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| Topic: The Laws the Law | |
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I do not think that church and government should be one. This happened in the past, and look what happened back them. I think it is a great idea to remove Prayer from school, it is school, not bible study. There is no reason for the 10 commandments to be on government property, other then the Church and affiliated buildings.
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last time that religion and the Government got together people were burned at the stake, drowned, hung and tortured... I love History!!!
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there is no line saying separation of church and state in the constitution just so you know it is a little more than that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion nor prohibit the free exercise thereof" ~ First Ammendmant Sounds like a seperation to me, and I am a religious person. Back to the OP, a law is a law and Jesus said "give unto ceaser what is ceasers and give unto god what is gods", however, there is a time when breaking the law becomes an act of rightiousness;^] |
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Edited by
scttrbrain
on
Thu 01/17/08 09:29 AM
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there is no line saying separation of church and state in the constitution just so you know it is a little more than that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion nor prohibit the free exercise thereof" ~ First Ammendmant Sounds like a seperation to me, and I am a religious person. Back to the OP, a law is a law and Jesus said "give unto ceaser what is ceasers and give unto god what is gods", however, there is a time when breaking the law becomes an act of rightiousness;^] "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion nor prohibit the free exercise thereof" ~ First Ammendmant That is saying that the government isn't to have any say in religion. No control over it. Kat |
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there is no line saying separation of church and state in the constitution just so you know it is a little more than that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion nor prohibit the free exercise thereof" ~ First Ammendmant Sounds like a seperation to me, and I am a religious person. Back to the OP, a law is a law and Jesus said "give unto ceaser what is ceasers and give unto god what is gods", however, there is a time when breaking the law becomes an act of rightiousness;^] "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion nor prohibit the free exercise thereof" ~ First Ammendmant That is saying that the government isn't to have any say in religion. No control over it. Kat Nor to be controled by it. "No law respecting an establishment of religion" means we can't base our laws from a particular religion. The founding fathers knew that a theocracy would be bad for the nation as it had been previously, and that the sollution was to have a government not ruled by the church nor to have rule over the church, hence "nor prohibit the free exercise thereof". Politics corrupt a religions message, better to have them seperate;^] |
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blah blah blah god and stuff
government should be free of any religions. they have no place in law making or in any governing body. GOD is your own personal thing, and government money should not go towards celebration of a belief. government time should not go towards celebration of a belief. the only thing government money and time should go towards is making laws, laws that do not go against what this country was founded on. FREEDOM. you are free to do whatever you will, in your own time and your own personal space. our founding fathers did not rely so heavily on god to guide them, just what is right and what man should be free to do. god only came about later, riding on the shoulders of people with sticks up their butts. looking to opress and influence others with their own beliefs |
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I could say "have a good day" and many could make much more out of it.
The founding fathers were almost all religious men. They tried to be so precise in their words, not knowing that people would begin to pick apart their words. It was so no "one" religion could have any control in anything. It never states that the church and state are separate. No where in there does it say that. If that was what they meant, then they would have said it specifcally. Kat |
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I could say "have a good day" and many could make much more out of it. The founding fathers were almost all religious men. They tried to be so precise in their words, not knowing that people would begin to pick apart their words. It was so no "one" religion could have any control in anything. It never states that the church and state are separate. No where in there does it say that. If that was what they meant, then they would have said it specifcally. Kat The term actualy came from other pieces of Jeffersons writing. They were religious men fleeing religious persecution from theocratic governments. No "one" religion controling government policy is the idea yes, that's what sepperation of church and state is. Kids can still pray in school, they can still have bible study, it just can't be led & organised by the state;^] |
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I could say "have a good day" and many could make much more out of it. The founding fathers were almost all religious men. They tried to be so precise in their words, not knowing that people would begin to pick apart their words. It was so no "one" religion could have any control in anything. It never states that the church and state are separate. No where in there does it say that. If that was what they meant, then they would have said it specifcally. Kat The term actualy came from other pieces of Jeffersons writing. They were religious men fleeing religious persecution from theocratic governments. No "one" religion controling government policy is the idea yes, that's what sepperation of church and state is. Kids can still pray in school, they can still have bible study, it just can't be led & organised by the state;^] What? England and France? Kat |
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I could say "have a good day" and many could make much more out of it. The founding fathers were almost all religious men. They tried to be so precise in their words, not knowing that people would begin to pick apart their words. It was so no "one" religion could have any control in anything. It never states that the church and state are separate. No where in there does it say that. If that was what they meant, then they would have said it specifcally. Kat The term actualy came from other pieces of Jeffersons writing. They were religious men fleeing religious persecution from theocratic governments. No "one" religion controling government policy is the idea yes, that's what sepperation of church and state is. Kids can still pray in school, they can still have bible study, it just can't be led & organised by the state;^] What? England and France? Kat |
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I could say "have a good day" and many could make much more out of it. The founding fathers were almost all religious men. They tried to be so precise in their words, not knowing that people would begin to pick apart their words. It was so no "one" religion could have any control in anything. It never states that the church and state are separate. No where in there does it say that. If that was what they meant, then they would have said it specifcally. Kat The term actualy came from other pieces of Jeffersons writing. They were religious men fleeing religious persecution from theocratic governments. No "one" religion controling government policy is the idea yes, that's what sepperation of church and state is. Kids can still pray in school, they can still have bible study, it just can't be led & organised by the state;^] What? England and France? Kat Not all of them, but most were protestants fleeing catholic persecution, that was coming to america. However, religious persecution didn't end there. Remember the salem witch trials? Thomas Jefferson was an educated historian, as was Ben Franklin, as was John Adams. This theocratic notion they knew had been abused for thousands of years & the way to change was reform into a democracy with a freedom of religion, including the right to not be ruled by any religion. Read Thomas Jeffersons writing, it's obvious what he meant;^] |
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to a lot of people, the holidays mentioned have nothing to do with religion anymore.
When i celebrate those holidays, i am not celebrating because of religion, i am celebrating time with family. i have nothing against religion, but i'm not for it either. i'm just kinda here in the middle. i do however get pissed off when a person tries to push a religion on me. I don't tell them what to believe, so i dont appreciate being told what to believe. I went to a Catholic church with a friend (I am baptised Catholic BTW) the Father told me " you WILL be in church every sunday morning from now on" I said **** you I will not. I haven't been back to the church since. I don't like being told what to do, if he would have asked me to come on the following sunday, i would have been much more open to coming. I think people feel the same way, as if it's being pushed onto them. I say believe what you want, and leave others alone. I also have no opinion to whether those words should or shouldnt be there. I'm all for seperation of church and state though, and with that I do not feel that churches should be exempt from taxes. JMO |
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I could say "have a good day" and many could make much more out of it. The founding fathers were almost all religious men. They tried to be so precise in their words, not knowing that people would begin to pick apart their words. It was so no "one" religion could have any control in anything. It never states that the church and state are separate. No where in there does it say that. If that was what they meant, then they would have said it specifcally. Kat The term actualy came from other pieces of Jeffersons writing. They were religious men fleeing religious persecution from theocratic governments. No "one" religion controling government policy is the idea yes, that's what sepperation of church and state is. Kids can still pray in school, they can still have bible study, it just can't be led & organised by the state;^] What? England and France? Kat Not all of them, but most were protestants fleeing catholic persecution, that was coming to america. However, religious persecution didn't end there. Remember the salem witch trials? Thomas Jefferson was an educated historian, as was Ben Franklin, as was John Adams. This theocratic notion they knew had been abused for thousands of years & the way to change was reform into a democracy with a freedom of religion, including the right to not be ruled by any religion. Read Thomas Jeffersons writing, it's obvious what he meant;^] Actually...I have read his letters. Those written to him and his responses. As well as Franklin's and Adams's. And a few others. I read the letters to and from. Not just theirs alone. It is like the bible. Can't just read a verse and make it so. Must read all of it. We will always read differently as people. Same with eye witness accounts of a crime. Very rarely will we all say the same thing. Or hear it the same. Kat |
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The law is not static. It gets changed over time. The case that mentions the seperation of church and state is just as valid as anything our forefathers said. Our government is alive and ever changing. In the same way that we have done away with slavery that they did not. No one would say slavery is good because Washington and Jefferson owned slaves. It was a country in it's infancy. We have a responsibility to make our country all it can be. That means keeping it safe from those that want to make everyone bow down to their personal God. Like it or not separation of church and state is the law of this great country.
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In the courts does it not say "In God WE Trust" ? The flip side in all of this is if people do not want God then eventually they will loose His protection.I feel this is happening already.
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The law staying out of religion.
If you conform to what they want or are so small you are not a threat. Example.. I am sure most of you without studying or knowing any facts have condemned David Koresh. Why did the govt need 400 heavly armed men to arrest him? Why was the media after the 1st day or earlier made to stay back 2 miles? Don't we have news corresponce in the field who go right with the troops who are going into harms way? David Koresch was known to jog on the road you saw on tv regurally. He was seen in Wal mart a couple of days before the raid. I personally know a retired sheriff who went down thier and as sheriffs do they sit down and talk. The sheriff at waco was approached by the ATF and he told them he knew David just let me call him I am sure he will come in. Then you can question him. The ATF would not have it. Later that same sheriff got in front of the news cameras and claimed he did not know of the raid or how dangerous David was. Then the fire.After 80+ people are killed would you call this a crime scene? The ATF did not. They while the news media was so far away brought in dump trucks and loaded everything even the bodies i am told into the trucks. Then took it to a secret location to identfy the bodies. That place should of been roped off and nobody should of disturbed anything. It should of been open to the press to observe. Like I said i do not know him? I do not agree with his philosiphies. But soon earlier the child ware fare of Texas had not found any evidence of abuse. The only ones claiming abuse were ex members and our govt. The media used thier powers to make him out to be a monster. How many of you honestly bought into thier propagada? If this can be done to them and the media and our own govt. can make a man out to be a monster and claim he was the real reason for all the deaths. When no allegations has ever been proven. Do you not think it can happen to any of us? Yes I agree I wish the Govt. would stay out of our business and we will stay out of thiers. Blessings....Miles |
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In the courts does it not say "In God WE Trust" ? The flip side in all of this is if people do not want God then eventually they will loose His protection.I feel this is happening already. everything relating to god needs to be removed from government property. it was not right for them to put it in money or the pledge, those two things did not originally have it in there. it's offensive to pander to one god while ignoring all the other faiths or lack of faiths, our government was not designed to do so. god is a personal thing, a freedom you're free to excersize. government represents the people and should not deal in beliefs, just laws |
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I could say "have a good day" and many could make much more out of it. The founding fathers were almost all religious men. They tried to be so precise in their words, not knowing that people would begin to pick apart their words. It was so no "one" religion could have any control in anything. It never states that the church and state are separate. No where in there does it say that. If that was what they meant, then they would have said it specifcally. Kat "Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man & his god, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of separation between church and state.: -Thomas Jefferson in his letter to the Danbury Baptist Association -Kerry O. |
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everything relating to god needs to be removed from government property. it was not right for them to put it in money or the pledge, those two things did not originally have it in there. it's offensive to pander to one god while ignoring all the other faiths or lack of faiths, our government was not designed to do so. god is a personal thing, a freedom you're free to excersize. government represents the people and should not deal in beliefs, just laws you said that quite well |
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I could say "have a good day" and many could make much more out of it. The founding fathers were almost all religious men. They tried to be so precise in their words, not knowing that people would begin to pick apart their words. It was so no "one" religion could have any control in anything. It never states that the church and state are separate. No where in there does it say that. If that was what they meant, then they would have said it specifcally. Kat "Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man & his god, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of separation between church and state.: -Thomas Jefferson in his letter to the Danbury Baptist Association -Kerry O. Thank you;^] |
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