you guys loose a bunch of time in tehcnical details, that even become
pathetic reading this.
the bible is a book mthat suppose to teach to love our brothers and
sisters in the same way we love ourselves.
now a very interesting question would be how much do you love yourself?

Regards

TLW

Ok I have a headache and this thread is just making it worse and
confusing the hell out of me...I'm goin to poetry

Nice point TLW.

What has me curious is that in starting to read the Bible (you can thank
spider for that) I have learned that MANY words within it are falsely
(shem) represented. In lots of cases several different words have been
translated into one word. (hell). The more I read the more I find that
does not agree with the original hebrew (as far as the old testement is
concerned).

This is not a good thing because some of the differences CHANGE the
meaning of the word of God. DRASTICALLY! Yet this is the same book
that people are told is the absolute word of God.

If you participate in propagating a lie that you do not know is a lie
are you guilty or is the ones that made it a lie?

If you know something contains a falsehood with it would you warn
others?

when i was little i was taught the bible, in the same terms hell, sin,
etc.
It my duty to study more deep in detail, i have the blessing to find
Father Hugo who was my teacher for more 10 years.
He taught me that I'm good or follow the bible not because I'm scared of
hell. I do that because it's a duty of love to God and my brothers and
sisters.
NOw you guys keep going with your technichalities.

TLW

Spider, the Torah.

AB: Which version of Hebrew is being translated?

Differentkindofwench,

I've never seen a Greek translation of the Torah. I guess they exist,
but I wouldn't know how they are translated.

the Greek also use 'LORD' where YHWH is present.

The oldest complete Septuagint (Greek Old Testament) versions, from
around the second century A.D., consistently use Κυριος (=
"Lord"), where the Hebrew has YHWH, corresponding to substituting Adonay
for YHWH in reading the original

DKW

The version of old Hebrew.

One known as Paleo-Hebrew or Paleo-Sementic. The interesting thing is
that the scrolls found at Qumran (Dead Sea) also have YHWH within them
but do not contain what modern hebrew has as vowel pointers.

EHYEH ASHER EHYEH

So what about the Hebrew being translated. Is it straight up Hebrew or
"an ancient Hebrew script known as paleo-Hebrew. The fact that there
are only eight biblical manuscripts written in this script, all of them
representatives of the Torah suggests that this ancient script was
reserved for especially important books." Quote taken from The Dead Sea
Scrolls Bible.

This book by the way also talks about another scroll found, "classified
as a non-biblical scroll called the Temple Scroll, a work that purports
to be a new Torah for the Last Days in which God speaks to Israel
evidently through Moses in the first person."

Therin lies a problem.

both Jesus and Mohammand claim to have spoken as if they were Moses.

Scuse me, Say What?

Differentkindofwench
Shalom.

I believe what Ab is saying is the muslims put our Savior and Mohamm-d as prophets. Moshe spoke of a prophet like him that we would listen to.

Deut 18:17-22

17 "And Yahweh said to me:'What they have spoken is good. 18 I will raise up for them a ((Prophet) like you from among their brethren, and will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them all that I command Him.) 19 And it shall be that whoever will not hear My words, which He speaks in My name, I will require it of him.
NKJV
This is where they believe Yahshua was a prophet.

Notice as this thread says that he speaks in Yahweh's name.. As john 5:43 Yahshua proclaimed.

As I saw earlier YHWH was translated LORD 6900+ times. No other name or word is repeated this much in the bible.

Now many says he has many names yet he says he has 1 name and that his ways are not our ways. So what is he saying? To believe.. Do not question your creator be obedient children. Just like at the Israelites promiced they would and Yahweh promiced to be thier Elohim.


I find this interesting in Ezra.

Ezra 2:13
13 the people of Adonikam, six hundred and sixty-six;
NKJV 666

Rev 13:17-18
and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

18 Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the (number of a man): His number is 666.
NKJV

notice the beast also has a name. it is the # of a man..666..now the # of man is 6 as he was created on the 6th day.

So what is this mans name? It is strange that Adonikam has 666 children. What does Adonikam's name mean?



OT:113

OT:113 /oda* 'adown (aw-done'); or (shortened) 'adon (aw-done'); from an unused root (meaning to rule); sovereign, i.e. controller (human or devine ) OT:113

KJV - lord, master, owner. Compare also names beginning with "Adoni-".

So here we can see that Adoni: means to rule, soveriegn, and the KJV-lord or master.


what about the rest? (kam)

OT:6967

OT:6965 <Wq quwm (koom); a primitive root; to rise (in various applications, literal, figurative, intensive and causative):


KJV - abide, accomplish, be clearer, confirm, continue, decree, be dim, endure, enemy, enjoin, get up, make good, help, hold, (help to) lift up (again), make, but newly, ordain, perform, pitch, raise (up), rear (up), remain, (a-) rise (up) (again, against), rouse up, set (up), (e-) stablish, (make to) stand (up), stir up, strengthen, succeed, (as-, make) sure (-ly), (be) up (-hold, -rising).

now you can see this has all the attributes of our master. Yahshua.


So taking this (Adonikam)= My lord has risen, My lord has established, My lord strengthens, My lord lifts up, My lord confirms...

Just like everyone wants to say for our savior and the bible has agreed with it.


See we have everyone fighting Yahweh's name. Why? Because they hate it. This will really show through when the 2 witnesses appear using Yahweh's name. It is obvious they prefer to use the name Adonikam instead of Yahweh whether they realize it or not. Because they are children of disobedience. Not doing as the word says. So of cource Yahshua's comming will come as a thief in the night. Yahweh's name is powerful. He tells us.

EVERYONE WHO CALLS UPON THE NAME OF YAHWEH SHALL BE SAVED. The meaning of Yahshua.

May Yahweh's Grace be With You.... Shalom.. Miles

Miles, do you really think the falseness was regarding how God's name is said or does that commandment pertain to not attributing falsely to what his laws and messages are or is it both?

does it really matter to him what we call him??? I don't think it does..if I wanted to call him the great kazzoo then I could ...what the hell do I know I have no knowledge about any of this and at this point none of it really matters in the the long run....screw it I'm goin back to where I belong

Cherub you belong wherever you want to be and right well you know it too. Sorry, I get a little tense when people slam themselves.

I find this name business a bit hard myself. No offense to anyone of the Jewish faith. Hebrew is very foreign to my ears. Yes, I know just because I'm not used to it does not make it any less so and just because one's forefather's behaved in a way that was inappropriate doesn't mean you should follow their actions either. All I am saying is this is a hard call to wrap my mind around something so "simple" being such a major law. Here's another aspect of my problem with this. If the name needs to be the same, I would really be interested to know the meaning of this name in every language it has been transcribed into., i.e. Allah, Yah is family right Miles is that what you said before? God, Jehovah (which I believe used to be spelled differently and is known to be a misspelling or translation, I can't remember which) what other names for God are out there being incorrectly used. I need to read this thread again, sorry, should have waited to post.

shalom

jc does not equal Yahshua. From my knowledge of greek the sus in Jc would = sow. Just as J-hovah the hovah = mischief.Strange who that would really refer to. Elohim is from the family of the Angels.Elohim means mainly Judge in Hebrew. That is why Yahshua called himself Elohim. We also can call ourselves Elohim as in "Judgement (Elohim) starts at the house of Israel" Blaspheming the name of Yahweh is not using it. bringing it to naught. destruction. many wonder what is blaspeming of the Holy Spirit. The only sin that can not be forgiven. The 3rd commandment is the only commandment that says he will not hold you guiltless (sinless). It is quite a mystery why people fight so hard not to say it and proclaim Yahweh as Elohim of the Heavens and the Earth that Created all things.. Satan is said to be the g-d of this world.. I am syre DKW I am stepping on a lot of toes but it is true what I have said and can easily be proven.... Blessings of Shalom Miles

I don't mind you stepping on toes, Miles. That's one of the reasons I wear boots - doesn't hurt as bad......

Thought just occurred regarding blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. If the Holy Spirit is contained in each of us, do ya think that could be pertaining to suicide? My turn to step on toes.

Wench

AB;

I have to jump in here - because your original post fails as a valid argument. You have created a logical fallacy by constructing an argument using "The fallacy of the shifting middle" as an acceptable premise to prove your point.

You have stated that the translation of YHWH to LORD is in defiance of the 3rd commandment because in English Lord does not translate directly back to YHWH. However - most people understand that when you read an English bible LORD translates as YHWH. The fact that Lord also translates into other interpretations does not apply to the argument - that is the shifting middle. Here YHWH = LORD = YHWH is the only acceptable definition when reading scripture, so there is nothing "False" about the translation into English of the 3rd commandment.

lj

Eljay..

Then what does this mean. Does Yahweh change? We must do as we are commanded not what we reason to be.

Isa 55:8-9
For My thoughts are not your thoughts,
Nor are your ways My ways ," says Yahweh.
9 "For as the heavens are higher than the earth,
So are My ways higher than your ways,
And My thoughts than your thoughts.
NKJV
This insertion of LORD for Yahweh is prophecy..

Jer 8:8-9
"How can you say, 'We are wise,
And the law of Yahweh is with us'?
Look, the false pen of the scribe certainly works falsehood.
9 The wise men are ashamed,
They are dismayed and taken.
Behold, they have rejected the word of Yahweh;
So what wisdom do they have?
NKJV

Mal 2:7-9

7 "For the lips of a priest should keep knowledge,
And people should seek the law from his mouth;
For he is the messenger of Yahweh of hosts.
8 But you have departed from the way;
You have caused many to stumble at the law.
You have corrupted the covenant of Levi,"
Says Yahweh of hosts.
9 "Therefore I also have made you contemptible and base
Before all the people,
Because you have not kept My ways
But have shown partiality in the law."
NKJV
Those words tell us alot.
DKW

Shalom..

No. Suicide is not mentioned as a sin that is unforgivable. For at the judgement thier works will be what is looked at. Not that i think suicide is acceptable. Most who commit suicide are in great need of compassion and understanding.


Rev 20:12-14
2 And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before Elohim, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books. 13 The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works.
NKJV
So they will have a chance.

Now the Holy Spirit living in us. Yes this is a very important matter.

1 Cor 3:16-17
Do you not know that you are the temple of Yahweh and that the Spirit of Yahweh dwells in you? 17 If anyone defiles the temple of Yahweh, Yahweh will destroy him. For the temple of Yahweh is holy, which temple you are.
NKJV

Here we see defiling the temple will lead to your destruction. As Yahshua said to fear him.

Matt 10:28-29
8 And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
NKJV

Then look at what the Assembly in Smyrna is told about Satan..

Rev 2:8-11

"And to the angel of the church in Smyrna write,

'These things says the First and the Last, who was dead, and came to life: ( Yahshua) 9 "I know your works, tribulation, and poverty (but you are rich); and I know the blasphemy ( notice blasphemy is used) of those who say they are Jews (see below) and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan. 10 Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days. Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.

11 "He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death."'
NKJV

Notice Yahshua here refers to Blasphemy, satan,and those who say they are jews.

Now why would he refer to the jews here? Could it be he is speaking of those who say they "BELIEVE" BUT REALLY DO NOT? He tells the true believers be faithful. What are they to be faithful to?

Rev 12:17
7 And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of Yahweh and have the testimony of Yahshua our Messiah.
NKJV

Do you see in both instances he speaks of satan?

Now look at what he told the assembly before this one.Rev 2:1
Ephesus
NKJV

Rev 2:2-4
And you have tested those who say they are apostles and are not, and have found them liars; 3 and you have persevered and have patience, and have labored for My name's sake and have not become weary.
NKJV

Here again Yahshua speaks of those who say they are jews (Apostles) The heads of Assemblies.

Then after that what is it they are doing? and Keeping, His name. Yahweh is Salvation.

You can go throughout the bible and Yahweh calls his children those who call upon his name.

Blasphemy and satan seem very clearly to be against his name Yahweh.. He is jealous for his name. Yet all we hear is excuse after excuse why we should not use his name or he knows who we are calling or talking about. That is not the point. it is will you obey and believe. If you do he promices to be your Elohim and you to be his children who are called by his name.

Rev 14:1

Then I looked, and behold, a Lamb standing on Mount Zion, and with Him one hundred and forty-four thousand, having His Father's name written on their foreheads.
NKJV

Yahweh is my Father and I carry his name as any child carries his fathers name.

May Yahweh's Grace and Knowledge Fill You With His Wisdom of Gold........ Shalom and Blessings .. Miles

Miles;

I know you adressed your last post to me - but I have no idea what point you were trying to make. My post was directed to AB's original topic and his flaw in logic. Is that what you were adressing?

lj