I saw a posting in my lucid dreaming group online, and thought i would talk about it here. The idea is that at the center of every human, is a small bit of primordial nothingness, which is sort of like a black hole. This force is the eventual death of that person. Upon death, we all go through this black hole of death, or fear it and turn away from it. The trick is, to go through this black hole of your own death while in dreaming, while you are still alive. The idea is that this force is what binds spirit to flesh and that by going through it in dreaming, one would then be able to access the other side of consciousness, the subconscious consciously. It sounds a bit scary, and a bit risky, but it also makes a whole lot of sense. Thoughts?

Sounds like meditation...

so THAT'S what meditation is. I thought it was trying to silence one's thoughts.

It depends on what your goal is when you meditate.. You can silence your thoughts to find peace or reach deeper within your consciousness or try to highten your awareness of your spiritual nature..

True. I often meditate with the goal of reviewing my life so far, and reclaiming the spent energy from those encounters I am remembering.

You can't silence ALL thoughts...I can't anyway. Just learn to let them slip on through, go back to the breathing and not hold on to any of the thoughts..or make any judgment about them.

Lucid dreaming is the ability to alter, or change the events happening in a dream ...by consciously being aware as you drift off to sleep you can actually change what is going on..should something unpleasant happen or someone you don't want to be there comes along..you change it. Make them go away, change where you are, alter the environment.
It takes a lot of practice, so does meditation. Hence.."the practice of meditation."

It sounds quite interesting. I've been attempting something quite similar in my lucid dreams as well. I'm not sure if it's the same concept. What I've been attempting is a total 'detachment' of any sensory perception. And it is scary as you suggest, because to let go of everything does ineed produce the 'feeling' of being in a blackhole where there will be no way of 'getting back'.

I mean, I'm even letting go of 'dreams'. So in a very real sense it's like a state of pure thoughtlessness. Like becoming a black hole as you suggests.

I'd be interesting in reading the conversations going on at your lucid dreaming group online. If you care to, feel free to send me the link and owl take a peek. I've actually been looking for similar groups as I'm into shamanic journeying and lucid dreaming myself.

no doubt--if meditation was silencing /all/ thoughts...i'd be screwed ;o) lol

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/lucid-dreaming/

Anyone who says "meditation is ..." and gives a single-short-phrase-answer is only describing some kinds of meditation. There is no single, short, universal answer for what meditation is, which applies to all uses of the word. In can range from focused thought, to an effort to still one's mind, to opening one-self more fully to sensory experience, to disconnecting ones mind from sensory input, to listening for guidance, to "reviewing my life so far, and reclaiming the spent energy from those encounters I am remembering.", to cultivating awareness of the body, to becoming absorbed in the repetition of a sound, the list goes on (and many of those were not mutually exclusive).

Edit: Given the looseness of this word usage, I would say that lucid dreaming probably qualifies as a 'kind of meditation' for some people.

Yeah, no doubt! I know of no respected authority which advocates the complete silencing of thoughts. When people speak of 'stilling the mind' they usually speak of developing a habit of mind in which you tend to not -respond- to your thoughts with more thoughts; you simple maintain whatever you were focused on as thoughts arise, without getting involved with the thought.

sounds like this person did acid

Thanks for the link causality. I requested to join. Will be under Windhorse_Dancer

Kendra

Regarding the Black hole concept, I think you'll find many won't be able to do it, and the biggest issue will be how much control one can, in the end, wield.

I'm thinking there may be a concept similar to falling dreams, whereby if you actually hit, you supposedly don't wake up. So, ultimate control of one's body and the majority don't truly have that.

I've been lucid dreaming for forever, but while I get closer to the ground, I still can't maintain enough control to touch down.

There are very real barriers set in place to restrict dreaming and the gaining of absolute control over the dreaming body. You have to go through each in order, and you can't go through one without smacking your face against it first.

Yes and no.

Many people can and do lucid dream, but don't know what they're doing.

It's when they realize, want to learn and start taking the steps necessary to do so that the barriers pop up and one has to work through it.

And there's still days when that's easy then others.

I think the biggest issue becomes the attachments in the waking world. Family, friends, animals, and since some really aren't suicidal, they never quite step past that last barrier.

Well, the way I understand it, it is basically jumping up the middle of the tree of life without messing around with all those zigzags the journey would normally have, done the safe way. Sort of heading through the abyss. Of course, anyone who has had a close brush with death, knows the power inherent in it. I'm sort of at the point where I barely have physical stuff, and have no attachments at all. No, lease, no job, no nearby family or friends. It's an odd feeling.

Hrrmmm, I could see that as a good description, initially at least. I do believe people make leaps of various things, not just related to lucid dreaming. However, I don't know anyone who went into lucid dreaming and was able to just keep it up. They still had to backtrack a bit, to train it to become more consistent.

Regarding no attachments, I find that interesting. Though for me, just not practical or of interest.

I think this would be important.

For me, I can't go very far into this kind of thing before I get scared and panic. It's happened to me in meditation and I panic.

Fear is the first guardian of the path to knowledge of the truth. In fact, you can tell where the truth is, because it feels scary to go towards it. You have to conquer fear, and when you do you face clarity. Clarity is tough. If you pass that, you face power. Power wins. If it doesn't you face the last enemy, old age. That one really does win...at some point.