No, this is not a bash men thread. I am sure there are women who do this too.

I have noticed and it may be just my experience but here goes....

In the dating environment, especially, I have to describe my condition. When I describe my MS stuff to some men and they feel "bad" for me or I am assuming this is the trigger, they get into that frame of mind and you can hear it in their tone and even see it in their writing, they want to tell you to "not/stop be/being a sissy" but they do not do it because you are a woman, I am guessing.
It is frustrating for me to try to get them to understand, one, that I am just explaining what the MS does to me and what my body goes through, two, that it is part of my life I cannot escape. Being a sissy is the furthest from the problem...lol and it is something very important if a cohabitation situation were to evolve or even when it comes to picking out where to go on a date. I am usually lightening the information from the real pain and suffering because I don't like pity. But it would be nice to have a little empathy. To understand that they understand would be really nice not dismissing it.

So my question here is: Do you think that by the way we "toughen" up the boys in their younger years, that we remove their ability to show and/or feel empathy correctly?

Or is that when one doesn't have knowledge or experience something it is hard to empathize?

Or both?

Definition: Empathy is the capacity to recognize and, to some extent, share feelings (such as sadness or happiness) that are being experienced by another sentient or semi-sentient being.


What do you think?

Men are taught to guard their feelings until they feel safe to trust someone. Only then can they reveal their hearts.

In other words, it is probably not reasonable to invite a man (guarded feelings) into a personal emotional world, and expect him to feel comforable sharing his feelings before developing a deep relationship with you.

Its not 'incorrect', that they hold back on sharing feelings.

Youre putting them in an uncomfortable situation.

I suspect what they are trying to tell you is to stop trina make them into a sissy--someone who shares their feelings quickly and readily.

do you mean that they are telling u to stop being a sissy because they are maybe not comfortable or knowledgable about MS? How soon are you telling them about it?

It shouldn't be that big of a deal, really. I had an apartment mate with MS and she did not participate in our more athletic adventures, but otherwise...she was fine but for fatigue.

So I guess it is hard for you because it must be a delicate balancing act as far as not overhwelming guys with this too soon, and not withholding important info about yourself....?

Interesting. I think this is an A,B and C answer.

A)Yes. I believe boys as kids should be exposed more to the real world, another words their emotions. I think when we are boys we are hot wired to be "tough" and in this toughness comes a detachment from our emotions. THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO ALL MALES, just most.

B) Unfortunately some people run as soon as they hear something they do not understand or CARE to understand. This is a male/female reaction.

C)As a society in the states, we fail at passing on morality to the younger generations. Whether they feel like "Aww Mom that was back in your days, things are different now" . This has been going on for several decades and the spiral is just getting worse.

When was the last time you went to the store and a young man held doors open for you? Or whens the last time you had a young one say "Yes mam"? Point being even the simplest of things have become a non thought. Long ago those were common place, showing respect for others, now days it is more the rarity.

Men are taught to guard their feelings until they feel safe to trust someone. Only then can they reveal their hearts.

In other words, it is probably not reasonable to invite a man (guarded feelings) into a personal emotional world, and expect him to feel comforable sharing his feelings before developing a deep relationship with you.

Its not 'incorrect', that they hold back on sharing feelings.

Youre putting them in an uncomfortable situation.

I suspect what they are trying to tell you is to stop trina make them into a sissy--someone who shares their feelings quickly and readily.

Interesting. I think this is an A,B and C answer.

A)Yes. I believe boys as kids should be exposed more to the real world, another words their emotions. I think when we are boys we are hot wired to be "tough" and in this toughness comes a detachment from our emotions. THIS DOES NOT APPLY TO ALL MALES, just most.

B) Unfortunately some people run as soon as they hear something they do not understand or CARE to understand. This is a male/female reaction.

C)As a society in the states, we fail at passing on morality to the younger generations. Whether they feel like "Aww Mom that was back in your days, things are different now" . This has been going on for several decades and the spiral is just getting worse.

When was the last time you went to the store and a young man held doors open for you? Or whens the last time you had a young one say "Yes mam"? Point being even the simplest of things have become a non thought. Long ago those were common place, showing respect for others, now days it is more the rarity.

No, this is not a bash men thread. I am sure there are women who do this too.

I have noticed and it may be just my experience but here goes....

In the dating environment, especially, I have to describe my condition. When I describe my MS stuff to some men and they feel "bad" for me or I am assuming this is the trigger, they get into that frame of mind and you can hear it in their tone and even see it in their writing, they want to tell you to "not/stop be/being a sissy" but they do not do it because you are a woman, I am guessing.
It is frustrating for me to try to get them to understand, one, that I am just explaining what the MS does to me and what my body goes through, two, that it is part of my life I cannot escape. Being a sissy is the furthest from the problem...lol and it is something very important if a cohabitation situation were to evolve or even when it comes to picking out where to go on a date. I am usually lightening the information from the real pain and suffering because I don't like pity. But it would be nice to have a little empathy. To understand that they understand would be really nice not dismissing it.

So my question here is: Do you think that by the way we "toughen" up the boys in their younger years, that we remove their ability to show and/or feel empathy correctly?

Or is that when one doesn't have knowledge or experience something it is hard to empathize?

Or both?

Definition: Empathy is the capacity to recognize and, to some extent, share feelings (such as sadness or happiness) that are being experienced by another sentient or semi-sentient being.


What do you think?

I don't really share my feelings about it right away, just the effects of it on me and my life.

I do not want to be accused of sucking someone in and then them finding out that I am not "normal" and require special treatment or I limit them in what they want to do in life because of my situation.

You know?

When mom was going to her MS support group, there was my father and another man who stayed with their wives when they were diagnosed out of about 35 women. The other man did it strictly to help the wife with insurance, and basically moved into another room of the house and started dating again, figuring his wife would be one to go downhill fast and die. All of the other women were divorced within about 2yrs of being diagnosed because their hubbies didn't want to deal with it.

It probably is an uncomfortable issue for them, and they have to figure out how much they want to get involved with someone who has such a problem/issue. They might be empathetic and not know how to react, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were also figuring how to get away.

You may not share your feelings, yet you are expecting them to give you theirs. You say flat out 'it would be nice to have their empathy' and you want their understanding. I think it should be fine to say, "for health reasons, I cant do this, but I can do that".
Regardless, I wouldnt expect or encourage sympathy from them early on. Give them strength...as you say, you dont want pity.

I know. Its a tricky spot you are in.

When mom was going to her MS support group, there was my father and another man who stayed with their wives when they were diagnosed out of about 35 women. The other man did it strictly to help the wife with insurance, and basically moved into another room of the house and started dating again, figuring his wife would be one to go downhill fast and die. All of the other women were divorced within about 2yrs of being diagnosed because their hubbies didn't want to deal with it.

It probably is an uncomfortable issue for them, and they have to figure out how much they want to get involved with someone who has such a problem/issue. They might be empathetic and not know how to react, but I wouldn't be surprised if they were also figuring how to get away.

You say that you dont want pity, but when you say stuff like 'you want empathy, and understanding' and that statement above, makes it seem like you DO want pity.

A person does not want to embarq on a relationship as though they are your therapist, nurse, or mom. Youre putting out the wrong energy for dating. That stuff wont get the naughty bits off the couch.

I agree to the balancing but I want to be forthwith because they need to have the choice to deal with it or leave the situation.

Sounds to me like you are doing it the right way. You are trying to be honest and open about something that is an everyday part of your life, just like having kids (to a point). You should make mention of it and then maybe pull off of it and allow them to ask more on it. If a man feels like you are dumping your world on him, and he has no stake in it. Most men/women will run.

Does not mean you nor your situation is the problem. It does show that they have little heart and compassion for others though.

Problem is not you, it's them.

It is always more fun to blame them...lol But I maybe doing some things wrong too. Actually this thread has helped me see things I didn't before so that is a good thing.

Empathy is being able to see/feel another person's experience. It isn't pity. Nor is understanding pity.

I don't want to be felt sorry for. I want them to see what my life is like so they know what they are coming into so they can choose whether it is what they can deal with or not.

I am a very independent woman so I don't lean on people much at all. Which I consider a downfall of mine. I need to be able to balance when to ask for help and when not to. Also it is hard for me to know when is a good time to discuss these things and what should be the reaction afterwards.

I have vacillated from complete disclosure to partial disclosure to no disclosure and with not much success. If I wait until we have had a few conversations and then drop the bomb, they act as if I was being dishonest. If I fully disclose then they think I am "being a sissy or I make them think they need to be a nurse???? or something.

Again women like to be understood that is why they talk so much and interact so much. So maybe I am looking for understanding more than empathy.

But that still doesn't change the OP question. Are we taking away our men's ability to show/share feelings/experiences (empathy) with others by our way of "toughening" them up when they are young? And telling them not to be a "sissy".