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| Topic: One Mans travels to Africa | |
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I understand the desire to learn about the culture of one's distant ancestors, but I disagree with the idea that the culture of one's distant ancestors must be one's identity.
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Thu 11/06/14 09:40 PM
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oh, I see 
,,,,not the right audience,,, Right audience, but not the responses you were wanting? no , not the objectivity ,, just immediate defensiveness,,, but its all good,, 
I actually READ the article and I'm not seeing the "defensiveness" nor understanding your defensiveness ABOUT perceived "defensiveness" in others. To his points in the article, numbered as he did: 1. The author, himself, indicated it was 'cool' to be a part of the majority, for once...suggesting he understands better how whites in the U.S. feel and *operate*...and that it's NOT necessarily borne out of an innate maliciousness. 2. Common sense dictates that how 'slavery' museums and tourist spots are viewed in Africa (in a majority black population) would be vastly different than how such *attractions* would be viewed here, in the U.S. Depending on who created it, who ran it, and who funded it, it would be automatically suspect. 3. Though 4th-generation U.S. born, I'm of German-Irish (and a whole bunch of other stocks thrown in) descent; someday, I'd like to visit Ireland (the ONLY foreign country I'd like to go to), simply because it IS part of my heritage. Even though it's in MY blood, where my ancestors were born / how they lived / what trials and tribulations THEY faced does NOT affect my life, today. It's simply a part of my waaaay distant heritage. Guess what? Just about every single person living in the U.S. today, regardless of their skin color, can say the same thing; this is NOT a uniquely-black phenomenon. 4. Oppression of blacks (as well as oppression of ANY peoples) IS an international concern...and, again, it is NOT unique to the U.S. nor unique to white people; as the author, himself, points out, blacks in Africa are oppressing OTHER blacks in Africa because of Ebola (and because of status, and due to money, and due to one's station-in-life, etc.). When enough people are gathered together, fighting over the same resources, they will *naturally* begin to segregate and create "better-thans" and "less-thans" to *better* control capital AND those resources. 5. ALL people residing in the U.S. (unless they are of Native American descent) *suffer* from diaspora; again, it is NOT a uniquely-black *burden*. In this day and age of technology and globalization (which the author, himself, gives a nod to), this constant need to separate one's people FROM the whole, as somehow different and/or uniquely blessed OR uniquely burdened, IS becoming hackneyed, outdated, and outmoded, "whether we like it or not." Best of luck to you... 
the immediate defensiveness I describe was the off topic and irrelevant points about what OTHERS experience maybe I have a weird perception, but I cant imagine if someone described, lets say, their RAPE, that people would respond by saying,, well people all over the world get raped, its not unique ,,,,etc,, etc,,, etc,,, This was an INDIVIDUAL who wrote an article about HIS experience,, but instead of addressing it,, it was , indirectly, shot down by pointing out instead that it isn't a 'unique' experience I don't agree that the past no longer affects blacks in America,, I don't agree that their experience throughout the MAJORITY of American history is the same as anyone elses during that period IN THE USA except that of 'natives',,,,, Just as I start by feeding my own family , I find it reasonable that instead of allowing the media or the world convince me that I am removed from and distant from my ancestral history, that I embrace and learn about it, and continue to connect with it, even across oceans via learning about the land, the culture, the people and seeing them as family / united by ancestry. ,,otherwise I agree, the experience is not UNIQUE, none really are,, but it is an experience and a perception that I thought was well described by the INDIVIDUAL experiencing it and one I can also relate to,,, especially in terms of how Africa is portrayed, compared to everything else that it offers and all the other experiences people have on its continent,, |
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I understand the desire to learn about the culture of one's distant ancestors, but I disagree with the idea that the culture of one's distant ancestors must be one's identity. its all a PART of our identity as much as my grandmother , who just passed, is a part of the identity of my children and all those who come after me,,,, |
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the immediate defensiveness I describe was the off topic and irrelevant points about what OTHERS experience maybe I have a weird perception, but I cant imagine if someone described, lets say, their RAPE, that people would respond by saying,, well people all over the world get raped, its not unique ,,,,etc,, etc,,, etc,,, Actually, you can imagine anything you'd like, but the facts of the matter remain that MANY people (women AND men, alike) DO react when rape victims talk about their rape online with the exact response you "can't imagine". Those who don't, often use it as a homing device, much like sharks do when they *smell* fresh blood. This was an INDIVIDUAL who wrote an article about HIS experience,, but instead of addressing it,, it was , indirectly, shot down by pointing out instead that it isn't a 'unique' experience
I am aware that this article was HIS INDIVIDUAL experience; in my first post I addressed what I took away from his writings about HIS INDIVIDUAL experience. You took away something completely different. By the way, HIS own words when describing HIS INDIVIDUAL experience were being used as a rallying cry to ALL blacks and ALL people, EVERYwhere, to be more aware of black conditions, worldwide. I don't agree that the past no longer affects blacks in America,, I don't agree that their experience throughout the MAJORITY of American history is the same as anyone elses during that period IN THE USA except that of 'natives',,,,,
I didn't say blacks' experience IN THE USA is the same as everyone else's IN THE USA; I spoke to the diaspora, to which you and the author repeatedly referred. If you (and the author) don't know what the word means, perhaps neither of you should use it when attempting to make a point. Just as I start by feeding my own family , I find it reasonable that instead of allowing the media or the world convince me that I am removed from and distant from my ancestral history, that I embrace and learn about it, and continue to connect with it, even across oceans via learning about the land, the culture, the people and seeing them as family / united by ancestry. ,,otherwise I agree, the experience is not UNIQUE, none really are,, but it is an experience and a perception that I thought was well described by the INDIVIDUAL experiencing it and one I can also relate to,,, especially in terms of how Africa is portrayed, compared to everything else that it offers and all the other experiences people have on its continent,, It is YOUR CHOICE (which you are free to make and free to embrace) to continue to set you and your people apart in an ever-growing and all-encompassing global community. It is YOUR CHOICE (which you are free to make and free to embrace) to continue to see you and your people as singularly different, unique, blessed and cursed from / above all other peoples. Since you specifically brought them up, the FACT remains that Jews HAVE been specially persecuted on a worldwide stage, for thousands of years. The FACT remains that peoples of ALL faiths, heritages, and ethnicities HAVE BEEN and continue to be persecuted on a worldwide stage. If, in your mind, it makes you feel better and enjoy life better (both as an individual AND as part of a global community) to ignore the totality of history and just focus on your own people's history, have at. Likewise, feel free to ignore the plight of all OTHER oppressed people, worldwide, and focus on JUST your people's oppression...including *seeing* injustices where none exist, if it bolsters your position and deepens your commitment. Today, a people loses validity when it focuses on the trials and tribulations THEY are going through, while refusing to acknowledge that other peoples have their own trials and tribulations as well and instead insists that EVERYone focus on addressing their issues, first. To others, it will remain to be seen as hypocritical, self-serving, and self-centered; don't be too surprised if the world, who should be working to stamp out ALL injustices against ALL peoples, doesn't jump on your bandwagon for the one people you hold most dear. Best of luck in your work...
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War subjugates and oppresses with human rights. Did you know that the U.S. is having at hand at this in Africa now?
2014 African Summit How the US Military Took Over the African Continent | Interview with Kambale Musavuli Published on Aug 6, 2014 Abby Martin speaks with Kambale Musavuli, national spokesperson for Friends of the Congo, discussing the 2014 Africa Summit and the backlash against US policy in the African continent. |
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the immediate defensiveness I describe was the off topic and irrelevant points about what OTHERS experience maybe I have a weird perception, but I cant imagine if someone described, lets say, their RAPE, that people would respond by saying,, well people all over the world get raped, its not unique ,,,,etc,, etc,,, etc,,, Actually, you can imagine anything you'd like, but the facts of the matter remain that MANY people (women AND men, alike) DO react when rape victims talk about their rape online with the exact response you "can't imagine". Those who don't, often use it as a homing device, much like sharks do when they *smell* fresh blood. This was an INDIVIDUAL who wrote an article about HIS experience,, but instead of addressing it,, it was , indirectly, shot down by pointing out instead that it isn't a 'unique' experience
I am aware that this article was HIS INDIVIDUAL experience; in my first post I addressed what I took away from his writings about HIS INDIVIDUAL experience. You took away something completely different. By the way, HIS own words when describing HIS INDIVIDUAL experience were being used as a rallying cry to ALL blacks and ALL people, EVERYwhere, to be more aware of black conditions, worldwide. I don't agree that the past no longer affects blacks in America,, I don't agree that their experience throughout the MAJORITY of American history is the same as anyone elses during that period IN THE USA except that of 'natives',,,,,
I didn't say blacks' experience IN THE USA is the same as everyone else's IN THE USA; I spoke to the diaspora, to which you and the author repeatedly referred. If you (and the author) don't know what the word means, perhaps neither of you should use it when attempting to make a point. Just as I start by feeding my own family , I find it reasonable that instead of allowing the media or the world convince me that I am removed from and distant from my ancestral history, that I embrace and learn about it, and continue to connect with it, even across oceans via learning about the land, the culture, the people and seeing them as family / united by ancestry. ,,otherwise I agree, the experience is not UNIQUE, none really are,, but it is an experience and a perception that I thought was well described by the INDIVIDUAL experiencing it and one I can also relate to,,, especially in terms of how Africa is portrayed, compared to everything else that it offers and all the other experiences people have on its continent,, It is YOUR CHOICE (which you are free to make and free to embrace) to continue to set you and your people apart in an ever-growing and all-encompassing global community. It is YOUR CHOICE (which you are free to make and free to embrace) to continue to see you and your people as singularly different, unique, blessed and cursed from / above all other peoples. Since you specifically brought them up, the FACT remains that Jews HAVE been specially persecuted on a worldwide stage, for thousands of years. The FACT remains that peoples of ALL faiths, heritages, and ethnicities HAVE BEEN and continue to be persecuted on a worldwide stage. If, in your mind, it makes you feel better and enjoy life better (both as an individual AND as part of a global community) to ignore the totality of history and just focus on your own people's history, have at. Likewise, feel free to ignore the plight of all OTHER oppressed people, worldwide, and focus on JUST your people's oppression...including *seeing* injustices where none exist, if it bolsters your position and deepens your commitment. Today, a people loses validity when it focuses on the trials and tribulations THEY are going through, while refusing to acknowledge that other peoples have their own trials and tribulations as well and instead insists that EVERYone focus on addressing their issues, first. To others, it will remain to be seen as hypocritical, self-serving, and self-centered; don't be too surprised if the world, who should be working to stamp out ALL injustices against ALL peoples, doesn't jump on your bandwagon for the one people you hold most dear. Best of luck in your work...
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the immediate defensiveness I describe was the off topic and irrelevant points about what OTHERS experience maybe I have a weird perception, but I cant imagine if someone described, lets say, their RAPE, that people would respond by saying,, well people all over the world get raped, its not unique ,,,,etc,, etc,,, etc,,, Actually, you can imagine anything you'd like, but the facts of the matter remain that MANY people (women AND men, alike) DO react when rape victims talk about their rape online with the exact response you "can't imagine". Those who don't, often use it as a homing device, much like sharks do when they *smell* fresh blood. This was an INDIVIDUAL who wrote an article about HIS experience,, but instead of addressing it,, it was , indirectly, shot down by pointing out instead that it isn't a 'unique' experience
I am aware that this article was HIS INDIVIDUAL experience; in my first post I addressed what I took away from his writings about HIS INDIVIDUAL experience. You took away something completely different. By the way, HIS own words when describing HIS INDIVIDUAL experience were being used as a rallying cry to ALL blacks and ALL people, EVERYwhere, to be more aware of black conditions, worldwide. I don't agree that the past no longer affects blacks in America,, I don't agree that their experience throughout the MAJORITY of American history is the same as anyone elses during that period IN THE USA except that of 'natives',,,,,
I didn't say blacks' experience IN THE USA is the same as everyone else's IN THE USA; I spoke to the diaspora, to which you and the author repeatedly referred. If you (and the author) don't know what the word means, perhaps neither of you should use it when attempting to make a point. Just as I start by feeding my own family , I find it reasonable that instead of allowing the media or the world convince me that I am removed from and distant from my ancestral history, that I embrace and learn about it, and continue to connect with it, even across oceans via learning about the land, the culture, the people and seeing them as family / united by ancestry. ,,otherwise I agree, the experience is not UNIQUE, none really are,, but it is an experience and a perception that I thought was well described by the INDIVIDUAL experiencing it and one I can also relate to,,, especially in terms of how Africa is portrayed, compared to everything else that it offers and all the other experiences people have on its continent,, It is YOUR CHOICE (which you are free to make and free to embrace) to continue to set you and your people apart in an ever-growing and all-encompassing global community. It is YOUR CHOICE (which you are free to make and free to embrace) to continue to see you and your people as singularly different, unique, blessed and cursed from / above all other peoples. Since you specifically brought them up, the FACT remains that Jews HAVE been specially persecuted on a worldwide stage, for thousands of years. The FACT remains that peoples of ALL faiths, heritages, and ethnicities HAVE BEEN and continue to be persecuted on a worldwide stage. If, in your mind, it makes you feel better and enjoy life better (both as an individual AND as part of a global community) to ignore the totality of history and just focus on your own people's history, have at. Likewise, feel free to ignore the plight of all OTHER oppressed people, worldwide, and focus on JUST your people's oppression...including *seeing* injustices where none exist, if it bolsters your position and deepens your commitment. Today, a people loses validity when it focuses on the trials and tribulations THEY are going through, while refusing to acknowledge that other peoples have their own trials and tribulations as well and instead insists that EVERYone focus on addressing their issues, first. To others, it will remain to be seen as hypocritical, self-serving, and self-centered; don't be too surprised if the world, who should be working to stamp out ALL injustices against ALL peoples, doesn't jump on your bandwagon for the one people you hold most dear. Best of luck in your work...
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the immediate defensiveness I describe was the off topic and irrelevant points about what OTHERS experience maybe I have a weird perception, but I cant imagine if someone described, lets say, their RAPE, that people would respond by saying,, well people all over the world get raped, its not unique ,,,,etc,, etc,,, etc,,, Actually, you can imagine anything you'd like, but the facts of the matter remain that MANY people (women AND men, alike) DO react when rape victims talk about their rape online with the exact response you "can't imagine". Those who don't, often use it as a homing device, much like sharks do when they *smell* fresh blood. This was an INDIVIDUAL who wrote an article about HIS experience,, but instead of addressing it,, it was , indirectly, shot down by pointing out instead that it isn't a 'unique' experience
I am aware that this article was HIS INDIVIDUAL experience; in my first post I addressed what I took away from his writings about HIS INDIVIDUAL experience. You took away something completely different. By the way, HIS own words when describing HIS INDIVIDUAL experience were being used as a rallying cry to ALL blacks and ALL people, EVERYwhere, to be more aware of black conditions, worldwide. I don't agree that the past no longer affects blacks in America,, I don't agree that their experience throughout the MAJORITY of American history is the same as anyone elses during that period IN THE USA except that of 'natives',,,,,
I didn't say blacks' experience IN THE USA is the same as everyone else's IN THE USA; I spoke to the diaspora, to which you and the author repeatedly referred. If you (and the author) don't know what the word means, perhaps neither of you should use it when attempting to make a point. Just as I start by feeding my own family , I find it reasonable that instead of allowing the media or the world convince me that I am removed from and distant from my ancestral history, that I embrace and learn about it, and continue to connect with it, even across oceans via learning about the land, the culture, the people and seeing them as family / united by ancestry. ,,otherwise I agree, the experience is not UNIQUE, none really are,, but it is an experience and a perception that I thought was well described by the INDIVIDUAL experiencing it and one I can also relate to,,, especially in terms of how Africa is portrayed, compared to everything else that it offers and all the other experiences people have on its continent,, It is YOUR CHOICE (which you are free to make and free to embrace) to continue to set you and your people apart in an ever-growing and all-encompassing global community. It is YOUR CHOICE (which you are free to make and free to embrace) to continue to see you and your people as singularly different, unique, blessed and cursed from / above all other peoples. Since you specifically brought them up, the FACT remains that Jews HAVE been specially persecuted on a worldwide stage, for thousands of years. The FACT remains that peoples of ALL faiths, heritages, and ethnicities HAVE BEEN and continue to be persecuted on a worldwide stage. If, in your mind, it makes you feel better and enjoy life better (both as an individual AND as part of a global community) to ignore the totality of history and just focus on your own people's history, have at. Likewise, feel free to ignore the plight of all OTHER oppressed people, worldwide, and focus on JUST your people's oppression...including *seeing* injustices where none exist, if it bolsters your position and deepens your commitment. Today, a people loses validity when it focuses on the trials and tribulations THEY are going through, while refusing to acknowledge that other peoples have their own trials and tribulations as well and instead insists that EVERYone focus on addressing their issues, first. To others, it will remain to be seen as hypocritical, self-serving, and self-centered; don't be too surprised if the world, who should be working to stamp out ALL injustices against ALL peoples, doesn't jump on your bandwagon for the one people you hold most dear. Best of luck in your work...
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Fri 11/07/14 05:16 PM
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I actually NEVER Used the word 'diaspora' and I hope all adults know what it means
I actually also noted that I would have not just focused on slavery but included JIM CROW,,which not ALL have experienced and which is much more recent than slavery people can and do address issues in some order, as we cant possibly discuss all peoples and all issues at one time THIS article and THIS person spoke on A TOPIC of unity between African americans and their ancestral land THAT topic doesn't become some disclaimer of any other topic or some 'setting apart' of the significance of any other topic I have regularly commented similarly about issues posted about Jewish/Israel perceptions I have also commented on native American topic they all EXIST and are ALL IMPORTANT in this world,, its sad that discussing one makes others assume that its being EXCLUSIVE of other issues its like being in the girl scouts and having people assume that you therefore only care about girls,,, its a big world,, we should discuss whatever is touching us when it is touching us,,, without it being equated to some contest of what is more or less important, unique , or significant to what might touch someone else,,,, |
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I actually NEVER Used the word 'diaspora'... Notify the proper authorities, then...your account's been hacked: ...5) There needs to be more cross-continental discourse of connecting blacks across the diaspora...
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Fri 11/07/14 05:26 PM
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it wasn't hacked it was a quote from the ARTICLE,, not my use,,,
the many uses of the word are: Full Definition of DIASPORA 1 capitalized a : the settling of scattered colonies of Jews outside Palestine after the Babylonian exile b : the area outside Palestine settled by Jews c : the Jews living outside Palestine or modern Israel 2 a : the movement, migration, or scattering of a people away from an established or ancestral homeland <the black diaspora to northern cities> b : people settled far from their ancestral homelands <African diaspora> c : the place where these people live I believe the author used the word as in definition 2c. |
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I actually also noted that I would have not just focused on slavery but included JIM CROW,,which not ALL have experienced and which is much more recent than slavery
A Note to Members Outside the USA: "Jim Crow" refers to the anti-black laws that Democrats in the USA passed in order to discriminate against black Americans. |
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Edited by
msharmony
on
Fri 11/07/14 05:41 PM
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I actually also noted that I would have not just focused on slavery but included JIM CROW,,which not ALL have experienced and which is much more recent than slavery
A Note to Members Outside the USA: "Jim Crow" refers to the anti-black laws that Democrats in the USA passed in order to discriminate against black Americans. Not exactly Jim Crow laws were STATE laws,, supported by a healthy overlap of dems and republicans,,,, |
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it wasn't hacked it was a quote from the ARTICLE,, not my use,,, You might want to go check YOUR post in which YOU used the word, as it was during YOUR recap of what YOU got from the article in which YOU (too) used it. In any event, you are deliberately *arguing* semantics as to avoid the point that I'd originally made: EVERY SINGLE PERSON in the United States who is not of Native American descent is effected by diaspora. It is NOT a uniquely black phenomenon. Stop claiming it as a unique word, uniquely expressive of a unique situation, uniquely belonging to blacks who live in the United States. It's a term correctly used by ANY person who - within their heritage - had family members who left ANY homeland. C'mon, now...at least give me that, since you steadfastly refuse to NOT segregate yourself and your people from the global community at large, 'kay?
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I actually also noted that I would have not just focused on slavery but included JIM CROW,,which not ALL have experienced and which is much more recent than slavery
A Note to Members Outside the USA: "Jim Crow" refers to the anti-black laws that Democrats in the USA passed in order to discriminate against black Americans. Not exactly Jim Crow laws were STATE laws,, supported by a healthy overlap of dems and republicans,,,, Not exactly Jim Crow laws were federal, state, county, and local. |
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it wasn't hacked it was a quote from the ARTICLE,, not my use,,, You might want to go check YOUR post in which YOU used the word, as it was during YOUR recap of what YOU got from the article in which YOU (too) used it. In any event, you are deliberately *arguing* semantics as to avoid the point that I'd originally made: EVERY SINGLE PERSON in the United States who is not of Native American descent is effected by diaspora. It is NOT a uniquely black phenomenon. Stop claiming it as a unique word, uniquely expressive of a unique situation, uniquely belonging to blacks who live in the United States. It's a term correctly used by ANY person who - within their heritage - had family members who left ANY homeland. C'mon, now...at least give me that, since you steadfastly refuse to NOT segregate yourself and your people from the global community at large, 'kay?
I really didn't start this semantics argument, I felt my op was clear 5 points from the article ,,says it all, from the article as to the rest,, I continue to clarify that I have not posted about anything in being 'unique' it is only the reader, who often when someone speaks of slavery or connecting with ancestral lands or history,, infers that the one speaking/writing is attempting to paint something as unique when it is, as a matter of fact, just their personal(which can be read as unique in a sense of it being about a specific point of view and experience) thoughts and feelings,,, yes, I do give you diaspora isn't unique to black folks, I don't understand why anyone would think it was just as continent isn't unique to America,, just as if I were to state that 'americans need to unite across the continent',, I would be referring to the CONTINENT That is common to AMERICANS,,, and not trying to adopt the word 'continent' semantically to be exclusive to America,,, |
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I actually also noted that I would have not just focused on slavery but included JIM CROW,,which not ALL have experienced and which is much more recent than slavery
A Note to Members Outside the USA: "Jim Crow" refers to the anti-black laws that Democrats in the USA passed in order to discriminate against black Americans. Not exactly Jim Crow laws were STATE laws,, supported by a healthy overlap of dems and republicans,,,, Not exactly Jim Crow laws were federal, state, county, and local. common misconception..federal laws are just the law,,,,the 'jim crow' laws were state and under,,,, From the 1880s into the 1960s, a majority of American states enforced segregation through "Jim Crow" laws (so called after a black character in minstrel shows). From Delaware to California, and from North Dakota to Texas, many states (and cities, too) could impose legal punishments on people for consorting with members of another race. http://www.nps.gov/malu/forteachers/jim_crow_laws.htm |
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Wait I'm lost. How many mans went to Africa?
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Wait I'm lost. How many mans went to Africa? haha didn't the title say 'one mans,,,' just the author of the article I referenced had the personal experience and perception being discussed,,, |
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