100% FREE ONLINE DATING
sponsored links
Previous
| Topic: Black dress, with the tights underneath... | |
|---|---|
|
|
|
I don't equate changing someone as the same thing as trying to prevent them from suicide...the two thoughts don't even come together in the same spot anywhere in my head.. 
We can all say we won't change for someone, but to a certain degree I think we all do every time we get involved with someone, either consciously or unconsciously. As far as suicide, I would do whatever was within my power to stop someone. From my work, I know most often than not, this is an impulsive act of someone who most often is off their meds, crazy drunk on booze and drugs, or half out of their minds with despair or grief and would otherwise not consider suicide. Again, most often than not, when their thoughts are more coherent, and they get some help with treatment/meds, they regret the act. I find it funny everyone is hinging on the suicide thing, it was an example. Taken to the extreme love fails, where love fails it did not exist...love doesn't exist, you will never support your partner regardless of personal thoughts. You will never find the perfect median as it simply does not exist, there is right and there is wrong and solely you dicate the two. In a relationship, it is no different, you still see black and white. And it is you who dictates the black and white. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
As far as the suicide issue my self I would do what ever it takes if it were my kids and meant giving up my life I would in a heart beat..... I have more then once stepped in when someone was voicing they were going to commit suicide and have stopped it on at least 4 occasions. And must say I'm happy I did it as well one of those times was with my own son. To think what my life would be with out him is not worth thinking about....
A couple of other times was with friends and once with a lady I met online about my age 7 years ago and I'm proud to say to this day she is doing great and still sends me e-mails...... A little kindness goes a long ways and then some........... When I was younger my attitude was if they want to kill them selves let me find them a sharper knife so they can do it right the first time..... Well until you have someone you love with all your heart such as a child in that same position. Believe me it will change your way of thinking in a heart beat it did mine. I was the lucky one I was at the right place at the right time to prevent it....... To this day I still have my son I thank the Heavens above to be blessed with that gift to have been there and the strength to fight him for the gun he had in his hands..... Would I do it again sure in a heartbeat........ 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
As far as the suicide issue my self I would do what ever it takes if it were my kids and meant giving up my life I would in a heart beat..... I have more then once stepped in when someone was voicing they were going to commit suicide and have stopped it on at least 4 occasions. And must say I'm happy I did it as well one of those times was with my own son. To think what my life would be with out him is not worth thinking about.... A couple of other times was with friends and once with a lady I met online about my age 7 years ago and I'm proud to say to this day she is doing great and still sends me e-mails...... A little kindness goes a long ways and then some........... When I was younger my attitude was if they want to kill them selves let me find them a sharper knife so they can do it right the first time..... Well until you have someone you love with all your heart such as a child in that same position. Believe me it will change your way of thinking in a heart beat it did mine. I was the lucky one I was at the right place at the right time to prevent it....... To this day I still have my son I thank the Heavens above to be blessed with that gift to have been there and the strength to fight him for the gun he had in his hands..... Would I do it again sure in a heartbeat........
Yes, you can save some. You cannot save all of them, and my idea is that if you truly loved them regardless of personal feelings of what they did...you would still respect them and love them. Even if that means supporting the decision they made, regardless of the outcome...this can be multitudes of things, I used suicide as an example because it is one of the more extreme things people do. Trust me, I've also been in the situation with a loved one and I also pulled her through it. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't equate changing someone as the same thing as trying to prevent them from suicide...the two thoughts don't even come together in the same spot anywhere in my head..
We can all say we won't change for someone, but to a certain degree I think we all do every time we get involved with someone, either consciously or unconsciously. As far as suicide, I would do whatever was within my power to stop someone. From my work, I know most often than not, this is an impulsive act of someone who most often is off their meds, crazy drunk on booze and drugs, or half out of their minds with despair or grief and would otherwise not consider suicide. Again, most often than not, when their thoughts are more coherent, and they get some help with treatment/meds, they regret the act. I find it funny everyone is hinging on the suicide thing, it was an example. Taken to the extreme love fails, where love fails it did not exist...love doesn't exist, you will never support your partner regardless of personal thoughts. You will never find the perfect median as it simply does not exist, there is right and there is wrong and solely you dicate the two. In a relationship, it is no different, you still see black and white. And it is you who dictates the black and white. My point exactly. Nothing in life is black & white, we live & love in shades of gray. There is no right or wrong, but varying degrees of the two. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
As far as the suicide issue my self I would do what ever it takes if it were my kids and meant giving up my life I would in a heart beat..... I have more then once stepped in when someone was voicing they were going to commit suicide and have stopped it on at least 4 occasions. And must say I'm happy I did it as well one of those times was with my own son. To think what my life would be with out him is not worth thinking about.... A couple of other times was with friends and once with a lady I met online about my age 7 years ago and I'm proud to say to this day she is doing great and still sends me e-mails...... A little kindness goes a long ways and then some........... When I was younger my attitude was if they want to kill them selves let me find them a sharper knife so they can do it right the first time..... Well until you have someone you love with all your heart such as a child in that same position. Believe me it will change your way of thinking in a heart beat it did mine. I was the lucky one I was at the right place at the right time to prevent it....... To this day I still have my son I thank the Heavens above to be blessed with that gift to have been there and the strength to fight him for the gun he had in his hands..... Would I do it again sure in a heartbeat........
Yes, you can save some. You cannot save all of them, and my idea is that if you truly loved them regardless of personal feelings of what they did...you would still respect them and love them. Even if that means supporting the decision they made, regardless of the outcome...this can be multitudes of things, I used suicide as an example because it is one of the more extreme things people do. Trust me, I've also been in the situation with a loved one and I also pulled her through it. If it happened and I was not able to succeed in stopping the process they set out to do. Nothing in this world would make me stop loving them. But I would never forgive myself for not being able too..... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't equate changing someone as the same thing as trying to prevent them from suicide...the two thoughts don't even come together in the same spot anywhere in my head..
We can all say we won't change for someone, but to a certain degree I think we all do every time we get involved with someone, either consciously or unconsciously. As far as suicide, I would do whatever was within my power to stop someone. From my work, I know most often than not, this is an impulsive act of someone who most often is off their meds, crazy drunk on booze and drugs, or half out of their minds with despair or grief and would otherwise not consider suicide. Again, most often than not, when their thoughts are more coherent, and they get some help with treatment/meds, they regret the act. I find it funny everyone is hinging on the suicide thing, it was an example. Taken to the extreme love fails, where love fails it did not exist...love doesn't exist, you will never support your partner regardless of personal thoughts. You will never find the perfect median as it simply does not exist, there is right and there is wrong and solely you dicate the two. In a relationship, it is no different, you still see black and white. And it is you who dictates the black and white. My point exactly. Nothing in life is black & white, we live & love in shades of gray. There is no right or wrong, but varying degrees of the two. No, there is only black and white for most people. Such as your take on my thread, assumed I was taught to think this way, as well you assumed it to be warped. There is always black and white, and people dictate between the two...rarely any shades of grey. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't equate changing someone as the same thing as trying to prevent them from suicide...the two thoughts don't even come together in the same spot anywhere in my head..
We can all say we won't change for someone, but to a certain degree I think we all do every time we get involved with someone, either consciously or unconsciously. As far as suicide, I would do whatever was within my power to stop someone. From my work, I know most often than not, this is an impulsive act of someone who most often is off their meds, crazy drunk on booze and drugs, or half out of their minds with despair or grief and would otherwise not consider suicide. Again, most often than not, when their thoughts are more coherent, and they get some help with treatment/meds, they regret the act. I find it funny everyone is hinging on the suicide thing, it was an example. Taken to the extreme love fails, where love fails it did not exist...love doesn't exist, you will never support your partner regardless of personal thoughts. You will never find the perfect median as it simply does not exist, there is right and there is wrong and solely you dicate the two. In a relationship, it is no different, you still see black and white. And it is you who dictates the black and white. I was trying to address both issues in your post...but I'm actually having a little trouble following your thoughts and perhaps that's because I KNOW love exists. I see it, feel it every day in the eyes of children, hugs from friends and family, good deeds done toward others and from Buittercup kisses.  I don't subscribe to the thought that because love failed, it never existed...how can love fail AND not exist? It has to exist in order to fail.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't equate changing someone as the same thing as trying to prevent them from suicide...the two thoughts don't even come together in the same spot anywhere in my head..
We can all say we won't change for someone, but to a certain degree I think we all do every time we get involved with someone, either consciously or unconsciously. As far as suicide, I would do whatever was within my power to stop someone. From my work, I know most often than not, this is an impulsive act of someone who most often is off their meds, crazy drunk on booze and drugs, or half out of their minds with despair or grief and would otherwise not consider suicide. Again, most often than not, when their thoughts are more coherent, and they get some help with treatment/meds, they regret the act. I find it funny everyone is hinging on the suicide thing, it was an example. Taken to the extreme love fails, where love fails it did not exist...love doesn't exist, you will never support your partner regardless of personal thoughts. You will never find the perfect median as it simply does not exist, there is right and there is wrong and solely you dicate the two. In a relationship, it is no different, you still see black and white. And it is you who dictates the black and white. I was trying to address both issues in your post...but I'm actually having a little trouble following your thoughts and perhaps that's because I KNOW love exists. I see it, feel it every day in the eyes of children, hugs from friends and family, good deeds done toward others and from Buittercup kisses. I don't subscribe to the thought that because love failed, it never existed...how can love fail AND not exist? It has to exist in order to fail.
Simple, it was lust all along. Family love is the only love I think truly exists, and even it is falling behind everyday. Good deeds has more to do with compassion then love, and love has less to do with compassion and more to do with personal connection...although most seem to combine both compassion and love into the same group although both have major differences. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hummm but I must say love does exist I have felt it in more ways then one. From a partner to my kids to my family...........love can only exist if you let it.....
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hummm but I must say love does exist I have felt it in more ways then one. From a partner to my kids to my family...........love can only exist if you let it..... Who said I haven't had love? Love is rare, in that it hardly exists and only exists for very few people. The majority of people will not feel love outside of family, most will feel lust and attach it to love and I've been guilty of that too. But I did have love, and I lost love...and it is by far the worst feeling I've gone through. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hummm but I must say love does exist I have felt it in more ways then one. From a partner to my kids to my family...........love can only exist if you let it..... Who said I haven't had love? Love is rare, in that it hardly exists and only exists for very few people. The majority of people will not feel love outside of family, most will feel lust and attach it to love and I've been guilty of that too. But I did have love, and I lost love...and it is by far the worst feeling I've gone through. I will admit it is one of the worst feelings there is to loss the love that once was there....But it can be found again as long as one does not close their hearts off to it.......I have found it more then once and yes it hurt like hell to loose it but I will never close my heart off to finding it again...... And never meant to imply you have not found it..... for within your writings I can tell you have and have been very hurt by it as well... |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't equate changing someone as the same thing as trying to prevent them from suicide...the two thoughts don't even come together in the same spot anywhere in my head..
We can all say we won't change for someone, but to a certain degree I think we all do every time we get involved with someone, either consciously or unconsciously. As far as suicide, I would do whatever was within my power to stop someone. From my work, I know most often than not, this is an impulsive act of someone who most often is off their meds, crazy drunk on booze and drugs, or half out of their minds with despair or grief and would otherwise not consider suicide. Again, most often than not, when their thoughts are more coherent, and they get some help with treatment/meds, they regret the act. I find it funny everyone is hinging on the suicide thing, it was an example. Taken to the extreme love fails, where love fails it did not exist...love doesn't exist, you will never support your partner regardless of personal thoughts. You will never find the perfect median as it simply does not exist, there is right and there is wrong and solely you dicate the two. In a relationship, it is no different, you still see black and white. And it is you who dictates the black and white. I was trying to address both issues in your post...but I'm actually having a little trouble following your thoughts and perhaps that's because I KNOW love exists. I see it, feel it every day in the eyes of children, hugs from friends and family, good deeds done toward others and from Buittercup kisses. I don't subscribe to the thought that because love failed, it never existed...how can love fail AND not exist? It has to exist in order to fail.
Simple, it was lust all along. Family love is the only love I think truly exists, and even it is falling behind everyday. Good deeds has more to do with compassion then love, and love has less to do with compassion and more to do with personal connection...although most seem to combine both compassion and love into the same group although both have major differences. How can there be compassion without love? Ever visited the Secret Pal thread? 
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hummm but I must say love does exist I have felt it in more ways then one. From a partner to my kids to my family...........love can only exist if you let it..... Who said I haven't had love? Love is rare, in that it hardly exists and only exists for very few people. The majority of people will not feel love outside of family, most will feel lust and attach it to love and I've been guilty of that too. But I did have love, and I lost love...and it is by far the worst feeling I've gone through. I will admit it is one of the worst feelings there is to loss the love that once was there....But it can be found again as long as one does not close their hearts off to it.......I have found it more then once and yes it hurt like hell to loose it but I will never close my heart off to finding it again...... And never meant to imply you have not found it..... for within your writings I can tell you have and have been very hurt by it as well... I figure it to be a natural response, didn't feel good to lose and whereas percentages go you lose it more than you keep it...figure I don't want to go through that again, so I won't try and find it and keep the sanctity of what I did have together. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't equate changing someone as the same thing as trying to prevent them from suicide...the two thoughts don't even come together in the same spot anywhere in my head..
We can all say we won't change for someone, but to a certain degree I think we all do every time we get involved with someone, either consciously or unconsciously. As far as suicide, I would do whatever was within my power to stop someone. From my work, I know most often than not, this is an impulsive act of someone who most often is off their meds, crazy drunk on booze and drugs, or half out of their minds with despair or grief and would otherwise not consider suicide. Again, most often than not, when their thoughts are more coherent, and they get some help with treatment/meds, they regret the act. I find it funny everyone is hinging on the suicide thing, it was an example. Taken to the extreme love fails, where love fails it did not exist...love doesn't exist, you will never support your partner regardless of personal thoughts. You will never find the perfect median as it simply does not exist, there is right and there is wrong and solely you dicate the two. In a relationship, it is no different, you still see black and white. And it is you who dictates the black and white. I was trying to address both issues in your post...but I'm actually having a little trouble following your thoughts and perhaps that's because I KNOW love exists. I see it, feel it every day in the eyes of children, hugs from friends and family, good deeds done toward others and from Buittercup kisses. I don't subscribe to the thought that because love failed, it never existed...how can love fail AND not exist? It has to exist in order to fail.
Simple, it was lust all along. Family love is the only love I think truly exists, and even it is falling behind everyday. Good deeds has more to do with compassion then love, and love has less to do with compassion and more to do with personal connection...although most seem to combine both compassion and love into the same group although both have major differences. How can there be compassion without love? Ever visited the Secret Pal thread?
Compassion has to do with caring, either for a group of people or a given situation. You can love that you do what you do for whatever or whoever it is, but still that is not the love I'm really talking about. I'm more on about one on one love between two people, not a wide-span of love for an action or group. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hummm but I must say love does exist I have felt it in more ways then one. From a partner to my kids to my family...........love can only exist if you let it..... Who said I haven't had love? Love is rare, in that it hardly exists and only exists for very few people. The majority of people will not feel love outside of family, most will feel lust and attach it to love and I've been guilty of that too. But I did have love, and I lost love...and it is by far the worst feeling I've gone through. I will admit it is one of the worst feelings there is to loss the love that once was there....But it can be found again as long as one does not close their hearts off to it.......I have found it more then once and yes it hurt like hell to loose it but I will never close my heart off to finding it again...... And never meant to imply you have not found it..... for within your writings I can tell you have and have been very hurt by it as well... I figure it to be a natural response, didn't feel good to lose and whereas percentages go you lose it more than you keep it...figure I don't want to go through that again, so I won't try and find it and keep the sanctity of what I did have together. No doubt your right one does loose it more often then they keep it but............there is always that chance that it will remain and unless your willing to gamble at it one will never know.......myself I think it is worth the gamble........I may be rolling those dice a log time but I'm not willing to give up on that once in a lifetime chance...
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't equate changing someone as the same thing as trying to prevent them from suicide...the two thoughts don't even come together in the same spot anywhere in my head..
We can all say we won't change for someone, but to a certain degree I think we all do every time we get involved with someone, either consciously or unconsciously. As far as suicide, I would do whatever was within my power to stop someone. From my work, I know most often than not, this is an impulsive act of someone who most often is off their meds, crazy drunk on booze and drugs, or half out of their minds with despair or grief and would otherwise not consider suicide. Again, most often than not, when their thoughts are more coherent, and they get some help with treatment/meds, they regret the act. I find it funny everyone is hinging on the suicide thing, it was an example. Taken to the extreme love fails, where love fails it did not exist...love doesn't exist, you will never support your partner regardless of personal thoughts. You will never find the perfect median as it simply does not exist, there is right and there is wrong and solely you dicate the two. In a relationship, it is no different, you still see black and white. And it is you who dictates the black and white. I was trying to address both issues in your post...but I'm actually having a little trouble following your thoughts and perhaps that's because I KNOW love exists. I see it, feel it every day in the eyes of children, hugs from friends and family, good deeds done toward others and from Buittercup kisses. I don't subscribe to the thought that because love failed, it never existed...how can love fail AND not exist? It has to exist in order to fail.
Simple, it was lust all along. Family love is the only love I think truly exists, and even it is falling behind everyday. Good deeds has more to do with compassion then love, and love has less to do with compassion and more to do with personal connection...although most seem to combine both compassion and love into the same group although both have major differences. How can there be compassion without love? Ever visited the Secret Pal thread?
Compassion has to do with caring, either for a group of people or a given situation. You can love that you do what you do for whatever or whoever it is, but still that is not the love I'm really talking about. I'm more on about one on one love between two people, not a wide-span of love for an action or group. There's a couple here in my community, they've been married 40 years and they've raised two fine young men. A few years ago, the husband required a leg amputation which in turn required much time in the hospital, rehab, physical therapy and literally changed their lives forever. They came through it, though I won't pretend times weren't hard at times and still are some days. But...they still dote on each other, fuss and tease with one another....still...hold hands and look at one another with such love I am envious. I hope for you, I hope for all of us, that kind of love and the ability to recognize it when it comes into our lives, the ability to break down the walls and allow it to happen. It does exist and we are all deserving of it. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I think I get where you are coming from, Fear...
Quite a few years back...my kid's Dad had been diagnosed with a physically debilitating illness..it would eventually involve wheelchairs and complete incapacitation. At the time, he was a 28 year old, fit and healthy mallee bull...all about his physical prowess....it was a HUGE belt to his esteem, his belief of who he was...everything....how humiliating to have to have his wife wipe his arse! Not that I cared, not that I thought less of him...poor bastard was in agony...so much pain...he needed support, compassion, and care. He decided he could bare no more...he wanted out....he had had enough. Did I panic? Did I beg and cajole hime to seek help for his depression? No...I just told him I felt enough love and respect for him to understand his wishes... however, before he took his life, he had to sit down and explain to each of our children why he was going to take his own life....to not leave me with the emotional mess. For me that was an act of love... I understood what he was feeling.... I couldn't stop him from suicide if he chose to....and I had to love him enough to let him choose his own destiny. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I think I get where you are coming from, Fear... Quite a few years back...my kid's Dad had been diagnosed with a physically debilitating illness..it would eventually involve wheelchairs and complete incapacitation. At the time, he was a 28 year old, fit and healthy mallee bull...all about his physical prowess....it was a HUGE belt to his esteem, his belief of who he was...everything....how humiliating to have to have his wife wipe his arse! Not that I cared, not that I thought less of him...poor bastard was in agony...so much pain...he needed support, compassion, and care. He decided he could bare no more...he wanted out....he had had enough. Did I panic? Did I beg and cajole hime to seek help for his depression? No...I just told him I felt enough love and respect for him to understand his wishes... however, before he took his life, he had to sit down and explain to each of our children why he was going to take his own life....to not leave me with the emotional mess. For me that was an act of love... I understood what he was feeling.... I couldn't stop him from suicide if he chose to....and I had to love him enough to let him choose his own destiny. Bingo, you fall into the rare occurence that love is truly there for...regardless of what he chose to do you supported it, of course it is on him to explain the situation to those close to you both and I can respect that. Love does work for some, some can accept certain situations regardless of personal thoughts and opinions...love isn't love unless you can eventually let go of it beit by a situation, or an emotional trip-bomb. Whereas I don't want any part of it at this time, time changes people as much as it holds them down...so maybe one day I will change my mind, but right now the theory holds that love simply doesn't exist as some would percieve it too. |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Fear~
I saw a film last year at the Cleveland Film Festival that addressed this very issue. If you love someone, set them free. And on the other side, if you love them, you'd live and try to heal to be with them. Suicide, ultimately, is a selfish decision and it's not based on love. Therefore... a person who commits suicide truly loves no one, including themselves. IMO |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I think I get where you are coming from, Fear... Quite a few years back...my kid's Dad had been diagnosed with a physically debilitating illness..it would eventually involve wheelchairs and complete incapacitation. At the time, he was a 28 year old, fit and healthy mallee bull...all about his physical prowess....it was a HUGE belt to his esteem, his belief of who he was...everything....how humiliating to have to have his wife wipe his arse! Not that I cared, not that I thought less of him...poor bastard was in agony...so much pain...he needed support, compassion, and care. He decided he could bare no more...he wanted out....he had had enough. Did I panic? Did I beg and cajole hime to seek help for his depression? No...I just told him I felt enough love and respect for him to understand his wishes... however, before he took his life, he had to sit down and explain to each of our children why he was going to take his own life....to not leave me with the emotional mess. For me that was an act of love... I understood what he was feeling.... I couldn't stop him from suicide if he chose to....and I had to love him enough to let him choose his own destiny. Well now if they are commit suicide due to these circumstances it is totally different and I would not stop them for I would not want anyone to stop me if I was in that much pain. There are levels of where one would stop them and then were they would not. I would not assist them but I would understand why they did what they did and let them be and wish them the peace they seek.... |
|
|
|
|
