Pavlovs dogs developed a very physiologically CONDITIONED response to a bell,, simply through a subconscious linking of the bell to a stimulus that would NATURALLY create that response

what IF we could tap into a consciousness within ourselves to take the control to completely CONDITION ourselves,, towards the reactions and perceptions that lead to healthy and full lives?


just a thought, when I hear people say 'that's just WHO I AM'
I have to wonder, if its set in stone or if its a reality created only by our conditioning and able to be changed thru the same

your thoughts?

They figured that out long ago. It's why advertisements work so well on 90% of the population.

All cognitive behavioral therapy is based on changing the conditioning one's learned through associations with OTHER learned conditioning to replace them, to achieve a better result.


It's highly successful: think smokers who quit and have the hardest time giving up that one cigarette with their morning coffee, that one after they finish eating, and all those ones while they're drinking socially with their buddies: it all hinges on behavior modification by changing the conditioning that's been automatically associated with it.

msharmony, I have similar thoughts when I hear "it's just human nature".

I think that humanity as a whole could benefit greatly from being more open to the concept that we're part of a collective consciousness.

There's no doubt in my mind that once an individual, develops an awareness of being conditioned externally, that they can choose to and are capable of going within and adjusting.

@msharmony
When people say 'that's just WHO I AM' then i think it is a sign of weakness.
Most alcoholics drink for the reason they feel sorry for themselves.
Instead of trying to solve their problems in a different (healthier) way.

I think that a society should create the basis for a healthy and full life. As a Role model.
But sometimes the world seems into an "identity crisis" itselve. And therefore
cannot give us the proper image of what you define as healty and full.
Also note that it might be hard not impossible to define what the essence of
a "healthy and full life" is. Because there are so many views on that. It might be
diffent things for you then for someone else. But maybe we can get closer to the basics
of that definition. By letting a government promote a healthy and full lifestyle to us.
Although people will off course have different opinions about that...

Also i think that the statement of "If a man loses the right to choose, then he ceases to
be a man " is true. I got this statement from the movie called "A clockwork orange" where
the state alters a criminal his mind into a harmless civilian by giving him drugs and
putting him in the role of victim. Thereby conditioning him into a person that is the opposite
Of what he was before as a ruthless criminal.
So therefore i think that it should come from education and the choice of that individual.
I think that people need to be able to make choices in life. Either good or bad. Because
that is the essence of what we are. We need to be able to differentiate between those two.
In order to understand it.

deeply thought michelake

YES , I have considered that too,, the people who most deeply subscribe to 'who I am' mentality would be the last to choose to recondition themselves,,,


but for those who are possibly of the mind to consider who they MIGHT BECOME,, the ability to tap into that hidden treasure of self conditioning/reconditioning could be priceless

Yes, absolutely :) People would be amazed if they knew what they could achieve if they put their minds to it.

A lot of classical Faustian horrors are based upon the premise that civilised behaviour is a social construct, therefore too much self discovery can lead to the kind of religious experience an atheist really doesn't like to have.
It's an interesting counterpoint to the idea of self hypnotic reprogramming, ie. are there mental health risks?

I think conditioned behaviour can only be "healed" by awarness...not by another kind of brain washing or subconscious conditioning...as @michelake's example of the criminal also points out...

Just yesterday (coincidence?) i was "forced" to listen to a commercial while listening something on the You Tube...and it was a commercial for the s.c. MindMaster, "The world's first words-and-images tool created to help you change your mind about yourself!" which is obviously a tool to reprogram your subconcious conditioning in order to solve such problems as smoking, overeating, lack of money etc... You just pay for it, and ...voila...your life is perfect. If anybody is interested, here's the page with this commercial:

http://www.mindmaster.tv/

op maybe some are condition from birth to young adult... then as they see a world can be open to them ...in many ways especially now ...others seem to go off into their own world to escape their life ... by using many things we call addictions to ... some have mental health diseases they are just born with and will have this for the rest of their life ... they can be conditioned to a point but sometimes they even go off from some kind of frustration ... mental health with those that come from war ... have issues ... sometimes can not be helped becouse of a conditions they where under ... is this like the saying can't teach a dog new tricks ... sometimes it takes some people under a great life change to have their ways be changed ... to many different mind sets to have just one answer ...

Hmmmm...

Most all learned behavior is a conditioned response. Manipulation is delivered fresh daily.

Ever Google "MK-Ultra"?

Real Manchurian Candidate stuff.




Would you believe that I have personally manipulated minds for over 30 years? Just like McDonald's, over a billion served.

When I hear a stupid comment, my conditioned response is to laugh at the person.

Funny meme, but not true in my experience.

I have 3 cat-beasties and they are trained to come to the sound of the treat jar, which happens to be metal. The lid makes a distinct bell tone when struck against the base. I use it when they escape the yard and I want to close up for the night. I open the door, ring ring, and here they come like furry missiles. You can tell how far they've wandered by how long it takes them to race to the door.

I think there is more of a natural process when using self conditioning, than when using any type of hypnosis

I don't believe there would be mental health risk to tapping in to the subconscious,,,,but I also have non traditional views in the area of 'mental health'

We probably wouldn't be human anymore.
It would take something inhuman to focus on every variable of daily life and sensory input to know each and every subsequent consequence, short and long term, and how they all interact, or will interact, since your environment, what is influencing you, and how you best fulfill your perceived needs, constantly changes.


I do.
A lot of people condition themselves to feel happy when they eat junk food, or "stress eat," to please the tongue rather than fuel the body, are aware of it yet do nothing but grow bigger.
A lot of people feel a lot of stress when deciding what to wear on a date rather than just dressing normally.
Tapping into the "subconscious" to try and control it can lead to overindulgence and over thinking even the most rudimentary of processes.
That leads to a lot of stress and anxiety.
There's your mental health risk.


AA and CBT have a lot in common. AA has been called a form of CBT.
Have you seen the recidivism rate of alcoholics, smokers, drug users, etc.? The failure rate of AA? It's like 90+%.
CBT is best used for depression. That's about it. And even then it's not all that effective, especially long term. At least compared to any other method of "treatment."


For all practical purposes it is set in stone unless you are omniscient.

Other than that, when I hear people say "that's just who I am" I don't wonder, nor do I assume they even know who they really are. It's not all that important. At best all I can do is make a decision on whether or not I want to continue interacting with them.
Ultimately, how they see themselves, who they think they are, and how I perceive them will always be different.

I am simply too finite and fallible to be able to see all the short or long term consequences of my choices, unless they are somewhat obvious.

Factually-speaking, I have to disagree. AA (and other peer-sponsored, peer-supported groups) does not require its participants who serve as mentors nor even its meeting leaders to be licensed, qualified counselors/psychologists/psychiatrists; CBT treatment, when done correctly, DOES require some sort of licensing.

====================

I don't feel like looking it up to provide a hotlink to a legitimate, reputable citation (partly because I'm too lazy today and mostly because I'm one of the few who consistently does provide 'em when participating in these conversations), but I remember reading years ago that while the brain is a remarkable organ, it's a rather simplistic one, too.

It believes what it hears. That's why if a person is told over and over again that they are useless, eventually the person will believe it. It's the power behind "positive affirmations"...and why the exercise of standing in front of a mirror verbalizing positive statements is so effective...


...the brain HEARS the statements and, over time, comes to believe them and associate the positive sentiments with the image in the mirror - and makes the positive connections. It's not good enough to simply think positive thoughts...one actually has to make it audible to develop a new, positive Sense of Self.

"Reconditioning".

I believe you received what I Was sending,,mrld,,,,lol

ty

yeah - sound of opening tuna can...a great cat training tool is a clicker...
just a funny image is all...

I expected a topic about hair conditioners...