Topic: Why do Democrats deny their direct ties to slavery and take
msharmony's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:11 PM
Edited by msharmony on Mon 12/07/09 05:13 PM
From PBS.ORG

On November 6, 1860 Abraham Lincoln was elected President of the United States -- an event that outraged southern states. The Republican party had run on an anti-slavery platform, and many southerners felt that there was no longer a place for them in the Union. ...



In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun

It appears the secession may have been due to an anti slavery platform that was opposed. The WAR started because the confederacy did not believe Lincolns inauggaral promise not to mess with the slavery currently in progress and attacked Ft Sumter. Now I am sure there are many accounts and interpretations of this time in history, but I consider pbs to be one of the least slanted sources one can find.


Ronny, you are right about the anti slavery and the republicans although Lincoln apparently was playing both sides to keep the peace. But lately, the republicans seem all about keeping the status quo and protecting the haves while letting the have nots rot.

heavenlyboy34's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:18 PM
OP-you err in the reason for the founding of the Republicans. The factions that comprised the party were-

* Northern Whigs united in their opposition to the Kansas-Nebraska Act, but leaderless following the deaths of Henry Clay and Daniel Webster, both in 1852
* The Free-Soil Party, which had played a spoiler role in several presidential elections, but now was bereft of effective leadership
* The Know-Nothing movement, whose roots lay in the fear of immigrants in general and Roman Catholics in particular
* Northern Democrats who deserted their Southern cousins over the slavery issue.

Fanta46's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:20 PM
Alabama;
McCain-61%
Obama-39%

Miss
McCain-56.4%
Obam-42%

Lousiana
McCain-58.6%
Obama-39/9%

SC
McCain-53.8%
Obama-44.(%

Arkansas
McCain-58.8%
Obama-38.8%

Georgia
McCain-52.2%
Obama-47%

Tenn
McCain-56.9%
Obama-41.8%

What's up with that?


He won Tex by 12%. They were a slave state but the population is heavy white with a lot of Mex thrown in.



Fla, VA and NC went to Obama. Fla, and NC barely, and VA by 6%

Fanta46's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:23 PM





It's impossible to have an intelligent debate on such an abbreviated post with so many misrepresented ideas as the op post.
Not in a post 1000 times as long.

The length and brevity of the post is evidence of it's inaccuracy and bias content.

Let's start with 1854,

The Republican party was founded in an attempt to break a series of ties within congress. Not slavery, but one more aligned with the Industrial North's attempts to gain Fed funding for road, bridge, and dock improvements. Improvements the Agricultural south thought was a waste of Fed taxes and sure to cause tax increases among all Americans. Yet funding that did not benefit the south.

The impression you get is an excuse they used to gain congressional members to win the funding.


You see you leaving out a key factor! Why did the north lack the equality monatarily? Slavery, Free labor! The South had free labor and yes the north was willing to turn a blind eye as long as the south didnt push the issue, but it came to a point where economics would not allow and yes it had everything to do with slavery! damn just dunking on you!


The South took pride in being self sufficient.
The North wanted free handouts.
They wanted all Americans, Northern and Southern, to pay for the improvements only they needed for their industrial economy.



okay offtopic


slavery = self sufficieny interesting


No, self sufficieny meaning they didnt need tax dollars.
self sufficient from the Federal Gov.

And no the civil war was not based on slavery.

Fanta46's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:25 PM

Alabama;
McCain-61%
Obama-39%

Miss
McCain-56.4%
Obam-42%

Lousiana
McCain-58.6%
Obama-39/9%

SC
McCain-53.8%
Obama-44.(%

Arkansas
McCain-58.8%
Obama-38.8%

Georgia
McCain-52.2%
Obama-47%

Tenn
McCain-56.9%
Obama-41.8%

What's up with that?


He won Tex by 12%. They were a slave state but the population is heavy white with a lot of Mex thrown in.



Fla, VA and NC went to Obama. Fla, and NC barely, and VA by 6%



If nothing the results of the 2008 election prove the south is now Republican leaning.

Fanta46's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:29 PM
When Lincoln finally wrote the emancipation Proclamation it was for use as a weapon and only pertained to the slaves in southern states at first.
He hoped it would cause an uprising of slaves in the south to disrupt the confederate army at their rear.

It didnt work.

Fanta46's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:30 PM
Slaves were not freed, even in the North until the war was over. 1865!

msharmony's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:30 PM
Seriously, does anyone really believe the uprising,, civil war, had nothing to do with the threat against slavery?

Fanta46's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:35 PM
I'll also repeat. Most Southern States did not secede from the Union until Ft. Sumter was attacked.
To most the defining reason was States rights. They didn't appreciate the Fed Gov marching Armies across their land to attack their neighbors.

no photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:35 PM

From PBS.ORG

On November 6, 1860 Abraham Lincoln was elected President of the United States -- an event that outraged southern states. The Republican party had run on an anti-slavery platform, and many southerners felt that there was no longer a place for them in the Union. ...



In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun

It appears the secession may have been due to an anti slavery platform that was opposed. The WAR started because the confederacy did not believe Lincolns inauggaral promise not to mess with the slavery currently in progress and attacked Ft Sumter. Now I am sure there are many accounts and interpretations of this time in history, but I consider pbs to be one of the least slanted sources one can find.


Ronny, you are right about the anti slavery and the republicans although Lincoln apparently was playing both sides to keep the peace. But lately, the republicans seem all about keeping the status quo and protecting the haves while letting the have nots rot.


Yes The Republican party is a shell of it's former self and they once lived up to a portion of their platform and now rarely do any conservative thinking contrary to their promises! We can argue personal responability and social economics but harmony Republicans are not racists, poeple are racists! And democrats are not civil rights champions either! history shows that they are not. I know the civil rights bill of 1963 was monumental but in comparison to what the democrats did to black america prior to that is a far greater sin and peanuts! Not to mention if you look at the work it took of years of legislation to get to 1963. Not to mention the majority of the civil rights violation and crimes commited against african americans during the 1960's accured in the Democrat stronghold "the South" Democrat goveners and so on...... there hands are not clean!

Fanta46's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:36 PM
Edited by Fanta46 on Mon 12/07/09 05:37 PM

Seriously, does anyone really believe the uprising,, civil war, had nothing to do with the threat against slavery?



Most southerners didnt even own slaves. Esp the poor ones who volunteered to fight.
Besides, slavery was still legal in the North.


no photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:40 PM

Alabama;
McCain-61%
Obama-39%

Miss
McCain-56.4%
Obam-42%

Lousiana
McCain-58.6%
Obama-39/9%

SC
McCain-53.8%
Obama-44.(%

Arkansas
McCain-58.8%
Obama-38.8%

Georgia
McCain-52.2%
Obama-47%

Tenn
McCain-56.9%
Obama-41.8%

What's up with that?


He won Tex by 12%. They were a slave state but the population is heavy white with a lot of Mex thrown in.



Fla, VA and NC went to Obama. Fla, and NC barely, and VA by 6%



are you stating that whites vote against blacks and vise versa? duh! what does that prove? your logic just makes no sense!

msharmony's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:42 PM
Edited by msharmony on Mon 12/07/09 05:44 PM


Seriously, does anyone really believe the uprising,, civil war, had nothing to do with the threat against slavery?



Most southerners didnt even own slaves. Esp the poor ones who volunteered to fight.
Besides, slavery was still legal in the North.




Wow,,, ok

and Ronny,,,this statement "Republicans are not racists, poeple are racists" is 100 percent correct. I believe that racism is not political but personal and can be found on both sides. I just think that most people are under the impressiont that social programs mostly benefit minority groups and therefore the taxpayers who do happen to be racists against these groups are more likely to align themselves with the republican party which generally opposes such programs.

no photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:42 PM


Alabama;
McCain-61%
Obama-39%

Miss
McCain-56.4%
Obam-42%

Lousiana
McCain-58.6%
Obama-39/9%

SC
McCain-53.8%
Obama-44.(%

Arkansas
McCain-58.8%
Obama-38.8%

Georgia
McCain-52.2%
Obama-47%

Tenn
McCain-56.9%
Obama-41.8%

What's up with that?


He won Tex by 12%. They were a slave state but the population is heavy white with a lot of Mex thrown in.



Fla, VA and NC went to Obama. Fla, and NC barely, and VA by 6%



If nothing the results of the 2008 election prove the south is now Republican leaning.
okay the south is republican leaning because of those stats lol.... no it just shows the south is still racists, flip the color of skin and u flip the results! not to mention its one race!

no photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:43 PM

When Lincoln finally wrote the emancipation Proclamation it was for use as a weapon and only pertained to the slaves in southern states at first.
He hoped it would cause an uprising of slaves in the south to disrupt the confederate army at their rear.

It didnt work.


it's quite a talent to read the mind of a dead man!

no photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:46 PM

I'll also repeat. Most Southern States did not secede from the Union until Ft. Sumter was attacked.
To most the defining reason was States rights. They didn't appreciate the Fed Gov marching Armies across their land to attack their neighbors.


thats such a crock! You are doing exactly what you accuse others of! You say it's states rights, have you thought maybe the south used states rights as their excuse when it was really about slavery. damn from the free throw line flying threw the air jordan style...DUNK!

Dragoness's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:48 PM



damn i wont argue anymore your not gonna admit your wrong but here is an actual interveiw with him!

http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Interview_with_Nathan_Bedford_Forrest

Nathan Bedford Forrest's own words! Geez democrats just won't admit when they are wrong, if you can't see your wrong There really is not anything left to say!frustrated rant rant rant


He did not say he was a democrat...lol

So you proved nothing yet again.

Why do you want to lie anyway?


My word set down the koolaid for a second please! I quote!

Feeling towards Uncle Sam
"What are your feelings towards the federal government, general?"

"I loved the old government in 1861. I loved the old Constitution yet. I think it is the best government in the world, if administered as it was before the war. I do not hate it; I am opposing now only the radical revolutionists who are trying to destroy it. I believe that party to be composed, as I know it is in Tennessee, of the worst men on Gods earth-men who would not hesitate at no crime, and who have only one object in view-to enrich themselves."


Who could he possibly be talking about? Keep in mind he is a confederate General! Take a deep breath and except it! Do you want the actual registartion slip to know that he was a registered democrat? Evidence is just that evidence so who is lying? He says "that party" Which party is he refering to? The republican party obviously! The founder of the KKK you stated he was! A confederate general! so whom is he refering too? Who does the KKK founder mean when he says he hates that party? 2+2 equals 4 so you stop lying!


You haven't proven your point yet.

I am still waiting.

Democrats did not start the KKK.


Dragoness's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:49 PM
You know after reading through the original post again.

The original Republicans would be ASHAMED of their descendents today, wouldn't they have????


So sad to see the degeneration of a good party like that.

Fanta46's photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:50 PM


From PBS.ORG

On November 6, 1860 Abraham Lincoln was elected President of the United States -- an event that outraged southern states. The Republican party had run on an anti-slavery platform, and many southerners felt that there was no longer a place for them in the Union. ...



In his inaugural address, delivered on March 4, 1861, Lincoln proclaimed that it was his duty to maintain the Union. He also declared that he had no intention of ending slavery where it existed, or of repealing the Fugitive Slave Law -- a position that horrified African Americans and their white allies. Lincoln's statement, however, did not satisfy the Confederacy, and on April 12 they attacked Fort Sumter, a federal stronghold in Charleston, South Carolina. Federal troops returned the fire. The Civil War had begun

It appears the secession may have been due to an anti slavery platform that was opposed. The WAR started because the confederacy did not believe Lincolns inauggaral promise not to mess with the slavery currently in progress and attacked Ft Sumter. Now I am sure there are many accounts and interpretations of this time in history, but I consider pbs to be one of the least slanted sources one can find.


Ronny, you are right about the anti slavery and the republicans although Lincoln apparently was playing both sides to keep the peace. But lately, the republicans seem all about keeping the status quo and protecting the haves while letting the have nots rot.


Yes The Republican party is a shell of it's former self and they once lived up to a portion of their platform and now rarely do any conservative thinking contrary to their promises! We can argue personal responability and social economics but harmony Republicans are not racists, poeple are racists! And democrats are not civil rights champions either! history shows that they are not. I know the civil rights bill of 1963 was monumental but in comparison to what the democrats did to black america prior to that is a far greater sin and peanuts! Not to mention if you look at the work it took of years of legislation to get to 1963. Not to mention the majority of the civil rights violation and crimes commited against african americans during the 1960's accured in the Democrat stronghold "the South" Democrat goveners and so on...... there hands are not clean!


That's BS.
The North was full of Democrats as well as well as Whigs.

The Republican Party was new and all weren't against slavery!
They were mostly Industrialist and opportunists.


They opposed the Kansas-Nebraska Act. It would have created a Div like the one in Missouri and kept congress equal with votes remaining tied on bills they wished to turn in their favor.

no photo
Mon 12/07/09 05:52 PM


Seriously, does anyone really believe the uprising,, civil war, had nothing to do with the threat against slavery?



Most southerners didnt even own slaves. Esp the poor ones who volunteered to fight.
Besides, slavery was still legal in the North.




Yeah and most slaves where sold by balck men in africa right? why do you justify the south's sin of killing and inslaving a race of people? The civil war was about two countries one beleived in slavery and one did not. White America did not want to go to war for it thats why Lincoln was such an unpopular president! But the reality was at least the north was moving away from slavery and the south resisted and it became a point where War had to come! the North would have withered away with a border country with free labor and the south would have conquered the north if given time. It was all about slavery!