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| Topic: Reinstate the Draft? | |
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Edited by
InvictusV
on
Tue 02/10/09 09:19 PM
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I'm not sure I see any reality here. Why are we at war? Why do we need a world net security force? y get a 'free ride' through college? NO, they don't. Why areWhat is the deal with protecting our borders, are we so afraid our 'pure' culture will be defiled if other cultures are introduced? Also, if you really think you get such a great education from being service to this country you need to talk to those 'in service'. When does a soldier have time to go to school? When do the guys on ship and in submarines have time for classes? Do you REALLY believe that when they get out the half the homeless veterans? A job you hate? How many civilians attempt suicide, simply because they hate a job? Now look up the suicide statistics for severice people these day? Slave labor - you bet it is. If you think for one moment those 'in service' have freedom - look that one up too. Once inducted they are no longer 'civilians' and no longer under the protection of the Constitution, federal or state. You don't want people coming into your country seeking a better way of life, but if they institute a draft here, there are plenty of places an American can go before becoming a slave. We are no longer a 'free thinking, liberty invested' country. If we continue to 'enlist' while our economy is failing, soon we will be a police state. I've read various ideas and opinions about utilizing military as first responce units for distasters, riot control and yes shoring up those borders. Imagin everywhere you go seeing 'armed' forces walking 'the beat', looking over your shoulder for the cameras on the poles, limited internet access (for security reasons, of course). And suddenly realizing the majority of the employed are the underpaid, undereducated, militia that 'walk the beat' as people stand in line for their 'ration stamps'. NO DRAFT - In fact, before ANYONE considers enlisting, I would PLEAD with them to GET THE FACTS. NO you will not have choices once you sign the papers, No, you do not get to pick what you learn, or where you go or even how long you will be there. There is no glory to be had there, and the greatest honor you will find on your return may be a $300 dollar burial benefit, paid to your survivors. You don't need to 'enlist' to serve your country. If war is brought to our shores, we will fight to protect it as anyone would to protect their home and loved ones. But at this moment I see no purpose for the draft and reason for ANYONE to enlist. What a bunch of propaganda. Its not even remotely accurate. You need to take your ass and volunteer at a USO, maybe then you might get a clue. |
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Are you kidding? It's exactly what we need to protect American values.
Oh wait... no, it's more like Chinese, Russian and Iranian values. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription |
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"If only each King, Emperor, and President understood that his work of directing armies is not an honourable and important duty, as his flatterers persuade him it is, but a bad and shameful act of preparation for murder – and if each private individual understood that the payment of taxes wherewith to hire and equip soldiers, and, above all, army-service itself, are not matters of indifference, but are bad and shameful actions by which he not only permits but participates in murder – then this power of Emperors, Kings, and Presidents, which now arouses our indignation… would disappear of itself.”
—Leo Tolstoy |
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Obama's mention of a "civilian national security force."
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tt2yGzHfy7s&feature=related |
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Are you kidding? It's exactly what we need to protect American values. Oh wait... no, it's more like Chinese, Russian and Iranian values. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription Exactly. |
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Edited by
notquite00
on
Wed 02/11/09 02:28 AM
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Are you kidding? It's exactly what we need to protect American values. Oh wait... no, it's more like Chinese, Russian and Iranian values. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription Huh? Perhaps I misunderstood your post, but military service is not compulsory in China except for a couple of days in high school. It's more like an extended field trip, lol. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription |
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Edited by
transientmind
on
Wed 02/11/09 03:13 AM
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Are you kidding? It's exactly what we need to protect American values. Oh wait... no, it's more like Chinese, Russian and Iranian values. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription Huh? Perhaps I misunderstood your post, but military service is not compulsory in China except for a couple of days in high school. It's more like an extended field trip, lol. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription From the CIA World Factbook. https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/print/ch.html "18-22 years of age for selective compulsory military service, with 24-month service obligation; no minimum age for voluntary service (all officers are volunteers); 18-19 years of age for women high school graduates who meet requirements for specific military jobs (2007)" Here's the Wiki article that pertains specifically to the People's Republic of China. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_the_Republic_of_China |
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Are you kidding? It's exactly what we need to protect American values. Oh wait... no, it's more like Chinese, Russian and Iranian values. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription Huh? Perhaps I misunderstood your post, but military service is not compulsory in China except for a couple of days in high school. It's more like an extended field trip, lol. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription From the CIA World Factbook. https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/print/ch.html "18-22 years of age for selective compulsory military service, with 24-month service obligation; no minimum age for voluntary service (all officers are volunteers); 18-19 years of age for women high school graduates who meet requirements for specific military jobs (2007)" Here's the Wiki article that pertains specifically to the People's Republic of China. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_the_Republic_of_China That's a page on the *Republic of China*...i.e. Taiwan...Taiwan runs quite differently from Mainland. =\ To quote from Wiki: Selective Conscription (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription) : "Conscription has existed in theory since the establishment of the People's Republic of China in 1949; however, because of China's huge population and therefore the large number of individuals who volunteer to join the regular armed forces, a draft has never been enforced." So, in theory, you're correct. In practice, it has never been enforced since the birth of the PRC in 1949 for the reasons you stated. That still means that men and women are NOT forced to do military service. By contrast, all South Korean men MUST do two years of military service after high school. In my book, that means China has no draft in effect...if you disagree, then we'll have to agree to disagree! ;-) Most of the guys I've talked to hated it. ^_^ |
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Hahaha, freedom has a "price?" Well obviously I'm not very free when my government can engage in EXTORTION to make me serve in the military, so there goes that convoluted argument out the window.
Please, folks. Stop advocating tyrannical policies, our government is already looking enough like Nazi Germany these days. |
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Are you kidding? It's exactly what we need to protect American values. Oh wait... no, it's more like Chinese, Russian and Iranian values. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription Huh? Perhaps I misunderstood your post, but military service is not compulsory in China except for a couple of days in high school. It's more like an extended field trip, lol. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription From the CIA World Factbook. https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/print/ch.html "18-22 years of age for selective compulsory military service, with 24-month service obligation; no minimum age for voluntary service (all officers are volunteers); 18-19 years of age for women high school graduates who meet requirements for specific military jobs (2007)" Here's the Wiki article that pertains specifically to the People's Republic of China. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_the_Republic_of_China That's a page on the *Republic of China*...i.e. Taiwan...Taiwan runs quite differently from Mainland. =\ To quote from Wiki: Selective Conscription (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription) : "Conscription has existed in theory since the establishment of the People's Republic of China in 1949; however, because of China's huge population and therefore the large number of individuals who volunteer to join the regular armed forces, a draft has never been enforced." So, in theory, you're correct. In practice, it has never been enforced since the birth of the PRC in 1949 for the reasons you stated. That still means that men and women are NOT forced to do military service. By contrast, all South Korean men MUST do two years of military service after high school. In my book, that means China has no draft in effect...if you disagree, then we'll have to agree to disagree! ;-) Most of the guys I've talked to hated it. ^_^  It was a nice vegetarian streak... 
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Edited by
ReddBeans
on
Thu 02/12/09 06:45 AM
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NO DRAFT - In fact, before ANYONE considers enlisting, I would PLEAD with them to GET THE FACTS. NO you will not have choices once you sign the papers, No, you do not get to pick what you learn, or where you go or even how long you will be there. There is no glory to be had there, and the greatest honor you will find on your return may be a $300 dollar burial benefit, paid to your survivors. I felt the need to address one particular item in your post. The death benefit for a US Service member is not $300. You must be confusing the militray death benefit with Social Security. When I was in the service it was $100,000 paid out to whomever I designated as beneficiary. If I had children or a spouse and had died or been killed while on active duty they would have been given a pension in addition. No you may not have a choice as to what job you are put in, no you may not have a choice as to where you are sent. But if you read the papers that you are required to sign when enlisting that is all laid out for you and it isn't in small print. I would never try to talk someone out of joining the military. I would tell them make an informed decision. Talk to more than one recruiter. Talk to a variety of active duty, reserve and vets. Talk to family members of those serving. Then make your decision. Yes, your life belongs to the military for the next 4-6 years depending on how long you signed up for. |
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I don't believe in the draft. It was stopped to assure us that we would not go to war needlessly. As for my children serving in military. NO. They are 28 and 26 and they are happy doing for their country at home. This miliatry issue is sad. This war is sad. I am happy for those that serve or have served. I was a miliatry kid. It was not a happy life being in another country while the rest of my family was back in the USA.
Prayers to them that serve and the families they leave behind. Times have changed, I do realize that. but those that serve sacraifice more then time away. The miss out on part of the family life. |
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 Yes, those that serve in the military miss out on some aspects of family life. But that comes with the job and they know it and do it willingly. My soon to be 20 yr old son is in the Army. I couldn't be more proud of him for choosing to follow in my and his father's footsteps by joining the military. I would never try to talk one of my children out of joining the military. I would be proud of them and support them in everyway that I could. I have 4 more children and if one or all of them choose to serve than God Bless 'Em for it. |
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A draft is ridiculous. Stop fighting other peoples wars. Close the bases in Korea, Europe, and anywhere else that serve someones security purposes. Its time for other countries to start footing the bill for their security. This is nonsense. If we closed all overseas bases and brought our men and women back home, we could handle all the issues raised in the article. We could re open bases that were closed in the 90s and support OUR local communities. I agree for the most part, but not fully. Most countries are not an iminent threat to America, only American "interests". But many would be if they had a foothold on countries with resources like oil. My big issue is the privatization of the military support systems to Lord Cheneys company, KBR and others, and the exorbitant charges that we get, and always will get from that no bid "deal". I'm a bit peeved that KBR, when finally called on it's doing business with a terrorist country (Iran) illegally, just moved it's base to Bahrain and still operates there helping them develop more oil and money. KBRs "headquarters" there is a PO Box company in one building with over 30,000 other "companies". And extra benefits...NO US TAXES! I have a friend that drives a truck for KBR in Al-Kut Iraq..a dangerous job to be sure..but he gets 11,000 dollars a month. First 100,000/year non-taxable. Surely we could get more people in the military if we paid them half that. If we put the brakes on contracting out for everything from fuel to food to security for the military, we would be in lots better shape. KBRs up a few hundred BILLION so far. Good move George & ****...for you. |
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Hahaha, freedom has a "price?" Well obviously I'm not very free when my government can engage in EXTORTION to make me serve in the military, so there goes that convoluted argument out the window. Please, folks. Stop advocating tyrannical policies, our government is already looking enough like Nazi Germany these days. I wish I had a time machine to send you back to Nazi Germany. I think you would change your mind about thniking America is anything close to a tyrannical dictatorship. You are blessed to live here. You're just too young to know it. You don't have to go nearly that far, or far back to see tyrannical dictatorships. Most countries in the WORLD draft civilians to serve in the military. And most don't get body armor, vehicles, good weaponry or even fed. And you get "out" when you're dead. Lots of African and Central Asian countries just have guys come around and chop off your wife and kids heads, arms, feet if you don't serve whichever nut is needing gun-hands. Or if you do. I suppose ignorance is bliss and youth are 99% blissful these days. At the risk of sounding like an old kook, if you think America is mistreating you...move somewhere else. You'll be BEGGING to get back in. Betcha! |
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Hahaha, freedom has a "price?" Well obviously I'm not very free when my government can engage in EXTORTION to make me serve in the military, so there goes that convoluted argument out the window. Please, folks. Stop advocating tyrannical policies, our government is already looking enough like Nazi Germany these days. I wish I had a time machine to send you back to Nazi Germany. I think you would change your mind about thniking America is anything close to a tyrannical dictatorship. You are blessed to live here. You're just too young to know it. You don't have to go nearly that far, or far back to see tyrannical dictatorships. Most countries in the WORLD draft civilians to serve in the military. And most don't get body armor, vehicles, good weaponry or even fed. And you get "out" when you're dead. Lots of African and Central Asian countries just have guys come around and chop off your wife and kids heads, arms, feet if you don't serve whichever nut is needing gun-hands. Or if you do. I suppose ignorance is bliss and youth are 99% blissful these days. At the risk of sounding like an old kook, if you think America is mistreating you...move somewhere else. You'll be BEGGING to get back in. Betcha! Well said, I've said time and again if you're not happy with the way the country is do something to change it other than sit on ur hinny and b*tch about it or move to a country that is more suitable for you. The great thing about this country is that you have the freedom to leave and live elsewhere. And you also have the freedom to sit on ur hinny and do absolutely nuthin but b*tch. 
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I wish I had a time machine to send you back to Nazi Germany. I think you would change your mind about thniking America is anything close to a tyrannical dictatorship. You are blessed to live here. You're just too young to know it. You don't have to go nearly that far, or far back to see tyrannical dictatorships. Most countries in the WORLD draft civilians to serve in the military. And most don't get body armor, vehicles, good weaponry or even fed. And you get "out" when you're dead. Lots of African and Central Asian countries just have guys come around and chop off your wife and kids heads, arms, feet if you don't serve whichever nut is needing gun-hands. Or if you do. I suppose ignorance is bliss and youth are 99% blissful these days. At the risk of sounding like an old kook, if you think America is mistreating you...move somewhere else. You'll be BEGGING to get back in. Betcha! Oh yeah, the whole "IF U DONT LIKE AMERUCUH THEN U CAN MOVE OKAY" argument. You don't know me, you don't know who I am, you don't even know half of the crap I do despite your age. I come from a military family, and my f'ing brother in law is in Afghanistan right now, so piss off with your general assumptions and stop disrespecting the truth which I speak. CONSCRIPTION/DRAFT = SLAVERY. Get it through your head. If you don't believe that, you are an agent of tyranny and are not a true American. REAL Americans don't run around like chickens trying to find ways to serve their government, REAL Americans question their government and executive power because they know that the government is an inherently evil force and is easily corruptible. You have been warned. |
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no reason to reinstate a draft.
if they reinstated a draft, u would be seeing mass riots lol. u shouldnt force people to do something they dont want to do. i agree that everyone should do some type of service for their community/country whether it be americorps or the peace corps, but fighting is just not what some people want to do, nor should be forced to. |
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Are you kidding? It's exactly what we need to protect American values. Oh wait... no, it's more like Chinese, Russian and Iranian values. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_service#Selective_conscription man the next time u want to post a site. make sure its something credible and not wikipedia |
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I wish I had a time machine to send you back to Nazi Germany. I think you would change your mind about thniking America is anything close to a tyrannical dictatorship. You are blessed to live here. You're just too young to know it. You don't have to go nearly that far, or far back to see tyrannical dictatorships. Most countries in the WORLD draft civilians to serve in the military. And most don't get body armor, vehicles, good weaponry or even fed. And you get "out" when you're dead. Lots of African and Central Asian countries just have guys come around and chop off your wife and kids heads, arms, feet if you don't serve whichever nut is needing gun-hands. Or if you do. I suppose ignorance is bliss and youth are 99% blissful these days. At the risk of sounding like an old kook, if you think America is mistreating you...move somewhere else. You'll be BEGGING to get back in. Betcha! Oh yeah, the whole "IF U DONT LIKE AMERUCUH THEN U CAN MOVE OKAY" argument. You don't know me, you don't know who I am, you don't even know half of the crap I do despite your age. I come from a military family, and my f'ing brother in law is in Afghanistan right now, so piss off with your general assumptions and stop disrespecting the truth which I speak. CONSCRIPTION/DRAFT = SLAVERY. Get it through your head. If you don't believe that, you are an agent of tyranny and are not a true American. REAL Americans don't run around like chickens trying to find ways to serve their government, REAL Americans question their government and executive power because they know that the government is an inherently evil force and is easily corruptible. You have been warned. people shouldnt be afraid of their government, the govt should be afraid of the people |
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