Here is a link to a short video that, in my humble opinion, drives the nails into the coffin of the mind/brain or body/soul dualism concept.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2upDm-xFqMo

Any thoughts?

Almost 48 hours without any reply. Can I assume this debate has been laid to rest?

I'm not clear on the exact question or claim.

That would really be something, a debate that has been going on for generations resolved in 48 hours.

Check out, "On Truth and Knowledge" They are of the opinion that there is no "physical" reality. All matter is just a Spherical wave of energy. The site has works from all of the major philosophers and physicists, enough info to spend a lifetime contemplating.

Good Luck

That sounds very interesting and very much how I think reality is.

An argument about what is "physical" and what is "non-physical" is a pointless waste of time. And it does not prove that consciousness does not exist... just because you can't put it in a jar and study it.

paul1217

>>>Check out, "On Truth and Knowledge" They are of the opinion that there is no "physical" reality. All matter is just a Spherical wave of energy. The site has works from all of the major philosophers and physicists, enough info to spend a lifetime contemplating. <<<<




Do you have a link?

http://www.spaceandmotion.com/

Sorry it's "On truth and Reality" I have found it by googling both ways. Be prepared for a LOT of reading.

Thanks, I'm familiar with this guy's site, I like it a lot. I had lost track of where it was.

TexasScoundrel,

Instead of a link to a video, why don't you state your claim.

I think it's more likely people will watch a short video than read 10,000 words.

The point of the video is that there, is no dualism. Mind and brain are one in the same. So, watch the video and see if you can look up or come up with a reply.

There are some very deep thinkers on Mingle. I enjoy the reads. Here's the thing with me and videos. I currently get my internet using mi-fi. My "plan" only gives me 5 GBs/month. Videos gobble up tons of GBs. I know this is pretty unusual for most people. I would love to watch your video, but I just can't.

Very well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dualism_%28philosophy_of_mind%29

If mind and brain were the same thing there would not be two different meanings and two different words.

The video implied that the only thing that is "real" is what we call "physical" and that what people call non-physical does not exist.

What the video wants to imply is that there is no "soul" and that no consciousness of mind can exist after death.

The video's premise is that consciousness emerges from the physical brain and body therefore when that dies no consciousness or soul can exist.

The logic of the video stems from the premise above that I don't accept.

In order to convince me they would have to back up a lot and prove that consciousness is born after the brain and body are formed.

It has no explanation of HOW the brain and body are formed or how or when consciousness emerged from star dust.

It also does not come close to my question of at what point does an unconscious piece of space material (star dust)become conscious? (assuming their premise is true)

At what point does this miracle happen?

TexasScoundrel

You helped me prove that cells have consciousness in this thread. Check it out.


http://mingle2.com/topic/show/299604?page=6

I might ask you also:

Do you have a brain?

Do you have a mind of your own?

If so, who are you that has these things?

Who are you and where are you?

I might ask you also:

Do you have a brain?

Do you have a mind of your own?

If so, who are you that has these things?

Who are you and where are you?

Why do people say "my brain..."

Why do peoples say "my mind.."

Why do they say "I will give him a piece of my mind."

Or "My brain is not working very good today."

These are not just figures of speech.

No reply, so can I assume this debate has been laid to rest?

The video stated

"if we don't need a brain for consciousness then there is not reason that any object could not be regarded as conscious. Nor would there be any inherent reason for us to have bodies in the first place."

How would you argue against that?


QualiaSoup also brought up an older argument that we have had in the past. If certain parts of the brain are destroyed, through stroke, injury or disease, such as Alzheimers, the personality of and identity of that individual can be lost. It is lost because the physical connection to it has been destroyed. When we die, our physical brain dies with us. So how can our knowledge, our personality, our identity go on? It was merely a part of the physical existence.

What is your argument against that?

I think its a ridiculous statement to begin with.

What good is consciousness without bodies? Would you like to spend infinity as brain in a jar? I doubt it.





I can't speak for everyone but personality is not the sum total of a person. I personally have multiple personalities and they don't always agree with each other.

Texas,

That's a great video - so much material covered in such a short period of time. Its clean, direct, precise, and intelligent. Thank you for posting that link.