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| Topic: Open secrets? | |
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Edited by
Pansytilly
on
Sat 02/21/15 09:42 PM
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wow ..you really know how to shake things up. and to think ,I carried my Kleenex box! all the way over here for this..   ..
Well... I was hoping for a couple of serious inputs....  
I know, right ? 
I started a serious topic and it was when I first joined (can't remember what it was about) and all the answers were people having fun, I remember thinking WTF.
This is true, I can relate to this, at first it kinda pissed me off, now I am learning to ride on it. It must be the profile pic, right? 
No one takes Puppy Dawg with bunny ears seriously.... 
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I heard Jesus was a vampire .. he rose from the dead .. Because they put the nails in the wrong place And when he said this is my blood ..... It was vampire blood and you know what drinking that stuff does :-)   
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wow ..you really know how to shake things up. and to think ,I carried my Kleenex box! all the way over here for this.. ..
Well...considering what I've been reading on this section of the forums.... I was hoping for a couple of serious inputs.... 
You can leave a box of Kleenex here
Now....Pansy, get me a few sheets of that Kleenex! I need to wipe my laugh tears and blow my nose!! I ought to find Milo to lick that for you. 
Yikes......keep that pooch away! You never know whether he has been licking......someone's hands??? 
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I'm going to try to be serious. Lilith is speculation, and most Biblical scholars will say she did not exist. Nothing in the Bible suggests she did. The childhood of Jesus is generally explained by the fact that he was simply the son of a carpenter and that his childhood, except for when he engaged the religious leaders when he was approximately 12 years old, was really not noteworthy. I'm not able to answer your other points, but to those who were joking about the wise men, we assume there were 3 because they brought frankincense, myrrh, and gold, but 3 gifts doesn't mean there were 3 wise men. There may have been 30 for all we know. My advice would be to go into a random church and discuss these issues with the preacher, or if you know a Biblical scholar/historian, that's also a good resource.
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I'm going to try to be serious. Lilith is speculation, and most Biblical scholars will say she did not exist. Nothing in the Bible suggests she did. The childhood of Jesus is generally explained by the fact that he was simply the son of a carpenter and that his childhood, except for when he engaged the religious leaders when he was approximately 12 years old, was really not noteworthy. I'm not able to answer your other points, but to those who were joking about the wise men, we assume there were 3 because they brought frankincense, myrrh, and gold, but 3 gifts doesn't mean there were 3 wise men. There may have been 30 for all we know. My advice would be to go into a random church and discuss these issues with the preacher, or if you know a Biblical scholar/historian, that's also a good resource. There were 4 wise men, the helicopter gun ship killed the 4th. Pontious Pilate was the pilot, how do you think he got his name
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I'm going to try to be serious. Lilith is speculation, and most Biblical scholars will say she did not exist. Nothing in the Bible suggests she did. The childhood of Jesus is generally explained by the fact that he was simply the son of a carpenter and that his childhood, except for when he engaged the religious leaders when he was approximately 12 years old, was really not noteworthy. I'm not able to answer your other points, but to those who were joking about the wise men, we assume there were 3 because they brought frankincense, myrrh, and gold, but 3 gifts doesn't mean there were 3 wise men. There may have been 30 for all we know. My advice would be to go into a random church and discuss these issues with the preacher, or if you know a Biblical scholar/historian, that's also a good resource. There were 4 wise men, the helicopter gun ship killed the 4th. Pontious Pilate was the pilot, how do you think he got his name
I appreciate a joke as much as anyone, but Pansy asked a serious question. I was trying to give a serious answer. That^^^^is funny though.
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I'm going to try to be serious. Lilith is speculation, and most Biblical scholars will say she did not exist. Nothing in the Bible suggests she did. The childhood of Jesus is generally explained by the fact that he was simply the son of a carpenter and that his childhood, except for when he engaged the religious leaders when he was approximately 12 years old, was really not noteworthy. I'm not able to answer your other points, but to those who were joking about the wise men, we assume there were 3 because they brought frankincense, myrrh, and gold, but 3 gifts doesn't mean there were 3 wise men. There may have been 30 for all we know. My advice would be to go into a random church and discuss these issues with the preacher, or if you know a Biblical scholar/historian, that's also a good resource. There were 4 wise men, the helicopter gun ship killed the 4th. Pontious Pilate was the pilot, how do you think he got his name
I appreciate a joke as much as anyone, but Pansy asked a serious question. I was trying to give a serious answer. That^^^^is funny though.
I appreciate the laughs as well
As much as I appreciate the serious answer 
I'm not too interested in bible scholars on these matters...I'm sure a lot of stuff gets covered up by the church regarding these things, and I'm pretty sure there are historical texts that were purposely not included in the bible. I have heard myths about Lilith being spawned by the devil prior to Eve's creation, and so tried to corrupt Adam sexually that she was cast out and became the mother of demons... We do know that Jesus had siblings... And I've heard of theories that he travelled throughout the east up to China prior to returning to Jerusalem in his 30s to fulfill his mission... Some say he was suppose to have taken the form of Buddha that time.. As for the 3 wise men... Christmas on dec 25 is supposed to be an arbitrary date to follow a pagan practice in order to convert people... Pontious Pilate was just trying to keep his hands clean... Herod on the other hand, pulled the trigger but missed his target... |
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I'm going to try to be serious. Lilith is speculation, and most Biblical scholars will say she did not exist. Nothing in the Bible suggests she did. The childhood of Jesus is generally explained by the fact that he was simply the son of a carpenter and that his childhood, except for when he engaged the religious leaders when he was approximately 12 years old, was really not noteworthy. I'm not able to answer your other points, but to those who were joking about the wise men, we assume there were 3 because they brought frankincense, myrrh, and gold, but 3 gifts doesn't mean there were 3 wise men. There may have been 30 for all we know. My advice would be to go into a random church and discuss these issues with the preacher, or if you know a Biblical scholar/historian, that's also a good resource. There were 4 wise men, the helicopter gun ship killed the 4th. Pontious Pilate was the pilot, how do you think he got his name
I appreciate a joke as much as anyone, but Pansy asked a serious question. I was trying to give a serious answer. That^^^^is funny though.
I appreciate the laughs as well
As much as I appreciate the serious answer
I'm not too interested in bible scholars on these matters...I'm sure a lot of stuff gets covered up by the church regarding these things, and I'm pretty sure there are historical texts that were purposely not included in the bible. I have heard myths about Lilith being spawned by the devil prior to Eve's creation, and so tried to corrupt Adam sexually that she was cast out and became the mother of demons... We do know that Jesus had siblings... And I've heard of theories that he travelled throughout the east up to China prior to returning to Jerusalem in his 30s to fulfill his mission... Some say he was suppose to have taken the form of Buddha that time.. As for the 3 wise men... Christmas on dec 25 is supposed to be an arbitrary date to follow a pagan practice in order to convert people... Pontious Pilate was just trying to keep his hands clean... Herod on the other hand, pulled the trigger but missed his target... Actually, we don't know that Jesus had siblings. We also don't know that he was an only child. The brothers and sisters mentioned may be literal brothers and sisters, or because of the community, everyone was called brother and sister, so perhaps it was in that context. It's also possible that his brothers and sisters were a combination of both. No one really knows for sure. Just like no one knows when Jesus was born. Some historians say March or April, some say September or October, very few say some other time of year. Christmas is celebrated in December because early Christians, in order to convert pagans, chose a time when they were already celebrating. |
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I'm going to try to be serious. Lilith is speculation, and most Biblical scholars will say she did not exist. Nothing in the Bible suggests she did. The childhood of Jesus is generally explained by the fact that he was simply the son of a carpenter and that his childhood, except for when he engaged the religious leaders when he was approximately 12 years old, was really not noteworthy. I'm not able to answer your other points, but to those who were joking about the wise men, we assume there were 3 because they brought frankincense, myrrh, and gold, but 3 gifts doesn't mean there were 3 wise men. There may have been 30 for all we know. My advice would be to go into a random church and discuss these issues with the preacher, or if you know a Biblical scholar/historian, that's also a good resource. There were 4 wise men, the helicopter gun ship killed the 4th. Pontious Pilate was the pilot, how do you think he got his name
I appreciate a joke as much as anyone, but Pansy asked a serious question. I was trying to give a serious answer. That^^^^is funny though.
I appreciate the laughs as well
As much as I appreciate the serious answer
I'm not too interested in bible scholars on these matters...I'm sure a lot of stuff gets covered up by the church regarding these things, and I'm pretty sure there are historical texts that were purposely not included in the bible. I have heard myths about Lilith being spawned by the devil prior to Eve's creation, and so tried to corrupt Adam sexually that she was cast out and became the mother of demons... We do know that Jesus had siblings... And I've heard of theories that he travelled throughout the east up to China prior to returning to Jerusalem in his 30s to fulfill his mission... Some say he was suppose to have taken the form of Buddha that time.. As for the 3 wise men... Christmas on dec 25 is supposed to be an arbitrary date to follow a pagan practice in order to convert people... Pontious Pilate was just trying to keep his hands clean... Herod on the other hand, pulled the trigger but missed his target... Actually, we don't know that Jesus had siblings. We also don't know that he was an only child. The brothers and sisters mentioned may be literal brothers and sisters, or because of the community, everyone was called brother and sister, so perhaps it was in that context. It's also possible that his brothers and sisters were a combination of both. No one really knows for sure. Just like no one knows when Jesus was born. Some historians say March or April, some say September or October, very few say some other time of year. Christmas is celebrated in December because early Christians, in order to convert pagans, chose a time when they were already celebrating. I think he did have siblings... Younger ones, of course ... Altho I don't know about Joseph's status prior to taking Mary as his wife tho.... A prophet is not accepted by his own household...
But eventually he called his disciples as friends, brothers and sisters because of spiritual patronage. So it's kind of ironic to be celebrating his birth on the basis of a pagan practice .... ...
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I'm gonna shake things up a bit... Who here knows about any "lost" bible tales? Like the childhood of Jesus... Adam and Lilith... Cain after his banishment... Who were the sons and daughters of men that tempted the people of God... And where did they come from... Etc...etc.. Would like to know the info currently circulating... Oh, please no Jesus and Magdalene speculations.... Just info... No gossip... No alien talk either... Thanks much! Christendom, has only 4 commonly held gospel accounts of Jesus while alive. They are Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, but there are other gospels that The Church doesn't usually have as part of the Bible as well. There is actually a Gospel Of Barnabas that is quite lengthy, for example. The Quran actually has some references to events in Jesus' life as well, that aren't common knowledge in the Bible. Jesus speaks as a baby, even on the day of his birth: Surah 3: 46 Surah 19: 22-34 Jesus is granted, by Allah's leave, the ability to form the likeness of a bird from clay and to cause it to come to life: Surah 5: 110 In the same Surah, Jesus' Disciples who were very hungry, had requested Jesus if he could request a miraculous table with food for themselves, again by Allah's leave: Surah 5: 112-115 None of these Quranic references are in the Bible that is commonly held today, but I have no cause to doubt they are hidden away somewhere in the Vatican archives. |
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I've heard of that story but not of turning clay into a bird... More returning a bird to life after accidentally killing it when he was still a young boy..
The second one might've been a reference to the multiplication of fishes and bread. I'm sure they do have some texts hidden away somewhere, they certainly had the resources before to gather and filter such references unopposed... Gnostic and heretical as they might be, I'm sure there are some that can be considered as possible... Who knows, maybe more Dead Sea Scrolls will be discovered in the coming days. |
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I'm going to try to be serious. Lilith is speculation, and most Biblical scholars will say she did not exist. Nothing in the Bible suggests she did. The childhood of Jesus is generally explained by the fact that he was simply the son of a carpenter and that his childhood, except for when he engaged the religious leaders when he was approximately 12 years old, was really not noteworthy. I'm not able to answer your other points, but to those who were joking about the wise men, we assume there were 3 because they brought frankincense, myrrh, and gold, but 3 gifts doesn't mean there were 3 wise men. There may have been 30 for all we know. My advice would be to go into a random church and discuss these issues with the preacher, or if you know a Biblical scholar/historian, that's also a good resource. There were 4 wise men, the helicopter gun ship killed the 4th. Pontious Pilate was the pilot, how do you think he got his name
I appreciate a joke as much as anyone, but Pansy asked a serious question. I was trying to give a serious answer. That^^^^is funny though.
I appreciate the laughs as well
As much as I appreciate the serious answer
I'm not too interested in bible scholars on these matters...I'm sure a lot of stuff gets covered up by the church regarding these things, and I'm pretty sure there are historical texts that were purposely not included in the bible. I have heard myths about Lilith being spawned by the devil prior to Eve's creation, and so tried to corrupt Adam sexually that she was cast out and became the mother of demons... We do know that Jesus had siblings... And I've heard of theories that he travelled throughout the east up to China prior to returning to Jerusalem in his 30s to fulfill his mission... Some say he was suppose to have taken the form of Buddha that time.. As for the 3 wise men... Christmas on dec 25 is supposed to be an arbitrary date to follow a pagan practice in order to convert people... Pontious Pilate was just trying to keep his hands clean... Herod on the other hand, pulled the trigger but missed his target... Actually, we don't know that Jesus had siblings. We also don't know that he was an only child. The brothers and sisters mentioned may be literal brothers and sisters, or because of the community, everyone was called brother and sister, so perhaps it was in that context. It's also possible that his brothers and sisters were a combination of both. No one really knows for sure. Just like no one knows when Jesus was born. Some historians say March or April, some say September or October, very few say some other time of year. Christmas is celebrated in December because early Christians, in order to convert pagans, chose a time when they were already celebrating. I think he did have siblings... Younger ones, of course ... Altho I don't know about Joseph's status prior to taking Mary as his wife tho.... A prophet is not accepted by his own household...
But eventually he called his disciples as friends, brothers and sisters because of spiritual patronage. So it's kind of ironic to be celebrating his birth on the basis of a pagan practice .... ...
Believing it is fine, but again, we don't know as a matter of history. Personally, without historical evidence, I'm not willing to opine on this particular matter. |
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Edited by
Pansytilly
on
Sun 02/22/15 08:53 PM
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I think he did have siblings... Younger ones, of course ... Altho I don't know about Joseph's status prior to taking Mary as his wife tho.... A prophet is not accepted by his own household...
But eventually he called his disciples as friends, brothers and sisters because of spiritual patronage. So it's kind of ironic to be celebrating his birth on the basis of a pagan practice .... ...
Believing it is fine, but again, we don't know as a matter of history. Personally, without historical evidence, I'm not willing to opine on this particular matter. Jesus' brothers are mentioned in several Bible verses. Matthew 12:46, Luke 8:19, and Mark 3:31 say that Jesus’ mother and brothers came to see Him. The Bible tells us that Jesus had four brothers: James, Joseph, Simon, and Judas (Matthew 13:55). The Bible also tells us that Jesus had sisters, but they are not named or numbered (Matthew 13:56). In John 7:1-10, His brothers go on to the festival while Jesus stays behind. In Acts 1:14, His brothers and mother are described as praying with the disciples. Galatians 1:19 mentions that James was Jesus’ brother. The most natural conclusion of these passages is to interpret that Jesus had actual blood half-siblings. -disclaimer- I just copied this ^^^ But I do believe that he had siblings... It would be weird if he didn't, considering Mary was practically just a teen when she got married to Joseph... I think the reason a lot of things such as these are not expounded on in the bible is because it would not add any importance in it's main purpose as a book of faith... The only time I can recall Jesus calling his followers as any family member is when when he said, "who is my mother, and who are my brothers..." Which does reference his acknowledgement of the dichotomy between his mortal and spiritual family. Regarding opinions with or without historical evidence... History may also be considered as... A matter of opining a well marketed perspective... Yes? Which is partly why I posed my original question, and not too keen on looking for much scholarly answers...
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There is much that isn't included in specifically the bible about Jesus. The amount of scriptures we actually have you would need a fork lift to carry rather then hand held bibles. Only the more "imparative" things along the lines of our salvaiton is in the bible itself.
I think he did have siblings... Younger ones, of course ... Altho I don't know about Joseph's status prior to taking Mary as his wife tho.... A prophet is not accepted by his own household...
But eventually he called his disciples as friends, brothers and sisters because of spiritual patronage. So it's kind of ironic to be celebrating his birth on the basis of a pagan practice .... ...
Believing it is fine, but again, we don't know as a matter of history. Personally, without historical evidence, I'm not willing to opine on this particular matter. Jesus' brothers are mentioned in several Bible verses. Matthew 12:46, Luke 8:19, and Mark 3:31 say that Jesus’ mother and brothers came to see Him. The Bible tells us that Jesus had four brothers: James, Joseph, Simon, and Judas (Matthew 13:55). The Bible also tells us that Jesus had sisters, but they are not named or numbered (Matthew 13:56). In John 7:1-10, His brothers go on to the festival while Jesus stays behind. In Acts 1:14, His brothers and mother are described as praying with the disciples. Galatians 1:19 mentions that James was Jesus’ brother. The most natural conclusion of these passages is to interpret that Jesus had actual blood half-siblings. -disclaimer- I just copied this ^^^ But I do believe that he had siblings... It would be weird if he didn't, considering Mary was practically just a teen when she got married to Joseph... I think the reason a lot of things such as these are not expounded on in the bible is because it would not add any importance in it's main purpose as a book of faith... The only time I can recall Jesus calling his followers as any family member is when when he said, "who is my mother, and who are my brothers..." Which does reference his acknowledgement of the dichotomy between his mortal and spiritual family. Regarding opinions with or without historical evidence... History may also be considered as... A matter of opining a well marketed perspective... Yes? Which is partly why I posed my original question, and not too keen on looking for much scholarly answers...
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Edited by
Pansytilly
on
Mon 02/23/15 12:35 AM
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There is much that isn't included in specifically the bible about Jesus. The amount of scriptures we actually have you would need a fork lift to carry rather then hand held bibles. Only the more "imparative" things along the lines of our salvaiton is in the bible itself. ^^^ that's what I said... Lol... Which is why I was asking for any little known "lost tales" to begin with  ... Tho not necessarily exclusive to Jesus.... Old Testament myths seem to be just as interesting as well...
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Adam and Lilith... It is important to keep in mind what the words/names mean. "Adam" and "Eve" are not specificaly singular people nor gender specific 100%. Adam means mankind and eve means life barer, which generally is assumed to be "female". The traditional meaning of Eve is 'living'. That's why God created Adam "mankind" then gave us life "eve". Thus Lilith may have been Adam's wife as "Eve" isn't a person persay. |
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Adam and Lilith... It is important to keep in mind what the words/names mean. "Adam" and "Eve" are not specificaly singular people nor gender specific 100%. Adam means mankind and eve means life barer, which generally is assumed to be "female". The traditional meaning of Eve is 'living'. That's why God created Adam "mankind" then gave us life "eve". Thus Lilith may have been Adam's wife as "Eve" isn't a person persay. I'd disagree on that. ... The "concept" of Adam and Eve as just mere "concepts" of representation seem more like an attempt to misrepresent them... Haha... Sounds crazy, I know.... but, I do think they are concrete entities and not merely the abstractions we have assigned them.... Lilith included... Otherwise, anything in the bible can be taken as mere abstractions and simply a work of pure fiction... |
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Adam and Lilith... It is important to keep in mind what the words/names mean. "Adam" and "Eve" are not specificaly singular people nor gender specific 100%. Adam means mankind and eve means life barer, which generally is assumed to be "female". The traditional meaning of Eve is 'living'. That's why God created Adam "mankind" then gave us life "eve". Thus Lilith may have been Adam's wife as "Eve" isn't a person persay. I'd disagree on that. ... The "concept" of Adam and Eve as just mere "concepts" of representation seem more like an attempt to misrepresent them... Haha... Sounds crazy, I know.... but, I do think they are concrete entities and not merely the abstractions we have assigned them.... Lilith included... Otherwise, anything in the bible can be taken as mere abstractions and simply a work of pure fiction... So where did Cain get his wife if Adam and Eve was just two people? |
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Umm... Nephilim? Not quite sure where that fits in, but I hear they were responsible for a lot of "monsters" in the Bible and mythology. Nephilim being the blasphemous offspring of humans and (fallen) angels. I know nephilim were indeed the off spring of fallen angels... That's why they were giants... The stuff of myths and legends... Assuming that these nephilim existed in the same timeline as the garden of Eden, after the rebellion of lucifer... Which is why when Adam and Eve were cast out, that's when they encountered these nephilim and sons and daughters of man..... Right? Cain's wife --- I think it may have some correlation with this ^^^^^ What's your take on it? |
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Umm... Nephilim? Not quite sure where that fits in, but I hear they were responsible for a lot of "monsters" in the Bible and mythology. Nephilim being the blasphemous offspring of humans and (fallen) angels. I know nephilim were indeed the off spring of fallen angels... That's why they were giants... The stuff of myths and legends... Assuming that these nephilim existed in the same timeline as the garden of Eden, after the rebellion of lucifer... Which is why when Adam and Eve were cast out, that's when they encountered these nephilim and sons and daughters of man..... Right? Cain's wife --- I think it may have some correlation with this ^^^^^ What's your take on it? Because again "Adam" means mankind. No telling throughout the years where they might have "migrated" or moved around, ect. To different various places in that general area. |
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