Society is an exercise in UNITY.

The thing about unity is that there is no mandate that the unity needs to possess positive ideals.

The trend of the world society is showing a decrease in sympathy and increase of narcissistic values.
The cultures within society are likewise showing a trend of decreasing sympathy and unity for the fellow (wo)man.
This is evident in the loss of neighborhood unity as a whole.
There is even a loss of family unity happening.
People are isolating from each other.

When I was a kid, we went and hung out together.
My parents played cards, went to events to socialize and were present in life. When something bad happened in the neighborhood, we all got together to help one another.
I don't see that very much anymore.
People seem to be lost in their own lil worlds.
Happy to exist in a virtual presence and just read about or watch the video of what happens to others after the fact.

Sympathy has become delayed and is only important to some as a means of advancing their image. A "what's in it for me" attitude.
The culture that is growing is heading towards isolationism and indifference. Our media overexposure is dulling our sympathy.

Life is a journey. .. live and learn is not coined just for the hell of it.

What's more, the family has given up trying to guide the children in many cultures. Its a generational decline in the values and practices of child rearing.
Some parents still possess strong family values and take an active stance to teaching their children the values of their past but more and more parents are abandoning old ways because it interferes with their need to work harder and make more money. Children are becoming a burdon for an increasing ratio of families in any culture.

Sometimes is not something doen on purpose, they just don't know any better because somewhere in the chain of life they lost that imperative. Their parents didn't teach the values so these children didn't learn them to teach their children and so on.

"I don't like going to grandma and grandpa's house because they make us all sit at the table for meals and talk to each other."
"I want to eat dinner with my phone or in front of the TV!"

What is mental illness? How is it defined? It seems in many countries, it is highly stigmatized, and something to be feared, and 'managed'
It seems to me that this management is worse than the psychosis itself. You are effectively made a 'downcast' an ' untouchable'
Have you read the psychopath test, by Jon ronson..
It would seem that we are lead by psychopaths, who roam free, undrugged, and in power.
This is a difficult subject. I'm saddened that the shootings have somehow been linked to mental illness. Its a fair question though.
But what about a police man, shooting an unarmed man in the back, who was running away from him. Is the copper deemed to be mentally ill? Or is he just a nasty piece of work, with a licence to do such things?

There are different degrees of mental illness in different cultures.
Being of 'sound' mind is difficult to quantify.
Usually, it is defined by the propensity to harm oneself or others.

A propensity to do something or a propensity for something is a natural tendency to behave in a particular way.

Mental illness can be natural or unnatural.
Sometimes a person's brain chemistry or deformity causes a mental illness.
Other times, the mental illness is learned or caused by damage to the brain.
Sometimes, a mental illness can be caused by the person on purpose thru drug abuse or repeated toxic exposures to harmful things.

Different cultures treat mental illness in different ways. What is considered intolerable in one culture might have no significance in another.

Different degrees in different cultures what in heavens have you been smoking?

Good questions. I think there is a certain 'acceptable' level of mental illness, on a spectrum, socially. Just think about the changes in the APA DSM manuals regarding what was mental illness once but no longer. It seems the industry definition is all ego centric around whether a person is TROUBLED in their life by something. if it doesnt trouble them or cause physical harm to others, it is not an illness any longer.

then think about stigma and how stigma itself is stigmatized, how the value is to accommodate how everyone feels so that they arent troubled by anything they do or feel outside of the physical harm to someone else?

Less stigmatization is less reason for people to be troubled or have their life troubled by the things they feel and do. , so then what is left to define as mental illness? And the circle goes on and on and on.

In the case of how trigger happy citizens and police are, it seems mainly an illness with certain classes of people who can afford and utilize the medical profession. And much of the scenario with the nasty copper is just what has become acceptable and conditioned as 'reasonable' to fear and 'reasonable' to do in reaction to fear.\, which is why the political tendency to associate fear with certain groups of people becomes particularly dangerous.

Is it a mental illness to want pain during sex? No, not if it doesn't trouble the person who desires it?
is it a mental illness to shoot someone that makes you feel fearful because of preconditioned assumptions based on their appearance? No, not if the average person would have found that fear 'reasonable' as well.

ITs scary times that seem to be lowering the bar further and further on the importance of human life and human dignity.

The very nature of what happens to the mentally ill, makes them not want to seek help, even though, they do want to seek help. What I mean is, they know what will happen. They will be locked up, labeled and drugged. Most probably the label and drug will be for life. Who wants that? . This chemical unbalance thingy, is a myth, perpetuated by drug companies to make money. If it were so, it could be proven with scans.
Having psychosis and such is bad enough, without all of that. There is a theory, that people who suffer psychosis are in fact healers, going through a sort of spiritual awakening. By drugging them we prevent them from ever being healed. That not only harms them, but society as a whole.
Jesus, Mohammed, and anyone who was getting divine messages, to hopefully help humanity, would be locked up and drugged.
What is a shaman? Someone who is mentally Ill, who needs a label and a drug? I think not.
Shrinks spin a web, companies peddle wares. 'Normality' is resumed. Be productive, work 9 to 5. Keep your head down. Don't rock the boat. Don't ask questions, even though we encourage questions. Swallow the liberty kool aid.
I don't know, its all just a bunch of b.s. to me.
thou shalt not pass

Harmony - what a well written discussion you have initiated. I have no real answers, just 2 examples. Tom4U - my childhood was much like yours, use of imagination to play games, family time, etc. and (#2) one of my daughters works at a half-way house for teens 14 to 18, in an attempt to keep them out of prison. Although she can tell me very little due to the privacy act, she does say that she cannot even imagine some of the evils and happenings that brought these children to the edge of prison. That 99% go back to abuse and neglect by their parents or other individuals, at extremely young ages, and continuing until now. That even when these teens are allowed to phone a family member, that adult member oftens berates the teen and whines about themself, therefore leaving the teen with guilt, anger, etc. I truly worry about our families, or lack thereof and find ALL of the input on this thread very informative.

ty..I appreciate the contributions as well, and that everyone is staying on topic.

"Are all 'evil' people suffering from a mental illness? "


I would say definitely not. In fact, the people who I am most disturbed by, are those who consciously and clearly sanely, decide to dedicate themselves to harming others. Physically OR psychologically.

This is why I can so often be seen pounding the table and calling for clean, basic logic, and for recognition of core human equalities. In my experience, the closest thing to evil that I have dealt with, was always from people who decided to calmly craft, usually for some kind of personal gain (that is, not just sex or money), an excuse for why THEY didn't have to obey their own claimed moral principles.

I would just like to say your post is really well written and thought provoking. You are very right....these are the questions we need to be asking ourselves.

Divide and Conquer....that has been the aim of governments and big business for along time now. There is strength in community and strong communities question their goverments! But if the government can break down that sense of community they can do whatever they want.

So so so true...

ty

Y'know, I used to think that way.
The problem was, I was giving the government too much intelligence and purpose. They're not that smart.

The break down is in the people's unity and not a directed method to acheive a goal.
We are self-destructing. Not just the USA, all the 1st world nations are in turmoil.

That's because more people have a global consciousness now.
More people have higher reasoning ability but lower moral fortitude.
You are hard pressed to find anyone balanced and emotionally mature anymore. Too much drama, too much narcisissim and too much isolationism.
We have head-strong people focused on their own immediate needs and it bleeds into every aspect of society.

It's evident in the religious communities and people's belief structures.
For the governments to 'rule' requires the people's ability to believe without question. Religion worked because people had the capacity to believe without question but more and more people are requiring reason and proof for belief now.

I'm not sure if that is a good thing or a bad thing but it certainly is different. Only time will tell how our intelligence changes our world.

Everybody knows that the dice are loaded
Everybody rolls with their fingers crossed
Everybody knows the war is over
Everybody knows the good guys lost
Everybody knows the fight was fixed
The poor stay poor, the rich get rich
That's how it goes
Everybody knows
Everybody knows that the boat is leaking
Everybody knows that the captain lied
Everybody got this broken feeling
Like their father or their dog just died
Everybody talking to their pockets
Everybody wants a box of chocolates
And a long-stem rose
Everybody knows

Yes but there's more things to affect our sub conscious now, more t.v. internet, phones, kids are glued to their bloody phones 24/7 , the bloody Facebook generation. And its long been there aim, they now just have new and more methods of delivery. The Prozac xanax generation. See the/rapist, get some pills you'll be fine, t.v. dinners and mind numbing screens

Ahh....a fellow Cohen fan.

Layers that never end.
People/societies/cultures just have a limit to how much time and money they will spend in peeling those back, and the degree which layers have meaning, purpose, and/or value.

R2D2...

I understand your own problems, and I've known people who feel as you do. The problem is that you are falling prey to what is known as "confirmation bias".

I used to think very little of psychiatrists and psychologists myself. I used to run circles around them, then wonder why they were so useless. So what changed?

Well, first off, I began having panic attacks. That forced me to admit there was a problem.

Secondly, I began educating myself. Of course, I had an advantage: I already had good instincts about how the mind works and why people behave the way they do. I looked at actual science and research.

A lot of old school psychology did not follow empirical methods. There was too much guesswork....and confirmation bias. Supposition based on observation rather than science and thorough documentation.

As for your own confirmation bias, you are wrong about the chemicals showing up in scans. BUT you aren't entirely wrong either. The chemicals should show up in other tests, like blood work. Scans typically show electro-chemical impulses, but they cannot show whether a lack of electrical activity is due to a chemical deficiency. On the other hand, blood work cannot show concentrations of brain chemicals in various parts of the part. They can only show a generalized concentration throughout the bloodstream.

So you are right to have doubts about meds which are supposed to correct chemical deficiencies. The science just isn't there.

But there are meds whose effects actually can be tracked via brain scans. In controlled tests, introducing certain drugs then running scans can show whether or not the drug boosts activity in key areas of the brain. It's not detecting the chemical but the change prompted by the drug.

That said, there are still some holes that research has yet to fill. But now I'm digressing...

In your case, your experience causes you accept certain views or misinformation as fact, just because it aligns with your own personal experience. But that does not mean it is true.

You're actually a pretty intelligent guy. That's why I'm mentioning this.

And I'm not saying you're entirely wrong either. Instead, what I see is that you're exaggerating the things that you want to believe, making them more important or more grandiose than they are in reality. If you pay attention to what Tom has been saying, he's effectively telling you the same thing.

I will say this though...
If there are still people being treated as you've experienced, then that is disgraceful in this day and age. They should lose their licenses, and be barred for life from practicing. I'm not talking about just pushing pills. I'm talking about the overall treatment of patients on all levels. If they are that bad - that insensitive and apathetic - then they need to be removed from the field of treatment altogether.

Thankfully, my experience - both personally and observationally - has not been the same as yours, even though I am very aware that your experience was once much more prevalent here in the U.S. than it is now.