Jew is a term used reflexively for a person who is both religiously a Jew and likewise a person who is HEBREW.

A person who is Arab can be Islamic (Usually) and in their faith only Arabs really are the TRUE Islamics. Muslim applies to all others of the faith who are NOT Arab by descent.

Claiming to not tell a person's religion by genetics is sort of true to an extent except that Judaism is a way of life and a RACE OF PEOPLE! Sorry but this claim is only partially valid.

Nobody ever said you could tell someone's religion solely by
genetics!

What was said was that genetic studies disprove the idiotic claims
of Sands that it is likely that the ancestry of most contemporary
Jews stems mainly from outside the ancient Land of Israel and that
a "nation-race" of Jews with a common origin never existed

It is now known through the genetic studies that Sands' view is
patently false.

Genetic studies prove that the ancestry of most contemporary Jews
stems directly from a common origin in the Mideast and that
basically all Jews show common ancestry directly linked to the
ancient Land of Israel and the nation-race of Jews is shown
directly through their modern day descendants.



The studies were done to understand the origins of people in this
case the Jewish population.



Actually there was no invasion of Jews in Israel. Jews always lived
there and migration always occurred there but it picked up a lot
when Jews had to escape Hitler and find a place to live and most
of the countries of the world would not accept any more Jews.



Actually the term "Ashkenazi" comes from a Hebrew word and refers
only to Jews - see the website on basic judaism 101 where this
question level is rated "basic". Ashkenazis are one of three major
groups of Jews based on geography. The term was invented to describe
one of these groups of Jews and no one else. There is no such thing
as non-Jewish Ashkenazis. Ashkenazis, Sephardim and Mizrachi are
all Jews from different geographic areas who have slightly different
rituals. Other than that, they are all Jews who practice the
religion Judaism and whom the genetic studies clearly show are
related and originate from the Middle east.

When you speak of the Ashkenazi of Israel you are merely talking
about Jews whose ancestors are from these areas. Meanwhile you are
confused about so-called secular Jews who are Jews from any of these
regions who just don't go to church everyday.

First of all, secular Jews are still Jews - still believe all the
central precepts of Judaism but are somewhat less observant.

It's like saying that Christians who don't go to church everyday are
not Christian even though they believe in Jesus, go to lengths to
follow his teachings but they only go to church on Christmas and
Easter or for various family events.



It still begs the question - why do some here always try to find ways
to delegitimize some Jews and attack Israel?

I think this bias against Jews in particular and also with Israeli
Jews is the reason others are suspicious of the motivation especially
with the long history of unjust bias and lies disparaging Jews as a
form of genocidal religious hatred.




Read the whole article on Ashkenazis here...
http://www.jewfaq.org/ashkseph.htm

Ashkenazic and Sephardic Jews
Ashkenazim v'Sepharadim (in Hebrew)

Level: Basic

• There are several subgroups of Jews with different culture and traditions:
Ashkenazic: Descendants of Jews from France, Germany and Eastern Europe
Sephardic: Descendants of Jews from Spain, Portugal, North Africa and the Middle East
Mizrachi: Descendants of Jews from North Africa and the Middle East
• Other subgroups are Yemenite, Ethiopian and Oriental

Ashkenazic and Sephardic Jews represent two distinct subcultures of Judaism. We are all Jews and share the same basic beliefs, but there are some variations in culture and practice. It's not clear when the split began, but it has existed for more than a thousand years, because around the year 1000 C.E., Rabbi Gershom ben Judah issued an edict against polygamy that was accepted by Ashkenazim but not by Sephardim.
Who are Ashkenazic Jews?

Ashkenazic Jews are the Jews of France, Germany, and Eastern Europe and their descendants. The adjective "Ashkenazic" and corresponding nouns, Ashkenazi (singular) and Ashkenazim (plural) are derived from the Hebrew word "Ashkenaz," which is used to refer to Germany. Most American Jews today are Ashkenazim, descended from Jews who emigrated from Germany and Eastern Europe from the mid 1800s to the early 1900s. The pages in this site are written from the Ashkenazic Jewish perspective.

=-=-=-=

or, read the Wiki http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_Jews

Ashkenazi Jews, also known as Ashkenazic Jews or Ashkenazim (Hebrew: אַשְׁכְּנַזִּים, Ashkenazi Hebrew pronunciation: [ˌaʃkəˈnazim], singular: [ˌaʃkəˈnazi], Modern Hebrew: [aʃkenaˈzim], [aʃkenaˈzi]; also יְהוּדֵי אַשְׁכֲּנַז Y'hudey Ashkenaz, "The Jews of Ashkenaz"), are an ethnoreligious group who trace their origins to the indigenous Hebrew speaking peoples of Canaan in South Western Asia, and settled along the Rhine in Germany from Alsace in the south to the Rhineland in the north, probably during the early Middle Ages.[5]

The name Ashkenazi derives from the biblical figure of Ashkenaz, the first son of Gomer, and a Japhetic patriarch in the Table of Nations (Genesis 10). In the rabbinic literature, the kingdom of Ashkenaz was first associated with the Scythian region, then later with the Slavic territories,[6] and, from the 11th century onwards, with northern Europe and Germany.[7] The Jews living in these regions associated with Ashkenaz's kingdom thus came to call themselves the Ashkenazi.[7] Later, Jews from Western and Central Europe also came to be called Ashkenazi because the main centers of Jewish learning were located in Germany.

Many Ashkenazi Jews later migrated, largely eastward, forming communities in non German-speaking areas, including Bohemia, Hungary, Poland, Belarus, Lithuania, Russia, Ukraine, Romania, and elsewhere between the 11th and 19th centuries. With them, they took and diversified Yiddish, a High German language written using the Hebrew alphabet. It had developed in medieval times as the lingua franca among Ashkenazi Jews. The Jewish communities of three cities along the Rhine: Speyer, Worms and Mainz, created the SHUM league (SHUM after the first Hebrew letters of Shpira, Vermayza, and Magentza). The ShUM-cities are considered the cradle of the distinct Ashkenazi culture and liturgy.

None of the genetics give a person a right to claim a country that they were not born in.

So what if they are "Hebrew?"

If as you said, "a convert is not a real Jew" then keep religion out of the conversation.


Judaism is not a "race of people" either because 'race' is about skin color.

As for being "a way of life" you can say that about anything.

So it looks to me like "Jewish" is not a religion, because converts are not "real Jews." and the religion does not make you Jewish.

And it is not race because race is skin color and there are so-called Jews of all skin colors.

What it is, is a family bloodline.

Therefore we are basically down to describing a Jew as someone who has a very particular genetic marker that is passed down from the mother.

If your father is Jewish, you will not have this genetic marker and you cannot claim to be Jewish.

So it is all about a genetic marker and nothing else.

Family Bloodlines leading to whom?

(Some claim Abraham and King David, but there is no evidence that they are anything other than fictional characters.)

you really don't get it,do you?
At least you're giving my Jewish Friends their Daily Comic Relief!

You really need to read up on Science instead of making assumptions!
Those Researches stand,and you nor your Friends can do anything about it,except come up with your own Genome Research,which goes a bit further than what you have shown here so far with your Pictorial Samples!
They don't cut it in the Scientific world!
Neither will your Red Herrings or Obfuscations!

It is YOU that don't get it.

I understand it completely now.

Unless you have a certain genetic marker passed down from your mother you are not considered to be a real Jew.

Your race or religion is irrelevant, meaningless.

But what does that genetic marker prove?

Not much except it proves a common ancestor. It does not give anyone the right to the "Holy Land."

I am completely clear now on what it takes to be a "real Jew."

I wonder when they will start issuing DNA screening and I.D. cards.

Like the system isn't winding up for that now with the criminal genetic data base?

Well so far, that's only for criminals.

Obfuscating?
More Red Herrings?

Obfuscating: to make obscure
red herring: something that distracts attention from the real issue

Now please explain to me what you mean by your remark.

I believe we have clearly established through previous discussion here, that to be a "real Jew" you must have a Jewish Mother.

Correct?
(Although many will dispute this claim, including some Jews.)

We have also established that Jews come in all races, so race does not determine who a Jew is.

Correct?

Now, the idea of a genetic marker, passed down by the mother is being offered up as some kind of proof that the people who have moved into Israel and created a "Jewish State" have some kind of rightful and lawful claim on the Holy Land and Israel.

Forget all other claims, if they have that genetic marker, they will be welcomed as Jews regardless of their race or religion.

Correct?

Now, I say these things to clarify not to confuse you or distract you from the subject. In fact, I am zeroing in on the subject.

If you are confused, then please tell me what is confusing you.

Conrad? Here is your chance to help clarify the issue if you are confused. What it is you don't understand?