Just so you can be happy.. one last time...
..hmmm.. I'm posting this topic on behalf of all those women and men out there... that are stuck in a loveless sexless relationship... but can't justify throwing it away... just to satisfy their need to be happy and in a loving sexual relationship one more time.. before going to the grave so to speak.... I have come across quite a few women in this situation... and we have all read the post from men.. that are in a similar situation... how do you justify throwing everything away or walking away from everything you and your partner have built up over the years.. not to mention justifying screwing up your kids if you have any..
Which seems to be the case for most people in this situation .. because they do not wish to damage their children.. with a divorce..... now in this scenario these people are not in a angry hateful relationship... they have simply outgrown each other.. no longer have any common interests..
.. it is simply a matter of growing apart from one another.. . Perhaps they are no longer sexually interested in their partner.... are they just no longer find them a intellectual challenge.... in other words the spark has gone out.. and yes!! they have tried over the years to rekindle the interest and passion..
But have come to realize ,they are now just two different people.. no longer going in the same direction.... I have come across these women ,who are looking for casual dating.. only.!!.. I really never know what to tell them..

Sure I could say get a divorce.. but that is like throwing the cow away just because the milk has gone sour.... are throwing a great piece of artwork away.. just because it has a little scratch on it..

Hmm... so should you tell them stop being so selfish and thinking of your own happiness..... work harder on your marriage even though you know it's not worth working on... I suppose they just want their cake and icecream too...
They want to be in a fun.. desirable relationship again.. and then go home to the relationship.. the life, they have built and worked so hard for... even though they know they are now living a lie.... but they find themselves now struggling... with the question of how do I make myself happy without hurting everyone..I love.. the age old question do you put your own happiness and self gratification... your need to be happy one more time. Your need to be in a happy full relationship

over the stability.. over the needs of your children.. and their emotional development. and the illusion you have created of a happy home in your now relationship /marriage....

.. I guess the real question is...
What it all boils down to is....is ,your own happiness really all that matters....oui..
..

Well this strikes me odd and close to home, I know someone that did this for years. They stayed married for the children's sake. They continued to build their lives around the kids. When the last one graduated they just looked at each other and said well that is it then. They went their separate ways divided everything up fairly etc...

Then a few years later they were at the eldest child's wedding together. The Child looked at both of them and told them that "he would never do what they did waste the best part of his life staying in a marriage for kids. It was hell growing up knowing that his parents were together because of him and his siblings.".

I did witness this and just about choked at this couple, since they had thought they were always doing the right thing sacrificing their lives for their children's... Yeah right in doing this they made everyone in the household miserable.. Two of their children have sworn off marriage forever because they saw how miserable their parents were.

I was in a loveless marriage{my second one}, did everything to bring it back. It was dead and nothing would change it. I was actually thankful to him for cheating, so we could end this farce we were living. I had my life he had his and there was nothing that would ever breath life into it again. We are great friends today...

Nope if it is dead time to bury it and move on.

As far as selling the cow because the milk went sour..Nope time to breed her again. Art work with a scratch depends on the artwork and where the scratch is. IMO...

.. yes I thought the cow and the artwork put the point across nicely..lol.. and you're saying put your happiness above all .. else..?

I think when one of the two parties hasn't the same outlook on the commitment and wants/needs to leave it is better to let go...and seperate.

and I witnessed something very similar to Sitkas' description except that the kids asked their parents to separate.
The boys were 12 & 14 years old at the time...and their parents split 2 years later and now have a more "quiet" life...

Not really putting everyone's happiness in perspective.

When a couple are together for nothing more than monetary or children it shows in all that they do. Everyone feels it.

So two people are staying together for what??? Because of assets? Not enough reason to give up happiness and contentment in life. Life is too short.

There are ways to end a marriage or relationship without all the bitterness.

..yes.. I agree if the couples unhappiness with each other is obvious to the children.. thats not healthy... but in this scenario I presented above.. there really is no ugliness in the home.... I am sure this couple argues like all couples do..
But from what I understand they keep their differences away from there children..... seems to make sense..
... which makes the question of putting your own happiness above all else.. even a harder one... from what I understand.. is it really only this other person that is unhappy..hmm

I am willing to bet my retirement fund that this isn't true..

The couple I gave as an example, didn't ever argue in front of their children. They were good people just drifted apart.

When two people are in a loveless relationship no one is happy. Take the kids out of the equation for an instance. I mean really if only one is admitting to unhappiness then someone IMO is in denial. Period.

I still you have two people, really lonely, depressed, and unhappy.

So making the decision to end it how can that be selfish and putting your happiness above anything else.

..well.. yes of course you are right..lol... but for what I understand they are both somewhat unhappy..
... but in this scenario .. their partner is content with the way things are.... not willing to change.... very happy to keep things the way they are.... I suppose content is the word..yup..

Will just keep adding layers to this scenario as we go along..lmao.... but like finding true happiness for yourself... it is complex

It's always all about me.

..well..yes.. it is I suppose...lol..
... when it comes right down to it..
Is your happiness more important than the happiness of those around you.?

My oldest son and his wife have been married 14 years, they have 2 children
(10 and 7), they have lived separate lives for the last 2 years, yet live under
The same roof, as they say it's cost effective....

Yet they seem to not see what this is doing to their children, the have withdrawn
This past year, coming from the mouth of a 10 year old, why don't mommy and daddy
Just live in different houses..

They love their parents, yet they feel the distance that this separation has
And is causing in there once calm family environment.

So in my opinion as I have stated to my son, he needs to let go of the comfort
And move on, so the boys can live a normal life, with both his parents, in a
More stable environment, meaning different homes..

I believe you need to be happy in your own life, in order to help our children be happy, safe and okay
With change.

Hmm.. so what you're saying is no matter how hard these people try to keep their loss of interest in each other away from their children.

The children will still pick up on it..
Hmm.... and somehow it's better to split up the family.. cause emotional and financial upheaval... then it is to seek out happiness on the side.. and then go home and be unhappy.. quietly while putting on a happy face for everyone.. at home.....
So happiness for yourself... without a painful cost.. to those around you.. is not achievable..

20 years
no cheating on either side
tried counseling
did not work
you cannot change someone who does not want to change
now ..knowing this
could I have stayed for the sake of my children
and the loss of my own soul

yep..that was an option

They have been there done that thing on the side, yes the children pick up on it,

What is that teaching them, ya.. It's okay to have a thing on the side boys... And then come home and
Play happy family...

Honesty with our children is the most important, and a split can be made... It does not always mean financial ruin,
Every situation is different,,,,,

From experience, my adult children came to me and asked me why I waited so long to divorce there father...
LoL.. I said I did not want to ruin there lives with a nasty divorce, they stated they knew things were off with
There father and me, and wished we would have spoken to them sooner about it...

.wow.. first I must say I'm a little disappointed..lol.. I was expecting something a little more highbrow from you a little more analytical..... I would have thought this kind of head shrinking would be right up your alley..lmao.....

. And of course at some point the inevitable will happen.. a separation then the divorce.... in the scenario i have put down here... that comes from some women I've chatted with online... they all seem to want to wait to the children or at a appropriate age if there's such a thing..... but they feel like they do not want to go without finding some peace of happiness now..
.. yes I suppose their unwillingness to throw away their comfortable life...
. And to put their children through a divorce /split home and all of that fun stuff... keeps them right where they are..... but I struggle with faulting them for trying to find some happiness now.... and of course.. I know and tell them .. about the many issues to come.. when you try to stay at home and find your happiness outside of the house... what happens when you meet this certain someone that truly fulfills your desires and makes you happy..... are you going to tell them you're married. ?... what happens when you fall in love with them.... now you are going to be miserable living a lie at home and living a lie with this other person..
Oh true happiness.. you are a wicked goal to achieve..lol

I tend to agree with Sitka:

"When two people are in a loveless relationship no one is happy. Take the kids out of the equation for an instance. I mean really if only one is admitting to unhappiness then someone IMO is in denial. Period."

However I know of an acquaintance (male !!) I need to say who pretends something similar to your scenario:
He has a mistress on the side and he believes his wife hasn't...they do family trips and so fort...he says his relationship is great with his children and his wife is content...with the Visa...

- Happiness itself is so difficult to define that it isn't really an argument...
Why should happiness be selfish ?
So many people don't even know what makes them happy anymore in the long run...how could they possibly judge about the happiness of their surroundings.

Making "sacrifices" to keep up appearances...

I think it's BS...

to ask a woman why she stays in a less than satisfying marriage...

well we all have our own justifications..

read all the "how to be a good little wife and mommy" books
you can get your hands on
ya read all the women's magazine articles on how to spice up married life
ya do the date night
ya try hobbies you can both do together
ya try to be more patient, more understanding, more supportive, and affectionate..

trying to convince yourself that the more you give
the more you will receive

you put the needs of the family above your own needs..
ya put your own needs so far back on the burner
you try to convince yourself ..


you no longer have them
you are a mom machine
that those needs for love, affection, caring and consideration
are for the weak

you shoulder that load baby
you put that head down
and you keep on going
year in and year out



and ooooooo hell ya
I have psycho analyzed myself more than once on that one

..so... no BS just cut right to your own right to your own happiness

Yep I agree...children feel when things are wrong and fake...and the change will help to adapt. Also nowadays it's so common to find those situations.
I think living in a home where everyone fakes his mood is more oppressing than having no money...(although that is tough too !) lol