Topic: 10 Disturbing Facts About ObamaCare
no photo
Thu 03/21/13 08:10 PM
ObamaCare Turns 3: 10 Disturbing Facts About Health Law

Just over three years ago, then-Speaker Nancy Pelosi famously quipped about ObamaCare that "we have to pass the bill so you can find out what is in it.

But only now, as ObamaCare's third anniversary approaches — President Obama signed it into law on March 23, 2010 — is the country starting to find out what the sweeping health care overhaul will actually do.

ObamaCare backers typically tout popular features that went into effect almost immediately. The law expanded Medicare's drug coverage, for example, and let children stay on their parents' plans until they turned 26.

But the bulk of ObamaCare doesn't take effect until next year. That's when the so-called insurance exchanges are supposed to be up and running, when the mandate on individuals and businesses kicks in, and when the avalanche of regulations on the insurance industry hits.

As this start date draws near, evidence is piling up that ObamaCare will: Boost insurance costs. Officially the "Affordable Care Act," ObamaCare promised to lower premiums for families. But regulators decided to impose a 3.5% surcharge on insurance plans sold through federally run exchanges. There's also a $63 fee for every person covered by employers. And the law adds a "premium tax" that will require insurers to pay more than $100 billion over the next decade. The congressional Joint Committee on Taxation expects insurers to simply pass this tax onto individuals and small businesses, boosting premiums another 2.5%.

Push millions off employer coverage. In February, the Congressional Budget Office said that 7 million will likely lose their employer coverage thanks to ObamaCare — nearly twice its previous estimate. That number could be as high as 20 million, the CBO says.

Cause premiums to skyrocket. In December, state insurance commissioners warned Obama administration officials that the law's market regulations would likely cause "rate shocks," particularly for younger, healthier people forced by ObamaCare to subsidize premiums for those who are older and sicker.

"We are very concerned about what will happen if essentially there is so much rate shock for young people that they're bound not to purchase (health insurance) at all," said California Insurance Commissioner Dave Jones.

That same month, Aetna CEO Mark Bertolini said ObamaCare will likely cause premiums to double for some small businesses and individuals.

And a more recent survey of insurers in five major cities by the American Action Forum found they expect premiums to climb an average 169%.

Cost people their jobs. The Federal Reserve's March beige book on economic activity noted that businesses "cited the unknown effects of the Affordable Care Act as reasons for planned layoffs and reluctance to hire more staff.

Around the same time, Gallup reported a surge in part-time work in advance of ObamaCare's employer mandate. It found that part-timers accounted for almost 21% of the labor force, up from 19% three years ago.

Meanwhile, human resources consulting firm Adecco found that half of the small businesses it surveyed in January either plan to cut their workforce, not hire new workers, or shift to part-time or temporary help because of ObamaCare.

Tax the middle class. IBD reported in February that much of the $800 billion in tax hikes imposed by ObamaCare will end up hitting the middle class, including $45 billion in mandate penalties, $19 billion raised by limiting medical expense deductions, $24 billion through strict limits on flexible spending accounts, plus another $5 billion because ObamaCare bans using FSAs to buy over-the-counter drugs.

Add to the deficit. The Government Accountability Office reported in January that Obama-Care will likely add $6.2 trillion in red ink over 75 years if independent experts are right and several of its cost control measures don't work as advertised.

Cost more than promised. The Congressional Budget Office now says ObamaCare's insurance subsidies will cost $233 billion more over the next decade than it thought last year.

Be a bureaucratic nightmare. Consumers got their first glimpse of life under ObamaCare when the Health and Human Services Department released a draft insurance application form. It runs 21 pages. "Applying for benefits under President Barack Obama's health care overhaul could be as daunting as doing your taxes," the AP concluded after reviewing the form.

Exacerbate doctor shortages. Last summer, a study by the Association of American Medical Colleges found that the country will have 62,900 fewer doctors than its needs by 2015, thanks in large part to ObamaCare. At the same time, a survey of 13,000 doctors by the Physicians Foundation found that almost 60% of doctors say ObamaCare has made them less optimistic about the future of health care and they would retire today if they could.

Leave millions uninsured. After 10 years, ObamaCare will still leave 30 million without coverage, according to the CBO. As IBD reported, that figure could be much higher if the law causes premiums to spike and encourages people to drop coverage despite the law's mandate.

metalwing's photo
Thu 03/21/13 08:56 PM
Who knows? Maybe even the Democrats will turn against it.

Mortman's photo
Thu 03/21/13 09:03 PM
Edited by Mortman on Thu 03/21/13 09:08 PM
What a load of horse crap.

I'm sure you'd like to think that higher premiums and less employer participation are the ACA's fault, but those were already emerging trends before the ACA was even passed.

I know in California where I live, a couple of the larger health insurers were warning of premium increases of 20-40%, then once the ACA passed, with its cap on 15% margin for health care, those same companies quietly backed off their increases, knowing that they'd have to justify those increases, due to the costs reporting, also mandated in the ACA. Anyway, those estimated premium increases are nearly meaningless, because they apply to people who now are ineligible for affordable health insurance. Right now, you'd be hard pressed to find an insurer to cover you, if they expect to pay back even half of your premiums in health claims.

As far as employers ceasing to cover their employees, there's absolutely nothing in the law that prevents them from dropping their employee coverage. When the ACA takes effect, those same employers will be forced to pay a penalty (what the Republicans called a tax) for not covering their employees. The Papa Johns Pizza CEO famously overstated the costs by about triple. Much less than 1% of the corporate costs of the pizza. Now consider the savings to the public, of those employees who no longer have to go to the emergency room for basic medical care.

Employers firing people over this? Hardly. If anything, they'll hire more people to lower individual hours. As unemployment lowers due to the economic recovery, those same employers will struggle to keep their employees. Not fire them. Really, that claim just ignores basic business laws. Employers don't hire employees because they're cheap to hire. They hire employees because they have work to get done. The ACA won't lower the workload. If employers will be firing employees in order to not cover their medical insurance costs, then those are just the employers who weren't paying for health insurance, anyway, so it's just another savings for the public, who won't have to cover as much of the health expenses.

I could go on. but long story short, the article is crap. The ACA isn't perfect, but except for small exceptions, none of those "disturbing facts" about Obamacare are lies or exaggerations.


Sources:
http://news.investors.com/032113-648891-obamacare-turns-3-10-disturbing-facts-about-health-law.aspx?ref=HPLNews

http://obamacarefacts.com/obamacare-myths.php

http://www.salon.com/2012/11/16/papa_johns_bad_obamacare_math/

http://obamacarefacts.com/obama-care-fact-check.php

http://www.snopes.com/politics/medical/over75.asp

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2011/01/health_care_myths.html

http://www.factcheck.org/2012/06/how-much-is-the-obamacare-tax/


metalwing's photo
Thu 03/21/13 09:09 PM

What a load of horse crap.

I'm sure you'd like to think that higher premiums and less employer participation are the ACA's fault, but those were already emerging trends before the ACA was even passed.

I know in California where I live, a couple of the larger health insurers were warning of premium increases of 20-40%, then once the ACA passed, with its cap on 15% margin for health care, those same companies quietly backed off their increases, knowing that they'd have to justify those increases, due to the costs reporting, also mandated in the ACA. Anyway, those estimated premium increases are nearly meaningless, because they apply to people who now are ineligible for affordable health insurance. Right now, you'd be hard pressed to find an insurer to cover you, if they expect to pay back even half of your premiums in health claims.

As far as employers ceasing to cover their employees, there's absolutely nothing in the law that prevents them from dropping their employee coverage. When the ACA takes effect, those same employers will be forced to pay a penalty (what the Republicans called a tax) for not covering their employees. The Papa Johns Pizza CEO famously overstated the costs by about triple. Much less than 1% of the corporate costs of the pizza. Now consider the savings to the public, of those employees who no longer have to go to the emergency room for basic medical care.

Employers firing people over this? Hardly. If anything, they'll hire more people to lower individual hours. As unemployment lowers due to the economic recovery, those same employers will struggle to keep their employees. Not fire them. Really, that claim just ignores basic business laws. Employers don't hire employees because they're cheap to hire. They hire employees because they have work to get done. The ACA won't lower the workload. If employers will be firing employees in order to not cover their medical insurance costs, then those are just the employers who weren't paying for health insurance, anyway, so it's just another savings for the public, who won't have to cover as much of the health expenses.

I could go on. but long story short, the article is crap. The ACA isn't perfect, but except for small exceptions, none of those "disturbing facts" about Obamacare are lies or exaggerations.


Sources:
http://news.investors.com/032113-648891-obamacare-turns-3-10-disturbing-facts-about-health-law.aspx?ref=HPLNews

http://obamacarefacts.com/obamacare-myths.php

http://www.salon.com/2012/11/16/papa_johns_bad_obamacare_math/

http://obamacarefacts.com/obama-care-fact-check.php

http://www.snopes.com/politics/medical/over75.asp

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/fact-checker/2011/01/health_care_myths.html

http://www.factcheck.org/2012/06/how-much-is-the-obamacare-tax/




I think you are trying to say the opposite of what you actually said.

Mortman's photo
Thu 03/21/13 09:58 PM

I think you are trying to say the opposite of what you actually said.


No. You may have seen the first link, which was the website for the original article (10 disturbing facts) but the other links are some pages that back up what I said.

The Affordable Care Act ("Obamacare") won't raise premiums, cause huge layoffs, cause employers to drop employer-sponsored health insurance, kill off seniors, or any of those other points. Honestly, nobody really knows all the effects and benefits of the ACA, yet. That's partly what Speaker Pelosi meant in her famous quote, but she was also referring to the public discussion that was sure to follow. For every cause for what the article says, I could point to other things to negate or reverse the effect in the article. It's bogus and just meant to play into a Republican narrative that Obamacare is bad. Again, it's not perfect, but it's better than what we used to have.

metalwing's photo
Fri 03/22/13 07:13 AM


I think you are trying to say the opposite of what you actually said.


No. You may have seen the first link, which was the website for the original article (10 disturbing facts) but the other links are some pages that back up what I said.

The Affordable Care Act ("Obamacare") won't raise premiums, cause huge layoffs, cause employers to drop employer-sponsored health insurance, kill off seniors, or any of those other points. Honestly, nobody really knows all the effects and benefits of the ACA, yet. That's partly what Speaker Pelosi meant in her famous quote, but she was also referring to the public discussion that was sure to follow. For every cause for what the article says, I could point to other things to negate or reverse the effect in the article. It's bogus and just meant to play into a Republican narrative that Obamacare is bad. Again, it's not perfect, but it's better than what we used to have.


Well, let me explain it to you in a different way. Read the quote of your post carefully and see if it is what you really mean.

" The ACA isn't perfect, but except for small exceptions, none of those "disturbing facts" about Obamacare are lies or exaggerations."

Conrad_73's photo
Fri 03/22/13 07:56 AM
if they had any sense they would have followed the Swiss Healthcare System!
Not perfect,but outstrips Obammy-Care by Lightyears!

Maybe when you're hurting enough from that new Tax!
Taxation what it is!
Good Luck!
Politicians must be laughing at every Banquet that new Slushfund is paying for!laugh

InvictusV's photo
Fri 03/22/13 08:20 AM


I think you are trying to say the opposite of what you actually said.


No. You may have seen the first link, which was the website for the original article (10 disturbing facts) but the other links are some pages that back up what I said.

The Affordable Care Act ("Obamacare") won't raise premiums, cause huge layoffs, cause employers to drop employer-sponsored health insurance, kill off seniors, or any of those other points. Honestly, nobody really knows all the effects and benefits of the ACA, yet. That's partly what Speaker Pelosi meant in her famous quote, but she was also referring to the public discussion that was sure to follow. For every cause for what the article says, I could point to other things to negate or reverse the effect in the article. It's bogus and just meant to play into a Republican narrative that Obamacare is bad. Again, it's not perfect, but it's better than what we used to have.


I call BS on this..



Insurers warn of sticker shock due to health care law’s new taxes, requirements as it expands

Some Americans could see their insurance bills double next year as the health care overhaul law expands coverage to millions of people.

The nation’s big health insurers say they expect premiums — or the cost for insurance coverage — to rise from 20 to 100 percent for millions of people due to changes that will occur when key provisions of the Affordable Care Act roll out in January 2014.

— Changes to how insurers set premiums according to age and gender could cause some premiums to rise as much as 50 percent, according to America’s Health Insurance Plans, or AHIP, an industry trade group that’s funded by insurers.

— A new tax on premiums could raise prices as much as 2.3 percent in 2014 and more in subsequent years, according to a study commissioned by AHIP. Policyholders with plans that end in 2014 probably have already seen an impact from this.

— Requirements that insurance plans in many cases cover more health care or pay a greater share of a patient’s bill than they do now also could add to premiums, depending on the extent of a person’s current coverage, according AHIP.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/insurers-warn-of-sticker-shock-due-to-health-care-laws-new-taxes-requirements-as-it-expands/2013/03/13/bb9806c0-8bf2-11e2-af15-99809eaba6cb_story_1.html


Conrad_73's photo
Fri 03/22/13 08:29 AM


I think you are trying to say the opposite of what you actually said.


No. You may have seen the first link, which was the website for the original article (10 disturbing facts) but the other links are some pages that back up what I said.

The Affordable Care Act ("Obamacare") won't raise premiums, cause huge layoffs, cause employers to drop employer-sponsored health insurance, kill off seniors, or any of those other points. Honestly, nobody really knows all the effects and benefits of the ACA, yet. That's partly what Speaker Pelosi meant in her famous quote, but she was also referring to the public discussion that was sure to follow. For every cause for what the article says, I could point to other things to negate or reverse the effect in the article. It's bogus and just meant to play into a Republican narrative that Obamacare is bad. Again, it's not perfect, but it's better than what we used to have.
Plainly,It's Feces!

metalwing's photo
Fri 03/22/13 10:40 AM
I saw today where a bi-partisan bill passed to do away with the 2.5%tax on "devices" that was hidden in the Obamacare bill. It was viewed to cost 43,000 jobs and was a major source of income to pay for Obamacare.

I wonder if Obama will sign it?whoa

mightymoe's photo
Fri 03/22/13 12:54 PM
personally, i think it will bankrupt the country sooner it than would have without it... now, everyone with the smallest problem will be heading to the doctor, and they will do all the expensive tests, knowing they don't need them, and charge extra money for it...and i guess the government will pay for it all...

kc0003's photo
Fri 03/22/13 12:57 PM
Edited by kc0003 on Fri 03/22/13 01:16 PM
It wasn't exactly hidden. The tax was not meant to be forwarded to the consumer. According to the IRS: "Because the tax is imposed upon the sale of a taxable medical device by the manufacturer or importer, the manufacturer or importer is responsible for reporting and paying the tax."

In addition, the law provides for what is called a "retail exemption," meaning items such as eyeglasses, contact lenses, hearing aids, and "other devices that are of a type that are generally purchased by the general public at retail for individual use" are exempt from the medical device excise tax.

The 43,000 jobs loss you refer to was produced by a study done by AdvaMed, a medical tech. association that represents about 80% of the firms that sell medical technologies in the USA. It's basically a lobbying group. Now imagine that, an 'association' representing a muti-billion dollar industry, having influence on our law makers, go figure.

metalwing's photo
Fri 03/22/13 02:05 PM

It wasn't exactly hidden. The tax was not meant to be forwarded to the consumer. According to the IRS: "Because the tax is imposed upon the sale of a taxable medical device by the manufacturer or importer, the manufacturer or importer is responsible for reporting and paying the tax."

In addition, the law provides for what is called a "retail exemption," meaning items such as eyeglasses, contact lenses, hearing aids, and "other devices that are of a type that are generally purchased by the general public at retail for individual use" are exempt from the medical device excise tax.

The 43,000 jobs loss you refer to was produced by a study done by AdvaMed, a medical tech. association that represents about 80% of the firms that sell medical technologies in the USA. It's basically a lobbying group. Now imagine that, an 'association' representing a muti-billion dollar industry, having influence on our law makers, go figure.


Well, I guess technically, nothing was hidden in the bill since it was all in writing. But, if you recall, no one had time to read it. They had to "pass the bill so they could see what was in it!"

mightymoe's photo
Fri 03/22/13 02:08 PM


It wasn't exactly hidden. The tax was not meant to be forwarded to the consumer. According to the IRS: "Because the tax is imposed upon the sale of a taxable medical device by the manufacturer or importer, the manufacturer or importer is responsible for reporting and paying the tax."

In addition, the law provides for what is called a "retail exemption," meaning items such as eyeglasses, contact lenses, hearing aids, and "other devices that are of a type that are generally purchased by the general public at retail for individual use" are exempt from the medical device excise tax.

The 43,000 jobs loss you refer to was produced by a study done by AdvaMed, a medical tech. association that represents about 80% of the firms that sell medical technologies in the USA. It's basically a lobbying group. Now imagine that, an 'association' representing a muti-billion dollar industry, having influence on our law makers, go figure.


Well, I guess technically, nothing was hidden in the bill since it was all in writing. But, if you recall, no one had time to read it. They had to "pass the bill so they could see what was in it!"


i read it, and still have no idea what's in it... pelosi lied...

kc0003's photo
Fri 03/22/13 04:00 PM



It wasn't exactly hidden. The tax was not meant to be forwarded to the consumer. According to the IRS: "Because the tax is imposed upon the sale of a taxable medical device by the manufacturer or importer, the manufacturer or importer is responsible for reporting and paying the tax."

In addition, the law provides for what is called a "retail exemption," meaning items such as eyeglasses, contact lenses, hearing aids, and "other devices that are of a type that are generally purchased by the general public at retail for individual use" are exempt from the medical device excise tax.

The 43,000 jobs loss you refer to was produced by a study done by AdvaMed, a medical tech. association that represents about 80% of the firms that sell medical technologies in the USA. It's basically a lobbying group. Now imagine that, an 'association' representing a muti-billion dollar industry, having influence on our law makers, go figure.


Well, I guess technically, nothing was hidden in the bill since it was all in writing. But, if you recall, no one had time to read it. They had to "pass the bill so they could see what was in it!"


i read it, and still have no idea what's in it... pelosi lied...

well she is in Washington, isn't she?

the point is that this is not an across the board tax and the idea that implementing it will cause these companies to ship jobs overseas (as claimed in the report by AdvaMed) is little more that a scare tactic. albeit an obviously effective one.

metalwing's photo
Fri 03/22/13 04:19 PM




It wasn't exactly hidden. The tax was not meant to be forwarded to the consumer. According to the IRS: "Because the tax is imposed upon the sale of a taxable medical device by the manufacturer or importer, the manufacturer or importer is responsible for reporting and paying the tax."

In addition, the law provides for what is called a "retail exemption," meaning items such as eyeglasses, contact lenses, hearing aids, and "other devices that are of a type that are generally purchased by the general public at retail for individual use" are exempt from the medical device excise tax.

The 43,000 jobs loss you refer to was produced by a study done by AdvaMed, a medical tech. association that represents about 80% of the firms that sell medical technologies in the USA. It's basically a lobbying group. Now imagine that, an 'association' representing a muti-billion dollar industry, having influence on our law makers, go figure.


Well, I guess technically, nothing was hidden in the bill since it was all in writing. But, if you recall, no one had time to read it. They had to "pass the bill so they could see what was in it!"


i read it, and still have no idea what's in it... pelosi lied...

well she is in Washington, isn't she?

the point is that this is not an across the board tax and the idea that implementing it will cause these companies to ship jobs overseas (as claimed in the report by AdvaMed) is little more that a scare tactic. albeit an obviously effective one.


The tax was (according to the writers of the bill) on the manufacturers, not the public, so it wouldn't be passed along to the consumer ... (all 100 billion dollars of it over ten years). This is either stupid or dishonest, depending upon how much credibility you give our lawmakers.