Community > Science & Philosophy

Topic: real or reality (provoked by nature of reality thread)
adj4u Joined Sun 04/08/07 Posts: 21254	Sat 11/15/08 01:13 PM
It can't be determined definately. A majority vote does not = truth. We have to accept that some realities are going to be unknown. refer to microorganism post

SkyHook5652 Joined Sat 08/23/08 Posts: 4063	Sat 11/15/08 01:26 PM
It can't be determined definately. A majority vote does not = truth. We have to accept that some realities are going to be unknown. I'm willing to accept that if you can give a realiable means of differentiating between "real/actual" reality and "false/fake" reality. If there is no reliable means of differentiating, then the concept is useless because it is intrinsically undefinable.

SkyHook5652 Joined Sat 08/23/08 Posts: 4063	Sat 11/15/08 01:39 PM
Reality is truth. Not your version of it, but what actually is. Our inability to see it does not alter it. Then whose version is true? oh no, please don't open that can of worms, or since everybody thinks their right this thread will go down in flames.... Personally, I think that particular can is the only one that has anything in it besides smoke and hot air. If we cannot see it, how do we know it exists? If we can percieve part of it, but not all of it, how do we differentiat the "true" part from the "false" part? If we cannot determine which part is "true" and which part is "false", what good is it?

adj4u Joined Sun 04/08/07 Posts: 21254	Wed 07/01/09 04:26 PM
The real hat is what was actually there, not what someone says was there. The question I've been trying to get answered is: How do you determine what was actually there? There are three different reports regarding the hat. The "real" one is what was actually there. But how is that determined? It obviously cannot be determined from eyewitness reports. So how is it determined? As far as I can tell, there is no way to determine it. And that is why I kepep saying the only practical definition of reality is based on agreement. Ruth put it pretty well And "what is" is determined to be real based on the fact that the largest number of people agree to its reality. so the earth really was flat until 1500 that is nice to know how did it become a sphere ????????????????????????

lighthouselover Joined Sun 10/14/07 Posts: 1100	Wed 07/01/09 04:42 PM
W.I. Thomas: "Definition of the Situation" "If men define situations as real, they are real in their consequences." I worked with people who were severely and persistently mentally ill...they had their own reality...they heard it, they saw it, they lived it... was it "real"? not to anothers perception... is reality not just a perception that has been agreed on by the masses? whether or not it is what it is? reality or real...to the person who perceives what ever it is, the consequences are real to them as well...

myteemouse Joined Thu 01/10/08 Posts: 245	Wed 07/01/09 04:51 PM
W.I. Thomas: "Definition of the Situation" "If men define situations as real, they are real in their consequences." I worked with people who were severely and persistently mentally ill...they had their own reality...they heard it, they saw it, they lived it... was it "real"? not to anothers perception... is reality not just a perception that has been agreed on by the masses? whether or not it is what it is? reality or real...to the person who perceives what ever it is, the consequences are real to them as well... (Nods head) My training requires that I work with a client based on his/her perception of reality and go from that point.

14shadesOfgray Joined Mon 08/10/09 Posts: 793	Fri 08/21/09 05:08 AM
only because I love talks like these... I stopped right here... adj4u said: what is is real what is observered is their perception of what real thus it is their reality of the observation but not necessarily real ------------ if you have three witness to an event and they each say te had on a hat (chances are the hat was real) but one says it is a blue stocking hat another says it was a blue golf cap and the other say it was a black stocking cap what is the real hat and then the reply he recieved was this The real hat is what was actually there, not what someone says was there. Then everything just veered off into different points and biased ideals...I see that But let me give my view on that. He asked a very good question. What is the real hat??

14shadesOfgray Joined Mon 08/10/09 Posts: 793	Fri 08/21/09 05:11 AM Edited by 14shadesOfgray on Fri 08/21/09 05:11 AM
The real hat...... in his story, he SAID, "chances are the hat was real" so we cannot doubt that the hat was a figmant of anyones imagination... and the one says it was a blue stocking hat, one says it was a blue golf cap the other says it was a black stocking cap...so which one is it? tell you what it is.... it is a HAT

14shadesOfgray Joined Mon 08/10/09 Posts: 793	Fri 08/21/09 05:12 AM
so what is the point of debating on who is right or wrong?

adj4u Joined Sun 04/08/07 Posts: 21254	Fri 08/21/09 05:13 AM
The real hat...... in his story, he SAID, "chances are the hat was real" so we cannot doubt that the hat was a figmant of anyones imagination... and the one says it was a blue stocking hat, one says it was a blue golf cap the other says it was a black stocking cap...so which one is it? tell you what it is.... it is a HAT yep it was a hat but was there a cat in the hat

14shadesOfgray Joined Mon 08/10/09 Posts: 793	Fri 08/21/09 05:15 AM
if there was a cat in the hat the cat was black not blue

adj4u Joined Sun 04/08/07 Posts: 21254	Fri 08/21/09 05:19 AM
if there was a cat in the hat the cat was black not blue unless the cat was depressed then it may have been a black and blue cat

14shadesOfgray Joined Mon 08/10/09 Posts: 793	Fri 08/21/09 05:25 AM
it would be gray ;)

invisible Joined Mon 04/09/07 Posts: 7692	Fri 08/21/09 05:34 AM
if there was a cat in the hat the cat was black not blue unless the cat was depressed then it may have been a black and blue cat Not everything is black or white (or blue for that matter) There are millions of shades in between.

14shadesOfgray Joined Mon 08/10/09 Posts: 793	Fri 08/21/09 06:44 AM
<-------

adj4u Joined Sun 04/08/07 Posts: 21254	Fri 08/21/09 06:52 AM
if there was a cat in the hat the cat was black not blue unless the cat was depressed then it may have been a black and blue cat Not everything is black or white (or blue for that matter) There are millions of shades in between. are you a shady character??

SkyHook5652 Joined Sat 08/23/08 Posts: 4063	Fri 08/21/09 07:42 AM
The real hat is what was actually there, not what someone says was there. The question I've been trying to get answered is: How do you determine what was actually there? There are three different reports regarding the hat. The "real" one is what was actually there. But how is that determined? It obviously cannot be determined from eyewitness reports. So how is it determined? As far as I can tell, there is no way to determine it. And that is why I keep saying the only practical definition of reality is based on agreement. Ruth put it pretty well And "what is" is determined to be real based on the fact that the largest number of people agree to its reality. so the earth really was flat until 1500 that is nice to know how did it become a sphere ???????????????????????? If that’s all you got from my post, then you completely missed my point. You imply that a thing is not “real” if it is not “consistent”. Which is interesting in itself. It would mean that a thing that happened only once would not be “ real”. Now if you wish to define “reality” that way, you’re perfectly entitled to do so. But I submit that you have simply presented a definition that represents your viewpint. If someone else uses a different definition, your concepts of “reality” will be different. So without agreement, reality is nothing more than a personal opinion.

14shadesOfgray Joined Mon 08/10/09 Posts: 793	Fri 08/21/09 07:44 AM Edited by 14shadesOfgray on Fri 08/21/09 07:45 AM
reality is nothing at all but a viewpoint i can agree with that ---i just smiled---who cares about freud

SkyHook5652 Joined Sat 08/23/08 Posts: 4063	Fri 08/21/09 08:03 AM
The real hat is what was actually there, not what someone says was there. The question I've been trying to get answered is: How do you determine what was actually there? There are three different reports regarding the hat. The "real" one is what was actually there. But how is that determined? It obviously cannot be determined from eyewitness reports. So how is it determined? As far as I can tell, there is no way to determine it. And that is why I keep saying the only practical definition of reality is based on agreement. Ruth put it pretty well And "what is" is determined to be real based on the fact that the largest number of people agree to its reality. so the earth really was flat until 1500 that is nice to know how did it become a sphere ???????????????????????? If that’s all you got from my post, then you completely missed my point. You imply that a thing is not “real” if it is not “consistent”. Which is interesting in itself. It would mean that a thing that happened only once would not be “ real”. Now if you wish to define “reality” that way, you’re perfectly entitled to do so. But I submit that you have simply presented a definition that represents your viewpint. If someone else uses a different definition, your concepts of “reality” will be different. So without agreement, reality is nothing more than a personal opinion. Maybe it would help to flip it around and look at it from another perspective… Try to imagine something “real” that nobody agrees on. Good luck.

invisible Joined Mon 04/09/07 Posts: 7692	Fri 08/21/09 08:20 AM
Maybe it would help to flip it around and look at it from another perspective… Try to imagine something “real” that nobody agrees on. Good luck. How about the weather? Everyone sees that different.