independent- schmindependent.... do you appreciate that I hold the door for you ? that I ask if you're feeling well today ? that I saved up to take you someplace really special ? That I'm ready,willing and able to defend you in a scrape ?, that I'm streetsmart enough to keep us both out of'm ?

Do you reach for me in your sleep or call my name ?

If so...you aren't really all that self reliant now...are ya?

This is NOT meant to offend anyone...I'm just trying to make a point that sometimes independence isn't all that it's cracked up to be... but if you don't agree, more power to ya...

You can do all of those things and still be independant.

Do I like a man to open my door for me..ABSOLUTLY. and does he get brownie points for it. ABSOLUTLY. but can I and will I open my own door...ABSOLUTLY.

This however is the connudrum I am speaking of.

I want and expect to be treated like a lady, and in turn will treat a man like a MAN.

I'm a Queen, and deserve to be treated as such, and in return will treat him like a King, if I am not treated like a Queen, he then is treated like the court jester. I allow people to decide who they are to me.... and then follow suit.

Queen...hmmm...fitting.

MOST men are intimadated by strong independant women...

Independent Woman are awesome. I am very attracted to a strong woman. I like the way they think, the way they act. the self confidence the show.

The only reason a guy wouldnt like this later on is if he is insecure, or some how uneasy about the relatonship.

This has nothing to do with a woman independence. She can be strong and still be a lady. I always open a door for a lady. Don't think you have to shelf your manners just because she is a strong willed woman.

Well put David And that is just one of the reasons why YOU are a wonderful MAN

to me it is more want than need; and I certainly don't need anyone for the things I can do myself. There are so many things one just cannot do for oneself...and I don't mean anything sexual, I just mean in general.

I knew there were some guys who truly understood this.

there is a fine line line between independence and shoving something in a mans face.........It is ingrained in a man from birth that he is the protector it has always been this way and always will be........I'm independent and know i can do it myself i however choose to make the concession to allow a man to do certain things because it makes them feel good like they are fullfilling their role...........just as i know he can cook however he allows me because it makes me feel good and allows me to feel as though i'm fulfilling my role............is it really all that diffrent?

why do we need predetermined roles? My "role" is not as a cook; just as I don't think the guy's role is to take out the trash. Why can't we both do what we do best?

I refuse to act weak for a man, I just can't do it. I know women who pretend they can't change light bulbs just so the man will feel "strong". If he is that insecure, I don't want him.

Just my opinion.

I totally agree!!!!!

Ok so other then that guy what's his face who doesn't even really deserve a mention, some interesting points have been brought up. For one, of course we like that you hold the door open for us but in my experience, it seems that once comfortable level of relationship is obtained, this comes to a complete stop. If you're a man that has been in a relationship for longer then 6 months and you STILL do this, here . So apparently men want a woman who is independent when they are not around. But maybe sometimes we should fake that we don't know how to say unplunge the toilet or check our tire pressure just to make them feel needed once in awhile. Independent women aren't *****es guys, we just don't wanna be treated like the victim or have everything that we have worked so hard for taken away by ignorant belittling. It's not all of you, so don't take it so personally. I'm off to karate, have a good night all!

Depends on the guy. I'm totally fine with, in fact, I expect, anyone I'm with to have her own life, her own interests, her own opinions. It's nice not to have someone just agree with everything I say. If I wanted that, I'd get a parrot. That way I could hear my own words echoed in someone else's voice all day long.

Hey..when I got off the computer at 3 am the posts were still on here....but this morning they were deleted..well some of them..I also reported him from his profile page after he deleted his picture...Have a good night...drama free..

Usually, I end up being the cook. My mom is an Italian lady and she made damn sure I could fend for myself. I actually like cooking most things, especially anything that has to do with an open flame.

Baking...not so much. No knowledge of baking, no interest in it.

I am really sorry he dragged you into it. It was me he had the problem with and you were attacked because you defended me. I was still on when the attack on you got deleted..it was there and then it was gone. I was glad about that because it was even worse than what he said to me.

Baking is overrated. I can cook; I also hate to bake.

I can cook, it is just that I don't feel it should be my role. My role is partner.

Hey girlie....I wasnt worried about it..he didnt hurt my feelings...some people just have no moral thread and dont know how to treat people....and...his profile said he was a widow..he could be ticked off at the world about it..unless of course...he killed her himself....He struck me as a Hannibal Lector...psycho type of guy...probably doesnt have a good rap sheet...nonetheless have a kick ass weekend:)

I can cook too, but nothing gourmet.

Baking has too many steps, so I don't do it.