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| Topic: A physcis question of light | |
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The inside track is light doesn't move nor go anywhere. It's an energization, but any changing state has a rate of change... Rather than double post I'll edit to express another point I thought prudent, muons have mass and can go very fast, measured at almost the speed of light, as fast as any transmission of rest mass and information as ever recorded and even theorized. Muons go so fast they time travel. Yes, once in motion everything is time travelling due to SR (length contraction). The muon/traveller experiences normal time, but the relative observer is in another velocity vector, ergo experiences time differently. The physical observation was that a muon dramatically exceeded its atomic lifespan when travelling close to the speed of light, perfectly in accordance with Einstein's prediction. It proved you can travel further than the distance physically possible at the speed you're doing, the traveller will believe he somehow got there faster than the speedometer reads, but the observer will believe the traveller aged more slowly than he should've. To the traveller this is time travel exactly the way you see warp drive and hyperspace motivators in science fiction. It's to the observer in your relative point of origin which sees no such thing, but after centuries of travel dead bodies do not arrive, the crew is perfectly healthy and might've aged only years. That's normal special relativity, which is proven and we currently base all hard science on it, including computer engineering. It wouldn't work if it wasn't correct, so it's correct. We observe examples of it being correct and any other hypothesis being falsified. We can fly around the stars like you see in the movies. That's just a question of engines/fuel/energy-technology. It isn't a problem for the crew. It's the people back home that you'll never see again, but the planet and many generations later of population will probably still be around for a return home. You can meet your descendants. Nothing but straight classical physics laws in all that. physics laws can change... we, as a race, are still at an infant level of science understanding and what we consider "laws"... |
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You often hear that "light speed cannot be exceeded" or nothing can go faster than the speed of light. That concept isn't true in a number of situations. The easiest two examples are the expansion of space/time and falling into a black hole. The universe has expanded at different rates at different times and has recently "sped up". The speed of light is constant only relative to the space/time containing it's existence; or in other words, "where it is at!". The expansion rate of space/time after the big bang was enormous! During that period light, and everything else, was hauling azz away from each other at speeds that make light look like a slow poke! Consider the effect gravity has on the light near a black hole. The gravity does "suck" the light in or it would slow the light trying to escape. The speed of light in this case does not change. Instead, space/time is being stretched as it enters the black hole making the space/time longer and longer making the light travel farther and farther trying to get out! Another way to describe it would be that the light trying to get out is traveling at the speed of light but the space/time surrounding the light is falling in at a speed greater than the speed of light. Therefore, the light has an outward vector equal to the speed of light and an inward vector just greater at the event horizon and increasingly greater at it approaches the singularity. Time, therefore, runs normal far away from the black hole and increasingly slower as the distance to the black hole is reduced. Falling in and getting close to the singularity, time all but stops. lol, time doesn't stop, change, or slow down/speed up... can you tell me what time is, and it's properties? |
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NASA has a program for space vehicles traveling faster than the speed of light. The concept is to expand space/time behind the ship as you compress space/time in front of the ship. They claim some "encouraging" experiments but I wasn't impressed. The theory is sound but the equipment is cave man.
A recent "science show" on cable stated that a doctor from Italy has measured light from the same source at two different speeds thereby disproving the theory that light has one speed in a vacuum. He was measuring light from a gamma ray source billions of light years away. I think he is full of baloney. If you compress the gas in empty space for billions of light years, it isn't so empty anymore and becomes a medium. Light is slowed by passing through a medium such as gas, liquid, glass, etc. Different frequencies of light are slowed different amounts which is how prisms work. |
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You often hear that "light speed cannot be exceeded" or nothing can go faster than the speed of light. That concept isn't true in a number of situations. The easiest two examples are the expansion of space/time and falling into a black hole. The universe has expanded at different rates at different times and has recently "sped up". The speed of light is constant only relative to the space/time containing it's existence; or in other words, "where it is at!". The expansion rate of space/time after the big bang was enormous! During that period light, and everything else, was hauling azz away from each other at speeds that make light look like a slow poke! Consider the effect gravity has on the light near a black hole. The gravity does "suck" the light in or it would slow the light trying to escape. The speed of light in this case does not change. Instead, space/time is being stretched as it enters the black hole making the space/time longer and longer making the light travel farther and farther trying to get out! Another way to describe it would be that the light trying to get out is traveling at the speed of light but the space/time surrounding the light is falling in at a speed greater than the speed of light. Therefore, the light has an outward vector equal to the speed of light and an inward vector just greater at the event horizon and increasingly greater at it approaches the singularity. Time, therefore, runs normal far away from the black hole and increasingly slower as the distance to the black hole is reduced. Falling in and getting close to the singularity, time all but stops. lol, time doesn't stop, change, or slow down/speed up... can you tell me what time is, and it's properties? It's properties are to slow down in the presence of a gravitational field or approaching the speed of light (any speed actually). What are you laughing about? No GPS would work without this property being known and calculated to calibrate. The clocks on the GPS satellites run at different speeds than the GPS units on Earth. Time is an integral part of space/time, the fabric of the universe. |
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You often hear that "light speed cannot be exceeded" or nothing can go faster than the speed of light. That concept isn't true in a number of situations. The easiest two examples are the expansion of space/time and falling into a black hole. The universe has expanded at different rates at different times and has recently "sped up". The speed of light is constant only relative to the space/time containing it's existence; or in other words, "where it is at!". The expansion rate of space/time after the big bang was enormous! During that period light, and everything else, was hauling azz away from each other at speeds that make light look like a slow poke! Consider the effect gravity has on the light near a black hole. The gravity does "suck" the light in or it would slow the light trying to escape. The speed of light in this case does not change. Instead, space/time is being stretched as it enters the black hole making the space/time longer and longer making the light travel farther and farther trying to get out! Another way to describe it would be that the light trying to get out is traveling at the speed of light but the space/time surrounding the light is falling in at a speed greater than the speed of light. Therefore, the light has an outward vector equal to the speed of light and an inward vector just greater at the event horizon and increasingly greater at it approaches the singularity. Time, therefore, runs normal far away from the black hole and increasingly slower as the distance to the black hole is reduced. Falling in and getting close to the singularity, time all but stops. lol, time doesn't stop, change, or slow down/speed up... can you tell me what time is, and it's properties? It's properties are to slow down in the presence of a gravitational field or approaching the speed of light (any speed actually). What are you laughing about? No GPS would work without this property being known and calculated to calibrate. The clocks on the GPS satellites run at different speeds than the GPS units on Earth. Time is an integral part of space/time, the fabric of the universe. ok, what is time? a particle? a wave? what is time besides our perception? if "time" is really being affected by speed, what is being affected? |
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What if the reason the clocks in satellites keeping having to be corrected is because interference from things in space. Like magnetic fields and energy from the sun's solar flares. Maybe it's a lack of things need for the clock to operate properly on earth that is doesn't have in space. Maybe there are little gremlins messing with the clocks.
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What if the reason the clocks in satellites keeping having to be corrected is because interference from things in space. Like magnetic fields and energy from the sun's solar flares. Maybe it's a lack of things need for the clock to operate properly on earth that is doesn't have in space. Maybe there are little gremlins messing with the clocks. thats kind of my point... how can something that doesn't exist but in our minds be altered by speed? i would say it's something else that we don't know about yet... |
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I watched this thing How the universe works with Stephen Hawking and in it he mentions how the clocks on satellites are now designed to correct themselves and the theory being that it's because time runs at a different speed out there then it does here. Think he said it had something to do with gravity. Doesn't really make sense to me.
All these measurements only have meaning because we gave them meaning to help up make sense out of things and to be able to build better things. Not to different from me trying to explain to a handicapped guy that the only reason he thought a certain word, which was probably meaningless, meant anything was because he gave it meaning and that if it did have meaning at all chances are the other handicapped person who used the word on him didn't know what was either. I would say what it was as best I could but I can't remember it for the life of me. hahaha |
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The amount of adjustment clocks need for being subjected to speed or gravity is part the properties of time formulated by Einstein in his theories of Relativity. The clock in space doesn't change when a solar flare occurs, an asteroid flies by, or aliens come knocking. It changes it's speed (speed is a function of time) in EXACT relation to the formulas of relativity... constantly ... without variance.
Time, in exactly the same way, changes it's speed "relative" to gravity. Hence the term "Relativity" as in "Einstein's Theory of Relativity". The properties of time are given in every physics book in the world and integral to the proprieties of speed, velocity, and acceleration. And just as the concept of acceleration has calculated known properties (as in gravity), time is integral to the formulas. The whole concept that speed and gravity are "related" by Einstein's theories is based on the concept of "space/time". If you want to get rid of the concept of time, you need to ignore space with it. |
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Edited by
mightymoe
on
Tue 01/07/14 08:42 AM
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The amount of adjustment clocks need for being subjected to speed or gravity is part the properties of time formulated by Einstein in his theories of Relativity. The clock in space doesn't change when a solar flare occurs, an asteroid flies by, or aliens come knocking. It changes it's speed (speed is a function of time) in EXACT relation to the formulas of relativity... constantly ... without variance. Time, in exactly the same way, changes it's speed "relative" to gravity. Hence the term "Relativity" as in "Einstein's Theory of Relativity". The properties of time are given in every physics book in the world and integral to the proprieties of speed, velocity, and acceleration. And just as the concept of acceleration has calculated known properties (as in gravity), time is integral to the formulas. The whole concept that speed and gravity are "related" by Einstein's theories is based on the concept of "space/time". If you want to get rid of the concept of time, you need to ignore space with it. ok, fine... but no one has answered the question of what time is exactly...to me, it's just a perception, nothing else |
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The amount of adjustment clocks need for being subjected to speed or gravity is part the properties of time formulated by Einstein in his theories of Relativity. The clock in space doesn't change when a solar flare occurs, an asteroid flies by, or aliens come knocking. It changes it's speed (speed is a function of time) in EXACT relation to the formulas of relativity... constantly ... without variance. Time, in exactly the same way, changes it's speed "relative" to gravity. Hence the term "Relativity" as in "Einstein's Theory of Relativity". The properties of time are given in every physics book in the world and integral to the proprieties of speed, velocity, and acceleration. And just as the concept of acceleration has calculated known properties (as in gravity), time is integral to the formulas. The whole concept that speed and gravity are "related" by Einstein's theories is based on the concept of "space/time". If you want to get rid of the concept of time, you need to ignore space with it. ok, fine... but no one has answered the question of what time is exactly...to me, it's just a perception, nothing else From timephysics.com IDEAS THAT CAN HELP IN THE UNDERSTANDING OF TIME The road to understanding time is relativity and the concept of time dilation is an important milestone. To find out the cause of time we need to know why time slows in motion and around large masses. One of the most dramatic aspects of the universe is that it is expanding and the presence of motion, forces and curved space-time happens in the expanding space. Conceptually it is easier to derive space curvature in an expanding universe as an area of slower expansion. This is one of the crucial concepts that were missing from Einstein’s vocabulary till many years after he developed GR. Einstein’s GR with the universal force of gravitation predicted that universe could not be static; it has to be either expanding or contracting. Einstein however introduced a fudge factor in his equations to keep the universe from expanding or contracting choosing a static universe. Michelson and Morley experiment demonstrated that the speed of light is unaffected by the motion of the earth. If light moved in a fixed background of space or aether then the constancy of the speed of light was inexplicable unless large masses completely dragged aether. Presence of such a medium through which huge planetary and solar masses could move with perfect ease cannot be explained. Einstein did away with this issue by calling ether superfluous, however GR brings suspiciously ethereal terms such as warping or curving of space, black holes in space and frame dragging back into mainstream physics; it appears that we have just changed the name of aether to space. The constancy of the speed of light, lack of simultaneity and the Lorentz transformation equations lead to the block universe interpretation of time. It can be easily demonstrated that Einstein’s famous time dilation equation the Lorentz factor actually depends on the preservation of simultaneity therefore Lorentz transformation equation in its present form is not correct. This point will be discussed in detail later. Einstein believed that acceleration was the cause of time dilation in moving objects as this is the main difference that can be seen between travelling and stay home twin in the famous twin paradox thought experiment. Einstein equated acceleration in gravity with that in accelerated motion in his famous equivalence principal bringing time dilation into gravity. It is clear however from particle accelerators that acceleration plays no role in time dilation of moving particles. Time dilation in motion can be precisely calculated with velocity only; similarly gravitational time dilation can be calculated from escape velocity and not necessarily from gravitational acceleration. We do not need particle accelerators to tell us that acceleration cannot be the cause of time dilation. In twin paradox thought experiments the acceleration and deceleration of the travelling twin can be made brief or instantaneous and then the only difference between the two is the uniform velocity of the travelling twin. One of the reasons for the existence of the twin paradox is the insistence of SR that rest and motion are the same and motion is only relative however presence of centrifugal force in rotating objects suggests that motion and rest are not equivalent. Discovery of cosmic back ground radiation; zero point energy along with space curvatures of GR makes it difficult to think of space without some sort of structure. The other side of the coin is the ease with which massive objects move through space with zero resistance, and the constancy of the speed of light in moving objects like earth. Any new development in relativity will have to reconcile all these difficulties and precisely show it to be superior to relativity while keeping the predictions of relativity. Many unnecessary concepts in relativity have hampered the true understanding of time. The answer to this conundrum lies in the simple ideas developed by Lorentz, Einstein and others of his time. |
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Why don't you read up about Quantum Action, which is 10000 times faster than the speed of light? Don't believe me? Check it out?
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The amount of adjustment clocks need for being subjected to speed or gravity is part the properties of time formulated by Einstein in his theories of Relativity. The clock in space doesn't change when a solar flare occurs, an asteroid flies by, or aliens come knocking. It changes it's speed (speed is a function of time) in EXACT relation to the formulas of relativity... constantly ... without variance. Time, in exactly the same way, changes it's speed "relative" to gravity. Hence the term "Relativity" as in "Einstein's Theory of Relativity". The properties of time are given in every physics book in the world and integral to the proprieties of speed, velocity, and acceleration. And just as the concept of acceleration has calculated known properties (as in gravity), time is integral to the formulas. The whole concept that speed and gravity are "related" by Einstein's theories is based on the concept of "space/time". If you want to get rid of the concept of time, you need to ignore space with it. Still doesn't mean there couldn't be little gremlins in those satellites messing with the clocks. they certainly had fun messing with the traffic lights in the movie. lol |
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don't get me wrong, metalwing, i'm not saying your wrong, but i do fail to see how something can affect a nothing...
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don't get me wrong, metalwing, i'm not saying your wrong, but i do fail to see how something can affect a nothing... Then just think of space/time as "something".  Einstein did. I was surprised to see the explanation given on the timephysics website was almost identical to the one I gave you a few posts ago. There are a lot of ways to look at time. |
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don't get me wrong, metalwing, i'm not saying your wrong, but i do fail to see how something can affect a nothing... Then just think of space/time as "something". Einstein did. I was surprised to see the explanation given on the timephysics website was almost identical to the one I gave you a few posts ago. There are a lot of ways to look at time. i look at time as a perception, i can't see it being something of substance |
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Well in terms of math the big thing Einstein did was challenge Newton, which nobody else vocally did (but did experiments that showed discrepencies), and Newton's perception of time was based in ages old Euclidean math, which is understandable because in Mediaeval Europe on of the crimes of heresy was to "contradict scientific reason" and the Church had established "scientific reason" to be defined by Euclidean ideas in Greek scholarship way back in the time of Constantine. It was a big thing at the time, very scary. As recently as 1890 the British were still sentencing people for vampirism, anger religious fanatics at your peril back then.
Anyhoo, Newton's Euclidean premise in his math is that time is a universal constant. Einstein looked at the work of his contemporaries and noted that it actually appears that time is relative and there must be some other universal constant. You need a universal constant for math to work, to make equations with hypotheses, even if you have to make one up. The speed of light is in fact relative. It changes by medium but here's the problem: everything is a medium. The speed of light changes a little between interplanetary, interstellar and intergalactic space, that's been measured. Small, but a difference. What you don't get is an isotropic variation so it's really light that has no substance, it's a dynamic field you're trying to measure for rate of change in a medium. Time however, now with no longer the status of universal constant most definitely has a substance. It is an expression of "now". In order to have three dimensions and a physical object, you require a fourth, the moment in which it exists. Time is a part of the other three dimensions, it is a spatial field of relative variance. Not entirely unlike light, but light has much less variance. |
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Time is usually considered the fourth dimension. In vector mathematics it is just another variable to consider in the dimensional variables.
The final exam in one of my math courses was to find the vector location of a speck of dust on the tip of a helicopter blade with a given rotation speed in a 30 degree bank at a given forward velocity and a given rate of climb x seconds after a given position. Time is just a function of the movement of three dimensional space from one "now" to the next. |
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Why don't you read up about Quantum Action, which is 10000 times faster than the speed of light? Don't believe me? Check it out? 
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Why don't you read up about Quantum Action, which is 10000 times faster than the speed of light? Don't believe me? Check it out? Sometimes its hard to tell if someone is spouting woo or just a poorly articulated attempt at science. Quantum entanglement is real, even if we don't yet understand what it means. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_entanglement |
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