Invisible nice definition. I know the difference between
fornication and adultery ..I like how you defined it

Spider not a 700 year old word.

The exact word you used 'Poneria' is the word in the manuscript as it
was written 2000 years ago. That word is also present in the old
testement in the hebrew version of the word zanah.

Both, according to the Christian Ministries Definition BEFORE
REFORMATION IN THE 1300'S were the word 'Prostitute' and nothing else.

Stop forging lies about what I have said. I did not say a word that is
only 700 years old is in there I said a word that was translated into
FORNICATION some 700 YEARS AGO actualy meant 'Prostitution' or
'Prostitute' AT THE TIME THE WORD WAS USED BY PAUL. The current
definition means not a thing when you are talking about a work that
occured 1000's of years ago. The meaning of the word AT THE TIME IT WAS
USED is what I am talking about.

The meaning 'prostitute' not only ment that IN THE GREEK THAT THIS QUOTE
WAS SUPPOSEDLY WRITTEN IN it also ment 'Prostitute' in the hebrew that
the OLT TESTEMENT WAS WRITTEN IN which is A LOT OLDER THAN THE 2000
YEARS FOR THE WORDS WRITTEN BY PAUL.

Why must you post at me all the time. By now you should have realized
that I know, check and verify what I say.

You are posting a definition that was made 700 years ago. I posted the
definition that was used at the time the verse in question was uttered.

AdventureBegins,

Show me some proof that it only meant prostitute, cause I'm not finding
that.

zanah
---------------------------------------------------------------
to commit fornication, be a harlot, play the harlot
(Qal)
to be a harlot, act as a harlot, commit fornication
to commit adultery
to be a cult prostitute
to be unfaithful (to God) (fig.)
(Pual) to play the harlot
(Hiphil)
to cause to commit adultery
to force into prostitution
to commit fornication
---------------------------------------------------------------

porneia
---------------------------------------------------------------
illicit sexual intercourse
adultery, fornication, homosexuality, lesbianism, intercourse with
animals etc.
sexual intercourse with close relatives; Lev. 18
sexual intercourse with a divorced man or woman; Mk. 10:11,
metaph. the worship of idols
of the defilement of idolatry, as incurred by eating the sacrifices
offered to idols
---------------------------------------------------------------

Your own quote says "Most often", not "always".

Let's see what Jesus had to say...

Matthew 5:32
---------------------------------------------------------------
But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for
the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever
shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.
---------------------------------------------------------------

So, by your own logic, Jesus is saying "If your wife is selling her ass
on the street, you can divorce her. But if she's just giving it away to
every guy she meets, you are stuck buddy." Yeah, I think your defintion
is WAY off.

I repost it for you Spider, you might have overlooked it


Fornication is a term which refers to sexual intercourse between
consenting unmarried partners. Sex between unmarried persons is
distinguished from adultery by use of the term 'simple fornication'.

The origin of the word derives from Latin. The word fornix means "an
archway" or "vault" (in Rome, prostitutes could be solicited there).
More directly, fornicatio means "of the archway"; thus a euphemism for
prostitution.

Fornication is dealt with differently in various religions, societies
and cultures.

invisible,

Thank you invisible, but it's not relavant. I'm talking about the greek
word porneia, which AB says only means "prostitution". I haven't found
any source that says that and he hasn't provided one. If Jesus used the
word "porneia" to be prostitution only, then he taught a very unfair
doctrine to men and women who are cheated upon.

So then why do most of the modern bibles use different words instead
of “fornication”, in effect mistranslating the word “Pornea”? The
reason is that the definition of the word “Pornea” has changed in modern
years. “Young’s Analytical Concordance” (English translation of 1611)
correctly list the translation for the Greek word “Pornea” as
“Fornication” or “whoredom” and the English Webster's Collegiate
Dictionary, fifth edition of 1948, defines fornication as “illicit
sexual intercourse on the part of an unmarried” or “Figuratively, esp.
in Scripture, idolatry”. In the KJV, the word “Pornea” is correctly
translated as “fornication” but like the redefinition of our English
word “gay”, the modern Greek interlinear versions have redefined
“Pornea” to include “Adultery” as a possible translation for “Pornea”,
thereby causing complete confusion over the correct words of Jesus, in
effect incorrectly teaching that “Adultery” is a grounds for divorce.
See the results (over 50% divorce rate in USA) of changing the Greek
definition of “Pornea”

Sorry , I posted too quickly, I hope this helps you

If sex was not meant/made to feel good & make everyone want to do it,
our species would have come to an end long ago. Just my opinion & I know
this will start a brawl, but sex should never be considered a "sin" &
according to the path I walk, it is not. Not to mention it is a great
stress reliever & a fun form of excersize!

((((((((Ghost)))))))))

You are so right. Sometimes we only come to appreciate things when we
don't have them.

I concur!!!!!

{{{{invisible}}}}

Appreciating the less complicated things in life is what makes it
special & worthwhile. And sex is about as basic as it gets. A persons
sex drive is the second highest instinct, only preceeded by the will to
survive.

(((((((Ghost)))))))))

It is so true, you know. I we would listen more to these basic instincts
there might be less war in the world.

Doesn't cultural upbringing hone our instincts to be what is tradition
to that culture? For instance, a culture raised on leadership roles and
subservient individuals - wouldn't those individuals have different
instincts other than to protect themselves to survive?

The majority of our Greek authorities are generally in line with one
another as to the meaning of the word fornication. Fornication is
derived from the Greek word, (pornea) and refers to some form of illicit
sexual intercourse in general. Fornication can be committed between a
man and woman, a man and man, a woman and a woman, or a man/woman and an
animal. Our English term “pornography” is also derived from this Greek
word. Webster’s Comprehensive Dictionary (Encyclopedia Edition) defines
fornication as “Illicit sexual intercourse of unmarried persons.”
Though this term is most commonly used to describe sexual relations
outside of marriage, it is not limited to unmarried people because Jesus
allows “fornication” as an exception to scripturally divorce a spouse
(Matt. 5:32, 19:9). Therefore, a married person can commit fornication
just as an unmarried person can.

Why is Fornication Wrong?

The Bible unequivocally condemns the committing of fornication by
anyone, saint or sinner alike. The apostle Paul deals with this subject
on several occasions in the epistles that he penned. The Christians at
Thessalonica were commanded by him to abstain from fornication (I
Thessalonians 4:3). In his epistle to the churches of Galatia, he
classified fornication as one of the works of the flesh that can prevent
one from entering into the kingdom of God (Galatians 5:19-21). In the
book of Romans he reflects upon the status of many Gentiles of the long
ago when he stated,

“Wherefore God gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their
own hearts, to dishonor their own bodies between themselves…For this
cause God gave them up to vile affections: for even their women did
change the natural use into that which is against nature: and likewise
also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust
one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and
receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
Even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave
them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not
convenient; being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication,
wickedness…” (Romans 1:24, 26-29a).
This passage alone should be enough to convince the world that
fornication and homosexuality are anything but pleasing to the eyes of
the Almighty God. Nowhere does the apostle Paul deal with this problem
in greater detail than in the book of I Corinthians. He deals with this
problem throughout this book. In chapter 5, he deals with a particular
situation of one that was committing fornication with his father’s wife.
The church at Corinth had failed to properly teach, admonish, and
discipline this individual. In chapter 6, Paul condemns fornication in
vv. 9-20. Likewise, he deals with this problem from a different
perspective in chapter 7 saying, “Nevertheless, to avoid fornication,
let everyman have his own wife…” (v. 2). In chapter 10:8 he warns them
to avoid fornication unlike those in Numbers 25 who committed
fornication with the daughters of Moab.
These passages explain to us that fornication is wrong, but what makes
it wrong? There are two passages that should be discussed in order to
set in order the reason that fornication is wrong. First let us notice
I Timothy 5:14. Paul writes to the young preacher, “I will that younger
women marry, bear children, guide the house, give none occasion to the
adversary to speak reproachfully.” This is God’s plan for the woman.
Notice that bearing children comes after the command to marry. Why,
because the sexual relationship is confined ONLY to the marriage
relationship. Sexual intercourse between two unwed persons is wrong.
Second, let us go to the book of Hebrews. The penman of the book makes
it clear in chapter 13:4 that “Marriage is honourable in all, and the
bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.” When a
married person commits fornication with another, that individual has
defiled his/her marriage bed. Once again, the sexual relationship is
confined to married couples and married couples only!

Kat

No, I think our basic instincts are all the same, how they develop
depends on the culture.

Associating sin with sex is just plain wrong. That tactic has mess up a
lot of people’s heads. There are countless testimonials from people who
will tell you that religious ideas about sex really messed them up big
time.

I think it’s really sad when people resort to using religion to teach
their children morals especially. There are much more positive and
effect ways to teach healthy sexual behavior rather than instilling in a
child that sex is inherently sinful.

I dream of a day when people can actually teach healthy sexual behavior
based on nothing more than good logic and common sense. There are a lot
of sound logical reasons to teach healthy sexual behavior. I sincerely
believe that it is much better to teach a child these genuinely
practical reasons for healthy sexual behavior, rather than to just
instill in them that they are sinful.

Using the idea of sin to try to instill healthy morals is wrong on so
many levels. First off, it avoids the issue of teaching and explaining
sound logical reasons for healthy sexual behavior. Secondly it can have
the adverse affect of making an honest child feel guilty about having
natural urges and desires.

I prefer not to use religion to teach morals to begin with. There are
so many practical reasons to teach good morals in all areas that
religion shouldn’t even be required.

A belief in a god should be associated with the beauty of life, not with
the need to control adverse responses to life. There are much better
ways of educating humans to the hazards of unhealthy behaviors. Trying
to control people via a guilt complex is actually a very negative
technique and is ultimately a cop out to avoid having to face the issues
head-on with sound logic and explanations.

Religions should not be used as a cop out to avoid teaching sound
intellectual-based moral values. On the contrary the intellectual-based
morality is much more effective and positive. Not to mention
enlightening.

So the war comment doesn't really apply all that much....ok I
see.....just wondering.

Not really, but if we'd follow the one instinct more than the other,
meaning sex before the instinct of self protection, maybe there could
something be happening.

Strongs Ancient Greek dictionary (this is a hard bound book not a web
site) states that ancient greek definitions are frequently mistranslated
and have had their meaning changed in this age.

Porneia Ancient Greek definitions from strong Ancient Greek dictionary.

Pornos [to sell] a male prostitute or whoremonger.
Porne [prostitute]a strumpet; figuratively, an idolater:--harlot, whore.
Porneou to act the harlot;to practice idolatry.
Porneia Harlotry and idolatry.

You give the modern definition I give the definition that was in the
time of Paul.

Which definition do you think he was using. The one that we use in this
day (requires time travel) or the one that was in his day.

Look further up AB, I posted something I found on the web, stating that
the word got translated wrong in later times.