i feel that the debate at least on my point is no further
gun control is needed

i feel there is a little to much now

but enforse the laws on the books now

it does no good to pass more laws when they do not use the ones they
have now

if they let things get worse by not enforcing those they have
then they make more slipping in a little bigger restriction
and so on and so forth

and soon their is no right to own a firearm for any reason

and if the people can not be armed

then the people are servants of the govt.

and those in servatude don't really have rights

Jean,

it was reported in news, he gotten in to some kind of trouble, was court
ordered for outpatient counseling. Out patient is not recorded so he
was able to purchase guns, Va. laws very loose on gun control.

Not arguing, just repeating what read in news.

Here are gun laws for the state of Virginia (I think this is from 2005,
so I'm not sure if any of this has changed since then or not).

ANTI-TRAFFICKING
Is there a one-handgun-per-month limit on gun sales? Yes

State law restricts gun-trafficking by limiting the number of handguns
that can be purchased at one time. No more than one handgun may be
purchased by a person within a 30-day period. This restriction on
bulk-buying of handguns helps prevent gun traffickers from buying
handguns at gun stores and reselling them on the street to criminals.

ASSAULT WEAPONS
Are there limitations on assault weapons and magazines? No

No state restriction on the sale or possession of military-style
semiautomatic assault weapons like the AK47 and Uzi. Assault weapons are
as easy to buy as hunting rifles. No restriction on the sale or
possession of rapid-fire ammunition magazines that can fire up to 100
bullets without reloading. Federal law does prevent the sale of some
assault weapons and rapid-fire magazines manufactured after 1994, but
the federal law will sunset in 2004 unless Congress and President Bush
renew it.


ATTORNEY GENERAL REGULATIONS
May Attorney General regulate guns? No

Virgina: State law does not clearly authorize the Attorney General to
independently regulate firearms or establish gun safety standards as
part of the Attorney General�s responsibility to protect consumers.



BACKGROUND CHECK AT STATE LEVEL
Do state police perform a background check in addition to federal NICS
check? Yes

Virginia: State law requires gun buyers to go through a state-based
criminal background check in addition to the federal NICS check. This is
the best system since it includes checking both state and federal
records to prevent criminals and other prohibited people from buying
guns. in 2000, 2,568 gun buyers failed the criminal background check and
were stopped from buying guns.

BALLISTIC FINGERPRINTING
Must handguns be ballistic fingerprinted prior to sale? No

No state requirement that gun dealers or manufacturers provide police
with sample bullets/cartridges or digital images of bullets/cartridges
prior to the sale of a handgun, "ballistic fingerprinting," which would
assist police in tracing bullets at crime scenes to the guns that fired
them.



CCW LIMITS
May police limit carrying concealed handguns? No

State law forces police chiefs and state sheriffs to give concealed
carry permits (CCW) to anyone who can buy a handgun, allowing them to
carry loaded, concealed handguns in public (known as �shall issue�).
Police may not even require safety training in the legal or safe use of
weapons for CCW applicants. State law allows residents of some other
states to carry concealed weapons in this state without informing local
police.

CHILD ACCESS PREVENTION - CAP
Are gun owners held accountable for leaving guns accessible to kids?
Yes

State law holds gun owners responsible if they leave a gun easily
accessible to a child under 14 years old and the child uses the gun to
injure or threaten someone.

CHILD-SAFETY LOCKS
Must locking devices be sold with guns? No

No state requirement that guns be sold with child-safety locks that
could prevent a tragic accident. Child-safety locks cost as little as
$10 and could save lives if sold with firearms.

GUN MANUFACTURER ACCOUNTABILITY
Do cities have authority to hold gun makers legally liable? No

State law forbids city and county governments from taking any legal
action to hold gun manufacturers accountable, even when they act
irresponsibly in the way they design, market or distribute weapons. No
other industry enjoys such special immunity for irresponsible conduct.

GUN SHOW CHECKS
Are background checks required at gun shows? No

No state requirement that a Brady criminal background check be done on
people buying guns at gun shows if they are sold by "private"
individuals or gun "collectors." Gun shows can operate on a "no
questions asked, cash-and-carry" basis, making it easy for criminals and
even juveniles to buy as many guns as they want at gun shows, including
assault weapons. No records are required to be kept on gun show sales by
private individuals or gun collectors, making it almost impossible for
police to trace such weapons if they are used in a crime.

JUVENILE POSSESSION
Are minors restricted from possessing guns? Partial

State law restricts juveniles under 18 from possessing a handgun or
"assault firearm" unless the juvenile: 1) has parental authorization, 2)
is accompanied by an adult while at, or going to and from, a shooting
range or firearms educational class, 3) is hunting or going to and from
a hunting area or preserve, or 4) is in the armed forces. There are no
restrictions on juveniles possessing other rifles or shotguns. Many
assault weapons are not defined as an "assault firearm" because state
law narrowly defines "assault firearm" to include only pistols and
rifles that are equipped with an ammunition magazine that can hold more
than 20 rounds, are designed to hold a silencer, or are equipped with a
folding stock; and to only include shotguns with a magazine that will
hold more than seven rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is
chambered.

JUVENILE SALE
Is it illegal to sell guns to kids? Partial

State law prohibits sales of a handgun or "assault firearm" to juveniles
only if the seller knows that the buyer is prohibited from possessing
these firearms (see Juvenile Possession above). There are no limits
under state law on selling or giving children 12 or older rifles or
shotguns if they are not "assault firearms." Federal law also prohibits
licensed gun dealers from selling handguns to anyone under 21 and
selling rifles or shotguns to anyone under 18, and prohibits handgun
sales by private sellers to anyone under 18. The term "assault firearm"
is narrowly defined to include only pistols and rifles that are equipped
with an ammunition magazine than can hold more than 20 rounds, are
designed to hold a silencer, or are equipped with a folding stock; and
to only include shotguns with a magazine that will hold more than seven
rounds of the longest ammunition for which it is chambered.

LICENSE OR PERMIT TO PURCHASE
Is a license/permit required to buy handguns? No

No state requirement that handgun buyers obtain a handgun license or
undergo any type of safety training prior to buying a handgun.

LOCAL GUN LAWS - PREEMPTION
May cities enact laws stronger than the state's? No

State law forbids local city or county governments from enacting any
local gun laws, even though the state has failed to pass responsible
state-wide laws. This preemption of local government authority makes it
impossible for cities to enact sensible gun laws to make their citizens
safer. Local laws enacted prior to 1987 were allowed to remain in force.


RECORDKEEPING
May police maintain gun sale records? Partial

Virginia: State law authorizes law enforcement to keep a record for up
to 12 months, of every handgun sold in the state by licensed gun dealers
in order to enforce the state's restriction on bulk buying of handguns
(one-handgun-per-month law). But the state does not keep any records on
the sale of rifles or shotguns or on the "private" sale of handguns by
individuals. In addition, the governing body of any county may require
sellers of handguns to submit detailed sales records to the county
clerk. The handgun sale records are maintained by police for use in gun
tracing and related criminal investigations and to verify compliance
with the state's one handgun per month law. But the state does not
automatically compare past gun sale records with recent criminal
activity to identify and disarm felons and others who bought guns
legally, but later committed a crime or otherwise became ineligible to
keep possession of their firearms.

REGISTRATION
Are all guns registered with law enforcement? No

No state requirement that gun owners register their firearms. Police do
not know how many guns are in the state or where they are. The lack of
registration data makes it more difficult for police to trace guns used
in crime, identify illegal gun traffickers or hold gun owners
accountable for their weapons. There is no state system to automatically
identify and disarm felons and other prohibited people who bought guns
legally in the past, but later committed a crime or otherwise became
ineligible to keep possession of their firearms.

SAFETY STANDARDS
Are there consumer safety standards on guns? No

No state requirement that handguns meet any basic safety standards. No
requirement that guns be sold with a child-safety lock or a built-in
"personalized" lock to prevent unauthorized use. No requirement that
handguns have loaded-chamber indicators or magazine safety disconnects
that could prevent unintentional shootings. The state Attorney General
is not allowed to independently establish handgun safety standards.



SAFETY TRAINING
Is safety training required for handgun buyers? No

No state requirement that handgun buyers receive any safety training at
all. No requirement that handgun buyers demonstrate any familiarity with
gun laws or knowledge about safe handling/safe storage of handguns.

SATURDAY NIGHT SPECIALS
Are there limitations on 'junk' handguns? No

No state restriction on the sale of Saturday night specials or "junk"
handguns. No requirement that handguns meet any safety tests such as a
drop-safety test or a firing-performance test. No restriction on the
sale of snub-nosed handguns that are very small and easy to conceal.


SCHOOL ZONES
Is it illegal for CCW permit holders to carry guns into schools? Yes

Virginia - state law generally prohibits carrying concealed handguns
into schools, even if the gun owner has a CCW permit.

SECONDARY SALES
Are background checks required on 'private' gun sales? No

No state requirement that criminal background checks be done on people
buying firearms at gun shows, swap meets or through newspaper or
internet advertisements. Criminal background checks are only required if
the buyer goes to a federally-licensed gun store - all other sales are
not subject to the background check.


WAITING PERIOD
Is there a waiting period on gun sales? No

No state requirement that there be a waiting period for gun sales beyond
the "instant check" in federal law. Police are not given any additional
time to run a criminal background check to make sure the gun buyer is
not prohibited from acquiring firearms. There is no "cooling off" period
to help prevent crimes of passion.

i feel anyone UNTIL THEY PROVE THEMSELVES to be unfit
(by commiting a felony or becoming mentally dangerous
to themself or others)

should have the right to own a firearm

if they want to carry a firearm
then they should need to obtian a carry permit
to get said permit they should need to take a
safty course and a profiency test
the same as law enforcement takes
and maintain their profiency standard say once a year

falsify these ratings and the tester commits a felony
thus losing their right to own a firearm thus losing
the right to be in a firearms related business

Jean

Son lives there, told how I can buy a gun anytime I want.
Laws seem to have HUGE loopholes.

They sure do, OS.

Adj, a person should be able to own a gun until they "prove themselves
unfit?" Try telling that to the survivors of the VA Tech massacre.

previous post

They sure do, OS.

Adj, a person should be able to own a gun until they "prove themselves
unfit?" Try telling that to the survivors of the VA Tech massacre.
---------

was he not accused of stalking

is that not a felony

who decided not to pursue charges

was he not deemed to be suffering from mental disorder

who dropped the ball on that one
----------

i have not read complete stories of these acusations i have seen so
maybe he was not

but maybe the blame for him being able to obtian weapons goes a little
deeper than what is on the surface

My point also.

I think the ball was dropped on several accounts. I think he was able to
obtain a handgun because it's simply just too easy for 'anyone' to be
able to. That's why I think we need stricter gun control laws.

well you have the right to think that

and maybe they need to be

but maybe they should use the ones that are in place b4 making more

---------------
unrelated example to show reason

if you kid has a half eaten treat and asks for another what is said
ussually

(eat the one you got before you ask for more)
---------------

i know treats relate not to guns but the moral is the same

The answer isn't to create more laws, but to hold those accountable that
"dropped the ball".

maybe laws should be drawn to punish those that do not enforse the ones
they have

maybe those that dropped the ball should be held accountable to some
degree

let's quit saying the gun is the cause

maybe there are 100's of causes and they use the gun as the messenger

how many lawbiding citisens on guns never harmed anyone with
them

why should a law biding person be restricted because of the
few that break the law

take it out on the few not the many
--------------

Did you read my list of the gun "laws" for the State of Virginia? I do
think they need to either create more or, at the very least, replace the
existing ones with new ones.

The people who dropped the ball aren't entirely to blame, either. I
don't care how much this guy was persecuted, etc., I do believe he was
sane enough to know what he was doing. He planned the event, he carried
it out with malice and aforethought. He and he alone is solely
responsible for the murders. Those who dropped the ball are responsible
for not taking reasonable precaution to prevent such an occurrence,
perhaps, but are not ultimately responsible for the event.

I don't think a law-abiding citizen should be restricted in general, but
he/she should be restricted if he/she cannot meet certain standards that
would determine him/her to be responsible enough to carry a firearm,
however.

i can agree to a point

but using that same argument

the ease at which getting the weapon is not to blame although
it may have been a contrbuting factor

he alone commited the murders with for thought and malice

With the obvious planning, and disregard for human life, no law would
have stopped him.

previous post

I don't think a law-abiding citizen should be restricted in general, but
he/she should be restricted if he/she cannot meet certain standards that
would determine him/her to be responsible enough to carry a firearm,
however.
____________

that is already in place

no felony confictions

and no mental patients

what other restrictions would you add

Domestic violence.

= felony, already there

Not in the state of Virginia, it isn't..at least not from my
understanding of it. Seems just about "anyone" can go and buy a gun with
very little background check at all.

I think that a person should have to prove themselves mentally competent
to own a firearm. This should go beyond a 10-item questionnaire from
"Wal~mart" that asks, "Do you consider yourself responsible enough to
own a firearm?"