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| Topic: hitting a woman, is one time too many? | |
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What it boils down to is this, if you're a man in this country: If she yells, nags, throws things at you, threatens you, or hits you, no matter how hard or how often, you must run away like a frightened child, no matter how much time, feelings, and money you have invested in your relationship. You are never allowed to remain and subject yourself to further abuse, and you must never retaliate even once, even in self defense. That's right, thanks to VAWA, Biden, and the current state of the courts, men have no cajones any more. You must run fast and run far at the first sign of trouble, and leave the woman you fell in love with behind. That's the reality of it. I don't see it as running away but walking out with your dignity and your assets and your future. It is not that hard to document a chroniclly abusive woman because usually they don't just do it behind closed doors. Judges respond to proof. Talking to friends and family and medical evidence is what it takes to convict a man of abuse and the same is true of a woman. If you don't want to leave someone who has abused you that is your choice but it doesn't justify laying in a few licks here and there to get your own justice. Since somewhere in the process you picked her and it is going to be costly to get divorced. A really good reason to take your time about getting into a relationship. Judges "may" or "may not" respond to proof, there is no guarantee. Cops, lets just stay that their idea of probable cause is whimsical and speculative. Relationships, yes if you are fortunate enough to have just been dating this person, and she has not moved in with you, and it has not been several years, or are married, and/or have kids together, then yes you can easily cut and run with little emotional expense. However when you include those provisions I mentioned, it becomes much more difficult if not impossible to leave that person behind. People have memories and emotions and attachments, it's not as easy as ripping up a contract. yeah, I think ,to be the preferred gender in this culture, there are still some laws that really suck for them. I'm not trying to mince words here, but what I think you meant is the "protected" gender. Men have no such protection. We are still primitive in our beliefs that men are physically superior to women, yet women are afforded all of the equal rights protections under the law, and only a fool would believe that all men are physically or emotionally superior to women. VAWA has screwed this country over, and there needs to be real soon a fair and equitable human to human justice code when it comes to domestic violence laws. Until then, it is skewed entirely towards the female's favor. It is sad to think that now in 2009, going into 2010 that people's eyes are being opened to this phenomenon that's gone on for centuries. I agree that many laws discrimnate against men, but I did mean preferred. If we look at the numbers, who owns the companies, who are the ceos, who has the power, it is still mostly men chosing other men, mostly. Perhaps you misunderstood me, msharmony, as an equal rights advocate, I favor EQUAL rights, regarding gender, race, religion, and sexual preference. Yes I know that in the realm of economy and politics there is a "glass ceiling." However, in the matter of civil rights and most specifically DV cases, the laws are heavily biased in favor of women, this I cannot accept or condone. It should be equal for both genders. And the longer we cling to these primitive values and beliefs, the slower we will progress in justice and fairness. In the matter of family law, men do get the short end of the shaft. I agree. We could fix that by fixing the matter of family roles. With much privilege comes much responsibility. When we level out relationships so women have privileges to match their responsibilities, and men have responsibilities to match their privileges,, we will have an easier time fixing the double standards in the courts. Not sure I understand what you're trying to say, but yes, there is a HUGE double standard in the courts when it comes to DV law. As far as the rest of life, we're in the 21st century now, and we should be ashamed of ourselves especially in developed nations like the U.S., Canada, U.K., and Australia, that this sherade is allowed to continue. Human to human, that's how the laws need to be, whether it be family courts, employment, wages, healthcare, criminal justice, etc. We live here on Earth, and we are human, minds wrapped in different bodies whether it be gender, race, religion, or sexual preference, first and foremost we are human beings, and so far, there is no penultimate justice, and that makes me sad. |
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You know i was reading thru this thread and hitting is bad on both sides, but hey a man shouldn't hit a woman period! Even if a woman hit him first, he should just take his lumps like a man and move on. I mean i am for equality and all, but there will never be physical equality between men and women! Sure a big woman may beat up on a small man, but generally a woman poses no threat to a man thats the real issue here. The courts will prosecute a woman for violence but how can a man honestly declare self defense? Self defense means you need to have a threat, how does an average woman pose a threat to an average man. She doesn't pure and simple thats why men cant use self defense as a reason in a court of law. Now if there clearly is no physical advantage on the part of the male then maybe but i think this would be quite rare. So barring that she has a weapon what reasoning does a man have to hit a woman? None, pure and simple and lets face it if you get your *** kicked by a woman chances are your not interested in pressing charges??? Sorry Ronny, I guess you don't understand, I won't even try to make you understand, but if you ever want to, maybe you should talk to a DV defense attorney sometime, or at least do some research on female to male violence. Maybe I can't open your eyes and that's okay, but coming soon, this story will break, be it here in Denver, or CNN is going to blow it wide open. There is a bias here, and the line will be crossed no further. It's time to put aside gender bias and start treating others as human beings, not embracing 16th century beliefs. By the way you would not believe the number of men I talked to that said if a women ever laid a hand on them, they would strike back, regardless of the consequences. And the consequences are jail-time. The laws are biased and you know it. It's time this B.S. ends. |
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No one wants to say it huh? Dance around it, pretend it doesn't exsist but it's just taboo to say the facts huh?
MEN AND WOMEN ARE NOT PHYSICALLY EQUAL! that is a pure and simple fact and the courts will never ignore it! Sure there is a bias and it's changing slowly but the courts will never ignore the fact men are physically larger and stronger! |
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You know i was reading thru this thread and hitting is bad on both sides, but hey a man shouldn't hit a woman period! Even if a woman hit him first, he should just take his lumps like a man and move on. I mean i am for equality and all, but there will never be physical equality between men and women! Sure a big woman may beat up on a small man, but generally a woman poses no threat to a man thats the real issue here. The courts will prosecute a woman for violence but how can a man honestly declare self defense? Self defense means you need to have a threat, how does an average woman pose a threat to an average man. She doesn't pure and simple thats why men cant use self defense as a reason in a court of law. Now if there clearly is no physical advantage on the part of the male then maybe but i think this would be quite rare. So barring that she has a weapon what reasoning does a man have to hit a woman? None, pure and simple and lets face it if you get your *** kicked by a woman chances are your not interested in pressing charges??? Sorry Ronny, I guess you don't understand, I won't even try to make you understand, but if you ever want to, maybe you should talk to a DV defense attorney sometime, or at least do some research on female to male violence. Maybe I can't open your eyes and that's okay, but coming soon, this story will break, be it here in Denver, or CNN is going to blow it wide open. There is a bias here, and the line will be crossed no further. It's time to put aside gender bias and start treating others as human beings, not embracing 16th century beliefs. By the way you would not believe the number of men I talked to that said if a women ever laid a hand on them, they would strike back, regardless of the consequences. And the consequences are jail-time. The laws are biased and you know it. It's time this B.S. ends. You know i dont disagree there is a bias. I agree that its wrong, but a proper way to handle it. for example if your in a relationship you have strong ties and the women is abusive call the cops and let the courts handle it. But i mean really how can woman hurt you???? they cant unless they have a weapon....So its not self defense to strike someone that is much weaker than you! |
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You know i was reading thru this thread and hitting is bad on both sides, but hey a man shouldn't hit a woman period! Even if a woman hit him first, he should just take his lumps like a man and move on. I mean i am for equality and all, but there will never be physical equality between men and women! Sure a big woman may beat up on a small man, but generally a woman poses no threat to a man thats the real issue here. The courts will prosecute a woman for violence but how can a man honestly declare self defense? Self defense means you need to have a threat, how does an average woman pose a threat to an average man. She doesn't pure and simple thats why men cant use self defense as a reason in a court of law. Now if there clearly is no physical advantage on the part of the male then maybe but i think this would be quite rare. So barring that she has a weapon what reasoning does a man have to hit a woman? None, pure and simple and lets face it if you get your *** kicked by a woman chances are your not interested in pressing charges??? Sorry Ronny, I guess you don't understand, I won't even try to make you understand, but if you ever want to, maybe you should talk to a DV defense attorney sometime, or at least do some research on female to male violence. Maybe I can't open your eyes and that's okay, but coming soon, this story will break, be it here in Denver, or CNN is going to blow it wide open. There is a bias here, and the line will be crossed no further. It's time to put aside gender bias and start treating others as human beings, not embracing 16th century beliefs. By the way you would not believe the number of men I talked to that said if a women ever laid a hand on them, they would strike back, regardless of the consequences. And the consequences are jail-time. The laws are biased and you know it. It's time this B.S. ends. You know i dont disagree there is a bias. I agree that its wrong, but a proper way to handle it. for example if your in a relationship you have strong ties and the women is abusive call the cops and let the courts handle it. But i mean really how can woman hurt you???? they cant unless they have a weapon....So its not self defense to strike someone that is much weaker than you! Well now you have a glimpse of my point. Guess what happens? You get arrested! Do you understand now? The court will sort it out now, depends on the attorney you hire and the jury you inherit. If it hasn't happened to you or someone you know, you won't understand. This goes higher than any one court case and needs to be adressed by the U.S. Supreme Court, this travesty of justice has gone on too long. Research how men have been falsely prosecuted and incarcerated by clearly biased and corrupted VAWA laws and maybe you will gain some insight. Women don't need to be physically superior, they only need to lie and make false accusations. Research, and you may understand. |
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You know i was reading thru this thread and hitting is bad on both sides, but hey a man shouldn't hit a woman period! Even if a woman hit him first, he should just take his lumps like a man and move on. I mean i am for equality and all, but there will never be physical equality between men and women! Sure a big woman may beat up on a small man, but generally a woman poses no threat to a man thats the real issue here. The courts will prosecute a woman for violence but how can a man honestly declare self defense? Self defense means you need to have a threat, how does an average woman pose a threat to an average man. She doesn't pure and simple thats why men cant use self defense as a reason in a court of law. Now if there clearly is no physical advantage on the part of the male then maybe but i think this would be quite rare. So barring that she has a weapon what reasoning does a man have to hit a woman? None, pure and simple and lets face it if you get your *** kicked by a woman chances are your not interested in pressing charges??? Sorry Ronny, I guess you don't understand, I won't even try to make you understand, but if you ever want to, maybe you should talk to a DV defense attorney sometime, or at least do some research on female to male violence. Maybe I can't open your eyes and that's okay, but coming soon, this story will break, be it here in Denver, or CNN is going to blow it wide open. There is a bias here, and the line will be crossed no further. It's time to put aside gender bias and start treating others as human beings, not embracing 16th century beliefs. By the way you would not believe the number of men I talked to that said if a women ever laid a hand on them, they would strike back, regardless of the consequences. And the consequences are jail-time. The laws are biased and you know it. It's time this B.S. ends. You know i dont disagree there is a bias. I agree that its wrong, but a proper way to handle it. for example if your in a relationship you have strong ties and the women is abusive call the cops and let the courts handle it. But i mean really how can woman hurt you???? they cant unless they have a weapon....So its not self defense to strike someone that is much weaker than you! Well now you have a glimpse of my point. Guess what happens? You get arrested! Do you understand now? The court will sort it out now, depends on the attorney you hire and the jury you inherit. If it hasn't happened to you or someone you know, you won't understand. This goes higher than any one court case and needs to be adressed by the U.S. Supreme Court, this travesty of justice has gone on too long. Research how men have been falsely prosecuted and incarcerated by clearly biased and corrupted VAWA laws and maybe you will gain some insight. Women don't need to be physically superior, they only need to lie and make false accusations. Research, and you may understand. You know i understand your point and i know there is bias. But i think your off topic, the question was, is it okay to hit a woman? Thats all i am refering to, not the bias thats entirely differen issue! Regardless how the courts handle it a man should not hit a woman unless he needs to in self defense. So that means she has a weapon or she really poses a threat ie....he is a really little dude or she is a really tough woman. But a womens punch aint gonna hurt a whole lot and a man's punch can do some damage so there is a clear difference in power thats all i am saying! |
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Gawd help a man that even shoves me...
Yells in my face or calls me a name. He is done. I was married to a wall hitter once and got out. Just a matter of time before a wall isn't enough. He was just "showing me" what he was capable of. I showed him the door. |
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That women and men are not the same (which I agree) does not mean that laws shouldnt be applied equally to both or that we should SANCTION women doing whatever they want to men and because women are 'weaker' condemn men when they strike back. the bottom line should be that no adult should strike another adult and if they do, although it does make someone the better person to just walk away, it shouldnt cause them to be CONDEMNED if they dont.
I think people take things to extreme and I believe in somewhat reasonable force, but beyond that, if my daughter hits her boyfriend and he hits her back,,Im going to be quite upset with BOTH of them but I will hold her responsible for starting the assault. |
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Edited by
FearandLoathing
on
Thu 12/03/09 07:05 AM
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What it boils down to is this, if you're a man in this country: If she yells, nags, throws things at you, threatens you, or hits you, no matter how hard or how often, you must run away like a frightened child, no matter how much time, feelings, and money you have invested in your relationship. You are never allowed to remain and subject yourself to further abuse, and you must never retaliate even once, even in self defense. That's right, thanks to VAWA, Biden, and the current state of the courts, men have no cajones any more. You must run fast and run far at the first sign of trouble, and leave the woman you fell in love with behind. That's the reality of it. Cajones? I think it takes a lot more cajones to walk away than to stay and fight it out...fighting is useless unless it is competitive. If I'm not moving up in rank on a ladder, I don't want to fight you...regardless of sex. Not to say I haven't fought, I just don't see any point in violence on such a meager scale. There is no point to fighting because someone called me gay or made fun of my hair, I don't care...if you touch me, I'll push you away...you gun it, and I defend myself. Simple as that. I've never hit a woman, though I've been hit by many...'what a waste of time' is all I was thinking. She's mad at something, or even at me...if needs be I will push her away from me, but I'll never strike a lady. ...They deserve more respect than what you would do on the street to the nearest "gangbanger" POS. |
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You know i was reading thru this thread and hitting is bad on both sides, but hey a man shouldn't hit a woman period! Even if a woman hit him first, he should just take his lumps like a man and move on. I mean i am for equality and all, but there will never be physical equality between men and women! Sure a big woman may beat up on a small man, but generally a woman poses no threat to a man thats the real issue here. The courts will prosecute a woman for violence but how can a man honestly declare self defense? Self defense means you need to have a threat, how does an average woman pose a threat to an average man. She doesn't pure and simple thats why men cant use self defense as a reason in a court of law. Now if there clearly is no physical advantage on the part of the male then maybe but i think this would be quite rare. So barring that she has a weapon what reasoning does a man have to hit a woman? None, pure and simple and lets face it if you get your *** kicked by a woman chances are your not interested in pressing charges??? Sorry Ronny, I guess you don't understand, I won't even try to make you understand, but if you ever want to, maybe you should talk to a DV defense attorney sometime, or at least do some research on female to male violence. Maybe I can't open your eyes and that's okay, but coming soon, this story will break, be it here in Denver, or CNN is going to blow it wide open. There is a bias here, and the line will be crossed no further. It's time to put aside gender bias and start treating others as human beings, not embracing 16th century beliefs. By the way you would not believe the number of men I talked to that said if a women ever laid a hand on them, they would strike back, regardless of the consequences. And the consequences are jail-time. The laws are biased and you know it. It's time this B.S. ends. You know i dont disagree there is a bias. I agree that its wrong, but a proper way to handle it. for example if your in a relationship you have strong ties and the women is abusive call the cops and let the courts handle it. But i mean really how can woman hurt you???? they cant unless they have a weapon....So its not self defense to strike someone that is much weaker than you! Well now you have a glimpse of my point. Guess what happens? You get arrested! Do you understand now? The court will sort it out now, depends on the attorney you hire and the jury you inherit. If it hasn't happened to you or someone you know, you won't understand. This goes higher than any one court case and needs to be adressed by the U.S. Supreme Court, this travesty of justice has gone on too long. Research how men have been falsely prosecuted and incarcerated by clearly biased and corrupted VAWA laws and maybe you will gain some insight. Women don't need to be physically superior, they only need to lie and make false accusations. Research, and you may understand. You know i understand your point and i know there is bias. But i think your off topic, the question was, is it okay to hit a woman? Thats all i am refering to, not the bias thats entirely differen issue! Regardless how the courts handle it a man should not hit a woman unless he needs to in self defense. So that means she has a weapon or she really poses a threat ie....he is a really little dude or she is a really tough woman. But a womens punch aint gonna hurt a whole lot and a man's punch can do some damage so there is a clear difference in power thats all i am saying! I took a beating for 45 minutes. Everything from being Hit, Kicked, Beer bottles thrown at me and hitting me in the head and a glass picture broke on my face which cut me. Did I strike back, NO! Was it tempting, Yes! But I knew better! How did I handle it. I finally dialed 911 cause it wasn't gonna stop. The county sheriffs took one look at me and turned her around and cuffed her. She now has a record for assault, and Im getting divorced!!!! It goes both ways, neither a man or a woman should have to put up with being hit! And neither a man or a woman has the right to strike! |
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Abuse is a complex issue. Statistics on the American Bar Association's Commission on Domestic Violence provide some insights...but law enforcement officials believe that much abuse - physical, verbal, sexual - goes unreported to law enforcement authorities, and thus, escapes these statistics. While abuse goes both ways, clearly women are far more likely to be victims than men. In either case, it is wrong...and against the law. Here's a sampling of statistics.
According to the U.S. Department of Justice, between 1998 and 2002: Of the almost 3.5 million violent crimes committed against family members, 49% of these were crimes against spouses. 84% of spouse abuse victims were females, and 86% of victims of dating partner abuse at were female. Males were 83% of spouse murderers and 75% of dating partner murderers 50% of offenders in state prison for spousal abuse had killed their victims. Wives were more likely than husbands to be killed by their spouses: wives were about half of all spouses in the population in 2002, but 81% of all persons killed by their spouse. Of females killed with a firearm, almost two-thirds were killed by their intimate partners. The number of females shot and killed by their husband or intimate partner was more than three times higher than the total number murdered by male strangers using all weapons combined in single victim/single offender incidents in 2002. And when children see adults hitting each other...what lesson is learned?  
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Gawd help a man that even shoves me... Yells in my face or calls me a name. He is done. I was married to a wall hitter once and got out. Just a matter of time before a wall isn't enough. He was just "showing me" what he was capable of. I showed him the door.   ^THANK YOU!!!! And YOU made a GREAT MOVE! SEE,,,this is my POINT ladies and Gents,,,, WE our all smart enough to know,,tah OUR LOVER,,,,has or does NOT have, the abilties to be TO UP-SET!!!!!AND ANGRERED,,,, SO WHY????TEMPT THEM, or TAKE THAT GAMBLE?? LOVE,,,should NEVER BE THAT HARD! To LIVE WITH... Because then love isn't really,,,THERE!!! FACT!!! 
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Not a lesson I wanted my son to learn! It was in my home, she was drunk, and my child saw that and I sent him to his room but he still had to listen to it. I am upset that he was present!
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I don't even hit men ... just to err on the side of caution.
Good talking points though ... Glad we can discuss something relatively mindful of intellect in here. |
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Edited by
anacondaarms
on
Thu 12/03/09 08:12 AM
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Yes a good discussion, and Me either, Im very non - confrontational when it comes to physical. But I will speak my mind.
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Edited by
CatsLoveMe
on
Thu 12/03/09 12:11 PM
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What it boils down to is this, if you're a man in this country: If she yells, nags, throws things at you, threatens you, or hits you, no matter how hard or how often, you must run away like a frightened child, no matter how much time, feelings, and money you have invested in your relationship. You are never allowed to remain and subject yourself to further abuse, and you must never retaliate even once, even in self defense. That's right, thanks to VAWA, Biden, and the current state of the courts, men have no cajones any more. You must run fast and run far at the first sign of trouble, and leave the woman you fell in love with behind. That's the reality of it. Cajones? I think it takes a lot more cajones to walk away than to stay and fight it out...fighting is useless unless it is competitive. If I'm not moving up in rank on a ladder, I don't want to fight you...regardless of sex. Not to say I haven't fought, I just don't see any point in violence on such a meager scale. There is no point to fighting because someone called me gay or made fun of my hair, I don't care...if you touch me, I'll push you away...you gun it, and I defend myself. Simple as that. I've never hit a woman, though I've been hit by many...'what a waste of time' is all I was thinking. She's mad at something, or even at me...if needs be I will push her away from me, but I'll never strike a lady. ...They deserve more respect than what you would do on the street to the nearest "gangbanger" POS. Okay, you bring up some interesting points here. The cajones to walk away; some would say that running makes you look like a coward, or you are abandoning and unwilling to work things out, and solve the problem. It is also quite difficult to just leave when you are of the mindset that you love this woman unconditionally, and there's no problem that can't be worked out. This would be the trap we set for ourselves. The right to self defense; altruistic. Yes we should all have this right, but the courts don't see it that way. Other than what you think you may no as physical violence, a shove, push, slap, a threat, even a menacing look may be construed as assault or harassment in many state courts. They deserve respect; well of course. However, this line gets crossed when some women repeatedly abuse and provoke their partner. Ever hear of self-medicated bipolar disorder? Trust me, if you're not a PHD trained therapist, DO NOT get involved with one, thinking she can be saved or cured. So there are the nuances of this complicated issue. A boring simple answer to the original question; no, it's not. The deck is stacked in favor of the female, and that's why so many relationships end tragically. How about no human being may harm another, if we could all do that, the world would be a better place. |
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a man who hits a woman for any reason (other than she's trying to stab him to death) is a a low life slug with small penis issues
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He better make the first shot count!
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"one of these day Alice... POW! straight to the moon"
-Ralph Cramdon |
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"one of these day Alice... POW! straight to the moon" -Ralph Cramdon Im a woman, but if I were a man,,Id be hated, because I would hit back anyone who hit me, its a reflex. I wouldnt knock her out for smacking me but she would certainly see an equal reaction to her action. |
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