Topic: Syria: The future
smart2009's photo
Fri 08/10/12 09:19 AM


The rebellion has already killed 19,000 Syrians.


I see news articles all over claiming that X amount of Syrians have been killed or have been forced from their homes, but I see no proof of any of that and no credible sources. The world barely knows who is fighting whom over there and I don't see any credible source being sighted or anyone counting the dead.

I don't even see any pictures of thousands of people dead or migrating. Not that pictures are proof of anything.

I just don't believe blindly what the media is reporting. I suspect that 98% of it is spin and propaganda mixed with bald faced lies.

Syrian rebels on Thursday bombardeda military air base in Aleppo using a tank captured from government troops as activists reported the regime has launched new raids against opposition fighters near the capital Damascus, killing dozens.
http://www.newser.com/article/da0dard82/syrian-rebels-use-captured-regime-tank-in-aleppo-activists-report-regime-raids-near-damascus.html
“Some days we get around 30, 40 people, not includingthe bodies,” said a young medic in one clinic. “A few days ago we got 30 injured and maybe 20 corpses, but half of those bodies wereripped to pieces. We can’t figure out who they are.”
The opposition Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said 18 people were killed in the Aleppo area on Sunday out of more than 150 people, two thirds ofthem civilians, slain across Syria.
http://www.livemint.com/2012/07/30202156/Syrian-air-force-joins-battle.html
The guards pulled him from his cell before dawn on Monday, bound his hands, blindfolded him and drove him to an empty lot in the Syrian city of Aleppo.They sat him in a row with 10 other captives, he said, then cocked their guns and opened fire.
"They sprayed us," recalled 21-year-old Mahmoud, the lone survivor of the latestmass killing of Syria's civil war. "Thefirst bullet hit my chest, then one hit my foot, then my head. As soon as my head got hit, I thought, 'I'm dead.'"
Reports of such killings have surfaced frequently during the 17 months of deadly violence that activists seeking to topple President Bashar Assad say haskilled more than 19,000 people. But details are usually scarce - no more than activist reports or amateur videos ofbloodied bodies or mass graves posted on YouTube.
Mahmoud related hisgrisly ordeal to The Associated Press hours after it happened. Struggling to speak, he lay in a bed in a makeshift rebel-run field hospital set up in a wedding hall in this town 13 miles (20 kilometers) north of Aleppo. Bandages covered his foot, head and chest. Plastic vines and colored lights adorned the walls of the darkened building, and two red velvet chairs once used by brides and grooms sat on a small stage.
Mahmoud gave only his first name to protect his family who still live in the area.
While his story couldnot be independently confirmed, Mahmoud's wounds matched his story and residents who found him and his dead colleagues corroborated certaindetails.
Together, they painted a picture of the summary slayingof 10 men, at least some of whom had only loose links to the armed rebels seeking to topple the regime. That story jibes with activist claims of the increasingly brutal tactics regime forces are using to try to crush the rebellion that has spread to Aleppo, Syria's largest city.
Syria's uprising started in March 2011 with peaceful protests calling for political reforms thatwere met with a fierce regime crackdown. Government brutality grew as dissent spread, and many in the opposition took up arms as the conflict morphed into a civil war.
Aleppo has been a stronghold of government supportthroughout the uprising, with a wealthy business class and many minority communities who fear they'll suffer if Assad falls. Until recently, the city of some 4 million people had been spared the violence that has ravaged other Syrian cities.
But during the last two weeks, rebels have been pushing into Aleppo's neighborhoods, clashing with security forces and torching police stations in a push to"liberate" the city. Syrian media has vowed the army is gearing up for a"decisive battle," while anti-regime activists have reported swelling numbers of troops and tanks on the city's edges.
The Syrian government blames the uprising on armed gangs and terrorists backed by foreign powers that seek to weaken Syria.
It was amid these tensions that Mahmoud, a Palestinian resident of Aleppo, had his fateful brush with Syrian security. On Thursday, Mahmoud said, he and a friend went to collect their paychecks from the thread factory wherethey work and heardclashes nearby. Sooneight men in civilian clothes stopped them and asked for their IDs and cell phones.
On Mahmoud's phone they found videos of anti-government demonstrations and messages he sent to rebels from the Free Syrian Army, asking God to protect them and make them victorious. The men threw Mahmoud andhis friend in the trunk of a car and drove them to a trash dump, where they were blindfolded, bound and beaten with sticks and large rocks before being taken to a security office.
Mahmoud was locked in a crowded cell with about a dozen other men, hesaid. Each day, some were taken out and new ones brought in.
"We were there for four days and they only gave us water to drink once. They never fed us," he said. "They never asked us anything. Every day it was beating, beating, beating."
Before dawn on Monday, guards pulled Mahmoud and10 others from their cells and told they were going to see a judge. They were bound at the wrists, blindfolded and driven to Aleppo's Khaldiyeh neighborhood, where they were lined up on a patch of rocky soil.
"They sat us all down next to each other, 'You here, youhere, you here,'" Mahmoud said."Then each one cocked his weapon and the shooting started."
Mahmoud was shot three times. Bullets pierced his chest andfoot and one grazed his skull. Minutes later, silence returned, and he realized he was still alive.
"I breathed, I said the shehada," he said, referring to theMuslim declaration of faith meant to puthim right with God."I tried to get up then started screaming because blood was coming out of me."
He scraped his face on a rock to remove the blindfold and crawled to where some nearby residents found him.
Among them was a 22-year-old electrician who said he heard the gunfireearly Monday and worried that people were being killed because he had discovered six bodies in the same spot a day earlier. Heshowed videos of the victims on his cell phone, their bodies piled atop each other covered in blood, some bearing large bruisesthat appeared to be from beatings. He said all had been shot dead.
He and others asked not to have their names published because they have topass through government checkpoints to get home.
The killings shocked residents of Khaldiyeh, a working-class neighborhood on Aleppo's northwest side that has seen little violence until now. While many residents support the rebels, they havenot established a foothold in the area, and the relative quiet has drawn thousands of people fleeing violence in other Aleppo neighborhoods or nearby villages.
As Mahmoud spoke, a white pickup pulled up outside the field hospital with the bodies of nine of the men killed Monday. The body of the tenth victim had been taken away by his family. All still had their hands bound and two still wore blindfolds. Two had bullet wounds to their heads, and others had blood on their faces and chests or coming outof their ears. None wore shoes.
Those killings convinced one Khaldiyeh resident who helped collect the bodies that the neighborhood needsarms.
"We want the Free Army to come to our neighborhood to protect us," he said."If they can't come, then they need to give us weapons so we can defend ourselves."
The field hospital's doctor, Mohammed Ajaj, said he is no longer shocked when the dead and wounded pass through town on their way to burial innearby villages or fortreatment across thenorthern border in Turkey.
"We've gotten used to it," he said.
An 18-year-old activist who helped collect the bodies said none of them had IDs.
"We really know nothing about them," he said, adding that he would stop in neighboring villages to see if anyone recognized them before delivering them to a morgue further north.
"If nobody claims them, we'll take their photos and putthem on our Facebook page so their families can find out that they're dead," he said.

A rising tide of civilians fleeing Syria’s violence is hitting four neighboring countries where almost 150,000 are being helped in camps run by the U.N. refugee agency and its partners, officials said Friday.
That figure counts only Syrians who have registered or are in the process of registering as refugees. Officials acknowledge the real number of Syrian refugees is likely above 200,000 since tens of thousands are believed to have not yet registered with authorities.
In late June, U.N. agencies estimated they would need$193 million to help 185,000 refugees from Syria by the end of 2012.
Spokesman Adrian Edwards told reporters Friday in Geneva that the U.N. refugee agency’s offices in Lebanon, Turkey, Jordan and Iraq have all reported big increases this week in the number of registrants.
As of Thursday night,the agency had taken note of 146,667 such people — 50,227 in Turkey, 45,869 in Jordan, 36,841 in Lebanon and 13,730 in Iraq.
“In several countries,we know there to be(additional) substantial refugee numbers, but these people have not yet registered,” Edwardssaid.
There were more than 6,000 new arrivals in Turkey this week alone, many from the besieged Syrian city of Aleppo and surrounding villages,while others came from Idlib and Latakia. “Where fighting happens, we tend to see the consequences,” he added.
Turkey has nine sites, including a new camp this week at Akcakale, for its fast-growing refugee population, of which 72 percent is women and children. It has notified U.N. and other aid officials that it intends to double its capacity by building enough camps to hold 100,000 refugees.
Jordan, meanwhile, is straining to build more camps to accommodate refugees from Syria’ssouth, where the uprising against President Bashar Assad’s government began in March 2011. An estimated 4,000 Syrians arrivedin Jordan on one recent night alone.
The International Organization for Migration said in a report Friday that more than 1,100 third-country nationals have sought its help to return home from Damascus and that 25 embassies — including those of Indonesia, Sudan and Yemen — have asked it to arrange travel out of Syria for another 3,011 people.
Copyright 2012 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

no photo
Fri 08/10/12 09:48 AM


The rebellion has already killed 19,000 Syrians.


I see news articles all over claiming that X amount of Syrians have been killed or have been forced from their homes, but I see no proof of any of that and no credible sources. The world barely knows who is fighting whom over there and I don't see any credible source being sighted or anyone counting the dead.

I don't even see any pictures of thousands of people dead or migrating. Not that pictures are proof of anything.

I just don't believe blindly what the media is reporting. I suspect that 98% of it is spin and propaganda mixed with bald faced lies.
so,what are you basing your Facts on?



I get my information with identified sources. You may not like or believe them, but they have names.

Stating that 19,000 Syrians were killed .... does not explain the source of that information.

My questions are: Where do these numbers come from? Exactly. Where were these people buried? How were they killed? Where can a person verify the information, get the names of these people etc.





smart2009's photo
Fri 08/10/12 09:48 AM



The rebellion has already killed 19,000 Syrians.


I see news articles all over claiming that X amount of Syrians have been killed or have been forced from their homes, but I see no proof of any of that and no credible sources. The world barely knows who is fighting whom over there and I don't see any credible source being sighted or anyone counting the dead.

I don't even see any pictures of thousands of people dead or migrating. Not that pictures are proof of anything.

I just don't believe blindly what the media is reporting. I suspect that 98% of it is spin and propaganda mixed with bald faced lies.

Syrian rebels on Thursday bombardeda military air base in Aleppo using a tank captured from government troops as activists reported the regime has launched new raids against opposition fighters near the capital Damascus, killing dozens.
http://www.newser.com/article/da0dard82/syrian-rebels-use-captured-regime-tank-in-aleppo-activists-report-regime-raids-near-damascus.html
“Some days we get around 30, 40 people, not includingthe bodies,” said a young medic in one clinic. “A few days ago we got 30 injured and maybe 20 corpses, but half of those bodies wereripped to pieces. We can’t figure out who they are.”
The opposition Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said 18 people were killed in the Aleppo area on Sunday out of more than 150 people, two thirds ofthem civilians, slain across Syria.
http://www.livemint.com/2012/07/30202156/Syrian-air-force-joins-battle.html
The guards pulled him from his cell before dawn on Monday, bound his hands, blindfolded him and drove him to an empty lot in the Syrian city of Aleppo.They sat him in a row with 10 other captives, he said, then cocked their guns and opened fire.
"They sprayed us," recalled 21-year-old Mahmoud, the lone survivor of the latestmass killing of Syria's civil war. "Thefirst bullet hit my chest, then one hit my foot, then my head. As soon as my head got hit, I thought, 'I'm dead.'"
Reports of such killings have surfaced frequently during the 17 months of deadly violence that activists seeking to topple President Bashar Assad say haskilled more than 19,000 people. But details are usually scarce - no more than activist reports or amateur videos ofbloodied bodies or mass graves posted on YouTube.
Mahmoud related hisgrisly ordeal to The Associated Press hours after it happened. Struggling to speak, he lay in a bed in a makeshift rebel-run field hospital set up in a wedding hall in this town 13 miles (20 kilometers) north of Aleppo. Bandages covered his foot, head and chest. Plastic vines and colored lights adorned the walls of the darkened building, and two red velvet chairs once used by brides and grooms sat on a small stage.
Mahmoud gave only his first name to protect his family who still live in the area.
While his story couldnot be independently confirmed, Mahmoud's wounds matched his story and residents who found him and his dead colleagues corroborated certaindetails.
Together, they painted a picture of the summary slayingof 10 men, at least some of whom had only loose links to the armed rebels seeking to topple the regime. That story jibes with activist claims of the increasingly brutal tactics regime forces are using to try to crush the rebellion that has spread to Aleppo, Syria's largest city.
Syria's uprising started in March 2011 with peaceful protests calling for political reforms thatwere met with a fierce regime crackdown. Government brutality grew as dissent spread, and many in the opposition took up arms as the conflict morphed into a civil war.
Aleppo has been a stronghold of government supportthroughout the uprising, with a wealthy business class and many minority communities who fear they'll suffer if Assad falls. Until recently, the city of some 4 million people had been spared the violence that has ravaged other Syrian cities.
But during the last two weeks, rebels have been pushing into Aleppo's neighborhoods, clashing with security forces and torching police stations in a push to"liberate" the city. Syrian media has vowed the army is gearing up for a"decisive battle," while anti-regime activists have reported swelling numbers of troops and tanks on the city's edges.
The Syrian government blames the uprising on armed gangs and terrorists backed by foreign powers that seek to weaken Syria.
It was amid these tensions that Mahmoud, a Palestinian resident of Aleppo, had his fateful brush with Syrian security. On Thursday, Mahmoud said, he and a friend went to collect their paychecks from the thread factory wherethey work and heardclashes nearby. Sooneight men in civilian clothes stopped them and asked for their IDs and cell phones.
On Mahmoud's phone they found videos of anti-government demonstrations and messages he sent to rebels from the Free Syrian Army, asking God to protect them and make them victorious. The men threw Mahmoud andhis friend in the trunk of a car and drove them to a trash dump, where they were blindfolded, bound and beaten with sticks and large rocks before being taken to a security office.
Mahmoud was locked in a crowded cell with about a dozen other men, hesaid. Each day, some were taken out and new ones brought in.
"We were there for four days and they only gave us water to drink once. They never fed us," he said. "They never asked us anything. Every day it was beating, beating, beating."
Before dawn on Monday, guards pulled Mahmoud and10 others from their cells and told they were going to see a judge. They were bound at the wrists, blindfolded and driven to Aleppo's Khaldiyeh neighborhood, where they were lined up on a patch of rocky soil.
"They sat us all down next to each other, 'You here, youhere, you here,'" Mahmoud said."Then each one cocked his weapon and the shooting started."
Mahmoud was shot three times. Bullets pierced his chest andfoot and one grazed his skull. Minutes later, silence returned, and he realized he was still alive.
"I breathed, I said the shehada," he said, referring to theMuslim declaration of faith meant to puthim right with God."I tried to get up then started screaming because blood was coming out of me."
He scraped his face on a rock to remove the blindfold and crawled to where some nearby residents found him.
Among them was a 22-year-old electrician who said he heard the gunfireearly Monday and worried that people were being killed because he had discovered six bodies in the same spot a day earlier. Heshowed videos of the victims on his cell phone, their bodies piled atop each other covered in blood, some bearing large bruisesthat appeared to be from beatings. He said all had been shot dead.
He and others asked not to have their names published because they have topass through government checkpoints to get home.
The killings shocked residents of Khaldiyeh, a working-class neighborhood on Aleppo's northwest side that has seen little violence until now. While many residents support the rebels, they havenot established a foothold in the area, and the relative quiet has drawn thousands of people fleeing violence in other Aleppo neighborhoods or nearby villages.
As Mahmoud spoke, a white pickup pulled up outside the field hospital with the bodies of nine of the men killed Monday. The body of the tenth victim had been taken away by his family. All still had their hands bound and two still wore blindfolds. Two had bullet wounds to their heads, and others had blood on their faces and chests or coming outof their ears. None wore shoes.
Those killings convinced one Khaldiyeh resident who helped collect the bodies that the neighborhood needsarms.
"We want the Free Army to come to our neighborhood to protect us," he said."If they can't come, then they need to give us weapons so we can defend ourselves."
The field hospital's doctor, Mohammed Ajaj, said he is no longer shocked when the dead and wounded pass through town on their way to burial innearby villages or fortreatment across thenorthern border in Turkey.
"We've gotten used to it," he said.
An 18-year-old activist who helped collect the bodies said none of them had IDs.
"We really know nothing about them," he said, adding that he would stop in neighboring villages to see if anyone recognized them before delivering them to a morgue further north.
"If nobody claims them, we'll take their photos and putthem on our Facebook page so their families can find out that they're dead," he said.

A rising tide of civilians fleeing Syria’s violence is hitting four neighboring countries where almost 150,000 are being helped in camps run by the U.N. refugee agency and its partners, officials said Friday.
That figure counts only Syrians who have registered or are in the process of registering as refugees. Officials acknowledge the real number of Syrian refugees is likely above 200,000 since tens of thousands are believed to have not yet registered with authorities.
In late June, U.N. agencies estimated they would need$193 million to help 185,000 refugees from Syria by the end of 2012.
Spokesman Adrian Edwards told reporters Friday in Geneva that the U.N. refugee agency’s offices in Lebanon, Turkey, Jordan and Iraq have all reported big increases this week in the number of registrants.
As of Thursday night,the agency had taken note of 146,667 such people — 50,227 in Turkey, 45,869 in Jordan, 36,841 in Lebanon and 13,730 in Iraq.
“In several countries,we know there to be(additional) substantial refugee numbers, but these people have not yet registered,” Edwardssaid.
There were more than 6,000 new arrivals in Turkey this week alone, many from the besieged Syrian city of Aleppo and surrounding villages,while others came from Idlib and Latakia. “Where fighting happens, we tend to see the consequences,” he added.
Turkey has nine sites, including a new camp this week at Akcakale, for its fast-growing refugee population, of which 72 percent is women and children. It has notified U.N. and other aid officials that it intends to double its capacity by building enough camps to hold 100,000 refugees.
Jordan, meanwhile, is straining to build more camps to accommodate refugees from Syria’ssouth, where the uprising against President Bashar Assad’s government began in March 2011. An estimated 4,000 Syrians arrivedin Jordan on one recent night alone.
The International Organization for Migration said in a report Friday that more than 1,100 third-country nationals have sought its help to return home from Damascus and that 25 embassies — including those of Indonesia, Sudan and Yemen — have asked it to arrange travel out of Syria for another 3,011 people.
Copyright 2012 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

World Report 2012 : Syria | Human Rights Watch
World Report 2012: Syria
Events of 2011
Downloadable Resources:
World Report Chapter: Syria 2012 (PDF)
http://www.hrw.org/world-report-2012/world-report-2012-syria
Syria | Amnesty International
http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/syria
All content on Syria | Doctors Without Borders
http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/news/allcontent.cfm?id=219

no photo
Fri 08/10/12 10:06 AM


The rebellion has already killed 19,000 Syrians.


I see news articles all over claiming that X amount of Syrians have been killed or have been forced from their homes, but I see no proof of any of that and no credible sources. The world barely knows who is fighting whom over there and I don't see any credible source being sighted or anyone counting the dead.

I don't even see any pictures of thousands of people dead or migrating. Not that pictures are proof of anything.

I just don't believe blindly what the media is reporting. I suspect that 98% of it is spin and propaganda mixed with bald faced lies.

Syrian rebels on Thursday bombardeda military air base in Aleppo using a tank captured from government troops as activists reported the regime has launched new raids against opposition fighters near the capital Damascus, killing dozens.
http://www.newser.com/article/da0dard82/syrian-rebels-use-captured-regime-tank-in-aleppo-activists-report-regime-raids-near-damascus.html
“Some days we get around 30, 40 people, not includingthe bodies,” said a young medic in one clinic. “A few days ago we got 30 injured and maybe 20 corpses, but half of those bodies wereripped to pieces. We can’t figure out who they are.”
The opposition Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said 18 people were killed in the Aleppo area on Sunday out of more than 150 people, two thirds ofthem civilians, slain across Syria.
http://www.livemint.com/2012/07/30202156/Syrian-air-force-joins-battle.html
The guards pulled him from his cell before dawn on Monday, bound his hands, blindfolded him and drove him to an empty lot in the Syrian city of Aleppo.They sat him in a row with 10 other captives, he said, then cocked their guns and opened fire.
"They sprayed us," recalled 21-year-old Mahmoud, the lone survivor of the latestmass killing of Syria's civil war. "Thefirst bullet hit my chest, then one hit my foot, then my head. As soon as my head got hit, I thought, 'I'm dead.'"
Reports of such killings have surfaced frequently during the 17 months of deadly violence that activists seeking to topple President Bashar Assad say haskilled more than 19,000 people. But details are usually scarce - no more than activist reports or amateur videos ofbloodied bodies or mass graves posted on YouTube.
Mahmoud related hisgrisly ordeal to The Associated Press hours after it happened. Struggling to speak, he lay in a bed in a makeshift rebel-run field hospital set up in a wedding hall in this town 13 miles (20 kilometers) north of Aleppo. Bandages covered his foot, head and chest. Plastic vines and colored lights adorned the walls of the darkened building, and two red velvet chairs once used by brides and grooms sat on a small stage.
Mahmoud gave only his first name to protect his family who still live in the area.
While his story couldnot be independently confirmed, Mahmoud's wounds matched his story and residents who found him and his dead colleagues corroborated certaindetails.
Together, they painted a picture of the summary slayingof 10 men, at least some of whom had only loose links to the armed rebels seeking to topple the regime. That story jibes with activist claims of the increasingly brutal tactics regime forces are using to try to crush the rebellion that has spread to Aleppo, Syria's largest city.
Syria's uprising started in March 2011 with peaceful protests calling for political reforms thatwere met with a fierce regime crackdown. Government brutality grew as dissent spread, and many in the opposition took up arms as the conflict morphed into a civil war.
Aleppo has been a stronghold of government supportthroughout the uprising, with a wealthy business class and many minority communities who fear they'll suffer if Assad falls. Until recently, the city of some 4 million people had been spared the violence that has ravaged other Syrian cities.
But during the last two weeks, rebels have been pushing into Aleppo's neighborhoods, clashing with security forces and torching police stations in a push to"liberate" the city. Syrian media has vowed the army is gearing up for a"decisive battle," while anti-regime activists have reported swelling numbers of troops and tanks on the city's edges.
The Syrian government blames the uprising on armed gangs and terrorists backed by foreign powers that seek to weaken Syria.
It was amid these tensions that Mahmoud, a Palestinian resident of Aleppo, had his fateful brush with Syrian security. On Thursday, Mahmoud said, he and a friend went to collect their paychecks from the thread factory wherethey work and heardclashes nearby. Sooneight men in civilian clothes stopped them and asked for their IDs and cell phones.
On Mahmoud's phone they found videos of anti-government demonstrations and messages he sent to rebels from the Free Syrian Army, asking God to protect them and make them victorious. The men threw Mahmoud andhis friend in the trunk of a car and drove them to a trash dump, where they were blindfolded, bound and beaten with sticks and large rocks before being taken to a security office.
Mahmoud was locked in a crowded cell with about a dozen other men, hesaid. Each day, some were taken out and new ones brought in.
"We were there for four days and they only gave us water to drink once. They never fed us," he said. "They never asked us anything. Every day it was beating, beating, beating."
Before dawn on Monday, guards pulled Mahmoud and10 others from their cells and told they were going to see a judge. They were bound at the wrists, blindfolded and driven to Aleppo's Khaldiyeh neighborhood, where they were lined up on a patch of rocky soil.
"They sat us all down next to each other, 'You here, youhere, you here,'" Mahmoud said."Then each one cocked his weapon and the shooting started."
Mahmoud was shot three times. Bullets pierced his chest andfoot and one grazed his skull. Minutes later, silence returned, and he realized he was still alive.
"I breathed, I said the shehada," he said, referring to theMuslim declaration of faith meant to puthim right with God."I tried to get up then started screaming because blood was coming out of me."
He scraped his face on a rock to remove the blindfold and crawled to where some nearby residents found him.
Among them was a 22-year-old electrician who said he heard the gunfireearly Monday and worried that people were being killed because he had discovered six bodies in the same spot a day earlier. Heshowed videos of the victims on his cell phone, their bodies piled atop each other covered in blood, some bearing large bruisesthat appeared to be from beatings. He said all had been shot dead.
He and others asked not to have their names published because they have topass through government checkpoints to get home.
The killings shocked residents of Khaldiyeh, a working-class neighborhood on Aleppo's northwest side that has seen little violence until now. While many residents support the rebels, they havenot established a foothold in the area, and the relative quiet has drawn thousands of people fleeing violence in other Aleppo neighborhoods or nearby villages.
As Mahmoud spoke, a white pickup pulled up outside the field hospital with the bodies of nine of the men killed Monday. The body of the tenth victim had been taken away by his family. All still had their hands bound and two still wore blindfolds. Two had bullet wounds to their heads, and others had blood on their faces and chests or coming outof their ears. None wore shoes.
Those killings convinced one Khaldiyeh resident who helped collect the bodies that the neighborhood needsarms.
"We want the Free Army to come to our neighborhood to protect us," he said."If they can't come, then they need to give us weapons so we can defend ourselves."
The field hospital's doctor, Mohammed Ajaj, said he is no longer shocked when the dead and wounded pass through town on their way to burial innearby villages or fortreatment across thenorthern border in Turkey.
"We've gotten used to it," he said.
An 18-year-old activist who helped collect the bodies said none of them had IDs.
"We really know nothing about them," he said, adding that he would stop in neighboring villages to see if anyone recognized them before delivering them to a morgue further north.
"If nobody claims them, we'll take their photos and putthem on our Facebook page so their families can find out that they're dead," he said.




There is no proof or even evidence that the Syrian government did any of these killings. This could just as easily been terrorists sent in from the outside.

Also the number of 19,000 people dead is apparently a rumor and unsubstantiated. The named source is "activists seeking to topple President Bashar" and we all know who is seeking to topple President Bashar Assad.

So if that is the "source of information" then I have to discount it as not the least bit credible. It is more like a source of "disinformation."

It seems these days Journalists just make up stuff. They are ten times worse than any alleged "conspiracy theorist" because they refuse to name their sources. (They have no sources.... they make stuff up.)


Reports of such killings have surfaced frequently during the 17 months of deadly violence that activists seeking to topple President Bashar Assad say has. killed more than 19,000 people. But details are usually scarce - no more than activist reports or amateur videos of bloodied bodies or mass graves posted on YouTube.



And yet journalists print unsubstantiated rumors as if they were facts.... and they don't have any credible sources.








no photo
Fri 08/10/12 10:08 AM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 08/10/12 10:33 AM
World Report 2012 : Syria | Human Rights Watch
World Report 2012: Syria
Events of 2011
Downloadable Resources:
World Report Chapter: Syria 2012 (PDF)
http://www.hrw.org/world-report-2012/world-report-2012-syria
Syria | Amnesty International
http://www.amnesty.org/en/region/syria
All content on Syria | Doctors Without Borders
http://www.doctorswithoutborders.org/news/allcontent.cfm?id=219




This must be your list of the people who are spreading useless disinformation without any real variable sources. These so-called "journalists" are no better than tabloid and gossip publishers.



no photo
Fri 08/10/12 10:19 AM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 08/10/12 10:32 AM
In looking for a credible source for the report of 19,000 people killed in Syria I find these (unknown and unamed) sources:

1.
--- a young (unnamed) medic in one clinic. (an unamed clinic.)


2.
The opposition Syrian Observatory for Human Rights -- said 18 people were killed in the Aleppo area on Sunday out of more than 150 people, two thirds of them civilians, slain across Syria.

Note: (no names mentioned above. Who is "The opposition Syrian Observatory for Human Rights?)

3.
"recalled 21-year-old Mahmoud, the lone survivor of the latest mass killing of Syria's civil war.

(And of course the lone survivor with no last name given because he fears for his family.)

4.
Reports of such killings have surfaced frequently during the 17 months of deadly violence that activists seeking to topple President Bashar Assad say has killed more than 19,000 people. But details are usually scarce - no more than activist reports or amateur videos of bloodied bodies or mass graves posted on YouTube.

Therefore, the above is just a rumor. Not saying it is a lie, but it is certainly not to be considered to be a fact or credible information.


--->While his story could not be independently confirmed, Mahmoud's wounds matched his story and residents who found him and his dead colleagues corroborated certaind etails.<-----

The last paragraph (above) is giving you the job of deciding whether these reports are true or not.




no photo
Fri 08/10/12 10:28 AM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 08/10/12 10:29 AM
And now if you want some real names to research or google of "activists seeking to topple President Bashar Assad then here they are:


Leading this revolutions regime changing team are Zionists US Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs Jeffery Feltman and US Ambassador to Israel Dan Shapiro, former Lebanese Prime Minister Sa’ad Hariri, influential, US-based Zionist Syrian exiles Farid al-Ghadry and Ammar Abdulhamid, the well-connected ex-Syrian VP, Abdel-Halim Khaddam and of course, the powerful Syrian Muslim Brotherhood.


Investigating the Reform Party of Syria I now discover that Farid N. Ghadry (Frank Ghadry in the U.S.) is a Israel loving Zionist..



smart2009's photo
Fri 08/10/12 11:00 AM

And now if you want some real names to research or google of "activists seeking to topple President Bashar Assad then here they are:


Leading this revolutions regime changing team are Zionists US Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs Jeffery Feltman and US Ambassador to Israel Dan Shapiro, former Lebanese Prime Minister Sa’ad Hariri, influential, US-based Zionist Syrian exiles Farid al-Ghadry and Ammar Abdulhamid, the well-connected ex-Syrian VP, Abdel-Halim Khaddam and of course, the powerful Syrian Muslim Brotherhood.


Investigating the Reform Party of Syria I now discover that Farid N. Ghadry (Frank Ghadry in the U.S.) is a Israel loving Zionist..




Conspiracy theory logical fallacies?

no photo
Fri 08/10/12 11:07 AM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 08/10/12 11:09 AM


And now if you want some real names to research or google of "activists seeking to topple President Bashar Assad then here they are:


Leading this revolutions regime changing team are Zionists US Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs Jeffery Feltman and US Ambassador to Israel Dan Shapiro, former Lebanese Prime Minister Sa’ad Hariri, influential, US-based Zionist Syrian exiles Farid al-Ghadry and Ammar Abdulhamid, the well-connected ex-Syrian VP, Abdel-Halim Khaddam and of course, the powerful Syrian Muslim Brotherhood.


Investigating the Reform Party of Syria I now discover that Farid N. Ghadry (Frank Ghadry in the U.S.) is a Israel loving Zionist..




Conspiracy theory logical fallacies?



No, not at all. The news you report are unsubstantiated RUMORS with un-variable sources.

I have given you NAMES YOU CAN investigate.

These are real people, with real agendas. Is there a conspiracy? Probably. Go ask them.

Yes, I'm quite sure they are conspiring to oust Assad from Syria.




no photo
Fri 08/10/12 11:14 AM
Also, I don't know why you would respond to this valid and direct information (actual names of real people involved) - with a response like:

"Conspiracy theory logical fallacies?"

(That is almost as bad as using the buzz word "anti-Semitic." laugh )

For once, why doesn't someone actually do some research on these people and their agenda concerning Israel and Syria? If you really want answers that is what you would do.... But you may not like what you find.

Instead of cutting and pasting unsubstantiated rumors from flaky journalists... investigate the actual people involved.


smart2009's photo
Fri 08/10/12 11:28 AM

Also, I don't know why you would respond to this valid and direct information (actual names of real people involved) - with a response like:

"Conspiracy theory logical fallacies?"

(That is almost as bad as using the buzz word "anti-Semitic." laugh )

For once, why doesn't someone actually do some research on these people and their agenda concerning Israel and Syria? If you really want answers that is what you would do.... But you may not like what you find.

Instead of cutting and pasting unsubstantiated rumors from flaky journalists... investigate the actual people involved.



One big reason for this is that some conspiracy theorists are clever. They use psychology to make their theories sound more plausible. They appeal to certain psychological phenomena which make people to tend to believe them. However, these psychological tricks are nothing more than logical fallacies. They are simply so well disguised that many people can't see them for what they are.
"Argument from authority". "Shotgun argumentation".

no photo
Fri 08/10/12 11:44 AM


Also, I don't know why you would respond to this valid and direct information (actual names of real people involved) - with a response like:

"Conspiracy theory logical fallacies?"

(That is almost as bad as using the buzz word "anti-Semitic." laugh )

For once, why doesn't someone actually do some research on these people and their agenda concerning Israel and Syria? If you really want answers that is what you would do.... But you may not like what you find.

Instead of cutting and pasting unsubstantiated rumors from flaky journalists... investigate the actual people involved.



One big reason for this is that some conspiracy theorists are clever. They use psychology to make their theories sound more plausible. They appeal to certain psychological phenomena which make people to tend to believe them. However, these psychological tricks are nothing more than logical fallacies. They are simply so well disguised that many people can't see them for what they are.
"Argument from authority". "Shotgun argumentation".




I don't know what "conspiracy theorists" you are even referring to. I simply gave you some names of actual real people who are pro Israel and who I believe are involved with the attempt to displace the Syrian government.

From that information, if you are truly interested in debunking or verifying that claim or suspician, you could do some research on the backgrounds of each of these people.

1. I think it has been well established that THERE IS A CONSPIRACY to overthrow the Syrian government.

The next task is to speculate who might be behind that effort and follow any leads (names) that pop up. An Investigator investigates. He or she does not just sit around waiting for the evidence to jump into his lap.

Instead, you seem to want to argue with me about my own opinion or "conspiracy theory." I have my own ideas and I follow actual names and leads to gather and form my opinions. If a news article does NOT have any real or verifiable or credible sources then the news article is not credible... just because it is a news article does not make it true or credible.




no photo
Fri 08/10/12 11:47 AM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 08/10/12 11:51 AM
The media and the "news" as I remember it, used to always name their sources. Anymore they don't. They simply say "sources say..." blah blah blah. What sources? Why should anyone believe a damn thing they are saying if they don't actually have any verifiable sources? They expect the idiotic public to just take their word for it and believe the rumors and propaganda and innuendo they are spreading.

At least I try to track down the source of the information.


no photo
Fri 08/10/12 11:57 AM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 08/10/12 12:01 PM
If there were some official somewhat trustworthy investigative agency taking count of the casualties of the Syrian conflicts and burying and counting the dead, then perhaps a news reporter could justify releasing a report and a number. But to say that 19,000 people have been killed based on the flaky source called (unknown) "activists" is irresponsible journalism if not outright lies and propaganda reported to satisfy the wishes of the corporate machine who so desperately wants people to think there is a full scale civil war going on, and who so desperately wants all attention to be on the Syrian conflict for some reason.

The "activists" was probably just one guy who made the number up.

Its absurd.


Optomistic69's photo
Fri 08/10/12 02:23 PM
Edited by Optomistic69 on Fri 08/10/12 02:23 PM

And now if you want some real names to research or google of "activists seeking to topple President Bashar Assad then here they are:


Leading this revolutions regime changing team are Zionists US Assistant Secretary of State for Near Eastern Affairs Jeffery Feltman and US Ambassador to Israel Dan Shapiro, former Lebanese Prime Minister Sa’ad Hariri, influential, US-based Zionist Syrian exiles Farid al-Ghadry and Ammar Abdulhamid, the well-connected ex-Syrian VP, Abdel-Halim Khaddam and of course, the powerful Syrian Muslim Brotherhood.


Investigating the Reform Party of Syria I now discover that Farid N. Ghadry (Frank Ghadry in the U.S.) is a Israel loving Zionist..






Just checking out this Jeffery Feltman....interesting to say the least.

The terrorist gangs, which are subordinated to the Zionist U.S. Secretary of State Jeffrey D. Feltman, and which terrorize the Syrian population in fancy names like “Free Syrian Army” (FSA), “Al Qaeda”, or “Farouk Brigade” by bombings and death squads, have in the ongoing democratic process in Syria, despite the massive support of Zionist propaganda and Wahhabi networks, no chance to come to power in Syria, because they are all rejected by the overwhelming majority of the Syrian population.


no photo
Fri 08/10/12 04:32 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 08/10/12 04:33 PM
Okay then we could start with him. On a google search I used key words: "Jeffrey Feltman on Syria" (without the quotation marks)

The link that looked interesting was second from the top.
http://www.syrianews.cc/syria-terror-operation-massacre-jeffrey-feltman/

Syria, Lebanon and Iran: Jeffrey Feltman, the modern and more horrible Lawrence of Arabia.

Second paragraph:

With the adoption of the UN resolutions on Syria, the Zionist-Wahhabi U.S. plan has failed. The plan included to force a “regime change” in Libya and Syria, implemented through propaganda, terror, sanctions, and an ultimately genocidal-bombing of the resistance. These steps should prepare the long-planned military regime change in Iran.


Down further:

The U.S. reign of terror thinks that it would be useful to further destabilize Syria, at least, until next year (by terrorism), in order to also weaken Iran, at least, temporarily. And by the weakening of Syria, they have also a better chance to reach a “regime change” in Lebanon – at the latest in the Lebanese parliamentary elections in 2013, but a “regime change” in Lebanon is still also possible before this date.


Okay lets now see if we can find anything positive about Jeffery Feltman that absolves him from this charge of being behind the terrorism in Syria.


I will look......

no photo
Fri 08/10/12 04:37 PM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Fri 08/10/12 04:39 PM
Well here on Youtube, you can hear Jeffery Feltman himself talk.

Titled: Assad is Doomed ! U.S. State Department Jeffrey Feltman - Syria Update 11-9-11

So this agenda has be at least going on since November 9th, 2011.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77XrsmDqUZw

"We urge our Arab partners to condem the regime." (Assad's regime.)

Therefore, YES... it is confirmed... Jeffery Feltman has an agenda. So is he working with anyone else? If so whom?


no photo
Fri 08/10/12 05:04 PM
As for the cooperation with the Muslim Brotherhood:


Brotherhood leaders say they have been reaching out to Syria’s neighbors, including Jordan, Iraq and Lebanon — as well as to U.S. and European diplomats — to reassure them that they have no intention of dominating a future Syrian political system or establishing any form of Islamist government.

“These concerns are not legitimate when it comes to Syria, for many reasons,” said Molham al-Drobi, who is a member of the Brotherhood’s leadership and sits on the Syrian National Council’s foreign affairs committee.

REF: Washington Post.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/syrias-muslim-brotherhood-is-gaining-influence-over-anti-assad-revolt/2012/05/12/gIQAtIoJLU_story.html

“These concerns are not legitimate when it comes to Syria, for many reasons,” said Molham al-Drobi, who is a member of the Brotherhood’s leadership and sits on the Syrian National Council’s foreign affairs committee.

My question of course would be:
Name some names.... which U.S. and European diplomats??


I will see if I can find out....bigsmile

Optomistic69's photo
Sat 08/11/12 03:06 AM

Well here on Youtube, you can hear Jeffery Feltman himself talk.

Titled: Assad is Doomed ! U.S. State Department Jeffrey Feltman - Syria Update 11-9-11

So this agenda has be at least going on since November 9th, 2011.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77XrsmDqUZw

"We urge our Arab partners to condem the regime." (Assad's regime.)

Therefore, YES... it is confirmed... Jeffery Feltman has an agenda. So is he working with anyone else? If so whom?





The video is of him while he was in the state department where he says that it would be in the interest of [America and The Syrian people] if Assad stood down.

What I would like to know is....what are his views now that he is the United Nations Under-Secretary-General for Political Affairs.

In whose interest will it be if Assad is driven out of office.?









Optomistic69's photo
Sat 08/11/12 03:13 AM
Is The United States really interested in the Well Being of Syrians or the advancement of America?