Exactly

No Taxes means no taxes at all.
No sales tax, no house tax, no school district tax, etc...

Lots of people complain about having to pay taxes.

Remove government:
No licenses, permits or inspections
Anyone can buy a gun, drive a car (even if it isn't safe), fish, hunt, build, etc...

Think about all the people employed from tax generation.
Road workers, game wardens, all the service professionals listed by argo63.
There would be no parks or preserves either.

Taxes maintain the social order of civilization.

Imagine a condition where there was a loss of government, like a natural disaster or super-virus.

Without government and taxes, could we maintain civilization?
What would happen?
Would private ownership control roads? Would mega-corporations step in and take control?
Might private owners pay to keep systems in place?
Might small businesses group together to assure they have customers?
Maintain roadways so their employees can make it to work?
Would the "person" contribute to keep government programs in place and operational?
Which programs would get how much of each person's money?
Would you willingly pay a penny to keep roads maintained?
Which roads?
Would you pay another penny to make sure farmers recover from a bad season?
Would you willingly pay a nickel to a person for overseeing the programs or would a nickel be too much?

I was working poor for awhile in my life. I paid taxes. Sometimes I got a refund, sometimes I didn't. Since I worked and had a W2, I have proof that I paid taxes.

People that work for government programs pay taxes too.
That is because they have income.
Preachers and priests have income as well. They pay no taxes. They don't even pay sales tax. They are tax exempt.
I worked awhile in auto parts supply.
Many times our commercial accounts were listed as tax exempt because their customers paid the taxes on the parts they used to fix their cars. It was a significant savings, I know because I billed it.

Anyone that applies for tax-exempt status, pays no taxes.
If you don't want to pay taxes, claim a religious status.

http://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-tips/self-employment-taxes/ministers-and-taxes/L2EiSFEMT

http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc4179

.. tax information for clergy or those thinking about claiming to be clergy

Everyone complains about the tax amount they pay. That will continue regardless of the tax structure. Fact is the U.S. unlike communist countries ( Like China) do not generate income thru selling. So if you do not actually sell something you have to generate income other ways.. thus, taxes.

I do not think anyone is saying we should not pay tax.. we should. Everyone understands we need protection ( Military), sound roads and transportation and social services.

But when you see case after case of out of control government spending it hits a nerve. ( do you remember the $500.00 hammer scandal?.. Uncle Sam paying $500.00 each for hammers that costs $25. off the shelf at Home Depot) Because after all it is our money they are spending.

I belong to a SHTF scenario site that explores what happens when a disaster strikes or other calamity situations.
I was discussing such a scenario and it came up that nobody would be paying taxes anymore. The discussion turned into an argument with basically two sides.

Need Taxes and Don't Need Taxes.

The 'need taxes' side took the position that people in general will not thrive unless they have a vested interest.

The 'no taxes' side persists that people will thrive because they will work together even without a vested interest.

The majority of the 'chaff' replies (non-discussion responses) indicated the attitude of no taxes, hates taxes.

If SHTF and government fails completely would people race to create a new government for all the people or would they revert to tribal societies?

Would people be able to maintain a productive society without taxes?
Can people govern themselves?
Does our current tax structure exceed personal vested interest?

We operate on a priority of Federal, State then Local taxes.
Most people live locally.
Shouldn't it be Local, State then Federal priorities?
Local being the highest, most important tax and Federal being the lowest least important taxes.
How would that priority change effect our standard of living?

would people be able to maintain productive society without taxes?

it depends on the definition of productive, there would always be those in charge and those exploited, with or without taxes, and those in charge will have to exploit others into productivity by threat of starvation, homelessness, or social persecution
taxes permit people, regardless of income level, to have a horse in the game and therefore a say in how the race is run ...


Can people govern themselves?

Yes, but they cant govern others. and people living with OTHERS need some uniform governance

Does our current tax structure exceed personal vested interest?
Not in my opinion.

I do not understand what you mean by the 'priority' of taxes, in what way is one tax a 'priority' over another?

Depends on if you mean me personally as an individual, but everyone else had to?

That would be freaking awesome.
I might get some hate mail, though.
It's sure to get out somehow. I mean if I ever work for someone then the accountants are going to see my check.
Plus people might start overcharging me in order to force me to pay what they think is my "fair share," that they have to pay.


If you're asking more along the puerile lines of "what if no one anywhere ever had to pay any taxes again, ever?"
Then it's a silly question.
There will always be taxes.
A lack of taxes does not magically remove the desire for power or control from people, nor the benefit of pooling resources.

At best/worst you'd just get those people that have money, power, influence, those that can wield police or armies, in control, and they'd take what they needed in order to maintain their power and influence.
They'd just not call it taxes. They'd call it preemptive altruism or something.


Sure there would.
That's like saying "without an income, there would be no father."


Taxes maintain what the controller of tax revenues decides.
Social order is maintained by society, social rules, human interaction. At best taxes are used by a government to create symbols and rituals based on social rules to make adherence and compliance easier.

Taxes are a tool of social order, they don't define social order.
Money is a store of value and effort. Taxes are a means of redistributing effort towards whatever the controlling body says needs effort or should be valued.


And the only relevant thing that happens is "government" magically goes away? Okay.


Sure. As "civilization" isn't a discrete absolute. There are different levels of "civilization."

Government is a byproduct of civilization, not a determinant.


People/corporations would attempt to control the things which are perceived to be in their self/community/group interest.


Pay whom? Pay what? What systems?


"Might?" Sure, that's a vague enough term.
Some small businesses "might" group together for any number of reasons.
Or they "might" not, for any other number of reasons. Maybe one small business cheated at the inter business softball game last year so no colluding with them.


Depends on the situation and the person.
Do they believe the government is going to be reestablished any day now? Are they in some kind of Mad Max world fighting for their next meal? What resources does the "person" have? What is their place/role in their community? What government programs, just all of them?


Beats me. They'd need a committee to figure out the necessity and timing. Ooops. That's government. But you said it might be a supervirus and the only effect seems to be the loss of government.
So starting any type of government would fail because of a supervirus killing it off.
So whichever programs fulfilled perceived self interest of the individual.


Based on a lack of relevant information I don't even know if my pennies are worth anything, recognized as "money" anymore.
If they aren't worth anything, then sure, I'd pay a penny. Maybe even 2.
Other than that, I'd be willing to pay for road maintenance if I received some benefit from the roads, I could afford to pay for maintenance, and/or it was demanded of me by my community which I needed for survival.
Other than that, there might be a supervirus or natural disaster thing running around. I might be trapped under rubble for all I know from this scenario. Then I'm paying nothing until someone gets me outta here, or keeps me from catching the supervirus.


lol.
That's only true if the preachers and priests live in poverty.
Otherwise they're treated as subcontractors so the church doesn't have to deal with income witholdings, the priest has to figure it out.
Churches don't pay taxes. Priests and preachers don't pay taxes if they're doing "church" work (e.g. buying a gallon of wine for the sacrament so no sales tax).
Otherwise, priests and preachers pay taxes like everyone else as employees of a church. They pay taxes for personal consumption (e.g. buying a gallon of wine for dinner).


Depends on what you mean by "taxes?"
If you are asking "would people be able to maintain a productive society without a compulsory theft of their personal work efforts by a centralized authority?"
Then yes, yes they could.


Some can, some can't.
Some people get lost in the wilderness and can "govern" themselves enough to survive and get out.
Other people panic and die.


Depends on the person.


Who says is isn't?
Have you sat down with all your receipts, your local, state, and federal tax codes, determined exactly how much in taxes you pay to each entity in every hidden way?

How do you incorporate things such as going to the grocery store and federal law mandating no sales tax on food stamp eligible consumables, so you pay less local taxes?
Even though the item may have come from a different state?
And potentially part of the price of the item incorporates taxes paid by that company in another state (or country), as well as a possible discount due to selling to your town which may have a significant enough population to offer greater economies of scale in distribution?

Or are you "really" asking "Shouldn't it be spoon fed to me in the media a biased focus or perspective of local, state, then federal
priorities, because the media I pay attention to mostly just focuses on national politics and taxes, and when I go on the internet and talk to people all over the country, the commonality is national interest rather than my local priorities!"


Depends on your current standard of living.
Anywhere to no effect whatsoever, to completely changing it positively or negatively.

Right now, we are set up with federal taxes and federal use of tax funds as a priority factor.
All of my W2s have federal tax paid as the highest denomination.
State tax paid comes in second and most have no local tax paid listed.
In some states, state tax base is based on the federal taxes paid and Federal earnings shown. Local taxes are also based on federal earnings. Sales tax is usually set at the state level.

The majority of our tax money goes to the federal level.
We don't "live" at the federal level.
We "live" at the local level.

Shouldn't we be paying highest local taxes with federal taxes being the lowest scale?
Wouldn't that put more money into our immediate society allowing for a better life?
Wouldn't that curb runaway federal spending?
Its like we have our priorities mixed up.

If you have $1.00
Lets say you keep $0.60 for your own use.
The $0.40 is split between 3 levels
Right now it seems $0.20 goes to federal, $0.15 goes to state and $0.05 goes to local.
We live in the local.
Wouldn't it make more sense to make Local 20% State 10% and Federal 10% of the tax?
Not to set the taxes at those percents but to take whatever the tax revenue is an divide it up that way.

It would put the strongest government at the local level where the people actually live. The programs and projects would be local based money that would pertain to local societies and their needs and wants.
Its what would happen in a recovery scenario after a government collapse. Because, it makes sense.

Make everyone whos able to get job, get work somewhere and help contribute to paying taxes!!!!

yep,will go over well indeed!

Oh I see.

I suppose if we were fifty seperate governments, we wouldnt really be a 'United States'

we are free to move between areas, and many do, which to me, makes the largest portion going to the being an 'AMerican' part of it the sensible way to do it.

A Tobin type tax would solve so many problems..

With every one paying their far share.. No escape..

A 0.01 % on all purchases.. No income tax. No Company tax.

. You may be considered poor financially but you lack nothing in intelligence. I love to read your posts because of the clarity you see in this politically heated time we live in. You seem to have a lot of integrity and won't be pursuaded easily . Stay strong , keep voicing your opinion. The Lord will provide.

it looks like people like me have nothing to sell in the market....damn~~~~
then the first international business of mine will be selling words....

then any things concern in your mind then? pals?......what is loyal truly meaning about? what had happen back to these years......and what had lost? the fate of prometheus had and will never change.....if some one even words can't give then what kind of thing they can offer? what had happen then? why those people had success? without forcing ? will you believe or not? but on the another hand what had happen? why trump against the mass media's will?

merry christmas few days delay.....and confuses ~~~~~

few countries make it on no taxes, no taxes mean no revenue in most places that are highly populated unless they have oil wealth to sell instead.

Thinking about it a nation of True Communism or True Kingdom could exist without taxes.
Because in true communism there is no personal ownership and in a true kingdom, the king owns everything.