They are making up a God. Yes, it is no different at all from any other convention religions. They all 'create' the god to go with the energy.



In Eckankar they spoke of the two headed god who represented the yin and yang or the "negative and positive" nature of this dual universe.

The Christian version of the two headed God was Satan and Jesus, Jehovah being the creator father.

Within the Hindu trinity of Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva, Brahma is the creator, Vishnu the preserver and Shiva the destroyer.

The 'negative' energy and the destroyer is the feminine side and the 'positive' energy, the creator is the masculine side.



Cool

Well, I think what Wicca is making up is simply a way of envisioning God.

I think religions like Greek Mythology and Christianity went way overboard on that. They over-defined God to the point where they actually did 'create' a God that doesn't even exist.

Wicca doesn't create God. It merely helps to create a vision of God. It allows God to be God.

At least that's my view of it.



The way Scott presents Wicca neither the feminine nor the masculine are all positive or all negative. They are both equal and both have positive and negative attributes just like all of nature. But positive and negative aren't in a battle with each other.

In fact, I really like the way Scott handles this one.

He describes it in human terms. We as humans have the ability to be good or bad. We can choose to be only good if we simply make that choice. Just because we have the potential for negativity doesn't mean that we need to be negative.

And we should view this potential in the Gods. But at the same time trust that the Gods are infinitely more able to choose which attributes they wish to express.

In other other words, there's no need to fear a God losing His or Her temper. They aren't going to become 'evil' without good reason.



Cool


Yes it is cool.

But I might add that I'm not sure if I'm viewing it as a 'religion'.

Like I had said in my other post, the very term 'religion' is a bit ill-defined anymore. It means too many different things to different people.

I think a better way for me to view this is that is simply a much better model to use to visualize and communicate with the lifeforces.

The idea that I'm choosing particular 'Gods' to worship is truly a wrong picture.

There is only one lifeforce. And I'm merely using this model as a medium of communiqué because it's so much more loving and meaningful to me.

As I've stated before too, I also like the alchemy aspect of it. I like the elemental magick as a means of communiqué. It something that I can identify with on an intelletual level, and emotional level, a romantic level, and a spiritual level.

So for me it like brings it all together.

On a purely pragmatic level I see it as being the same thing as the 'Law of Attraction' only complete with a very detailed systems of visualization and methods of communiqué.

Or as Ruth has put it. I see the "Law of Attraction" as being nothing more than a scientific view of Wicca stripped of it's visualization tools and it's romantic and elemental communiqué aspects.

I need the romance and the natural alchemy.

I just prefer to talk to God through nature. But that's just a personal preference I suppose.

Wicca may not be for everyone, but it's definitely attractive to me.

I guess it's going to be pretty hard to convince people that I'm not a witch when I'm using my broom to sweep away negative energy huh?



That is a really clever idea whoever came up with that one. No kidding. It turns a whole household chore into a spiritual cleansing experience!

Those witches were geniuses!

They understood the law of attraction and simply built up a very elaborate visualization process based on the elements of nature in a very romantic way complete with poetic incantations.

Simply marvelous!

When I die I want to be reincarnated in a world where everyone is a witch.

Blessed Be!

I had to look it up Ruth to find its origins.

The Rede in its best known form as the "eight words" couplet was first publicly recorded in a speech by Doreen Valiente in 1964. A similar phrase, Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law, appears in Aleister Crowley's works by 1904, in The Book of the Law (though as used by Crowley it is half of a statement and response, the response being "Love is the Law, love under Will"). According to B.A. Robinson of the Ontario Consultants on Religious Tolerance, Crowley adopted this line from François Rabelais, who in 1534 wrote, "DO AS THOU WILT because men that are free, of gentle birth, well bred and at home in civilized company possess a natural instinct that inclines them to virtue and saves them from vice. This instinct they name their honor". Another possible source is St. Augustine.

But then it just goes on and on with potential different sources or variations in the phrase.

Okay, I'm glad you found that. And, Doreen Valiente was High Priestess to Gerald Gardner I believe.

James, you are a witch.

I stand corrected then. I was actually just assuming that this had been attributed to the Goddess.

I think it's actually better if nothing was ever attributed to the Gods. Once we have Gods talking we end up with dogma.

To me "religion" is simply the way in which one connects with the Divine. So, if you make that connection as a Catholic, Buddhist, Wiccan or anything else then your religion is working for you.

Most people need ritual in order to make that connection. The rituals you use determine what religion you are.

I dont know. I kind of enjoy the polarity of the male and female deities but thats probably because this has roots in reality and day to day life. The two contribute to the whole. The objectionable premise for ANY religion in my opinion is the total dominance of either the masculine or feminine elements. Or if one constantly seeks to repress the creative abilities of one or the other as is so often the case with ______ insert name of religion here.

I tend to agree with you on this. But I think a lot of people associate religions with different 'gods'. They don't realize that they are just a means of communiqué.

Well let's face it some relgions would flately deny that they are merely a means of communiqué. They have a need to claim that their dogma is the only way. And that's the problem. They tend to think all religions are as arrogant as theirs.

In any case, at this stage of my involvement with Wicca I wouldn't claim to be Wiccan. I think this is going to take some time to develop. I don't expect instant results, even though I have already experienced some.

Just the same it's going to take me a while to build up a communiqué system that I'm totally comfortable with. In the meantime doing things like sweeping out negative energy is definitely a nice visualization ritual to become involved with. For me it works because I believe it works. And that all there is to that.

If someone were to ask me my religion I would just say that I'm an abstract pantheist who's learning the art of communiqué via the rituals of the ingenious witches of Wicca and yore.

If they find that too confusing owl just tell them I'm a naturalist with a love for alchemy.

If they find that too confusing owl drop them off at the humane center.

The Law of attraction is not "stripped of it's visualization tools."

Without visualization it would not even work. Rather, its visualization tools are unlimited. They are not confined to any particular ritual or vision. Wicca simpy offers some traditional suggestions for aiding in the visualization techniques.




I use my broom to fly.

Yeah well, I might try that after I finish sweeping all the Mediterranean mythologies out of this place.

I have a Dyson.

hey who replaced my broom with a mop!!!

I can only lay claim to a decorative broom with the wooden handle and the corn husk. Ive only ever had it hanging near my wood stove upstairs and Ive never used it to sweep away anything. It might fall apart if I tried.

I've been shopping online at occult stores.

I just wanted to pick up a nice athame and bolline. I could have probably used some knives I already have around here, but I found a couple that I'm really attracted to. They are both athames but I'll use one as a bolline.

Actually I'm kind of creating my own version of Wicca, as Scott Cunningham encourages. I'm looking at the athame as being the feminine ceremonial dagger of the Moon Goddess or High Priestess or Yin Nature of the universe. To me these are all the same concept of the same spiritual essence. This athame will be used to conduct, guide, and store spiritual power.

The second athame (which I'll actually use as a bolline) I will view has the masculine ceremonial dagger of the Horned God or The Great Magician or the Yang Nature of the universe. Again these are all the same concepts in my mind. Owl use this athame as a bolline to collect herbs, flowers, and any other offerings or resources required for rituals. I'm sure this bolline will become charged over time as well.

In fact, both of these daggers are already charged by my appreciation and gratitude of their beauty.

Her athame is 14 inches long. It has Celtic symbols on the handle and a picture of an eagle in flight. I realize that tradition calls for a black handle because black absorbs and stores spiritual power, but the eagle is black, and in my mind it can store unlimited power.

His bolline is 13 inches long. It has a wooden handle and wooden sheathe. Again I realize that a bolline is suppose to be white for purity. But in my mind the wood is naturally pure and is fitting for the Horned God or Alchemist Magician. I'm already associating the bolline with the Horned God anyway which is untraditional. I have decided to include both the Yin and Yang in everything throughout my construction of Wicca.

And that's exactly what I'm going. I'm constructing my own personalized version of Wicca, and I feel this is the way that it should be. Evidently Scott Cunningham does too. Ironically the store where I'm purchasing these athames has a comment about how they feel Wicca has 'deteriorated' into many different individual religious and non-religious magickal practices. I disagree with that view. I think this is truly the heart of it. In ancient times Shamans did indeed each create their own magical spells, tools, and rituals, as well as many different versions of gods and goddesses. So I'm totally comfortable with everyone doing it their own way. I would want to push my methods onto anyone else, nor would I want them to push their methods onto me. But I most certainly would be interested in sharing whatever practices and knowledge may work.

I think in some sense it's like medicine. Some medicines work better for some people, other medicines work better for other people. I think people should use what works best for them. I even personally believe that the Goddess and God would be bored stiff if everyone did everything exactly the same way. That would miss the whole point. The whole point is to be creative. This is what the Goddess and God are all about. To not be creative is to disappoint the gods.

I also believe that religion should be as romantic as it can possible be. And what might seem romantic to one person may not seem romantic to another. Why should religion be romantic? Because it's all about extolling life and creation and the creator. Therefore if it's not romantic, it's dead.

I'm building a romantic vision of Wicca for myself and the gods.

For those who are interested you can see the athame and bolline that I bought for the Goddess and God at the bottom of this web page:

http://www.csonline.net/designer/ideas/magick.htm

I feel like I just bought gifts for my spiritual Mother and Father.

I'm a Christian Minister and one of my best friends , who happens to live in front me, with her husband is a Wiccan.

I don't know which Christians or miguided notions that you are under, which teach that people of differing beliefs can't respect eachother's religious preference.

Those who have that ideology are the people who are not quite sure if they truly believe in what they are learning/teaching.

Most of the time they are trying to convince themselves, when they are attacking another's religious beliefs.

Welcome and thank you for your post.

I know there are Christians and people of other faiths who do respect differing beliefs, but I have come in contact with a lot who don't and who feel it is necessary to attack verbally. There are good and bad people in every religion.

There is much debate in the Wiccan community about "true Wicca". After all, it is a religion created by a man based on the ancient practices/beliefs of Paganism. Wicca works very well for a lot of people. But, just like any other religion there are a lot of people who follow it but don't buy into or practice all of it. These people still call themselves Wiccan and that bothers some of the more fundamentalist Wiccans. Just like "real Catholics" don't care for "cafeteria Catholics".

I'm a take out eat in Catholic.