I might add, that no points were won in this thread for the side against ss marriage.

Oh? Just who is authorized to make such a judgement?

Like Dan Cathy and the Family Research Council

when did marriage become a 'right'?


if it is a 'right' why does it have ANY limitations on it?
such as familial relationship or marital status?


by definition, if it involves a CONTRACT it is not a 'right'

Interesting responses...I guess our views depend on what we've been taught to believe. (By our parents and family or our church or our community at large etc.)... My church never discussed homosexuals. There was no "gay-bashing." Everyone seemed to assume that a certain percentage of people were born with an attraction to members of their same-sex. So it wasn't viewed as an actual "choice" per se. (And other people didn't really "choose" to be attracted to the opposite sex.)...We are all born with natural inclinations. I wasn't taught to persecute or judge homosexuals. I was taught that some people are born with different preferences...I grew-up in a "melting pot" type of area and a middle class suburb in So CA back in the 50's and 60's. My parents taught me to be respectful of everyone..I begged my parents to let me work at our local library when I was only fifteen and a half. (I loved books and was an avid reader.)...Anyway there was an obviously gay young man who worked at our library. He had a supervisory position. ..Everyone loved and respected him. He didn't get any "flack" even though it was rare to run into gay people in our area. (Or "obviously gay people" anyway.)...The librarian was a very nice and caring man too but he had different ways. He'd probably be called a "nerd" today. (Or an "absent minded professor" or ??)...I was glad I worked at the library when he found "true love." He was in his 40's when he married his "match." (A highly intelligent woman.)...Anyway my parents taught me not to sit in judgement of other people. (To respect and celebrate "differences.") And this is what my church taught me too.

I do agree that homophobia is learned from the environment that people grow up in, much like racism and anti-semitism. However, some people who are able to think for themselves, rather than rely solely on what they're taught by parents/church/whoever are able to get away from spewing that hatred and actually learn for themselves that just because someone is different, it doesn't necessarily mean they're bad or wrong.

I do agree that homophobia is learned from the environment that people grow up in, much like racism and anti-semitism. However, some people who are able to think for themselves, rather than rely solely on what they're taught by parents/church/whoever are able to get away from spewing that hatred and actually learn for themselves that just because someone is different, it doesn't necessarily mean they're bad or wrong.

Either way, why are you trying to take the ability to marry away from gay people? I understand that you don't agree with it, but that's certainly not a reason to deny people the ability to marry. Not one person has been able to explain clearly how it affects their life in a way that is detrimental to them.

its not an 'ability' , its a contract

the contract is set aside for heterosexual unions, the potential within which can create LIFE for which those in the contract can be legally responsible for once produced, and for which the ACTION that creates life is both expected and encouraged by the contract in so far as it allows for an end to that contract if there is a SEXUAL breach,, such as adultery




IM all for a contract that takes no consideration of sexual relations, but affords the same 'rights' in the eyes of the law

Interesting responses...I guess our views depend on what we've been taught to believe. (By our parents and family or our church or our community at large etc.)... My church never discussed homosexuals. There was no "gay-bashing." Everyone seemed to assume that a certain percentage of people were born with an attraction to members of their same-sex. So it wasn't viewed as an actual "choice" per se. (And other people didn't really "choose" to be attracted to the opposite sex.)...We are all born with natural inclinations. I wasn't taught to persecute or judge homosexuals. I was taught that some people are born with different preferences...I grew-up in a "melting pot" type of area and a middle class suburb in So CA back in the 50's and 60's. My parents taught me to be respectful of everyone..I begged my parents to let me work at our local library when I was only fifteen and a half. (I loved books and was an avid reader.)...Anyway there was an obviously gay young man who worked at our library. He had a supervisory position. ..Everyone loved and respected him. He didn't get any "flack" even though it was rare to run into gay people in our area. (Or "obviously gay people" anyway.)...The librarian was a very nice and caring man too but he had different ways. He'd probably be called a "nerd" today. (Or an "absent minded professor" or ??)...I was glad I worked at the library when he found "true love." He was in his 40's when he married his "match." (A highly intelligent woman.)...Anyway my parents taught me not to sit in judgement of other people. (To respect and celebrate "differences.") And this is what my church taught me too.

Thank you for sharing this. It gives me hope in the goodness of people. And now that you mention it, I have known some 70 and 80 year old people who have a much broader and open perspective on things. (And some who are as entrenched in their beliefs as ever).

I do agree that homophobia is learned from the environment that people grow up in, much like racism and anti-semitism. However, some people who are able to think for themselves, rather than rely solely on what they're taught by parents/church/whoever are able to get away from spewing that hatred and actually learn for themselves that just because someone is different, it doesn't necessarily mean they're bad or wrong.

As we know, in certain states, gay couples are allowed to marry. I believe that it will slowly happen in other states as well.

Lately I've run into some younger people who seem pretty radical and "extremist" when it comes to their views...And it's obvious that they've considered me rather naive or even stupid because I didn't "take up arms" along with them and "sling mud" at the other "side!"

its not an 'ability' , its a contract

IM all for a contract that takes no consideration of sexual relations, but affords the same 'rights' in the eyes of the law

Many in the pro-same-gender-marriage crowd don't even realize how they are projecting hate onto people who aren't hating.

What a strange false dichotomy. Marriage involves a contract. There is a marriage contract. There is also the 'ability' to get married. The existence of a marriage contract in no way impacts the meaning of validity of the statement you are responding to. The existence of a marriage contract doesn't change the fact that some have the ability to get married, and some do not. Many people also have the worldview that ability to get married is also a right. The existence of a marriage contract in no way reduces the merit of this point of view.




So you just don't want that contract to carry the label 'marriage' ?

I agree, but just because you don't feel animus doesn't mean you aren't engaged in a hateful act. Consider white slave owners. Many didn't feel hatred towards black people any more than you might feel hatred towards your dog; many told themselves that they loved their slaves. And yet, they embraced and propagated social institutions that were 'hateful'.

Many fundamentalists who think that gay people should be 2nd class citizens are engaged in a hateful act. Gays and activists are right to call them out on it.