QUOTE:

Also have to keep in mind the cultures and community there of. Now that it's been mentioned of the other sabbaths, please now give us the verse(s) that support these other sabbaths. If it's not support directly in the scriptures, it's neither specifically Christian or Catholic.

Jesus attended the Feast of Passover with his parents according to Luke 2:41.

John 13:29 where he gave instructions to his disciples to buy the things that was required for the Feast of Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread. (See also Matthew 26:17)

BTW these feasts were given as important to keep as it made the Israelites look forward to the Messiah who would come through their descent and Yeshua (Jesus) was the "Passover Lamb" pictured by the sacrificing of a lamb without blemish during the Passover celebration which God instructed Moses and the Israelites to keep.

Also there are still Christian religions which still keep the feasts just as the apostles and Christ's followers did.

This I will repeat is not saying whether someone should or should not keep them, I'm just saying this as a historical reference as to the timing of the sabbaths and other feasts and whether or not they were kept by those who adhered to Christianity in those days.

Such theology sounds similar to Marcion's, who was of course excommunicated and banished.


Study of the Jewish Scriptures, along with received writings circulating in the nascent Church, led Marcion to conclude that many of the teachings of Jesus were incompatible with the actions of the God of the Old Testament, Yahweh. Marcion responded by developing a dualist system of belief around the year 144.[6] This dual-god notion allowed Marcion to reconcile contradictions between Old Covenant theology and the Gospel message proclaimed by Jesus.

Marcion affirmed Jesus to be the saviour sent by the Heavenly Father, and Paul as his chief apostle. In contrast to the nascent Christian church, Marcion declared that Christianity was in complete discontinuity with Judaism and entirely opposed to the Old Testament message. Marcion did not claim that the Jewish Scriptures were false. Instead, Marcion asserted that they were to be read in an absolutely literal manner, thereby developing an understanding that YHWH was not the same god spoken of by Jesus. For example, Marcion argued that the Genesis account of YHWH walking through the Garden of Eden asking where Adam was proved YHWH inhabited a physical body and was without universal knowledge (omniscience), attributes wholly incompatible with the Heavenly Father professed by Jesus.

According to Marcion, the god of the Old Testament, whom he called the Demiurge, the creator of the material universe, is a jealous tribal deity of the Jews, whose law represents legalistic reciprocal justice and who punishes mankind for its sins through suffering and death. Contrastingly, the god that Jesus professed is an altogether different being, a universal god of compassion and love who looks upon humanity with benevolence and mercy. Marcion also produced his Antitheses contrasting the Demiurge of the Old Testament with the Heavenly Father of the New Testament.

Marcion held Jesus to be the son of the Heavenly Father but understood the incarnation in a docetic manner, i.e. that Jesus' body was only an imitation of a material body, and consequently denied Jesus' physical and bodily birth, death, and resurrection (e.g., he accepted Luke's Gospel yet eliminated portions such as the birth narrative) and thereby denied the historic Christian Gospel (1 Cor 15:3-4).

Marcion was the first to introduce an early Christian canon. His canon consisted of still only eleven books grouped into two sections: the Evangelikon, being a shorter and earlier version of the gospel which later became known as the Gospel of Luke,[7] and the Apostolikon, a selection of ten epistles of Paul the Apostle, whom Marcion considered the correct interpreter and transmitter of Jesus' teachings. The gospel used by Marcion does not contain elements relating to Jesus' birth and childhood, although it does contain some elements of Judaism, and material challenging Marcion's dualism.

That is because they do not believe Jesus to had been the being he was. They did not see him fulfilling the final prophecies of the old testament, covenant and still live by that covenant to this day. So no, his teachings would not be aligned with the old testament/covenant.



That by far could not be talking about the same God. Right off the start, talks about God being a Jealous God, which is repeated in the new testament/covenant with Jesus. God has always looked at the world with mercy, we're still aren't we? The ONLY difference is whom we are judged by. This includes but not limited to Now Jesus has taken a physical form, he can do the judging himself, rather then in the form of the Word. eg., we are all judged by the Word. That is the ONLY difference. And with that difference came how one receives forgiveness. We no longer have to sacrifice animals for forgiveness as we aren't under that covenant any longer. Nor are the Jews if they had faith in whom Jesus claimed to be. But they don't, again they are still waiting for their prophesied savior. It's the same God, same mercy he's always offered. Just the difference in the covenants on receiving forgiveness changes from being saved by works to being saved by faith.

NOT, ANGER, BUT RATHER , if we applly further resaecth, reflection and a good portion of common sense, we see that there is more than enough evidence out there, IF we do our own research, and dont just read other peoples work, which is not research, it is reading. There is enough evidence to diprove evolution, for example, , that one could prove that position in court. Yet they believe, they revise,and when the fossil record doesent agree with thier presumptions, they make a forgery and present it as gospel. i ask you this. where are the thousand, or millions ff lucy skeletons? where are the intermediat steps? there are one of each example. nor thousands like should exist. There is in fact A LOT less EVIDENCE NOW THAT SUPPORTS EVOLUTION, than there was in darwins day.

so we are not bound by old testament laws? cool! now i can murder, rape, steal , take my neighbors wife, ect because all those laws ar old testament..? jesus was quite specific about this, and so is pauls writings that we are not under grace, as all these ch\urches out there believe, but rather the law is permament. Gods law camnnot change, mans laws change every day so we tend to think in terms of revisions , ect, but that doesent work with biblical law. it never changes. what was wrong 2000 years ago is still wrong. by the way which one of the ten commandments offends these people? I dont see anything there except good advise for clean living. i THINK IT IS THE MORAL ISSUE: if we can rationalise that the bible isnt true, then one is free to live an immoral life without any problems. if however we believe the bible. which is essentially a law book, is true, and the word of God, then we are constained to to what is right, instead of what we WANT to do.

if you care, i can tell you that you are confusing religion with the bible. they are in facr incompatible with each other. Please refreain from quoting what someones doctrine is and saying, or implying that it is what the bible says. these "religious: types out there in fact are way more confused than you and i are.
p.s., have you seen the pics of the dinasaur tracks with human footprints inside of them? not talking about "piltdown man footprinte here, or some such so called pre human, but a perfectly preserved homo sapien foot prints.

This is why you should probably not do your own research

Whether or not it is "intellectually immoral" to believe in God depends upon how God is defined for the individual.

if the OT is no good then why don't we just Burn it so no one ever sees it? seems this would get rid of a lot of confusion. this would end all tithing to the church. Good right?

Sounds like the theology of Marcion again, who by the way was one of the main reasons the Church codified the texts

so if you believe in satanism, then by default you recognise that there is a a God, right? They go together. It would only follow. just saying. So you recognise there is a God,.... but you prefer the dark side. hmmmm good luck with that. IT ALWAYS COMES BACK TO THIS...
I WANT TO DO WHATEVER I WANT TO DOnt want to accept that there are any consequenses for bad behavior, so i snub God, ( shoot the messenger so to say. )It always comes back to morals, or lack therov.

We're not saved by grace? Think Jesus disagrees.

Ephesians 2:8

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God



You are absolutely correct, God's law doesn't "change". That is why we have prophecies, for our better understanding. It was prophecied in the old covenant that a savior would come. And guess what? He did, his name is Jesus. Jesus fulfilled the remaining old covenant prophecies, thus why he spent his life on Earth giving us a new covenant to replace the old one which was in the process of finalizing.



And you can find every commandment of the "10 commandments" repeated in the new testament/covenant. The main difference between the two covenants are when, how, and who we are judged by.



So with that logic, one can drive say 50mph in a 30mph zone and never get a ticket because they THINK it's not wrong? Interesting. And when one becomes a true believer, their will and what they want will be more inline with what God wants from us and his will for us.

You don't think the first men on Earth could have made foot prints inside of the dinosaur footprints? Don't know the exact time span's and all, but if the dinosaur prints are there as they are today, it is quite possible for cavemen and what not to have stepped inside of those foot prints after they has already been there say for example 200 years. There is no way to verify scientifically what time period either of those foot prints were made.

So the world just happened one day right?

Most of us think we know a lot about jesus. After all, weve read all the red letters n the gospels. But u never really know or fully understand jesus, his stories and ways ,until u know the world n wich he lived.
Life in our high tech. Fast paced society places, modern readers of the bible at an extreme disadvantage, when they seek to understand the biblical backdrop behind the story.
Keep closen studying the bible and u will not b dissapointed..

Three pages in to the discussion before someone finally points out what should have been stated right at the beginning!

"It amazes me how people are willing to deceive themselves like that. Because my conscience won't have it."

It amazes me how people are willing to debate God with such emotion and conviction without first agreeing on who or what they're talking about.

While I'm at it, I'll add my thoughts on the discussion of the Sabbath. The posts so far have been focused on the "letter of the law," not the "spirit of the law." The point is to set aside time to devote to God (or spiritual matters, if you can't stomach the "G" word).
The debate over Saturday vs. Sunday is moot.
"A day of the lord is as a thousand years." Not a literal thousand years, of course, but a really, really long time.
"On the seventh day, God rested."
Man has been created (conceived) and evolved into a physical being capable of perceiving, understanding and acting by the "Spirit of God." This is still the seventh day. God is still "resting" from creating stuff. We're responsible for creation and creating now, but so far we've really screwed things up.
Whether it's a Saturday, a Sunday or a "Black Sabbath" Wednesday, Remember to take some sabbatical time, regularly and often. Take time to chill out, relax, be thankful and humble, and contemplate the really important things in life.

I've sent a memo to the 51% of the scientific community who DO believe in God/a higher power


that you've determined they are nincompoops.



http://www.pewforum.org/2009/11/05/scientists-and-belief/

Just because someone believes in God doesn't mean it exists..that's why it's called "belief". To know and to believe are different things...people can believe in God even if they don't know God exists. No one knows if there is a God and no one claims to know.

self superiority as pride doth seem in all cases to proceed a fall from the self pedestal of self as all wise and all knowing...

which it seems, self as the total sum of the total maximum intelligence of all intelligence combined of what does and can exist, would be completely a speculation, as proof for or against does not exist...

so the obvious bias is totally apparent as to what one wish and want to be the case...

such would indeed be quite an exorbitant amount of grandiose belief in the sum of only the total self intelligence...


for only the small mind can and has decided and adopted it self as "all knowing"...

as it self as a god...

declaring it self be the total ultimate all knower of all that is and does exist, which of course, such could only ever be based upon the most of what it self is and knows...

but blindly believing the most most self know, or has seen, be the total sum of all existence...

hasty and arrogant and even blind self dazzling it self such seems...

so it seems, these deem them self as gods, or as all knowing, but then at the same time, declare there be no god, and so nothing that exist as greater than them self.

the self grandiose oft do struggle believing anything exist greater than it self, so oft do struggle to find few others of the same species of humans as equal in validity and merit and value, and so erode the value of belief in equality of all, hence never see ANYTHING as equal in greatness as them self...