Thanks for the comment britty :)
Chivalry in its true nature was actually invented in the time of the roman empire, however as I'm running out for thanksgiving I do not have time to copy/paste the referential material. Knights were invented by Rome to manage control of the outlying regions, which later evolved into the royal houses of europe. Prior to the roman expansion, all european area's were tribal and fuedal in nature.

for those of you that are interested, i have a personal oath to which i adhere to define my character. It is the only paragraph which i have ever heard (coming from the movie kingdom of heaven - though transliterated for today) which defines my character exactly.

"do good so that God will love me. Speak the truth even if it leads to my death. Be absent of fear in the face of all adversity, and safeguard the helpless." That is my oath.

Happy Thanksgiving to all my native friends :)

it is a commonly held belief that thanksgiving is an american tradition in unity with the first nations in the 13 colonies prior to the formation of the united states of america. This is wholly false.

It should be noted that the 1578 ceremony was not the first Thanksgiving as defined by First Nations tradition. Long before the time of Martin Frobisher, it was traditional in many First Nations cultures to offer an official giving of thanks during autumnal gatherings. In Haudenosaunee culture, Thanksgiving is a prayer recited to honor "the three sisters" (i.e., beans, corn and squash) during the fall harvest.

The history of Thanksgiving in Canada goes back to an English explorer, Martin Frobisher, who had been futilely attempting to find a northern passage to the Orient. He did, however, establish a settlement in Canada. In the year 1578, Frobisher held a formal ceremony in what is now the province of Newfoundland and Labrador, to give thanks for surviving the long journey. This event is widely considered to be the first Canadian Thanksgiving, and the first official Thanksgiving to occur in North America. More settlers arrived and continued the ceremonial tradition initiated by Frobisher, who was eventually knighted and had an inlet of the Atlantic Ocean in northern Canada named after him — Frobisher Bay now known as Iqaluit.

In the United States the early settlers of Plymouth Colony in Massachusetts were particularly grateful to Squanto, the Native American who taught them how to catch eel, grow corn and who served as their native interpreter (as Squanto had learned English as a slave in Europe). Without Squanto's assistance, the settlers might not have survived in the New World.

The Plymouth settlers (who came to be called "Pilgrims") set apart a holiday immediately after their first harvest in 1621, when they held an autumn celebration of food, feasting, and praising God. The Native American chiefs Massassoit, Squanto and Samoset joined in the celebration with ninety of their men in the three-day event.

President Abraham Lincoln first declared Thanksgiving a Federal holiday..as a "prayerful day of Thanksgiving" on the last Thursday in November.

Modern Thanksgiving in the United States is now celebrated on the fourth Thursday in November.

Thanksgiving is entirely a Canadian holiday that has been transferred from the Native First Nations communities in North America, with the first official recognized holiday being with the British Settlers in Upper Canada 43 years prior to the recognized celebration in the 13 colonies, which later became the United States of America.

None the less. As it is Thanksgiving weekend here in Canada, I would like to wish each and everyone of you a pleasant rememberance of things good and right in all the harvest of our lives for this past year :)

Happy Thanksgiving!

wow.... go to sleep and all the strange people suddenly post...
did anyone actually read the opening topic?

my discussion content was regarding chivalry and the difinitive appications of the narcissitic woman/man in this day and age, as even having the capacity to deserve to receive what said person is demanding....

how you all went from that to this on page three? uhh well okie dokie...

i just got lost in my own forum topic..what about me? and what about the dictionary? huh?

isn't this facebook? wait! :O where the hell am i?

muuuwaahhhh

heather:
yeah? watch this :P

on the fly no hands :D

=======================
for now the die is cast to elevate the core,
of what it is that justifies a man,
while in the dialogue shown toward the root
of all that must sow true,
to raise the bar for all the finer form.

it is my cause in this to bring just more,
and rid the parasite of common as a ban,
for all that's worth a better tune to suit,
is given here this day anew,
and firm a standard by this topic born.

and so my purpose is fulfilled without pretense,
we'll see how much this dialogue will advance.

jm 12:03:37 AM 06-Oct-2007 EST

(oh yeah.. i rock :D)

heather: a perfectly good quip all blown to hell :( damn i hate when that happens....
i just thought it was funny :P should've used more emoticons huh?

the day of the neandrathal is long but past and through.
what i'm speaking of isn't at all in anyway shape or form a concept of fancy poetry. It is right action and right heart and deed.

I have lived my entire life as such. I do not sit there with the guys and say, "oh man did you see her <insert body part here> and amazingly enough I'm not gay either! wow huh?

I actually tell off my friends who do that because she is someones sister, daughter, and mother, and or will be someday.

when i have a daughter, i won't take kindly to any man speaking to her in that manner. anymore than i would accept that lewdness of subjectivity towards a partner.

it is ignorrant and common. So if you refer to that as advice in relationship to common?

be aware of what you have just told every woman on this site. That you objectify women. by your own mouth you have said so.

heather: no you don't love me .... you just love the idea of me :P

mike: thank you so much for your desires :)

as long as you presume ownership where you should respect substance, you'll find that you're going to be seeing a lot of these little white screens, and they're little white boxes.

love is a gift, not a subjugation.

elfin poetry...

I met a lady in the wood.
No mortal maid, I knew, was she;
She was no thing of flesh and blood,
No child of human ancestry.

Her beauty held my eyes in thrall.
I spoke to her sweet words, soft-toned.
She answered me no word at all,
But only looked at me and moaned.

I spoke to her about Exchange,
Of Sterling and its recent rise.
The subject was beyond her range;
She stared at me with haunting eyes.

I touched upon the price of Rye
And its effect upon the Pound.
She walked beside me silently,
Like one that treads on charméd ground.

She witched me with her elfin grace.
I spoke of Wages and the Dole
And briefly sketched for her the case
For International Control.

She gazed upon me as I talked;
Some elfin thing she seemed to be.
I knew her, by the way she walked,
A creature of the Faëry.

Through green and leafy glades we went,
Knee-deep among the dewy ferns;
I touched upon the Law of Rent
And of Diminishing Returns.

And, as we wandered through the wood
Mid oaks and elm-tree boles rotund,
Explained to her as best I could
The workings of a Sinking Fund.

I said that Rubber was depressed
By recent rumours from Malay.
She only moaned and beat her breast
And cried aloud, 'Alack-a-day!'

I said my brokers had foreseen
A rise in Oil, and asked her view
As to the trend of Margarine,
She only answered 'Willaloo!'

I took her to a green-lit glade
Where tall trees twined their branches high
And a moss-muted streamlet made
Unmeditating melody;

And there I paused awhile; and there
I offered her my heart and hand,
And bade her take me in her care
To dwell with her in Fairyland.

I said I was a Whale-oil King,
With gold and goods and gear in plenty.
She said she was a Mrs. Byng
And had a family of twenty.

She turned and left me where I stood.
While round her elfin pipes were fluting
She walked away into the wood,
And I walked home to Lower Tooting.

patrick barrington

if it happens i'll let you know ;)

i wonder if elves are bisexual... then again, i wonder if you can have a TS elf, since they both look feminine heh...

heh...
did it ever occur to everyone that none of us are kings and queens yet each of us is actually perfect?

An artist doesn't paint and then when the painting is finished declare "go and find your way in the world"
a sculptor doesn't cut through the stone and then say, "prove yourself to me" upon completion.

thus, no man or woman, being born alive, can be anything less than completed in and of themselves. Just because some individuals can not sustain that self truth, doesn't mean its a lie.

emeraldisle: i think that the concept of "trust being earned" is absolutely the problem. Trust is innate. Distrust is learned.

Example: When we were infants. Our parents would hold us in our arms, we'd reach and claw and attempt to grab at distant things, and not once would it cross our minds that we could fall or that we would be dropped. As it had not occured for us to even remotely perceive if that instance or possibility.

then one day, we are dropped.

From that moment forward distrust is sowed as a seed. we are no longer sure if whom is holding us actually has a good grip of us, as we make sure that we have at least one limb gripping or wrapped around that which is supporting us.

when a person states that "trust must be earned" they are telling everyone else that they are entering the interaction without any trust whatsoever. No human being can defend against that. Niether man, nor woman. And the relationship is doomed before it is in motion.

thus, trust must be given willingly first. And trust will be demonstrated. A person who betrays trust, in either direction of a relationship, will do so again with someone else, as they have done prior to that instance to whomever came before. It isn't a reflection of the recipient. But rather of the offender. We are determined by what we do with what happens to us. Not by what happens to us.

sweetsings: that last post i made wasn't to you re: give what you get. that was to devilsmom.

what i'm saying more distinctly is that a man cannot give beyond that which he recieves. anymore than a woman can grow beyond the strength of a man by his core.

try it sometime. Try pulling a rosebush from its soil. you will not be able to do it. You will yank out the soil since the roots are wholly and completely interwoven with the soil to the point of the union being indivisible.

uhh no...
i mean that you only get what you give.

thats a good question actually. I've thought on that a bit, and i think that the only answer is those qualities which every woman has that goes toward requitted love.

hmmm, i have a concept which I liken to a rosebush and soil. where a woman is the rosebush and the soil is a man. though for those of you needing to exercise your angst isn't referential to a man being dirt. I've heard that one, and its drool.

however the premise is simple. a fully bloomed rosebush which springs forth new bulbs each season, cannot be torn from the soil, nor can soil be torn from the roots of the rosebush...

thus i would say that the chivalry of a man, towards the sustenance of the bush, is directly proportionate to the return of the nutrients that the rose bush gives to the soil through her roots.

a bush cannot have expectations and demands upon the soil beyond the soils ability to deliver the requirements to the bush.

i know thats not a really good answer, however, in the light of right action as a man, who claims to be chivalrous - as I do. I will choose wisdom rather than catologue towards expressing a good and right question properly.