Topic: Evolution IS a Blind Watchmaker
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Thu 11/27/08 07:30 PM


However, the fact remains that the Anthropic Principle is based on a lot of unproven assumptions. The most prominent cosmologists will be the first to suggest this.


Name one.


The most prominent cosmologists will be first to suggest that the Anthropic Principle is based on unproven assumptions, can you quote one saying that? You just name one and I'll find the quote? Can you do that James?

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Fri 11/28/08 09:47 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcAq9bmCeR0&feature=rec-HM-rev-rn

In this video CDK shows how by taking the example of a watch giving it the properties of living systems it will evolve.

He uses a simple computer simulation program that he wrote to achieve this and for our benefit he has posted the code to his application for all to pick apart.

Its quite beautiful and simple.

Jeremy.



Is there any other place he has all this information besides that video? I got half way through it and quit trying to read it before it changed.

I am an average reader and I like to actually take my time and think about what I read but this video was down right annoying because I not only did not have time to think about what I was reading, I could not read it all before it changed as it went too fast.

Posted code to his application is useless to people who don't understand it and can't pick it apart.

jb

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Fri 11/28/08 09:51 AM
Yea JB I agree CDK is a smart guy but tends to try to cram too much into the 10 minutes that is the max length for unpaid accounts on youtube and I am right there with you, even as an above average speed reader, it is still too fast for proper absorption. I just have to pause it constantly to really get the info to sink in.






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Fri 11/28/08 10:18 AM



However, the fact remains that the Anthropic Principle is based on a lot of unproven assumptions. The most prominent cosmologists will be the first to suggest this.


Name one.


The most prominent cosmologists will be first to suggest that the Anthropic Principle is based on unproven assumptions, can you quote one saying that? You just name one and I'll find the quote? Can you do that James?


I'm still waiting on that name James. Just drop in and give me a name.

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Fri 11/28/08 11:19 AM

Yea JB I agree CDK is a smart guy but tends to try to cram too much into the 10 minutes that is the max length for unpaid accounts on youtube and I am right there with you, even as an above average speed reader, it is still too fast for proper absorption. I just have to pause it constantly to really get the info to sink in.


Thanks, I did not know you could pause it.

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Fri 11/28/08 02:08 PM




However, the fact remains that the Anthropic Principle is based on a lot of unproven assumptions. The most prominent cosmologists will be the first to suggest this.


Name one.


The most prominent cosmologists will be first to suggest that the Anthropic Principle is based on unproven assumptions, can you quote one saying that? You just name one and I'll find the quote? Can you do that James?


I'm still waiting on that name James. Just drop in and give me a name.


At what point should I view your non-response as a concession? You are wrong, you know it and you can't back up your ludicrous claims. Either respond with the name of a cosmologist who has rejected the physics behind the Anthropic Principle or admit you were blowing smoke. Have some self respect man.

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Thu 05/28/09 12:26 PM
Bump for Eljay, or anyone who thinks he has a point.

Eljay's photo
Thu 05/28/09 02:19 PM
Edited by Eljay on Thu 05/28/09 02:24 PM

Bump for Eljay, or anyone who thinks he has a point.


Here's my point. Respond to this one.

Take a frog and put it in a blender. Turn the blender on for - oh, let's say a minute. Now pour the contents into a bowl. How long will it take the contents to mutate back into a frog? And please explain your answer.

Since all of the genetic material needed to mutate into the frog in the first place are present, you should be able to successfully explain how this occurance will take place, since this is how life began in the first place - is it not? No, wait - this is NOT part of the theory of Evolution... or is it? Since Abiogenesis is NOT the beginning of Evolution, and Creationism is a myth. Where did life begin? Let's start with that cornerstone and see where it leads.

For Bushi, or whoever else wishes to comment.

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Thu 05/28/09 02:34 PM


Bump for Eljay, or anyone who thinks he has a point.


Here's my point. Respond to this one.

Take a frog and put it in a blender. Turn the blender on for - oh, let's say a minute. Now pour the contents into a bowl. How long will it take the contents to mutate back into a frog? And please explain your answer.

Since all of the genetic material needed to mutate into the frog in the first place are present, you should be able to successfully explain how this occurance will take place, since this is how life began in the first place - is it not? No, wait - this is NOT part of the theory of Evolution... or is it? Since Abiogenesis is NOT the beginning of Evolution, and Creationism is a myth. Where did life begin? Let's start with that cornerstone and see where it leads.

For Bushi, or whoever else wishes to comment.
Your too much eljay, this is great stuff, Im going to have to copy this over to the leagueofreason. They will LOVE you.

Eljay's photo
Thu 05/28/09 02:55 PM



Bump for Eljay, or anyone who thinks he has a point.


Here's my point. Respond to this one.

Take a frog and put it in a blender. Turn the blender on for - oh, let's say a minute. Now pour the contents into a bowl. How long will it take the contents to mutate back into a frog? And please explain your answer.

Since all of the genetic material needed to mutate into the frog in the first place are present, you should be able to successfully explain how this occurance will take place, since this is how life began in the first place - is it not? No, wait - this is NOT part of the theory of Evolution... or is it? Since Abiogenesis is NOT the beginning of Evolution, and Creationism is a myth. Where did life begin? Let's start with that cornerstone and see where it leads.

For Bushi, or whoever else wishes to comment.
Your too much eljay, this is great stuff, Im going to have to copy this over to the leagueofreason. They will LOVE you.


You're a joy my friend. Keep me posted on your results.

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Thu 05/28/09 10:17 PM

No, wait - this is NOT part of the theory of Evolution... or is it? Since Abiogenesis is NOT the beginning of Evolution, and Creationism is a myth. Where did life begin? Let's start with that cornerstone and see where it leads.


Fortunately, "the theory of evolution" is NOT a single, presumed-perfect storyline which explains, in detail, every aspect of the development of life on this planet. Unfortunately, both sides sometimes argue about it as if it were.

I have no idea how single cell organisms came to exist on this planet. Like you, I don't accept any explanation for this that I've heard from the scientific community. (OTOH, The blended frog comparison is silly, as the circumstances on earth during that time period were completely different then you'd find in that blender, and the time periods involved make the entire history of humanity look like an eye blink.)

Before someone can have an open mind, they must be able to be comfortable with having some things unexplained. If a person emotionally or psychologically MUST have an explanation for something, they run the risk of clinging to a belief system that provides that comfort, regardless of whether its true. Looking at the history of science, it would seem that scientist are wrong about most things, most of the time! This does not stop them from learning and developing better ideas.

Though some people do consider abiogenesis an integral part of 'the theory of evolution', other people don't. Logically, the merit of evolutionary theory as applied to later developments is independent of the merit of theories of abiogenesis.

Quantumthoughtbubble's photo
Thu 05/28/09 10:57 PM

Science has always progressed based on need, innovation moves toward the market place to fill needs.


What's sad is that tons so called progress has been developed as the result of WAR. How many times has the solution caused more problems?

Quantumthoughtbubble's photo
Thu 05/28/09 11:09 PM



If you believe James on this subject, this is a chance to free your mind and actually learn the truth rather than believe James comforting lies. Do the research yourself and try to find a physicist who rejects the physics behind the Anthropic principle. Remember: James said that the Anthropic Principle is "based on total guesses and misunderstanding." Those are his words, rejecting sound and accepted science. Science that is confirmed in the laboratory every day.

BOOYA-KA-SHA

Quantumthoughtbubble's photo
Thu 05/28/09 11:37 PM



The idea of a God who is at war with fallen angels, lusts for blood sacrifices before he can forgive sins, and can't even deliver a promised land without asking his children to slaughter the men, women, and children that are living on that land with no mercy, is truly an assine idea.


That was wrighten to justify there actions in the name of god. The fact that they lied doesn't disprove god.


I'm no an atheist. I believe that we are all spirit. We were spirit before we were born and we'll be spirit after we die. If there is an intelligent spiritual foundation to this universe the most likely truth is that we are it.


So if you are rite than WE created our selve? please explain so that I may better understand how this spirtual foundation got here in the first place.


And even if it was, it certainly doesn't support the Mediterranean mythology. On the contrary, that mythology isn't even a picture of an intelligent God.


than you can probly bet that those stories don't depict th most high GOD of love. On the other hand if we are made in its image why wouldn't it have what most think are only human characteristics. IE: wrath


A full third of his angels turned against him. Clearly, right off the bat we see that his heaven isn't such a great place since a full third of his angels weren't happy there.

a simple case of "the grass is always greener"


Then, instead of just making those unhappy angels disappear he goes to war with them?

If it made the disappear what would that prove? NOTHING it had to let this all play out proveing it's case.

This is already a very unwise God and we haven't even gotten to the part where he creates humans.

You've got that mixed up. They left because they thought that they were better than us. "why should we serve such a lowley creature when they should be worshiping us as gods?" our mythology is full of false gods. I think you would agree with me there.

Jtevans's photo
Fri 05/29/09 12:48 AM
personally who gives a CRAP how the universe was created?why not quit wasting all this time trying to figure out how it was created and instead spend that time figuring out how to make the world better?

s1owhand's photo
Fri 05/29/09 01:32 AM
i liked it even if affinity isn't blindness.

bigsmile

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Fri 05/29/09 08:37 AM

personally who gives a CRAP how the universe was created?why not quit wasting all this time trying to figure out how it was created and instead spend that time figuring out how to make the world better?
Take your own advice. Each is his own master, what others do with there free time should concern you little outside of personal conflict.

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Fri 05/29/09 11:47 AM

personally who gives a CRAP how the universe was created?why not quit wasting all this time trying to figure out how it was created and instead spend that time figuring out how to make the world better?


Because we are creators in training. One day we will create universes. bigsmile :banana:

So it's only natural that we would like to know how to do it. :wink:

Thoughtfulthug's photo
Fri 05/29/09 02:20 PM
Kinda a silly metaphor that nature is a blind watchmaker. Kinda similar to God as an absentee landlord.




The only reason these two topics exist, creationism and evolution, is so some people will not have to do physical work for a living.
That has a germ of a truth there. But can you at least agree that some may percieve your quote as being anti-intellectualism?

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Fri 05/29/09 02:38 PM

Kinda a silly metaphor that nature is a blind watchmaker. Kinda similar to God as an absentee landlord.




The only reason these two topics exist, creationism and evolution, is so some people will not have to do physical work for a living.
That has a germ of a truth there. But can you at least agree that some may percieve your quote as being anti-intellectualism?
The concept of the watchmaker was a religious example of Intelligent design, the blind watch maker was an intellectual parody of that idea.

So the term itself is satire.