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Topic: Fickle public opinion
msharmony's photo
Thu 08/04/16 02:34 PM

   

Written by

Sady Doyle


Obsession
2016
February 25, 2016



It’s hard to remember these days, but just a few years ago, everybody loved Hillary Rodham Clinton. When she stepped down as US secretary of state in January 2013 after four years in office, her approval rating stood at what the Wall Street Journal described as an “eye-popping” 69%.



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Clinton’s favorability ratings currently hover around 40.8%.


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Women often find self-promotion difficult even outside the realm of politics. For example, a 2011 study found that men are four times more likely to ask for raises than their female co-workers. Women are much more likely than men to under-estimate their abilities. When they apply for jobs, they often refuse to even submit a resume unless they’re certain they have 100% of the requisite qualifications. (The qualification threshold for men is only 60%. Think about that the next time you wonder why on Earth Donald Trump thinks he should be president–or, for that matter, when Bernie Sanders insists that his lack of foreign policy experience compared to Clinton’s doesn’t matter, because he has better “judgment.”)

http://qz.com/624346/america-loves-women-like-hillary-clinton-as-long-as-theyre-not-asking-for-a-promotion/






IgorFrankensteen's photo
Thu 08/04/16 02:51 PM
Not completely sure what you're going for here, but of course I'll put something in anyway. Hope it's related.

I see two main reasons for Clinton's shifting approval ratings.

One is Clinton herself, because she isn't a naturally good public speaker, and because she allows her sensitivities to attack show too much in her responses. She can come across as evasive, ironically because she is trying to be extra clear. And sometimes she answers what she thinks the real question is, rather than staying with what was immediately asked.

Her other problem is, that the Republican Party has spent millions of dollars, and countless hours, making up all manner of false stories about her and about her Husband, and have repeatedly them endlessly for the last eight years especially.

The Republican propagandists know that it is unfortunately true, that if a lie is repeated often enough, and with enough conviction, and the people repeating it are dressed in suits, that many people will believe it, just because it HAS been repeated.

They further are good at playing the game with a straight face, which goes that they fling mud (lie stories) at someone again and again, and then stand back from the mess they've made, and say "look at all that mud! Must be something to it, if there's THAT much mud!"

It's similar to the version where they blow a bunch of smoke at everyone (propaganda) and then start chanting "where there's smoke, there's fire!"

In short, I wouldn't say that it's that the general public are "fickle," I think it's that the vast majority of people just don't realize that it takes ACTUAL WORK to think logically and to analyze facts. So they don't. And instead they roll with whatever seems to be the "going thing" around them.


msharmony's photo
Thu 08/04/16 03:13 PM
I was just putting out there my reason for seeing public opinion as fickle and not very constant or consistent.

It seems , looking at past numbers, that she is indeed well liked when in a position, but much less liked when running for any promotion of her position.

I am reminded of how Ferraro was hounded over what her husband did, even more ridiculosly,, when HE WAS A CHILD(a time when he had no say in most of what he did....lol), because his family lived on the same block a questionable people or some other ridiculous guilt by association conspiracy angle.....


in any case , SSDD in the world of news, polls, and surveys.

Conrad_73's photo
Thu 08/04/16 03:18 PM

Not completely sure what you're going for here, but of course I'll put something in anyway. Hope it's related.

I see two main reasons for Clinton's shifting approval ratings.

One is Clinton herself, because she isn't a naturally good public speaker, and because she allows her sensitivities to attack show too much in her responses. She can come across as evasive, ironically because she is trying to be extra clear. And sometimes she answers what she thinks the real question is, rather than staying with what was immediately asked.

Her other problem is, that the Republican Party has spent millions of dollars, and countless hours, making up all manner of false stories about her and about her Husband, and have repeatedly them endlessly for the last eight years especially.

The Republican propagandists know that it is unfortunately true, that if a lie is repeated often enough, and with enough conviction, and the people repeating it are dressed in suits, that many people will believe it, just because it HAS been repeated.

They further are good at playing the game with a straight face, which goes that they fling mud (lie stories) at someone again and again, and then stand back from the mess they've made, and say "look at all that mud! Must be something to it, if there's THAT much mud!"

It's similar to the version where they blow a bunch of smoke at everyone (propaganda) and then start chanting "where there's smoke, there's fire!"

In short, I wouldn't say that it's that the general public are "fickle," I think it's that the vast majority of people just don't realize that it takes ACTUAL WORK to think logically and to analyze facts. So they don't. And instead they roll with whatever seems to be the "going thing" around them.


those "Stories" are a Matter of Public Record!

mightymoe's photo
Thu 08/04/16 03:26 PM


   

Written by

Sady Doyle


Obsession
2016
February 25, 2016



It’s hard to remember these days, but just a few years ago, everybody loved Hillary Rodham Clinton. When she stepped down as US secretary of state in January 2013 after four years in office, her approval rating stood at what the Wall Street Journal described as an “eye-popping” 69%.



.........



Clinton’s favorability ratings currently hover around 40.8%.


.........



Women often find self-promotion difficult even outside the realm of politics. For example, a 2011 study found that men are four times more likely to ask for raises than their female co-workers. Women are much more likely than men to under-estimate their abilities. When they apply for jobs, they often refuse to even submit a resume unless they’re certain they have 100% of the requisite qualifications. (The qualification threshold for men is only 60%. Think about that the next time you wonder why on Earth Donald Trump thinks he should be president–or, for that matter, when Bernie Sanders insists that his lack of foreign policy experience compared to Clinton’s doesn’t matter, because he has better “judgment.”)

http://qz.com/624346/america-loves-women-like-hillary-clinton-as-long-as-theyre-not-asking-for-a-promotion/








what is it with blacks, women, and just about every non white male that constantly wants to blame the white man for every little thing in life?

her approval ratings went down because she lied to many times, plain and simple... is it the white mans fault shes a liar?

mightymoe's photo
Thu 08/04/16 03:28 PM

Not completely sure what you're going for here, but of course I'll put something in anyway. Hope it's related.

I see two main reasons for Clinton's shifting approval ratings.

One is Clinton herself, because she isn't a naturally good public speaker, and because she allows her sensitivities to attack show too much in her responses. She can come across as evasive, ironically because she is trying to be extra clear. And sometimes she answers what she thinks the real question is, rather than staying with what was immediately asked.

Her other problem is, that the Republican Party has spent millions of dollars, and countless hours, making up all manner of false stories about her and about her Husband, and have repeatedly them endlessly for the last eight years especially.

The Republican propagandists know that it is unfortunately true, that if a lie is repeated often enough, and with enough conviction, and the people repeating it are dressed in suits, that many people will believe it, just because it HAS been repeated.

They further are good at playing the game with a straight face, which goes that they fling mud (lie stories) at someone again and again, and then stand back from the mess they've made, and say "look at all that mud! Must be something to it, if there's THAT much mud!"

It's similar to the version where they blow a bunch of smoke at everyone (propaganda) and then start chanting "where there's smoke, there's fire!"

In short, I wouldn't say that it's that the general public are "fickle," I think it's that the vast majority of people just don't realize that it takes ACTUAL WORK to think logically and to analyze facts. So they don't. And instead they roll with whatever seems to be the "going thing" around them.




more from the "republican did it" company ... shes a liar, just like her boss is... and her husband as well... why is that so hard for you to see?

msharmony's photo
Thu 08/04/16 03:34 PM
Edited by msharmony on Thu 08/04/16 03:35 PM
what is it with blacks, women, and just about every non white male that constantly wants to blame the white man for every little thing in life?

her approval ratings went down because she lied to many times, plain and simple... is it the white mans fault shes a liar?




what is it with people always looking for 'fault',,,noone said whose 'fault' anything was.......its about public opinion,, if we MUST make it about 'fault'


its the publics 'fault'

the article explains that even women tend to not feel they are worthy of promotions,,,,


its not about 'white man'

its not even if she is 'lying',, everyone in politics 'lies' according to that same public opinion


her ratings are high in office (lying politician and all) but drop when she runs for office

no photo
Thu 08/04/16 04:48 PM
her ratings are high in office (lying politician and all) but drop when she runs for office
OP, I would submit that a person running for president is under a lot more scrutiny than a retiring Secretary of State. And that the pool of people polled is much larger for said presidential candidate.

As far as my opinion of her, there's nothing fickle about it...I wouldn't piss on her if she was on fire. And that hasn't changed for decades....and she's done nothing to improve my opinion of her, in fact her actions have exponentially worsened it....and it has nothing to do with her gender, I wouldn't piss on Bill if he was on fire either.

the article explains that even women tend to not feel they are worthy of promotions,,,,
The article is written by a feminist and progressive hack, so there's that....

no photo
Thu 08/04/16 04:55 PM
Fickle public opinion

Polls are pretty bad indicators of long term anything.

I mean for the most part you get several different organizations asking different questions of very few but different people.

The realclearpolitics aggregate poll you cited in another thread, most of the polls were questions asked of like 1,200 people, some fewer (if I remember correctly) like 300.

There was only one poll that questioned something like 12,000 people.

Not to mention, people ♦aren't generally being asked "do you openly support hillary over trump?" or "are you going to vote for hillary or trump," but more convoluted questions.
And a lot of poll questions are worded in ways to lead to a desired answer.

There are around 320,000,000 people in the us, speaking dozens of languages from diverse cultures and backgrounds.

320,000,000
12,000
1,200

You really think polls are an accurate indicator of anything all that relevant?
Let alone long term trends?
.003% of the population, at best, accurately represents 100%?

Polls are misused by the media to represent things that aren't really asked.
Polls are misused by politicians for propaganda and psych warfare purposes.
Then people use those headlines for confirmation bias.

So
Fickle public opinion

IMO not really.
Determining accurate public opinion is flawed, and made worse trying to determine anything over the long term.

Polls and public opinion numbers are good for confirmation bias and propaganda, that's about it.




msharmony's photo
Thu 08/04/16 05:06 PM

WASHINGTON, D.C. -- Pope Francis' favorability rating in the U.S. has returned to where it was when he was elected pope. It is now at 59%, down from 76% in early 2014. The pontiff's rating is similar to the 58% he received from Americans in April 2013, soon after he was elected pope.



There ya go, see even the Pope has bad spells.


the pope doesnt get or run for promotion

msharmony's photo
Thu 08/04/16 05:07 PM

Fickle public opinion

Polls are pretty bad indicators of long term anything.

I mean for the most part you get several different organizations asking different questions of very few but different people.

The realclearpolitics aggregate poll you cited in another thread, most of the polls were questions asked of like 1,200 people, some fewer (if I remember correctly) like 300.

There was only one poll that questioned something like 12,000 people.

Not to mention, people ♦aren't generally being asked "do you openly support hillary over trump?" or "are you going to vote for hillary or trump," but more convoluted questions.
And a lot of poll questions are worded in ways to lead to a desired answer.

There are around 320,000,000 people in the us, speaking dozens of languages from diverse cultures and backgrounds.

320,000,000
12,000
1,200

You really think polls are an accurate indicator of anything all that relevant?
Let alone long term trends?
.003% of the population, at best, accurately represents 100%?

Polls are misused by the media to represent things that aren't really asked.
Polls are misused by politicians for propaganda and psych warfare purposes.
Then people use those headlines for confirmation bias.

So
Fickle public opinion

IMO not really.
Determining accurate public opinion is flawed, and made worse trying to determine anything over the long term.

Polls and public opinion numbers are good for confirmation bias and propaganda, that's about it.







thats another possiblity,,

fickel public opinion
or flawed numbers regarding 'accurate' public opinion

msharmony's photo
Thu 08/04/16 05:32 PM
it wasnt a question of IF ratings changed

it was WHEN they change


highs and lows are broad


highs and lows and how they correlate with being in office and running for office is a more SPECIFIC thing

more of a TREND, if it always happens to be higher in office and lower running for office

Dodo_David's photo
Thu 08/04/16 06:38 PM
Clinton's poll rating has dropped because people have learned about her misdeeds while in public office.

msharmony's photo
Thu 08/04/16 07:05 PM
the misdeeds that others have done in office without similar effect?


IgorFrankensteen's photo
Fri 08/05/16 04:25 AM


Not completely sure what you're going for here, but of course I'll put something in anyway. Hope it's related.

I see two main reasons for Clinton's shifting approval ratings.

One is Clinton herself, because she isn't a naturally good public speaker, and because she allows her sensitivities to attack show too much in her responses. She can come across as evasive, ironically because she is trying to be extra clear. And sometimes she answers what she thinks the real question is, rather than staying with what was immediately asked.

Her other problem is, that the Republican Party has spent millions of dollars, and countless hours, making up all manner of false stories about her and about her Husband, and have repeatedly them endlessly for the last eight years especially.

The Republican propagandists know that it is unfortunately true, that if a lie is repeated often enough, and with enough conviction, and the people repeating it are dressed in suits, that many people will believe it, just because it HAS been repeated.

They further are good at playing the game with a straight face, which goes that they fling mud (lie stories) at someone again and again, and then stand back from the mess they've made, and say "look at all that mud! Must be something to it, if there's THAT much mud!"

It's similar to the version where they blow a bunch of smoke at everyone (propaganda) and then start chanting "where there's smoke, there's fire!"

In short, I wouldn't say that it's that the general public are "fickle," I think it's that the vast majority of people just don't realize that it takes ACTUAL WORK to think logically and to analyze facts. So they don't. And instead they roll with whatever seems to be the "going thing" around them.


those "Stories" are a Matter of Public Record!


Exactly as I said. They were MADE a part of the "public record" by being repeated over and over by the fact twisters.

Is Clinton a saint? Nope. But is she guilty of everything, or even ANYTHING that YOU (or some other anti-Hillary person) wants to pretend she is? Also nope.

If you look carefully at the "public record," you will find thousands of allegations. Of all those allegations, almost none of them are supported by actual facts. If you (responsibly) eliminate all stories which are not supported by facts, then you end up with a few standard political blunders and the same kind of exaggerations that all politicians and sales people are prone to, none of which support a declaration of anything past that she is a bit of a self-centered egotist about certain things.

And it's pretty hard to find a successful politician who isn't.

Serchin4MyRedWine's photo
Fri 08/05/16 05:33 AM

the misdeeds that others have done in office without similar effect?



What others? No State Department employee has ever had a PRIVATE server at home to use for government business. No other State department employee ever refused over 100 requests for more security and then didn't lift a finger when an Ambassador and his entourage was under attack and then blame it on a false premise.
What other person hid files from the DOJ during Whitewater, Filegate, Travelgate?

So in comparison, Gen Petraeus did a fraction of what Hillary has done a suffered career ending consequences.

I'm not sure I even believe this "poll" on Hillary. Where are the inside numbers, who did they poll(just Democrats?registered voters? online? etc)and why did they do this poll? I don't remember any polls on Condi Rice or Colin Powel.
This all seems like the typical liberal spin game.

After all the Clinton scandals past and ongoing, how could she ever get a 60% approval rating...must be from Democrats only.

mightymoe's photo
Fri 08/05/16 06:26 AM

what is it with blacks, women, and just about every non white male that constantly wants to blame the white man for every little thing in life?

her approval ratings went down because she lied to many times, plain and simple... is it the white mans fault shes a liar?




what is it with people always looking for 'fault',,,noone said whose 'fault' anything was.......its about public opinion,, if we MUST make it about 'fault'


its the publics 'fault'

the article explains that even women tend to not feel they are worthy of promotions,,,,


its not about 'white man'

its not even if she is 'lying',, everyone in politics 'lies' according to that same public opinion


her ratings are high in office (lying politician and all) but drop when she runs for office


whoa


no photo
Fri 08/05/16 07:31 AM
Edited by RebelArcher on Fri 08/05/16 07:29 AM
Is Clinton a saint? Nope. But is she guilty of everything, or even ANYTHING that YOU (or some other anti-Hillary person) wants to pretend she is? Also nope.
James Comey begs to differ. And a clandestine airplane rendezvous between AGs and husbands begs to differ. And sniper fire in Bosnia begs to differ.
And on and on and on....keep licking her boots though.

No one else has come CLOSE to out right lying like Hillary has and been given a pass on it.

no photo
Fri 08/05/16 08:25 AM
And just for $hits n giggles...for all the 'fickle' folks out there.....

______________
“Director Comey said my answers were truthful, and what I ’ve said is consistent with what I have told the American people, that there were decisions discussed and made to classify retroactively certain of the emails .”
—Hillary Clinton , interview on “ Fox News Sunday , ” July 31 , 2016
Clinton made these remarks after “ Fox News Sunday ” host Chris Wallace played a video of her saying : “ I did not email any classified material to anyone on my email. There is no classified materials . I am confident that I never sent nor received any information that was classified at the time . I had not sent classified material nor received anything marked classified . ”
_______________


Now, from FBI director Comey testifying before Congress....

_______________
GOWDY : Secretary Clinton said there was nothing marked classified on her emails either sent or received . Was that true?
COMEY: That ’ s not true.
GOWDY : Secretary Clinton said , “ I did not email any classified material to anyone on my email. There is no classified material . ” Was that true?
COMEY: There was classified material emailed.

_______________
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2016/07/31/clintons-claim-that-the-fbi-director-said-her-email-answers-were-truthful/

But you'll hear *crickets* about this this from the 'hack Dem progressive boot licker Hillary cuck' crowd.

msharmony's photo
Fri 08/05/16 02:06 PM
there is no crickets,,, retroactive means AFTER an action occurred


the question was asked in the form : there was nothing marked classified

which is not true if things were marked classified AFTER ,, the definition of 'retroactively'


a more interesting question would have included the words 'at the time'

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