>> I am intolerant of intolerance

My thoughts exactly.

Hi, Sherrie! ;o)

yeah, well...i'm intolerant on several issues. like drugs.

religious beliefs...depending on WHAT they are...i could maybe cope with.

er...if you sacrifice little animals, i think we're incompatible.

>> if you sacrifice little animals, i think we're incompatible.

How about sacrificing big animals?

Would that work for ya?

lol, james...i knew SOMEONE would end up saying that, heh.

er...no death-dealing. oh, no torture...experiments...none of that.

hey, mesage, artgurl, lulu -

Abra - you are so talented. I loved the poem, had a lot of feeling and touched emotions, I thing most of us have had to deal with. I also liked the music for the chorus, the high desperate cry with the low of defeat. Overall, I wish it could have had a better beat, maybe quicker, I don't know, maybe it just needs the right voice singing it.
Very lovely though, thanks for sharing.

sorry, did not mean to hijack the thread. I'll be quiet now.

heya!

never be quiet.

Well, my opinion for what it's worth:

I believe that having a comparable value system is essential. It wouldn't do to have one partner to believe that it's never acceptable to take advantage of the good nature of others, while the other partner thinks that people who are 'too nice' are naïve and deserve whatever comes their way.

If you consider religion equivalent to morality, then having the same religious beliefs is imperative. Otherwise, you could have vastly different religious views without difficulty. Belief (or equivalent belief) in God wouldn't be necessary as long as you both have similar overall values. For example, atheists have a considerably higher marital success rate than the national average in the U.S.

>> Belief (or equivalent belief) in God wouldn't be necessary as long as you both have similar overall values.

That's the bottom line right there.

There are far too many religious hypocrites around. Being religious doesn't mean a thing to me. It's how a person actually behaves that's important.

boy, isn't that the truth.

it's more important to me that a person has an ethical system that is compatible with my own...

Not important to me at all. But I'm an atheist.

Well, it is to each his own. But, for me it will be necessary to have similar beliefs. I do believe in God, that is my faith. It will not work for me to have a relationship with a man that believes differently. Not that he would be a bad person, but it could affect my belief system and my faith based personality. I could regress. For me to lose what I believe now, could be disasterous for me.
I too for a man that had different values to mine, could also do harm to his life beliefs.

But, I will tell you this: To believe or not to believe will not devalue anyone in my books. I love people and will always stand tall for a persons rights to live their own life the way they feel it is right to live.

Kat

I have seen plenty of relationships where there is no belief in God, and the relationship is a strong one. My Mom's and Dad's come to mind. However, I do not think that the situation where one has a strong belief in God while the other does not has much of a chance to get stronger. Too many issues and crises develop when faith within the relationship is tested. It is my personal belief - that a couple who are both believers have a necessity in having God as the third "string in the cord" else crises of faith will erode the relationship to a point of being un-repairable.

Abra;

Why is it that in all your posts you equate a belief in God with being religious - than site all of the hypocracy in Religions as being a reason not to belive in God? I thought you take pride in your beliefs as being logically based? I just get this sense that you always state this circular proof as a basis of stating that belief in God other than the one you've created for yourself is foolish. Or maybe I'm missing something from your posts. Not meant to be argumentative here - just curious about this. I often find you add a lot to the argument - until my original thought is brought up.

Eljay wrote:
“Why is it that in all your posts you equate a belief in God with being religious - than site all of the hypocrisy in Religions as being a reason not to believe in God?”

Well, first off, I never said that hypocrisy was a reason not to believe in god, but it’s a good reason not to become involved with religion.

Also, the confusion probably has to do with the posts I’m responding to:

INnotOF wrote in her post: “So when I told him I couldn't continue seeing him based on this need, he said he'd go to church with me.”

Seems that a “belief in god” has been reduced to a specific religion (or church) in this case.

Yes, I believe in god, and my believe is absolute. But I denounce organized religions completely. From my point of view organized religions breed ignorance, prejudice, any many other bad things.

So yes, there’s a huge difference between god and religion. I totally denounce religion. But I absolutely do not denounce god. The only problem is that since religions DEFINE their god, then I may necessarily need to also denounce their idol (which they view as god). But to me that’s not god.

So yes, it does get confusing.

When I sound like I’m denouncing a ‘god’ I’m really denouncing what I believe to be a false idol.

If a woman wanted me to go to church with her she’d basically be asking me to go worship an idol. I could never do that. So from her point of view I’m an “atheist” because I don’t believe in HER image of god.

I could actually say the same thing about her. I could say that she’s an atheist because she doesn’t know god directly. I just can’t understand people who need to put a third party between themselves and god. To me that would be utterly absurd.

In short, I don’t equate a belief in god with being religious. I equate a belief in a religion with being religious. I’m definitely not a religious person. I just know god directly. No third party required. God has nothing to do with churches. At least no more so than another other human activity.

Well, it's a fine line how regarding the way you define the two: "Belief in God" vs. "Value System". Both can play out in their own way. One couple may believe religious rituals are vital, whereas another couple may agree that just having the same understanding about their views is enough.

All I can say is that you have to know what's important to you and then spend LOTS of time talking and interacting with your potential mate. That's the only way to get a better sense of your long-term compatibility.

Faith is a tricky one, but in the end your heart will know when all is a green light! :-)

Good luck!

Abra;

Thanx for your explination - it makes it easier to discern between what you believe - and when your posts interweave a little "sarcastic tone".

I agree with the separation of "God" and "Religion" stance that you state. Perhaps not in quite the same way - but non the less, I've seen many peoples' faith crushed - all in the name of religion. Though I can honestly say that I have seen the reverse also. Not all churches such the life out of their adharents. (is that a word?) I tend to find the churches with heirarchies the worst. Churches that are non-denominational have always seemed to me to be a group of people with sincerity in their faith and belief simply meeting together to share and fellowship with one another - without all the trappings of pomp and circumstance.

i don't think it is necessary as long as they have strong character and a good heart.

As far as I am concerned... YES The Bible teaches be not unequally yoked together. If she dosn't believe in Jesus Christ as her personnal Savior the relationship with not work for me.

sounds like brainwashing....

Two people in a serious relationship generally can't have _vastly_ different world views. However, I know several couples who don't believe the same things when it comes to religion (my aunt and her husband come to mind), and because they focus on other parts of their relationship with each other, it works for them.

I guess I don't see it as a big problem as long as each person gives the other respect in regard to his/her beliefs. Except for those whose religion tells them they cannot marry or date outside the faith, it seems like a non-issue.

So many things supersede a relationship — sometimes or all the time — like kids, work, financial problems, etc. Even when one person is more involved than the other (e.g., step children), what's important is that they are there for each other, supporting and consoling as needed. Whether my partner believes what I believe about the world is of no consequence to me as long as we have similar values and respect what's important to each other.

And what happens when two people get married and have similar beliefs, but over a number of years one person changes and believes something different. Does that shift in thinking require that the relationship end? If it does, then I consider that the relationship was incredibly superficial.