Instead of pretend contradictions and contradictory opinions I thought we might have some real Biblical contradictions for a change.

For practical purposes will be using the KJV, as this is the one that seems to have the most contradictions in it; among the English versions, that is. Yet these errors are in no way confined to this particular English version only.

I will start with errors in translation. Well, I think most of these will be errors in translation.

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COMPARISON

Only by comparison can one appreciate the Concordant Version, so we propose a few examples with brief comments for consideration. Let us look at Genesis 1:1,2. As given by the King James “Bible,” it reads:


In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth, And the earth was without form and void; and darkness [was] upon the face of the deep.


The way this verse reads, practically all readers get the impression that God created the earth “without form and void.” In the celebrated “Evolution Trial” at Dayton, Tennessee, Mr. Darrow requested of the late Mr. Bryan to describe something that could be created “without form and void!” Scientists have poked fun at the “Bible” because of this statement, and pious reverence for a “book” rather than the truth, constrained them to accept and believe it because it was in there! The Concordant clarifies the matter:


IN A BEGINNING created by God [Elohim] were the heavens and the earth. Yet the earth became a chaos and vacant, and darkness was on the surface of the submerged chaos.


That this is the correct rendering, is confirmed by Isaiah 45:18, as given by the American Standard Revised Version, which speaks of the primal creation before the earth “became a chaos and vacant.”


For thus saith Jehovah that created the heavens, the God that formed the earth, and made it, that established it and created it not a waste, that formed it to be inhabited: I am Jehovah and there is none else!


This Scripture confirms the truth that the earth was created “not a waste” in the first verse of Genesis, but “to be inhabited,” and at a later date, through some cataclysmic judgment, is disrupted—“becomes waste and sterile, and darkness is on the surface of the abyss.” Compare Jeremiah 4:23-26 and 2 Peter 3:5,6.

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In John 20:1, the King James reads:

“The first day of the week . . .”

It is little known to Christendom that this is a “bogus” translation foisted upon the church by the translators, a “camel” that has been swallowed by scholars and students alike.

The original, in all three of the oldest manuscripts, reads "mia ton sabbaton," ONE OF THE SABBATHS. Our translators presumed to know more than the great Author and corrupted the word of God. They altered “one” to read “first,” inserted the word “day,” for it is not in the original and is not needed in the translation, and changed “sabbaths” to the singular “week.” Can one imagine a more perfidious and deceptive act of man? It truly is repugnant to those who reverently regard the original as the very word of God, and want it to speak to them as He was pleased to give it.

Ready for more?

In Acts 19:2 the Authorized Version reads:

Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed?

Due to the sense conveyed by this incorrect translation, many still believe that Jesus and the Holy Spirit are dead.

CLV Acts 19:2 said bs to them, " if Did you obtain holy spirit on believing?" Yet they to him, "Nay, neither hear we if there is holy spirit."

A ghost is someone dead. Jesus is alive.

CLV Mt 22:32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? He is not the God of the dead but of the living.

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Taken from the http://jesus-is-savior.com/Bible/NIV/new_age.htm web site...



This shows how, many times, the word "holy" is added to the text, as it is not always found in the Ancient manuscripts as it appears in the KJV.

CLV Rev 22:18 I am testifying to everyone who is hearing the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If ever anyone may be appending onto them, God shall be appending onto him the calamities written in this scroll.

CLV Rev 22:19 And if ever anyone should be eliminating from the words of the scroll of this prophecy, God shall be eliminating his part from the log of life, and out of the holy city, that is written in this scroll.

Evidently, these warnings mean nothing to those who support this English version.

The "holiness" that is spoken of in this version is man-made and NOT from God, as these words were added, not by God, but by men.

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Taken from the http://jesus-is-savior.com/Bible/NIV/new_age.htm web site...





More additions.

2Cor.5:18 - adding "Jesus" to the word "Christ" is not Scriptural, nor is it necessary. Did they think there was another "Christ?"

Acts 8:18 - Adding "holy" to the word "Spirit" only produces a man-made "holiness" that is NOT of God.

Acts 17:29 - Changing "Divine" to "godhead" changes the word of God. These are not God's words but the words of men.

Rev. 1:11 - Adding the words "I am the Alpha and Omega" changes God's Word into something man-made. If Faith comes by hearing God's word, it's little wonder there is such a lack of Faith among Christians.

Matt. 19:17 - By adding the word "god" to this verse, the translators dimmish some of the other important things that Jesus said. If it doesn't show up in the Ancient text, it is a man-made concept.

Joshua 22:22 - changing Yahweh to Lord God is not an improvement to God's word. It is an atrocity to His Word.

Daniel 3:25 - changing "a son of Elohim" to "the Son of God" only serves to muddy up His prophecies and make unclear His Word.

John 9:35 - it is evident that these "christians" don't know the difference between "the Son of Mankind" and "the Son of God." These are NOT interchangeable terms. Each has it's own connotation as described by His Spirit.

There are many more on that website.

I am still having trouble believing that these people make public these changes and have the nerve to say they believe in God, yet follow the words of men. I would call this attitude a "slap in God's face."

Embracing the errors in the KJV does cause damage to the believer and non-believer as well.

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Four little questions that can all be solved with one little word...

Is the sea perpetual? Jeremiah 5:22 or Revelations 21:1?

Jere 5:22 (CLV) Me do you not fear, an affirmation of Yahweh? From My presence are you not pained? Who has made sand the border of the sea, A limit eonian, and it passes not over it, They shake themselves, and they are not able, Yea, sounded have its billows, and they pass not over.

Rev 21:1 (CLV) And I perceived a new heaven and a new earth, for the former heaven and the former earth pass away, and the sea is no more.

Will the sanctuary (the temple) be set for evermore? Ezekiel 37:26, 28 or Revelations 21:22?

Ezek 37:26 (CLV) And I have made to them a covenant of peace, A covenant eonian it is with them, And I have placed them, and multiplied them, And placed My sanctuary in their midst--to the eon.

Ezek 37:28 (CLV) And known have the nations that I Yahweh am sanctifying Israel, In My sanctuary being in their midst--to the eon!'

Rev 21:22 (CLV) And a temple I did not perceive in it, for the Lord God Almighty is its temple, and the Lambkin.

Were sacrifices to continue forever? Exodus 31:16, 17; Lev 16:33, 34; 2Cronicles 2:4 or Hebrews 9:9, 10?

Exod 31:16 (CLV) Hence the sons of Israel will keep the sabbath so as to make the sabbath an eonian covenant throughout their generations.
17. Between Me and the sons of Israel it shall be a sign for the eon, for in six days Yahweh dealt with the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day He ceased and was refreshed.

2Chr 2:4 (CLV) lo, I am building a house to the name of Yahweh my Elohim, to sanctify [it] to Him, to make perfume before Him, perfume of spices, and a continual arrangement, and burnt-offerings at morning and at evening, at sabbaths, and at new moons, and at appointed seasons of Yahweh our Elohim; to the eon this [is] on Israel.

Heb 9:9 (CLV) which is a parable for the present period, according to which both approach presents and sacrifices are being offered, which can not make the one offering divine service perfect as to the conscience,
10. only in foods and drinks and baptizings excelling, and just statutes for the flesh, lying on them unto the period of reformation.

Will the Earth pass away? Psalm 78:69; Ecclesiastes 1:4 or Psalm 102:25; 26 Isaiah 66:22; Matthew 24:35; 2Peter 3:10; Revelations 21:1? Also see Isaiah 45:17 and Ephesians 3:21.

Psal 78:69 (CLV) And He built His Sanctuary like the heights of heaven,
Like the earth that He founded for the eon.

Eccl 1:4 (CLV) One generation goes, and another generation comes,
Yet the earth is standing for the eon.

Psal 102:25 (CLV) Before time You founded the earth,
And the heavens are the work of Your hands.
26. They shall perish, yet You shall stand.
All of them shall decay like a cloak;
You shall change them like clothing, and they shall pass by.

Isai 66:22 (CLV) "For as the new heavens and the new earth which I will make, will stand before Me," averring is Yahweh, "So stand shall your seed and your name.

Matt 24:35 (CLV) Heaven and earth shall be passing by, yet My words may by no means be passing by.

2Pet 3:10 (CLV) Now the day of the Lord will be arriving as a thief, in which the heavens shall be passing by with a booming noise, yet the elements shall be dissolved by combustion, and the earth and the works in it shall be found.

Rev 21:1 (CLV) And I perceived a new heaven and a new earth, for the former heaven and the former earth pass away, and the sea is no more.


Isai 45:17 (CLV) Israel is saved by Yahweh, with a salvation eonian. They shall not be ashamed nor confounded for future eons.

Ephe 3:21 (CLV) to Him be the glory in the ecclesia and in Christ Jesus for all the generations of the eon of the eons! Amen!

In all the above examples, each of these "contradictions" can be solved by using the Ancient Greek work 'aion' and the Ancient Hebrew word 'olam,' both meaning "age" and not "eternal."

The CLV uses the word 'eon' which is an acronym of the two. Look also at Young's version and you can see how the word "age" fits just fine in each and every instance.

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The Ancient words 'sheol,' 'hades,' 'gehenna,' and 'tartarus' are all mistranslated as "hell" in the KJV.

The word "hell" is not as old as these Ancient words. the whole concept of a "hell" was foreign to the Jews, and to Jesus.

There is no "hell" in the Scriptures.

In the OT, the word 'sheol' represented the spiritual side of death. All souls go to sheol (Ezk 18:4).

The Ancient Greek term 'hades' was chosen to represent the Ancient Hebrew term 'sheol' because it meant the same thing... unseen or unperceived. Unfortunately some of the other definitions of the word 'hades; got in the way. Definitions that were used by the pagan religions of that time.

Gehenna is only translated in the NT as "hell," and not in the OT. It represents a physical ravine just outside of Jerusalem. Still not sure how this physical place can be thought of as "hell."

Tartarus is used only once in the Scriptures and is said to hold angels, not men. It's literal translation is "jail."

In my opinion, any Bible that uses the word "hell" is full of errors.

The Jehovah witnesses will for sure attack the king James version.
For millions like me around the world who are filled by the Holy Spirit, the original author of the bible we trust Him to 'teach us all truth'(John 16 v 13) since he lives in us and He is with us(John 14 v 17)
He has been faithful.
It is not the 'letters' that is profitable but the 'Rhema'. Until the letters( the written word) becomes the Rhema (revealed word ) then it is not more than literature.The Holy Spirit is the one that gives each individual revelation of the bible.
So depend on the Holy Spirit,the very spirit of Jesus Christ and author of the bible.

Amen

I agree .
Most of the confusion (not so much "contradictions") comes from one not having the indwelling of the Holy Spirit nor the convictions and guidance .

God is able to rise above human errors regarding His Word.

So you think the Holy Spirit will lead us and teach us with a Bible that is mistranslated?

Interesting.

in the CJB, it makes it clear that there was a creation well before Adam and the Garden scene. and the MEDIATOR [like Yeshua is to us now] was then Satan [he was the most beautiful created angel and his name represented light before he sinned].

according to translation, [and we know from Job] that Satan walked the earth and mingled with the original creation. God rewarded him by giving him a throne in the Mountain of God where he was honored. Jeremiah and Isaiah speak of him walking through the honored path of flames [angels on both sides like military did for its leaders].

but Satan perceived he was equal to God and iniquity filled him. and as the story goes, he manipulated the original creation into believing he was God. and we know he caused 1/3 of the angels to rebel against Yahweh.

God was angered and when He booted Satan from heaven [which Yeshua claimed, I saw Satan fall as lightning], he then crashed onto planet earth causing cosmic collision that created a divulge. the result was everything on earth was destroyed and it caused the land to become void and the waters flooded the face of the entire planet [in my opinion, this is what science calls the Ice Age].

but this condition of a voided earth covered in water leads to being Genesis 1:2

2 The earth was unformed and void, darkness was on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God hovered over the surface of the water.



which this point also leads to an interesting verse in the Book of Job:

Job 26:5
5 Dead things are formed from under the waters, and the inhabitants thereof.

Well, this is true. Man fell. Then he was rescued by the Lord God in the garden. Read the Story of Adam and Eve in the Apocrypha.

But to get that across, your version would have to add words. If that is the case it is no longer a translation, but, much like the KJV, it becomes an interpretation.

What manuscripts is this version coming from?

David Harold Stern is a Messianic Jewish born in the US and moved to Israel. This means that he has really no connection with the ancient text himself.

He has an English translation of the Tanakh and New Testament.

The problem is, there is no Ancient Hebrew NT. The oldest NT we have are Ancient Koine Greek, not Hebrew.

From the CJB...

Genesis 1:1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
2 The earth was unformed and void, darkness was on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God hovered over the surface of the water.
3 Then God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light.
4 God saw that the light was good, and God divided the light from the darkness.
5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. So there was evening, and there was morning, one day.

Looks alot like the KJV.

But this English version does not fix the problem I outlined. The Earth was not created "unformed and void." Can you describe something that is created "void"?

CLV Jer 4:23 I saw the earth, and behold, it was a chaos and vacant, And ›the heavens, and they had no light.
24 I saw the mountains, and behold, they were quaking, And all the hills, they rocked.
25 I saw, and behold, there was no humanity, And every flier of the heavens, they had bolted away.
26 I saw, and behold, the crop land was a wilderness And all its cities, they were broken down because of Yahweh's presence, Because of the heat of His anger.

CLV 2Pt 3:5 For they want to be oblivious of this, that there were heavens of old, and an earth cohering out of water and through water, by the word of God;
6 through which the then world, being deluged by water, perished.

The above verses show that the Earth was not created "formless and void." It later became this way.



CJB Romans 7:24 What a miserable creature I am! Who will rescue me from this body bound for death?

What does your CJB say is the answer to Paul's question?

Judgment is about God setting what is wrong to right

krisis - decision (subjectively or objectively, for or against); by extension, a tribunal; by implication, justice (especially, divine law)

It seems that in an effort to support their Doctrine of Hell the church, the King James version has changed the meanings of several verses from a neutral meaning 'judgment' to 'condemnation' and 'damnation.'

Thus the word 'judgment' itself has become a very unstable word in our language. It has come to mean punishment, not it's original use of a neutral process. The Authorized Version renders the word ' judgment as 'condemnation' and 'damnation' about 13 times.

Take this example from...

AV Dt 1:17 Ye shall not respect persons in judgment...

CLV Dt 1:17 You shall not recognize faces with partiality in judgment...

The Authorized version seems a bit more harsh, where a closer rendering encourages a more neutral attitude.

Examples like these are spread throughout the Scriptures.

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Here are examples of how the term 'judgment' got changed into 'damnation'...

CLV Mt 23:33 "Serpents! Progeny of vipers! How may you be fleeing from the judging of Gehenna?

AV Mt 23:33 [Ye] serpents, [ye] generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

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CLV Mk 12:40 who are devouring the homes of widows, and for a pretense are prolix in praying. These will be getting more excessive judgment."

AV Mk 12:40 Which devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayers: these shall receive greater damnation.

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CLV Lk 20:47 who are devouring the homes of widows and, for a pretense, are prolix in praying. These will be getting more excessive judgment."

AV Lk 20:47 Which devour widows' houses, and for a shew make long prayers: the same shall receive greater damnation.

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CLV Jn 5:29 and those who do good shall go out into a resurrection of life, yet those who commit bad things, into a resurrection of judging.

AV Jn 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

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CLV Ro 3:8 and why not say, according as we are calumniated and according as any/some are averring that we are saying, that "We should be doing evil that good may be coming?" whose judgment is fair.

AV Ro 3:8 And not [rather], (as we be slanderously reported, and as some affirm that we say,) Let us do evil, that good may come? whose damnation is just.

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CLV Ro 13:2 so that he who is resisting an authority has withstood God's mandate. Now those who have withstood, will be getting judgment for themselves,

AV Ro 13:2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.

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CLV 1C 11:29 For he who is eating and drinking unworthily is eating and drinking judgment to himself, not discriminating the body of the Lord.

AV 1C 11:29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.

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In many cases, the King James version represents judgment as a past event and damnation as a result.

The judgment of the nations does not begin until Jesus Christ returns. The nations nor individuals have not been judged so there has been no damnation.

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Here are examples of how the term 'judgment' got changed into 'condemnation'...

CLV Luke 23:40 Yet answering, the other one, rebuking him, averred, "Yet you are not fearing God, seeing that you are in the same judgment!

AV Luke 23:40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?

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CLV John 3:19 Now this is the judging: that the light has come into the world, and men love the darkness rather than the light, for their acts were wicked.

AV John 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

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CLV John 5:24 "Verily, verily, I am saying to you that he who is hearing My word and believing Him Who sends Me, has life eonian and is not coming into judging, but has proceeded out of death into life.

AV John 5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

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CLV 1Cor 11:34 Now if anyone may be hungry, let him eat in/at home, that you may not be coming together into/for judgment. Now the rest I shall be prescribing as soon as I should be coming.

AV 1Cor 11:34 And if any man hunger, let him eat at home; that ye come not together unto condemnation. And the rest will I set in order when I come.

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CLV 1Ti 3:6 no novice, lest, being conceited, he should be falling in into the judgment of the Adversary.

AV 1Tim 3:6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.

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CLV James 3:1 Not many should become teachers, my brethren, being aware that we shall be getting greater judgment.

AV James 3:1 My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we shall receive the greater condemnation.

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CLV James 5:12 Now before all, my brethren, do not be swearing, neither by heaven, nor by the earth, nor any other oath. Now let your "yes" be "yes," and "not" be "not," lest you should be falling under judging.

AV James 5:12 But above all things, my brethren, swear not, neither by heaven, neither by the earth, neither by any other oath: but let your yea be yea; and [your] nay, nay; lest ye fall into condemnation.

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CLV Jude 1:4 For any/some human/men slip in who long ago have been written beforehand into/for this judgment; irreverent, bartering the grace of our God into/for wantonness, and disowning our only Owner and Lord, Jesus Christ.

AV Jude 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

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Again judgment seems to be in the past as condemnation, a result of judging, replaces this process.

Even in the United States, an effort is made to provide a fair and just judgment for it's citizens, even in it's imperfect state. How much more would be God's judgment?

What does any of this below matter?, when all one really needs to know is the answer to this one question:

...Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? (Luke 10:25)

"God moves in a mysterious ways; His wonders to perform." -William Cowper

God has sent a correction.

You know I pop my head in here once in awhile to see what's going on.. right?.. Where did you guys get all this stuff from.. we wrote one friggin book?!

Don't make me come down there.. o.k..

JC

on DH, you would have read me telling about my Grandfather who was an evangelist, pastor, part of the founding creator of the Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ, Bible professor in the states of Texas, Oklahoma, Florida, Indiana.

it was his understanding from several versions of literature including scriptures from several Bibles, Youngs Analytical Concordance, Strong's Concordance, and other manuscripts that he pieced the puzzle together. at the time, he held onto this revelation with exception to a few family members that also included my father and myself.

he knew about Matthew 28:19 before the internet [Catholics changing baptizing in NAME of Yeshua to Father-Son-Holy Ghost] because Acts 2:38 made no sense with Peter instructing to Baptize in the NAME of Yeshua. he would say something is fishy for Peter would follow specifically what Yeshua taught him.

but I have been in the loop concerning this since I was 7 years old.

and through my own studies, I can piece it together.

and I believe it whole heartedly!!

The Scriptures tell us God is One, not three or three in one.

Jesus is exactly Who He said He was, the Only begotten Son of God.

Do you have a chapter and verse on that? Or are you just making it up as you go along?

We have deleted several post due they were against the site rules.

At times threads do get moved and they may not end up where you want them.. But they are placed within the threads that we feel is best for them..If you don't see the link then use My Topics to find them...

The Christian Singles Forums is for Christians only to get to know each other and those that want to discuss issues within a civil matter..

General Religion is when you are debating over the Topics with others.. And at times will get heated.

We ask that all members keep it to a Civil Debate.. Just cause others do not believe as some, it does not mean their opinion is wrong..

With that said this thread has been moved back..

Please keep all comments Civil, explain why you feel the way you do by giving info for others to see your reasoning behind what you want them to see.

Forum Admin
Kristi

Thank you TxsGal3333.

I have shown that the KJV does not represent the Ancient text accurately in English. Why put your faith in a broken down English version?

There are several English versions that are more accurate.

Luke 14
28 For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have sufficient to finish it?
29 Lest haply, after he hath laid the foundation, and is not able to finish it, all that behold it begin to mock him,
30 Saying, This man began to build, and was not able to finish.

In the beginning the earth indeed was void and without form. Thought comes before form and then is the foundation laid, or God speaks and the Word comes forth. God could have formed the universe in an instant keeping silence and secret, but then how should we come to know Him? In His infinite wisdom, knowledge and mercy God chose to send His Word into the world to form it and reveal Himself to us. He chose to form the World in six days creating a pattern for us.

Deuteronomy 29:29 The secret things belong unto the Lord our God: but those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children for ever, that we may do all the words of this law.

Psalm 90:2 Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever thou hadst formed the earth and the world, even from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God.

Jesus is indeed fully God and fully man.

Isaiah 45:10 Woe unto him that saith unto his father, What begettest thou? or to the woman, What hast thou brought forth?