something to aspire to.....

Dragoness then how can the soul be anything more then all the experiences instincts perceptions and influences through-out someone life all combine into that one single thought that defines you as an individual

what a ripoff ...think if Jesus gave up that quickly ...and besides if it does sound delusional don't I always explain why it sounds delusional rationally ...so quit jerking around and describe God ...er...without sounding delusional

yes you are right...no need to give "imageorgiagirl" false hopes by saying she could bible thump to your level in only an eon...maybe I should have said an eternity

It can't be explained to anyone who has not experienced the Living God in ones soul......All I can say is that for me, myself, and I......It's very real.....God talks to me......God has given me gifts, God shows me the path that I am to take. And to try to explain this to anyone is a mute point....I must be found by ones self. That is why I always say that a relationship with God, and Jesus Christ is a very very personal one.

Christ be with me
Christ before me
Christ behind me
Christ in me
Christ beneath me
Christ above me
Christ on my right
Christ on my left
Christ where I lie
Christ where I sit
Christ where I arise
Christ in the heart of every man
who thinks of me
Christ in the mouth of every man
who speaks of me
Christ in every eye that sees me
Christ in every ear that hears me
Salvation is of the Lord.

And to tell someone they are delusional because of this.....is just a sad thing......but you also know funches that we share a special bond...and nothing you say or do will ever change that. And if we never see eye to eye on any of this....oh well such is life.....It would not change how I feel about ya.

There is something more. I understand all the experiences and so on define a person, I do. But there is an essense of life in the mix. I do not call it a soul most of the time but it is a light/energy that shines from a living thing. I know as an atheist you will discount the thought or rationalize it and that is okay. I agree with most atheists but there is just a smidgen more to it. I do not relate to the soul as a thing that goes to heaven, we make our own heaven with our thoughts and positive experiences while we are blessed with life. When we send out that last breath the light/energy of us is expelled into the universe. Not saying it goes somewhere or becomes anything else but it joins all the energy of the universe.

I already told you have it could be explained very easily by simply telling of something God told you that you didn't accidently hear your next door neighbor say out loud and you mistaking thought it was God talking to you ...





..er..fearalcatlady...calm down...it's only a discussion ...er.. you're not planning on trying to impale me or anything are you

I guess it can relate to the scientific theory of energy. It goes somewhere and all energy effects the objects around it somehow. I am not sure what it is called exactly but it is related to that type of thought process. We are living energy so we are a part of the energy equation on this planet.

I understand the essence of what you're saying Dragoness, but for the life of me I cannot figure out a way to verbalize it to separate it from the concept of "thought".

"Dragoness" an atheist is supposely a person that don't believe in God or Gods ....but I'm a person that understand what a suppose God is...also when it comes to auras or light/energy I have done much research on everything I have ever spoken about in this forum

http://www.geocities.com/funchesfilms/aura.html

you mean every action has an equal but opposite reaction?

No it is more in the quantum science realm about energy, I think. I cannot remember. An object has an energy to it, living objects especially and the energy of the object even when sitting with no movement effects the objects around it. Everything is connected throughout the universe at an energy level. So energy effects energy.

Funches,

May I ask if you have ever done any transcendental mediation?

If you have, how far have you made it?

Have you experienced freedom from the river of thought?

I ask, because this experience alone should give you insight into what Dragoness is talking about, and you would know that there are no ‘words’ to describe this because all the ‘words’ reside in the river of thought that you had abandoned through meditation.

This experience cannot be described in words, it can only be experienced.

Does that make it any less real? No.

But it does make it irrational in the sense that it cannot be rationalized through words.

Yet it is an experience that a human being can actually perceive.

So it is possible for humans to perceive ‘irrational’ experiences.

This doesn’t explain ‘god’ nor does it even imply the existence of ‘god’.

But it does suggest that we are more than just our ‘experiences’

This is the ‘soul’ or ‘spirit’ of our essence that Dragoness is referring to.

If you’ve been beyond the river of thought then you know of this experience.

If you haven’t been I highly recommend the experience.

You can achieve this experience via transcendental meditation, but don’t expect to do it over night.

Also, if you have been beyond the river of thought, then have you gone further beyond the horizon of the physical senses? This is much more difficult to do, especially for minds that love to THINK!

But if you can achieve that experience you will come to the realization that we can not only continue to perceive beyond our thoughts but can also continue to perceive beyond any physical stimulation.

That state of being is our true spiritual essence.

I’ve been there fleetingly. But enough to have experienced it. I now know that I can continue to perceive without thought and without physical stimuli. Neither of those things are ‘me’. They are merely what I perceive.

I am the perceiver. I am not the stimuli nor the sensors.

I am the play-doh, not the form.

Proof of the existence of ‘God’?

Hardly.

But it does suggest that I am not what you think I am.

And I know that you're just going to say I'm nothing more than a blob of delusional silly putty.

Transendental Meditation. You should try it!

Playing with play-doh can be fun too.

Thoughts, wishes, desires, talking, movement are all ways for this energy to be expelled out from us, just as being on the receiving end of these things is a way for us to replenish our energy. It is hard to explain, I agree. But there is more to us than just the shell of logic and emotions, there is one more quality, life energy/light.

ok Dragoness I'll give it another shot...well think of the universe as a fish bowl filled with water aka (energy) and every object in the fish bowl plus the water all under the jurisdiction of the laws of physics displacing and redistributing energy around the fish bowl ..even when a fish is at rest these outside forces are constantly at play either adding energy to the fish or depleating energy from the fish

it's really just a "New Age" belief ..with the same trappings as religion...not being able to describe it in words...unseen and incomprehensible ..and the biggest thing is not being able to supply any significant knowledge from the experience

yes "feisty wench" that's exactly what I was talking about...without the concept of thought included into the equation then what is the point ..that it is that one thought that makes you you and proves your existence to yourself

Okay, understood. But I think of it in reverse of that. There can be no "fishbowl" so to speak because the energy or force is beyond any capture. I will give you an example, it may be a sad one but have you seen the matrix? Remember when neo transformed through death to be "one"? He saw the energy of everything around him. He could harnass it at a level we cannot but that is what I am referring to, in a way. We are figures of energy and so is everything else in the universe. I say universe because we tend to think in a closed box of restrictions from thought but it exceeds this realm of thought.

Yes the interactions inside your "fishbowl" are the same that are happening right now with everything around me as I sit here typing to you. I am a force of energy to my surroundings. I put out a positive energy and the things (especially living) will respond feeling the positivity. Example, my dog, she has known terrible things in her life, but she can feel my energy and knows I will not hurt her. Even when I scold her for misbehaving she is not afraid. She does not trust others like this. I have this effect on animals. They are at ease around me. It is the energy I emit. My inner peace and positive thoughts are all part of it. Now with human babies, there is a more complex reaction to it. They rely more on their other senses, sight, scent, surroundings, etc.... So it does not happen so easily for them. But around me enough they feel it also. On the reverse tip of that if I am angry, everything around me is effected adversely. I really try not to stay angry for long because of the negative energy anger emits. Every living thing in the vicinity is effected by it.

This is the reverse of a god or entity that shines a light of love over the world of man. I believe we shine the light of love outward and cause a ripple effect that makes the world a world of love. Not enough of us, right now in the world to shine this light of love outward. But I do hope for many more like me who have this epiphany and realize it is an outward process not an inward one.

Does it make sense?

Actually I did respond to your tell me what God told you question....I can't help that you chose not to read it......Will not repeat it...you can go search for it....

I would not hurt one lil hair on your head every....

The significant knowledge from the experience is self. It is core of self. It is the energy at the core of self. Thoughts and emotions are but the outer shell of this energy. It is the energy of life. It is hard to explain but the inner knowledge you get from it is more influencial than any other knowledge you will ever have. Knowing how to just be. Just to be. Not be all your thoughts, not be all your emotions, not be what you do or say, not be your judgements, etc......

I know I am not explaining it well. I never have taken any classes in advanced science or philosophy. I have never done transendental meditation or if I did I did not know that is what I did. I searched the reaches of myself and discovered it in me.

I too like abra, recommend it for those who have never had the experience. It is not frightening or confusing. You just learn how to be, just be. All you are required to do is just be. No higher power to tell you right from wrong. No moral judgements from others. No influences from logical thought or crazy emotions. You are just there in that space and time and it is good. You will feel an energy when you reach the point of just being. This is the energy I speak of. You will feel it flowing into you and out of you.

I know I am sounding crazy as a loon here but I am really trying to explain.