from a bucket of fish and a loaf of bread... Making the blind see and the lame walk... Aye... River revival techniques of the huckster... Jesus would be ashamed of the stories that have been embellished about him... And those stories take away from the purity of his message. (purely for the reasons of men). Anything and everything is possible through God. With enough faith one could stop the turning of the world, with enough faith one could move mountains, with enough faith one could touch the stars. NOTHING is impossible. This world is ours to subdue. |
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Raise the dead... Food for thousands of people falling from the sky... feeding hundreds of people from a bucket of fish and a loaf of bread... Making the blind see and the lame walk... Aye... River revival techniques of the huckster... Jesus would be ashamed of the stories that have been embellished about him... And those stories take away from the purity of his message. (purely for the reasons of men). Those were miracles, because they were real. A huckster would have to fake the miracles by seeding the audience or something like that. |
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Raise the dead... Food for thousands of people falling from the sky... feeding hundreds of people from a bucket of fish and a loaf of bread... Making the blind see and the lame walk... Aye... River revival techniques of the huckster... Jesus would be ashamed of the stories that have been embellished about him... And those stories take away from the purity of his message. (purely for the reasons of men). Those were miracles, because they were real. A huckster would have to fake the miracles by seeding the audience or something like that. Real my eye... Have you seen such... because a MAN claims that this thing happened (while also claiming that HE or THEY were the CONTINUATION of the MESSAGE brought by the actual person so gifted by god) SIMPLY because they so claim... does not make it real. IF IT CAN NOT BE ALSO VERIFIED BY SCIENCE THEN CLAIMS MADE BY RELIGION ARE False. Subdue my eye (for cowboy) DOMINION is much different that SUBDUE... I have faith... I would not attempt to stop the world from turning because DOMINION tells me that it would KILL every living thing upon it should I be so base and self serving. DOMINION means I must approach my life with contemplation and thought, faith and hope, love and understanding... any thing less than that would be a dishonor to the DOMINION god has given me. |
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Real my eye... Have you seen such... because a MAN claims that this thing happened (while also claiming that HE or THEY were the CONTINUATION of the MESSAGE brought by the actual person so gifted by god) SIMPLY because they so claim... does not make it real. IF IT CAN NOT BE ALSO VERIFIED BY SCIENCE THEN CLAIMS MADE BY RELIGION ARE False. Subdue my eye (for cowboy) DOMINION is much different that SUBDUE... I have faith... I would not attempt to stop the world from turning because DOMINION tells me that it would KILL every living thing upon it should I be so base and self serving. DOMINION means I must approach my life with contemplation and thought, faith and hope, love and understanding... any thing less than that would be a dishonor to the DOMINION god has given me. Science systematic knowledge of the physical or material world gained through observation and experimentation. God is not of the physical or material world, so God cannot be verified by science. Also, interestingly enough, science cannot verify the scientific method, so it must be false. Science also cannot prove that I'm not the only sentient being in existence and I'm dreaming everything else. Science also cannot prove that the universe didn't begin on the day I was born with an appearance of age. It seems like you put your faith into the wrong god. |
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Real my eye... Have you seen such... because a MAN claims that this thing happened (while also claiming that HE or THEY were the CONTINUATION of the MESSAGE brought by the actual person so gifted by god) SIMPLY because they so claim... does not make it real. IF IT CAN NOT BE ALSO VERIFIED BY SCIENCE THEN CLAIMS MADE BY RELIGION ARE False. Subdue my eye (for cowboy) DOMINION is much different that SUBDUE... I have faith... I would not attempt to stop the world from turning because DOMINION tells me that it would KILL every living thing upon it should I be so base and self serving. DOMINION means I must approach my life with contemplation and thought, faith and hope, love and understanding... any thing less than that would be a dishonor to the DOMINION god has given me. Science systematic knowledge of the physical or material world gained through observation and experimentation. God is not of the physical or material world, so God cannot be verified by science. Also, interestingly enough, science cannot verify the scientific method, so it must be false. Science also cannot prove that I'm not the only sentient being in existence and I'm dreaming everything else. Science also cannot prove that the universe didn't begin on the day I was born with an appearance of age. It seems like you put your faith into the wrong god. I have not stated that SCIENCE must verify GOD... I said that a CLAIM made by a RELIGION that does not fit SCIENCE is false... a man made lie... As far as my faith... I have absolute faith in god... Without the need of man made balderdash. GOD IS. man makes religions. If science and religion do not agree then one or both are wrong... Empirical observation tells me that science is much more accurate. THIS DOES NOT TAKE AWAY FROM GOD. Nay rather does it show the man made nature of religion. God is great... Religion brings strife and discord. Would god do so? |
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