I would still like to know what your point is. At least give me that.

Are you looking to blame someone? If so who? If so, what happens to the idea that ALL IS ONE or that we are all connected?

Just tell me what point it is that you want to make.

JB

Well, my opinion is the highest of them all.

The only point being that I don't need God's approval to place it there.

Getting back to 'The Secret',...

I've been following the discussion between Jeanniebean and Michaelbean,...

I think they’re both radical fanaticals.

It truth probably lies somewhere between these extremes. The fact is that there is more that one spirit involved. The Secret never proclaimed that it advocates solipsism.

Clearly if two people are imagining the same goal (say becoming the president of the USA for example). Only one of them will be able to manifest that reality. In this kind of scenario clearly there is competition for the manifestation. Everyone can’t win in this case.

This is true in many of life’s endeavors. Even when we seek a mate. More than one person may desire a particular person to have as their mate. Only one, (if any of those) will cause that to become manifest. And the person who is being sought after may have alternative manifestations planned based on his or her own desires.

Clearly there’s more to it than just what we think. The physical world is ‘real’ (even if it’s a hologram). By that I mean that it follows certain rules and has a specific content (or at least it appears to have a specific content). So any manifestations are going to need to be confined to the rules and content of the overall dream.

One thing I found interesting that was actually written in the Bible (and I only offer it here as a curiosity not as a religious proclamation). It had to do with the tower of Babel and all of the people were together as one working on this tower they were building to reach to heaven.

Supposedly ‘god’ had to break it up. Why? Well according to the Bible the people were one and of one mind, and therefore anything they imagine to do they will accomplish and nothing will be restrained from them.

I have always seen this as basically saying that we are indeed imagining reality. But at the same time, it requires the imagination of all. As individuals we all contribute to the creation of reality. Collectively together we create all of reality. But as individuals we can only mold certain aspects of it within the confines of the whole.

So like I say, The Secret isn’t proclaiming solipsism where each individual is creating their own completely separate and independent reality. The Secret is saying that we are all creating reality and work within the confines of the whole. There are things we can change, and things we can’t . The key seems to be in belief. We can only change the things that we believe can be changed. The masses as a whole prevent us from believing in completely outrageous things, because even if we could convince ourselves to believe them, we know deep down in the middle-middle of our hearts that we aren’t going to convince others to buy into it. And for that reason we ultimately know convince ourselves that it’s not believable.

So there really shouldn’t be a problem of conflict of manifestations Michael. The Secret isn’t suggesting solipsism, it’s talking about a more general whole. I think Jeanniebean tends to go off the deep end on the other end of the rainbow trying to suggest that anything is possible if there is enough belief behind it. Maybe so, the question is, can that kind of belief be mustered in the face of what we believe to know about ‘reality’?

I like to think that anything is possible...From the standpoint of the true self, the higher self.

Although I could never prove it from the standpoint of the little self....me here in this body and personality.

I do understand that there are laws (which are agreements)for living in this reality. Gravity, spacetime, death, and the Law of Attraction. Probably many more I don't know about.

That does not mean that I believe that I personally am capable of creating anything I wanted by merely thinking about it. That is not how the laws are set up in this reality. There is a lot more to it than that.

I do know that if I don't think about what I want and especially if I don't know what I want, I will never come close to getting what I want.

I do know that thoughts are things. You cannot create or manifest anything that did not begin with a thought.

JB

artgurl presses her ear up against the door and thinks better about opening it ...


she slips some oatmeal raisin cookies under the door instead ...

Chomp! Chomp! Chomp! Chomp! Chomp! Chomp! Chomp!

:smacks lips and lets out a belch:

Then barks,….

Milk!

Milk!

Milk!

:sits and waits patiently for milk to appear:

It is not true, and can be clearly displayed as such.

That is my point.

Self-help and/or motivational resources do not equate to existentially sound arguments. They equate to a rather clever way to get people up off their arses, though...

Not to mention the financial aspect involved for those who write them.

It is truly no different in conceptual understanding than Christianity is, at least in one aspect. I have heard questions asking why people believe in it, also.

Simply broken down...



One is unhappy with life as it is and has been and truly desires better.

One then, humbly turns towards something else for hope and/or understanding.

One then finds what they seek.

Changes in thought equate to changes in actions.

The internal validation has begun.

The credit is duly given to that element which was different.

Seems rather simplistic, but can it be argued?

That element could be anything that enables one to believe that they know better, and therefore are prepared to do better...


The thread that runs through the way...


Faith in what you believe...

artgurl ties a cow to the doorknob ... knocks 3 times ... and runs like the wind ...

Since Creativesoul has become tired or bored with the subject and has failed to answer my question: Who, besides yourself, do you want to blame?

I will say this last thing.

When (or if) you understand the the Law of Attraction, you will stop complaining about your life and you will realize that you are 100% responsible for all of it ~~on a deep spiritual level.

If you do not reach this point,(in this life) then you are often looking to blame someone else or you may always be whining that something is "unfair."

Once you take responsibility for your life, your thoughts, your actions, your decisions, then you don't need to lean on or blame outside authorities ~ and you don't really need anyone to die for your "sins."

Yes its a big responsibility.

Suckle! Suckle! Suckle! Suckle! Suckle! Suckle! Suckle!

:smacks lips and lets out a belch:

:walks back over to the doghouse dragging chain:

:licks chops one more time:

:jumps up on the roof, lays on back, and gazes skyward:

:wearing sun glasses of course:

are you wearing the aviator hat and goggles ... and red scarf?

JB:

What in the world are you talking about?

Who is trying to blame anything or anyone for life?

Not I...

You were so far out in left field with your assumptions about me that I decided to exit as a result. We are not even in the same book, let alone the same paragraph or sentence. I have no idea how you have arrived at your place in this conversation.

All you just did was confirm what I had already begun to witness, based upon your words... not my assumptions thereof...



Peace...

You are beginning to sound like a hard core skeptic.
You base your conclusions only on outward appearances.

No matter.
Next time just state your point and your belief and save me a lot of time.

JB

This is one thing that I’ve never done.

How can you complain about something that you got for free?

Besides, if it’s that terrible there’s always euthanasia.

It you don’t like it just return it.

Do you have a direct link to my webcam?

What?????

Oh wow... notta problem JB... notta problem...

Do you know what my conclusions are?

Cause if ya do, ya know more than I do about me...

that is just your view. an interpretation that comes from what you want to think. an interpretation that it's true for you, and the people with similar thinking.
However, it's far far from what really the bible stands for.

It's a sad truth. This country lives in a bubble. That is why there are too many things coming on, and we don't see them.

We were talking about how people manifest their own reality and are 100% responsible for what happens to them.

(That includes the poor drunk who got mugged and killed while walking home from the bar.)

Who do you blame for that? You (and most people) want to blame the killer of course. By all appearances, the killer is 100% to blame. The drunk is the victim. He is not responsible. Why would he manifest such a thing, people ask?

I am saying that there were many unseen things, acts, thoughts decisions that lead up to that event.

A person either takes responsibility for his experiences and consequences of his actions or he blames someone or something else.

If that is not what we are talking about please enlighten me.

JB

I do now. You stated them.

too many things to read.
I just have to say one word: "causality."
nothing happens randomly.