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| Topic: Obama berates AIG and vows to try to block bonuses | |
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Thanks Wiley  However, if I understood it correctly, had 'we' not bailed out AIG the whole system would have collapsed not just in North America but worldwide. Is this correct? That's what the government claims. I suspect differently. But who knows? What do you believe? I believe the company should have been allowed to fail or file chapter 11. It would have been hard for awhile, but probably resolved itself by now. And another more deserving company probably would have taken AIG's place. Also, there was no stipulation for any records of any type for the first bailout handout given to AIG, correct? Nope. Bush dropped the ball on that one as did Congress. So I am assuming this proposed tax on bonuses applies to second bailout handout not the first? Correct. |
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Hey all question, these 'bonuses' are they really bonuses, have read where in some contracts (whether still employed or not) they were guaranteed the same salary for 2008 as they earned in 2007 regardless of productivity or performance. Was this not addressed in the bailout package? Were exceptions made? Just trying to understand. Also read that these bonuses made 73 millionaires from those that work/worked in the failing unit. There were exceptions in the bailout bill that specifically ok'd this. Thank you Chris Dodd. However, there was a clause that left it open for the Secretary of the Treasury to determine a contract valid before being obligated to pay it. So yes, the government knew this was going to happen. Yes, they are still griping about it. Yes, this is all smoke and mirrors to detract from the fact that a lot of the bailout money is going overseas. And yes, there's little to nothing we can actually do about any of it. Giving AIG a bailout to begin with was a mistake. Now we're starting to see the consequences of that mistake. I don't know. A lot of economist point to letting Lehman go down the drain as the reason for catapulting unemployment. AIG failure it has been proposed could have shut down the whole world. |
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I don't know. A lot of economist point to letting Lehman go down the drain as the reason for catapulting unemployment. AIG failure it has been proposed could have shut down the whole world. Proposed. Nobody knows for sure either way. |
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I thought I was the only one, I cannot rationalize why the government handed out money, with no stipulation, no rules nor regulations so easily. Free money, come and get it
 If one cannot run a company or runs it to the ground, I agree let them handle their own affairs. Get out of the hole anyway you can but each company should be responsible for their own get out of jail free card, not me and other taxpayers. I think this whole fiasco was known/planned as no where in my mind do I believe a company would offer to pay an employee regardless to their productivity and performance, WTF (jmo). |
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Edited by
wiley
on
Tue 03/17/09 12:33 PM
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I thought I was the only one, I cannot rationalize why the government handed out money, with no stipulation, no rules nor regulations so easily. Free money, come and get it If one cannot run a company or runs it to the ground, I agree let them handle their own affairs. Get out of the hole anyway you can but each company should be responsible for their own get out of jail free card, not me and other taxpayers. I think this whole fiasco was known/planned as no where in my mind do I believe a company would offer to pay an employee regardless to their productivity and performance, WTF (jmo). Well considering the government now has 80% controlling interest in AIG and with talk of taxing the bonuses at 100%, is it any wonder, really? This is a power grab by the government cloaked in "It's the economy stupid!" I find it disgusting that the government is whining about $165 million in "bonuses" while turning a blind eye to the billions of the bailout that went to foreign banks. Make no mistake, I have no love for the crooks in AIG, but they were never alone in this. The government is up to their eyeballs in it as well. |
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Talk, talk talk...
Pres says we will do this... or even that. Yet members of his own party continue to take monies from the very people that are at the core of this MANUFACTURED finincial crisis... Ever wonder how the Democratic party suddenly got TONS of money... as the finincial markets were crumbling... all in small increments... must have had a very good bot virus programmer on the payroll. what happend to wall street was no accident. |
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Edited by
nogames39
on
Tue 03/17/09 02:31 PM
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However, if I understood it correctly, had 'we' not bailed out AIG the whole system would have collapsed not just in North America but worldwide. Is this correct? (This was not addressed to me, but I just can't let it go.) Nope. Nothing would have collapsed anymore than it will collapse anyway. But, because we would have saved the funds that we waste on AIG and others, we would be actually in a better shape. The wall street claims this every time. That is how rich get their affairs paid, using the stupidity of "working class" who think they got the rich by the balls. The whole trick is that poor, being dumb, actually fight for this to happen, because they have been told that this is how you fight the rich. Poor are to dumb to see how this works exactly against them, and too immoral to understand that digging a hole for someone else is a bad idea to begin with. The poor could have spared themselves the misery if they were either smarter, or simply fair and just. In either case, then, this scheme of "bailing out the economy" would not happen. |
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However, if I understood it correctly, had 'we' not bailed out AIG the whole system would have collapsed not just in North America but worldwide. Is this correct? (This was not addressed to me, but I just can't let it go.) Nope. Nothing would have collapsed anymore than it will collapse anyway. But, because we would have saved the funds that we waste on AIG and others, we would be actually in a better shape. The wall street claims this every time. That is how rich get their affairs paid, using the stupidity of "working class" who think they got the rich by the balls. The whole trick is that poor, being dumb, actually fight for this to happen, because they have been told that this is how you fight the rich. Poor are to dumb to see how this works exactly against them, and too immoral to understand that digging a hole for someone else is a bad idea to begin with. The poor could have spared themselves the misery if they were either smarter, or simply fair and just. In either case, then, this scheme of "bailing out the economy" would not happen. Thank you for your response and scenario. However, uour constant analogy of the poor being dumb and stupid takes away from your valid point (jmo) Where do you stand? on which side? |
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http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2009/03/18/breaking-i-was-responsible-for-bonus-loophole-says-dodd/
BREAKING: I was responsible for bonus loophole, says Dodd Posted: 05:56 PM ET WASHINGTON (CNN) — Senate Banking committee Chairman Christopher Dodd told CNN’s Dana Bash and Wolf Blitzer Wednesday that he was responsible for adding the bonus loophole into the stimulus package that permitted AIG and other companies that received bailout funds to pay bonuses. On Tuesday, Dodd denied to CNN that he had anything to do with the adding of that provision. Is Obama going to berate Dodd? Is Harry Reid going to seek Dodds resignation? This looks like a perfect example of "Change We Need". I have a feeling its just going to be politics as usual. |
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Thank you for your response and scenario. However, uour constant analogy of the poor being dumb and stupid takes away from your valid point (jmo) Where do you stand? on which side? I try to constantly emphasize this, as you have correctly noticed. This is because there are only two ways to do the right thing: - Figure out what works (have a good brain) - Do what is just (have good morals) Having both qualities would be great, but even one will suffice. The problem with most poor today, is that while they don't have enough knowledge or desire to learn, they also have no moral compass. This should make it clear that without having either one of two required qualities, they will have no chance to live good life. I am not clear on "where you stand" thing. Not sure what you mean. Am I poor or rich? Am I smart or dumb? .... I'll make a guess and answer this as if you were asking me am I for or against AIG bailout: Not one should be bailed out. Everyone, equally, should be made to eat consequences of their actions or inaction. Poor or rich, smart or dumb. Equally. Thus, no, AIG should never have been bailed out in the first place! |
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Thank you for your response and scenario. However, uour constant analogy of the poor being dumb and stupid takes away from your valid point (jmo) Where do you stand? on which side? I try to constantly emphasize this, as you have correctly noticed. This is because there are only two ways to do the right thing: - Figure out what works (have a good brain) - Do what is just (have good morals) Having both qualities would be great, but even one will suffice. The problem with most poor today, is that while they don't have enough knowledge or desire to learn, they also have no moral compass. This should make it clear that without having either one of two required qualities, they will have no chance to live good life. I am not clear on "where you stand" thing. Not sure what you mean. Am I poor or rich? Am I smart or dumb? .... I'll make a guess and answer this as if you were asking me am I for or against AIG bailout: Not one should be bailed out. Everyone, equally, should be made to eat consequences of their actions or inaction. Poor or rich, smart or dumb. Equally. Thus, no, AIG should never have been bailed out in the first place! beg to differ... Most poor I have met have WAY MORE morals than other facets of our society... Claim not what you can't back up. Insult not when other words would suffice. As far as AIG... It is a symptom of a false system... A system which is doomed to fail (no matter how much money you pump at it)... If we continue to 'fix' corporations that make nothing, build nothing, sell nothing and charge a lot for that nothing... we will simply make the final fall that much longer and harder. |
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The problem with most poor today, is that while they don't have enough knowledge or desire to learn, they also have no moral compass.
 there are poor people that just fell on hard times or something drastic may have happened or just haven't gotten a break. i live paycheck to paycheck and not because of lack of desire to learn or lack of knowledge in my field....and i have a moral compass |
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Edited by
wiley
on
Thu 03/19/09 10:44 PM
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If we continue to 'fix' corporations that make nothing, build nothing, sell nothing and charge a lot for that nothing... Exactly. We are no longer a producing nation. Instead we are solely made up of consumers. We suffer from a huge trade deficit and every time we strike up a new trade agreement, it always put foreign interests above our own. Our government is working hard at pushing the entrepreneurs who are here out of this country. Our education system is successfully preventing any more from being created. The empire is going to fall hard I'm afraid. |
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Thank you for your response and scenario. However, uour constant analogy of the poor being dumb and stupid takes away from your valid point (jmo) Where do you stand? on which side? I try to constantly emphasize this, as you have correctly noticed. This is because there are only two ways to do the right thing: - Figure out what works (have a good brain) - Do what is just (have good morals) Having both qualities would be great, but even one will suffice. The problem with most poor today, is that while they don't have enough knowledge or desire to learn, they also have no moral compass. This should make it clear that without having either one of two required qualities, they will have no chance to live good life. I am not clear on "where you stand" thing. Not sure what you mean. Am I poor or rich? Am I smart or dumb? .... I'll make a guess and answer this as if you were asking me am I for or against AIG bailout: Not one should be bailed out. Everyone, equally, should be made to eat consequences of their actions or inaction. Poor or rich, smart or dumb. Equally. Thus, no, AIG should never have been bailed out in the first place! This is not true at all. |
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As for the AIG thing, I would rather try to stop the downfall then chance what is said will happen. Only the foolish would chance it with everyone at stake. My opinion of course.
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But, remember, the only thing "at stake" here, is the NWO, that is collapsing as we witness it.
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The problem with most poor today, is that while they don't have enough knowledge or desire to learn, they also have no moral compass. This should make it clear that without having either one of two required qualities, they will have no chance to live good life. Seems to always want to come back to the poor. They are to blame for their lack of knowledge, desire to learn and having no moral compass, what a bunch of stuff. AIG is by no means is poor - very knowledgeable, educated, and wealthy (the bonuses alone made over 11 millionaires) while I question their moral character, it does make your point moot. |
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The problem with most poor today, is that while they don't have enough knowledge or desire to learn, they also have no moral compass. This should make it clear that without having either one of two required qualities, they will have no chance to live good life. Seems to always want to come back to the poor. They are to blame for their lack of knowledge, desire to learn and having no moral compass, what a bunch of stuff. AIG is by no means is poor - very knowledgeable, educated, and wealthy (the bonuses alone made over 11 millionaires) while I question their moral character, it does make your point moot. Actually over 70 people got over $1 million in bonuses. 11 of those people no longer work for AIG. |
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The problem with most poor today, is that while they don't have enough knowledge or desire to learn, they also have no moral compass. This should make it clear that without having either one of two required qualities, they will have no chance to live good life. Seems to always want to come back to the poor. They are to blame for their lack of knowledge, desire to learn and having no moral compass, what a bunch of stuff. AIG is by no means is poor - very knowledgeable, educated, and wealthy (the bonuses alone made over 11 millionaires) while I question their moral character, it does make your point moot. Actually over 70 people got over $1 million in bonuses. 11 of those people no longer work for AIG. Stand corrected AIG made 73 people millionaires and 11 of them are no longer working. Poor little millionaires 
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 i'm NEVER that lucky where's the kicking the dirt smiley? |
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