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| Topic: Iraq | |
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Iraq did not have anything to do with 9/11, our focus should have never gone there so why did it? It is obvious someone in high places wanted Saddam instead of bin laden. We should have never preemptively struck a sovereign nation not responsible for 9/11. After that nothing gets better. Innocent lives have been lost on both sides. We have now stuck our foot in their civil disputes. We are now stuck in the place of staying their for 100 or more years as McCain wants or get out now and let them sort out their own civil disputes. Think of it this way. There are two or more sides in Iraq, ****e, sunni and others, one will not bow to the other so we have to either pick a side or let them do it. I say let them pick who will be in power and then deal with them after THEY have resolved it. Just like our civil war, if a third party had came in on us while we were fighting and told us they were going to "help us" and "democricize us". We would not have liked them at all, we may have even set our personal issues down to rid ourselves of them. We must allow them to be what they are going to be. You bring up a valid point. But here is the result of us letting this happen... It would cause a major genocide. And Iraq wouldn't be run by Iraqi's. The elite that would take over would most likely be under Iranian control. Hence why about half the insurgents we captured were Iranians. Kinda funny how they are helping out the insurgents when they were enemies with Iraq in the first place. This is why there is no simple solution (other that what Fanta said earlier). They can't be dependent on us forever. And we can't just pull out. |
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Iraq did not have anything to do with 9/11, our focus should have never gone there so why did it? It is obvious someone in high places wanted Saddam instead of bin laden. We should have never preemptively struck a sovereign nation not responsible for 9/11. After that nothing gets better. Innocent lives have been lost on both sides. We have now stuck our foot in their civil disputes. We are now stuck in the place of staying their for 100 or more years as McCain wants or get out now and let them sort out their own civil disputes. Think of it this way. There are two or more sides in Iraq, ****e, sunni and others, one will not bow to the other so we have to either pick a side or let them do it. I say let them pick who will be in power and then deal with them after THEY have resolved it. Just like our civil war, if a third party had came in on us while we were fighting and told us they were going to "help us" and "democricize us". We would not have liked them at all, we may have even set our personal issues down to rid ourselves of them. We must allow them to be what they are going to be. You bring up a valid point. But here is the result of us letting this happen... It would cause a major genocide. And Iraq wouldn't be run by Iraqi's. The elite that would take over would most likely be under Iranian control. Hence why about half the insurgents we captured were Iranians. Kinda funny how they are helping out the insurgents when they were enemies with Iraq in the first place. This is why there is no simple solution (other that what Fanta said earlier). They can't be dependent on us forever. And we can't just pull out. Who can say accurately what will happen? Not you nor me. Nor could anyone say what was going to happen from our civil war but we resolved it and we need to stop presuming a superior position to them. |
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You do make an excellent point Dragoness. The odds, however, are in that favor. But maybe people will come around. One thing is for certain. If you take away the food we give them, and the medical treatment, as well as let people go nuts in the streets, millions more will suffer and die. The outcome from all the death and suffering is one of uncertainty as you have mentioned...
 Iran won't necessarily win. We just know that their military is very interested in them winning.
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Edited by
madisonman
on
Sun 04/27/08 05:22 PM
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I find it hard to imagine that by blowing up the Iraqi infrastruture didnt cause hundreds of thousands of deaths. I do not think the average GI is takeing target practise on them either but all the things we did to win the war have caused countles deaths by disease and disaster. over a million dead is the estimate and over 2 million have fled the country. Its all on our doorstep and it is a giant FK up. We are going broke funding a war based on lies. No matter how much lipstick you put on this pig its still ugly
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Edited by
sam53
on
Sun 04/27/08 05:38 PM
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Who can say accurately what will happen? Not you nor me. Nor could anyone say what was going to happen from our civil war but we resolved it and we need to stop presuming a superior position to them. ................................................................ In my opinion ,and according to what I understood from various experts in politics ,The war started for three main reasons : 1: For oil .2: To have permanent military bases over there .3 : To enable Israel to control the middle east . 4 : It has nothing to do with the opposing factions there .  !. Instead of pretending to help Iraqis ,you should think about how many Americans need real help right now in health ,education ,social services ,mortgages ....etc. The point is : who is kidding whom these days ?. |
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Edited by
Drivinmenutz
on
Sun 04/27/08 05:36 PM
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I find it hard to imagine that by blowing up the Iraqi infrastruture didnt cause hundreds of thousands of deaths. I do not think the average GI is takeing target practise on them either but all the things we did to win the war have caused countles deaths by disease and disaster. over a million dead is the estimate and over 2 million have fled the country. Its all on our doorstep and it is a giant FK up. We are going broke funding a war based on lies. No matter how much lipstick you put on this pig its still ugly you make it sound like we carpet bombed the place. Unfortunately this view was brought to you by your local press. One million dead includes those that died form natural causes my friend. And those that have been killed on the streets as a result from normal street crimes, and car crashes. There are almost a million americans that die on a yearly bases. |
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I find it hard to imagine that by blowing up the Iraqi infrastruture didnt cause hundreds of thousands of deaths. I do not think the average GI is takeing target practise on them either but all the things we did to win the war have caused countles deaths by disease and disaster. over a million dead is the estimate and over 2 million have fled the country. Its all on our doorstep and it is a giant FK up. We are going broke funding a war based on lies. No matter how much lipstick you put on this pig its still ugly you make it sound like we carpet bombed the place. Unfortunately this view was brought to you by yur local press. |
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I find it hard to imagine that by blowing up the Iraqi infrastruture didnt cause hundreds of thousands of deaths. I do not think the average GI is takeing target practise on them either but all the things we did to win the war have caused countles deaths by disease and disaster. over a million dead is the estimate and over 2 million have fled the country. Its all on our doorstep and it is a giant FK up. We are going broke funding a war based on lies. No matter how much lipstick you put on this pig its still ugly you make it sound like we carpet bombed the place. Unfortunately this view was brought to you by yur local press. we didn't blow the sewers apart. Engineers tried to install sewers in Sadr City. But the wuhabi kept blowing them up. So now there is just a big hole in the middle of the streets and they are angry about that too. A bunch of two faced morons. And yea, if you read further you will find they have sufficient water. First thing we do if we take out a structure is to rebuild it. There is no plague there. Disease wasn't set in by us, at least not on any large scale. There was disease there already. And they have better medical treatment as a result of us. |
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ok i am going to stop the argument in here. I know more about this situation than most of you. I have witnessed it first hand. Half of what we were doing there were humanitarian missions. But you guys are way too set in your ways to start believe the truth now. I have my memories, you have your CNN and ABC.
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why were we instaling sewers then if not to replace the ones blown up?
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because they didn't have them in the first place.
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ok i am going to stop the argument in here. I know more about this situation than most of you. I have witnessed it first hand. Half of what we were doing there were humanitarian missions. But you guys are way too set in your ways to start believe the truth now. I have my memories, you have your CNN and ABC. ................................................................ Who does not know that CNN and ABC support the government's agenda ?. Who is kidding whom ?. The truth is that the war is brutal ,unnecessary ,unjustified ,illegal ,abusive and has less support among people around the world . It created more problems to millions of innocent people and put innocent people in graves . It is bullying in the first degree . Anyone who supports this war has no idea about politics at all . A real man or a real woman should obey only his or her conscience and do what is right and absolutely not what other crazy nuts tell him or tell her . !.
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calm down... I'm no politician. I am honest. CNN and ABC support the democratic government for the most part. Any yes, they are against the war as a result.
Maybe we should stop focusing on whether we should have gone over in the first place and focus on what we can do now. The lives we ruined were under Saddams elite. Yes they have it much worse now that we are there. But, we should focus on what to do now. Then conduct and investigation on the matter. This investigation would have to be conducted by several nuetral agencies to avoid being biased. I can understand false information. But we cant tolerate manipulation IF IF IF this were the case. You are right wars are brutal. No one knows this more than those who have been in the front line. I get it. Yes. I HAVE LIVED IT. And yes i would do it again. Be careful when using politics as a tool for reasoning and solving conflict. |
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http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=uncovered+the+whole+truth+about+the+iraq+war&sitesearch= Your darling George was fibbing. Mind you so was the rest of his administration. ok, i dont have a problem with people questioning this administration. I think they should. But here is the supposed REAL truth. The Bush administration wasn't acting alone. Democrats and republicans alike are just as guilty as your loathed enemy, Bush. This includes your precious Clintons and even the Rockefellers. It's called control. The government wants more of it. Democrats believe in expanding the government and them taking control of more things. The republicans believe in taking away certain rights that enable you to combat them. (Although democrats are guilty of this too when it comes to gun control) Put them together and you are nearing total control little by little. The war may have been instigated to cause fear. Hell, according to this theory 9/11 was also instigated for the same reasons. To enable this like the patiot act to pass. (Not sure i really believe either one) Then you have the clinton administration that focused on making us more dependent on just a few major food industries. They are also the ones responsible for genetically "enhancing" food production, which is why veggies have way fewer nutients, and why you standard milk can cause breast cancer. Why did they do this you ask? Well, more control. Make people dependent on you for as many things as possible. Food, water, shelter, OIL!, security, etc. (Oh yeah, don't forget the policies that screw up education) Then you can literally control them and get very very rich in the process. Honestly i don't really believe 9/11 was faked. Niether do i think the Iraq war was false. Although i'm not closed off to the idea because it just makes too much sense sometimes. But just the same. The Clintons are just as guilty of false claims to start conflicts, as well as, making us dependent on a few select industries, as the Bush family. Democrats and republicans are in this together. This is why we need some more people in office, trying to limit the powers of the federal government, as well as shrink it. Give a bit more power back to the states. Get rid of the patriot act and NAFTA, and instead of overtaxing farmers in our country forcing them to sell their land (notice how the land always gets developed), we should give them huge tax breaks. And we really should prevent the destruction of the already invented sources of energy that literally makes gasoline obselete. Oh yeah, and get rid of ethanol since it;s boosting the cost of local food production. So far, none of the 3 candidates really want to change any of this.   People need to place more blame where it belongs instead of attacking a single administration. Okay, done ranting.... sorry yall. RIGHT ON!
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why thank you
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augh....again drivin...you are saying what i have been trying to say in the millions of war debate threads out there...no one listens...it's because you are a man isn't it???? lol
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Edited by
madisonman
on
Mon 04/28/08 01:03 PM
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Iam simply stunned by your right wingers. If you cared to look at all the lies told about Iraq and then look at the reality of now, you would simply see you are victims of self delusion
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Your left wingers are equally as destructive my friend. I can understand you wanting answers. I will admit that there are shadey things going onin the government all the time. Iraq was probably no exception. I retain a certain critical thinking status because without a proper investigation it's almost impossible to pick sides. I don't pretend to know that none of the information was falsified. Niether of us really do.
Notice how i don't often argue about lack of justification for entering that country. It's because i probably would have done things differently. What i hate is when people try to convince me how the U.S. are so much worse than Saddam. How NOTHING good never has or will ever come from this. What i hate is when people try to make you feel bad about dying iraqis then they turn around and say we should just pull out. You know and i know that this would lead to a much higher body count then America alone would ever be allowed to achieve. So this is contradicting. You guys bring up excellent points. But sometimes A. try to place ALL emphasis on the bush administation which is a fallacy. and B. Are pretty much biased towards anything republican. You know and i know the picture is bigger. The war in Iraq isn't as big a problem as some others. Our problem is we are becoming dependent on our government for oil,food, education, health care, etc. Think about it. Both the left and the right wings are removing our rights and taking more control. At this rate by the time im old and grey there will beno privacy, cameras everwhere, people will be walking around and monitored with computer chips in their hands, you will only be allowed one child (like china), the U.S., Canada, and Mexico will all beunder the same laws/military/economy/etc. and unless your the society's elite, we will all be living at the poverty level. |
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Edited by
sam53
on
Mon 04/28/08 03:03 PM
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The only solution now is to get out and leave the people control their destiny . Congressman Dennis Kucinich from Ohio,
has a program to pull out and stop the war . It is easy to find a good solution to any problem but those who want to stay find billions of excuses to justify their agenda . !.
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The only solution now is to get out and leave the people control their destiny . Congressman Dennis Kucinich from Ohio, has a program to pull out and stop the war . It is easy to find a good solution to any problem but those who want to stay find billions of excuses to justify their agenda . !. this business of telling the world of our withdrawl plans is unprecidented in the history of warfare and a recipe for disaster.... for the Iraquis. |
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