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| Topic: DID A&Eve have | |
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I would assume that Adm and Eve had sexual relations more often than what is depicted in the bible but as I stated, what does that matter? As a story it really would not be an important or critical plot point. We can naturally assume that they would have been intimate with one another based on the circumstances. However, from the perspective of someone who believes in this and takes it literally and to be truth and factual, wouldn't you mainly just be concerned with whether or not Eve gave birth and became pregnant by Adam? I mean what is the significance of them getting jiggy with one another beyond that? We have to already assume that Yahweh had designed Eve in such a manner that sex would be pleasurable for her based on what I mentioned in my first post. Male sexuality is bound up in reproduction because you can not climax without that being involved. A woman on the other hand is not restricted by that. The functions are not mutually inseparable. In fact, sadly, in some African nations this is part of the reason why the bodies of young girls can be mutilated. I would say this pretty much sums it up. I can't think of anything to add - or take away. |
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Is that sarcasm? Hard to tell on here at times?
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I would assume that Adm and Eve had sexual relations more often than what is depicted in the bible but as I stated, what does that matter? As a story it really would not be an important or critical plot point. We can naturally assume that they would have been intimate with one another based on the circumstances. However, from the perspective of someone who believes in this and takes it literally and to be truth and factual, wouldn't you mainly just be concerned with whether or not Eve gave birth and became pregnant by Adam? I mean what is the significance of them getting jiggy with one another beyond that? We have to already assume that Yahweh had designed Eve in such a manner that sex would be pleasurable for her based on what I mentioned in my first post. Male sexuality is bound up in reproduction because you can not climax without that being involved. A woman on the other hand is not restricted by that. The functions are not mutually inseparable. In fact, sadly, in some African nations this is part of the reason why the bodies of young girls can be mutilated. I would say this pretty much sums it up. I can't think of anything to add - or take away. HMMM - as usual no help at all. but thnx anyway. do you think it might just be possible clit and all that that they were being kept from it just as little children are? there expierential knowledge is not active at this point there is no need to be thinking or having concern with hthese things till after there desirs and lust are awakend by their sin? just a thought just because we are born [as they just were] qwith sexual genitals does not mean they are being put to use right after we are born right? |
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I would assume that Adm and Eve had sexual relations more often than what is depicted in the bible but as I stated, what does that matter? As a story it really would not be an important or critical plot point. We can naturally assume that they would have been intimate with one another based on the circumstances. However, from the perspective of someone who believes in this and takes it literally and to be truth and factual, wouldn't you mainly just be concerned with whether or not Eve gave birth and became pregnant by Adam? I mean what is the significance of them getting jiggy with one another beyond that? We have to already assume that Yahweh had designed Eve in such a manner that sex would be pleasurable for her based on what I mentioned in my first post. Male sexuality is bound up in reproduction because you can not climax without that being involved. A woman on the other hand is not restricted by that. The functions are not mutually inseparable. In fact, sadly, in some African nations this is part of the reason why the bodies of young girls can be mutilated. I would say this pretty much sums it up. I can't think of anything to add - or take away. HMMM - as usual no help at all. but thnx anyway. do you think it might just be possible clit and all that that they were being kept from it just as little children are? there expierential knowledge is not active at this point there is no need to be thinking or having concern with hthese things till after there desirs and lust are awakend by their sin? just a thought just because we are born [as they just were] qwith sexual genitals does not mean they are being put to use right after we are born right? What do you mean "no help at all as usual"? What kind of comment is that? |
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Is that sarcasm? Hard to tell on here at times? Not at all. I think your post gives Tribo his best answer. |
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Well Tribo does not seem to think so. Tribo, if I make a comment and you have a differing opinion, please feel free to share that so that we may have a free flowing exchange of ideas on a thread that you in fact started. This certainly would not be a question I would have posed yet I took the time to give you and offer a well thought out answer. Are we not allowed to do this?
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Edited by
tribo
on
Thu 09/11/08 03:00 PM
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I would assume that Adm and Eve had sexual relations more often than what is depicted in the bible but as I stated, what does that matter? As a story it really would not be an important or critical plot point. We can naturally assume that they would have been intimate with one another based on the circumstances. However, from the perspective of someone who believes in this and takes it literally and to be truth and factual, wouldn't you mainly just be concerned with whether or not Eve gave birth and became pregnant by Adam? I mean what is the significance of them getting jiggy with one another beyond that? We have to already assume that Yahweh had designed Eve in such a manner that sex would be pleasurable for her based on what I mentioned in my first post. Male sexuality is bound up in reproduction because you can not climax without that being involved. A woman on the other hand is not restricted by that. The functions are not mutually inseparable. In fact, sadly, in some African nations this is part of the reason why the bodies of young girls can be mutilated. I would say this pretty much sums it up. I can't think of anything to add - or take away. HMMM - as usual no help at all. but thnx anyway. do you think it might just be possible clit and all that that they were being kept from it just as little children are? there expierential knowledge is not active at this point there is no need to be thinking or having concern with hthese things till after there desirs and lust are awakend by their sin? just a thought just because we are born [as they just were] qwith sexual genitals does not mean they are being put to use right after we are born right? What do you mean "no help at all as usual"? What kind of comment is that? why my dear K, a "sarcastic" one as usual - 
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Yeah alright. Im not really sure what you have contributed thus far. I will sit back here and wait to see if you can answer your own question to your satisfaction I guess.
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I would assume that Adm and Eve had sexual relations more often than what is depicted in the bible but as I stated, what does that matter? As a story it really would not be an important or critical plot point. We can naturally assume that they would have been intimate with one another based on the circumstances. However, from the perspective of someone who believes in this and takes it literally and to be truth and factual, wouldn't you mainly just be concerned with whether or not Eve gave birth and became pregnant by Adam? I mean what is the significance of them getting jiggy with one another beyond that? We have to already assume that Yahweh had designed Eve in such a manner that sex would be pleasurable for her based on what I mentioned in my first post. Male sexuality is bound up in reproduction because you can not climax without that being involved. A woman on the other hand is not restricted by that. The functions are not mutually inseparable. In fact, sadly, in some African nations this is part of the reason why the bodies of young girls can be mutilated. I would say this pretty much sums it up. I can't think of anything to add - or take away. HMMM - as usual no help at all. but thnx anyway. do you think it might just be possible clit and all that that they were being kept from it just as little children are? there expierential knowledge is not active at this point there is no need to be thinking or having concern with hthese things till after there desirs and lust are awakend by their sin? just a thought just because we are born [as they just were] qwith sexual genitals does not mean they are being put to use right after we are born right? Well - I don't know about the "lust" part of it. To me - lust is a self seeking desire. I think there was something natural going on - we tend to call it "love" I guess. The actual Herbrew or aramaic, had a number of different words describing the different qualities of love. But it isn't clear that they would not have understood what "be united to his wife" was all about. I don't know if it adds anything to your original question - but part of Eve's consequence for the fall was "pains in childbearing" and "Your desire will be for your husband". It should be noted that these are not gifts - but consequences. An indication of the anguish to come, rather than actual blessings. Not that this has implications to what it might have been previous to the fall - or that it implicitly implies it's occurance. TRhat too - remains subjective. |
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Well Tribo does not seem to think so. Tribo, if I make a comment and you have a differing opinion, please feel free to share that so that we may have a free flowing exchange of ideas on a thread that you in fact started. This certainly would not be a question I would have posed yet I took the time to give you and offer a well thought out answer. Are we not allowed to do this? nope only i'm allwed to answer any questions i post that being said - i have given rise to your response my lady, now you have my permission to rebuttle -
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Well Tribo does not seem to think so. Tribo, if I make a comment and you have a differing opinion, please feel free to share that so that we may have a free flowing exchange of ideas on a thread that you in fact started. This certainly would not be a question I would have posed yet I took the time to give you and offer a well thought out answer. Are we not allowed to do this? I think Tribo is having a "Funches" moment. It might take him a post or two to get out of it. |
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I would assume that Adm and Eve had sexual relations more often than what is depicted in the bible but as I stated, what does that matter? As a story it really would not be an important or critical plot point. We can naturally assume that they would have been intimate with one another based on the circumstances. However, from the perspective of someone who believes in this and takes it literally and to be truth and factual, wouldn't you mainly just be concerned with whether or not Eve gave birth and became pregnant by Adam? I mean what is the significance of them getting jiggy with one another beyond that? We have to already assume that Yahweh had designed Eve in such a manner that sex would be pleasurable for her based on what I mentioned in my first post. Male sexuality is bound up in reproduction because you can not climax without that being involved. A woman on the other hand is not restricted by that. The functions are not mutually inseparable. In fact, sadly, in some African nations this is part of the reason why the bodies of young girls can be mutilated. I would say this pretty much sums it up. I can't think of anything to add - or take away. HMMM - as usual no help at all. but thnx anyway. do you think it might just be possible clit and all that that they were being kept from it just as little children are? there experiential knowledge is not active at this point there is no need to be thinking or having concern with these things till after there desires and lust are awakened by their sin? just a thought just because we are born [as they just were] with sexual genitals does not mean they are being put to use right after we are born right? Well - I don't know about the "lust" part of it. To me - lust is a self seeking desire. I think there was something natural going on - we tend to call it "love" I guess. The actual Herbrew or aramaic, had a number of different words describing the different qualities of love. But it isn't clear that they would not have understood what "be united to his wife" was all about. I don't know if it adds anything to your original question - but part of Eve's consequence for the fall was "pains in childbearing" and "Your desire will be for your husband". It should be noted that these are not gifts - but consequences. An indication of the anguish to come, rather than actual blessings. Not that this has implications to what it might have been previous to the fall - or that it implicitly implies it's occurrence. TRhat too - remains subjective. you see love i see new creatures being no more than whats stated "helpmates" not lovers! of course if you can show me different i will be more than happy to recant my thought. to me these are "new" innocent beings [ o more than grown children]. they know not of sexual things at this point that's why such a rude awakening occurs when dark thoughts enter their mind after eating and gaining the knowledge of good and "evil" thoughts of desire and lust or any other word you want to add adjectivally. |
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Edited by
Krimsa
on
Thu 09/11/08 03:15 PM
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I would assume that Adm and Eve had sexual relations more often than what is depicted in the bible but as I stated, what does that matter? As a story it really would not be an important or critical plot point. We can naturally assume that they would have been intimate with one another based on the circumstances. However, from the perspective of someone who believes in this and takes it literally and to be truth and factual, wouldn't you mainly just be concerned with whether or not Eve gave birth and became pregnant by Adam? I mean what is the significance of them getting jiggy with one another beyond that? We have to already assume that Yahweh had designed Eve in such a manner that sex would be pleasurable for her based on what I mentioned in my first post. Male sexuality is bound up in reproduction because you can not climax without that being involved. A woman on the other hand is not restricted by that. The functions are not mutually inseparable. In fact, sadly, in some African nations this is part of the reason why the bodies of young girls can be mutilated. I would say this pretty much sums it up. I can't think of anything to add - or take away. HMMM - as usual no help at all. but thnx anyway. do you think it might just be possible clit and all that that they were being kept from it just as little children are? there expierential knowledge is not active at this point there is no need to be thinking or having concern with hthese things till after there desirs and lust are awakend by their sin? just a thought just because we are born [as they just were] qwith sexual genitals does not mean they are being put to use right after we are born right? Yeah like I was no help on your "Good and Evil" thread huh? Alright. So are you asking me if Yahweh was somehow punishing them and not allowing them free reign to explore one another? Well as I have told you before, I dont believe as Funches does that they were dingbats or mindless automatons. I think that Adam and Eve, for the sake of clarity and for the prospective audience that would be reading Genesis, the writers would have wanted it to be an accepted premise that Adam and Eve were average young adults. They would have had about as much cognitive ability as any other 19-20 year old of that time period. They were created fully formed so they had no childhood, no way to learn from mistakes incurred. Why would lust be "sinful"? Unless of course....Paganism held the concept of Sacred Sexuality. Yahweh not so much. |
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eljay said:
I don't know if it adds anything to your original question - but part of Eve's consequence for the fall was "pains in childbearing" and "Your desire will be for your husband". tribo replies: and the serpents consequences were also - this is not anything but statememnts of the sin committed not proof of earlier sexual activity, the very fact it says "Your desire will be for your husband". should be a clue to what i am saying - what was her desire for before the fall? the serpent? i think not. strongs - desire [longing, craving, of man for woman]so if this is her new found punishment, what would her desire have been before this? and to whom or what? |
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I would assume that Adm and Eve had sexual relations more often than what is depicted in the bible but as I stated, what does that matter? As a story it really would not be an important or critical plot point. We can naturally assume that they would have been intimate with one another based on the circumstances. However, from the perspective of someone who believes in this and takes it literally and to be truth and factual, wouldn't you mainly just be concerned with whether or not Eve gave birth and became pregnant by Adam? I mean what is the significance of them getting jiggy with one another beyond that? We have to already assume that Yahweh had designed Eve in such a manner that sex would be pleasurable for her based on what I mentioned in my first post. Male sexuality is bound up in reproduction because you can not climax without that being involved. A woman on the other hand is not restricted by that. The functions are not mutually inseparable. In fact, sadly, in some African nations this is part of the reason why the bodies of young girls can be mutilated. I would say this pretty much sums it up. I can't think of anything to add - or take away. HMMM - as usual no help at all. but thnx anyway. do you think it might just be possible clit and all that that they were being kept from it just as little children are? there experiential knowledge is not active at this point there is no need to be thinking or having concern with these things till after there desires and lust are awakened by their sin? just a thought just because we are born [as they just were] with sexual genitals does not mean they are being put to use right after we are born right? Well - I don't know about the "lust" part of it. To me - lust is a self seeking desire. I think there was something natural going on - we tend to call it "love" I guess. The actual Herbrew or aramaic, had a number of different words describing the different qualities of love. But it isn't clear that they would not have understood what "be united to his wife" was all about. I don't know if it adds anything to your original question - but part of Eve's consequence for the fall was "pains in childbearing" and "Your desire will be for your husband". It should be noted that these are not gifts - but consequences. An indication of the anguish to come, rather than actual blessings. Not that this has implications to what it might have been previous to the fall - or that it implicitly implies it's occurrence. TRhat too - remains subjective. you see love i see new creatures being no more than whats stated "helpmates" not lovers! of course if you can show me different i will be more than happy to recant my thought. to me these are "new" innocent beings [ o more than grown children]. they know not of sexual things at this point that's why such a rude awakening occurs when dark thoughts enter their mind after eating and gaining the knowledge of good and "evil" thoughts of desire and lust or any other word you want to add adjectivally. Well - I can't explain away your presumption here. I tend to take the position of examining what the text says, and forming a contectual meaning from it - rather than a suppositional one by what is not stated. That being said - I can't find a scriptural argument against Krimsa's conclusions. Though I would prefer to remain neutral in my response to your OP - as I can't see enough scriptural evidence to be definitive on which side is a better representation, I will remain with spiders view of my post. We know they did after the fall - It really doesn't concern me about pre-fall, because obviously - it wasn't a concern of Moses, nor God - else he would have inspired Moses to write about it. |
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I would assume that Adm and Eve had sexual relations more often than what is depicted in the bible but as I stated, what does that matter? As a story it really would not be an important or critical plot point. We can naturally assume that they would have been intimate with one another based on the circumstances. However, from the perspective of someone who believes in this and takes it literally and to be truth and factual, wouldn't you mainly just be concerned with whether or not Eve gave birth and became pregnant by Adam? I mean what is the significance of them getting jiggy with one another beyond that? We have to already assume that Yahweh had designed Eve in such a manner that sex would be pleasurable for her based on what I mentioned in my first post. Male sexuality is bound up in reproduction because you can not climax without that being involved. A woman on the other hand is not restricted by that. The functions are not mutually inseparable. In fact, sadly, in some African nations this is part of the reason why the bodies of young girls can be mutilated. I would say this pretty much sums it up. I can't think of anything to add - or take away. HMMM - as usual no help at all. but thnx anyway. do you think it might just be possible clit and all that that they were being kept from it just as little children are? there expierential knowledge is not active at this point there is no need to be thinking or having concern with hthese things till after there desirs and lust are awakend by their sin? just a thought just because we are born [as they just were] qwith sexual genitals does not mean they are being put to use right after we are born right? Yeah like I was no help on your "Good and Evil" thread huh? Alright. So are you asking me if Yahweh was somehow punishing them and not allowing them free reign to explore one another? Well as I have told you before, I dont believe as Funches does that they were dingbats or mindless automatons. I think that Adam and Eve, for the sake of clarity and for the prospective audience that would be reading Genesis, the writers would have wanted it to be an accepted premise that Adam and Eve were average young adults. They would have had about as much cognitive ability as any other 19-20 year old of that time period. They were created fully formed so they had no childhood, no way to learn from mistakes incurred. Why would lust be "sinful"? Unless of course....Paganism held the concept of Sacred Sexuality. Yahweh not so much. ok less go with your premise - that they were young adults and having sex then why would it be a shock to them after esting the fruit to see themselves naked? why- if they were intimate would that change at all? my answer is that they did not have that expieriential knowledge or there would have been no shame, as you say - what would they be ashamed of? BUT, if they were unaware of these things and feelings and the fruit gave them this awareness and they wereseeeing each other in a new light a carnal light with thought of sexual things they had never thought before then i can see why they would have felt the way they did , your way? no. |
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Well wasn't part of the punishment for stealing the fruit shame and guilt? That was my understanding but I could be wrong. I think whether they had sex before or not, there would have been no accompanying negative feeling associated with. But not after they were busted. I guess that's my take on it but I am in no way trying to say that's the only way to interpret it. This would be easier if Moses could have just explained it all immediately after its release.
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Well wasn't part of the punishment for stealing the fruit shame and guilt? That was my understanding but I could be wrong. I think whether they had sex before or not, there would have been no accompanying negative feeling associated with. But not after they were busted. I guess that's my take on it but I am in no way trying to say that's the only way to interpret it. This would be easier if Moses could have just explained it all immediately after its release. if you read closely the eating of the fruit did nothing but give "knowledge" of god and evil [ another indicator to me that they did not know goodness as such until after eating it they were just acting as ones who knew no other way to act thasn how they were acting] it in itelf did not cause the punishment - that was handed out by god afterwords. so the answer is no it was not part of the punishment - it was no omre than awakning of or new awareness of things they did not know of before eating. |
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Fair enough. I dont know then. I am not much for this "biblical speculation" because its just impossible to know for certain. None of us were there when this was being written. Another interesting interpretation on what the "knowledge" was exactly after they partook of the fruit was "Who will live and who will die." I like that one. That was one of the most interesting I found online.
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that kindasounds like my other discussion with eljay on what type of death A&E expierienced when they ate the friut? it surely wasn't physical death seeing they lived till 900+ yrs.
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