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| Topic: Irrational and unfalsifiable belief | |
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Religion often promotes beliefs that are considered by its critics to be irrational superstitions, and religion frequently defends itself by opposing or suppressing rational and inquiring thought.
Often this is done by passing laws against blasphemy and by demanding that religious beliefs are shown greater respect than other beliefs. In addition, many religions actively discourage lateral thinking or ‘doubting’. Many religious individuals believe that ‘life is a test’, where they are constantly under siege from an evil supernatural entity ( the devil ) who is constantly trying to lure them away from their god into eternal torment. This view of the world makes people very wary of ideas and experiences outside of their religion and actively or passively can cause them to lead a very narrow existence. Some notable recent philosophers of religion, such as Alvin Plantinga, have argued that religious belief founded on irrational reasons such as religious experiences are justified, even if the believer can’t prove his conviction by rational arguments. The idea that rational reasoning is not relevant to religious beliefs is known as Fideism. What are your thoughts on this? |
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Anything that represses/suppresses free thought and rational thinking is absurd. If we don't observe new things, and think new things, we will not learn new things. We would be in a rut. Very emotionally destructive.
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I make a point of never discussing politics or religion with strangers, it always leads to arguing. Anyway, is 'unfalsifiable' a word???
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Edited by
davidben1
on
Mon 07/07/08 07:54 AM
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is there need to name things.........
black and white good and bad wrong and right love and hate all are for comparison or the other would cease to exist..... seems your say most you are tired of the comaparisons....... each comparison or "religion" can only pass away when the reason for it is seen, and the true reason will show the roots of all things.....then something WILL be done about it, and even all you speak about religion that you rightfully so see has created such abandon, if you begin to TRY to see how they be GOOD first, then one can see that even as we speak morality is passing away, and that be love coming to be...... turn on the set that you hear all thru eyes of critism, and look to see HOW each love....... white kids dance with black kids..... all sects are embracing each other more, and this will always start with the youth.......they love more than all the adults that tell then what to believe and who to judge, and what be wrong and what be right....... comics can jeer a jew, an hispanic, a white man, a black man, and they laugh.....is that not love religion is to not see this........the question smiless it what has become as a religion to you that has made you seek so much to not see the love, and if you don't, have not there been many you have neglected...... love is always hidden in what look like immorality!!! |
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Edited by
smiless
on
Mon 07/07/08 08:48 AM
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is there need to name things......... black and white good and bad wrong and right love and hate all are for comparison or the other would cease to exist..... seems your say most you are tired of the comaparisons....... each comparison or "religion" can only pass away when the reason for it is seen, and the true reason will show the roots of all things.....then something WILL be done about it, and even all you speak about religion that you rightfully so see has created such abandon, if you begin to TRY to see how they be GOOD first, then one can see that even as we speak morality is passing away, and that be love coming to be...... turn on the set that you hear all thru eyes of critism, and look to see HOW each love....... white kids dance with black kids..... all sects are embracing each other more, and this will always start with the youth.......they love more than all the adults that tell then what to believe and who to judge, and what be wrong and what be right....... comics can jeer a jew, an hispanic, a white man, a black man, and they laugh.....is that not love religion is to not see this........the question smiless it what has become as a religion to you that has made you seek so much to not see the love, and if you don't, have not there been many you have neglected...... love is always hidden in what look like immorality!!! I have lived my entire life non religious. I do however, find it educational to see different views. Some find religion neccessary as others don't. I accept both to a certain extent. As a former Red Cross coordinator I had the opportunity to see the importance of religion for some and have also seen how it can also destroy peoples lives. In the long run for me personally, people are people and everyone is special and precious in their own individual way. I have a great compassion to help and have served as a humanatarian for many years travelling around the world. It doesn't matter what color, creed, or nationality one hails from. I will always jump in the water to save a drowning victim. So I do have a big heart and love in general to want a better life for everyone on this planet. The question is: Can one live a life non religious but spiritual life without using the knowledge of any religious scriptures. For me personally it has worked splendidly, yet perhaps it wouldn't work for others at all. What are your thoughts on this? If one can be non religious and still live a peaceful life, how would the world be without a single religous organization on it? |
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Edited by
davidben1
on
Mon 07/07/08 09:20 AM
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smiles.......is not religion only what one believe in their heart that matches with something on the outside of their heart.......
one religion be good, and all things good, as if it was not, one would not see anything else as bad..... if this has served you well as you say, then it be good, but what greater wisdom can one have then to know HOW to change what one sees they wish to ablosih for the pain it has caused...... to speak what one see is bad, and what is good, does this show only but what is good and bad, and not what is needed to make all become one, or no more good, and no more bad.......all as perfect..... but then if there is perfect, does not that speak an opposite of imperfect, and WHY when one sees this be true, that the only religion for any human to follow that can ever lead to MORE knowledge be to follow the DESIRE of the heart, and not a law or rule of what be good or bad...... but then certainally one could see the fear that could be percieved even in this statment, as what about all that do good only for sparing themself some bad consequence..... would not if this religion that convince ones to try to do good to save themself from eternal damnation, or for a better eternity, if it were abolished, allow havoc to reign free...... so it is seen then that religion be not the problem, but rather the hearing of MORE, as the reason a man first believed such things be the question that when answered lead to MORE...... are not all things more each day, each plant, each human then the same.......it is a circle that lead one to one conclusion if followed unitl the end......there has to be MORE than what man has seen in his conscious days...... if EACH human have a moral code of good and bad, is this created by what each one has seen and experienced, or was there one already in place that percieved each thing as good and bad......... it had to be already in place, or no thought of good and bad would have entered the mind...... would one then think pain made the moral code of each first......want.....love.....fear.....this would lead to many unanswered questions........peace |
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smiles.......is not religion only what one believe in their heart that matches with something on the outside of their heart....... one religion be good, and all things good, as if it was not, one would not see anything else as bad..... if this has served you well as you say, then it be good, but what greater wisdom can one have then to know HOW to change what one sees they wish to ablosih for the pain it has caused...... to speak what one see is bad, and what is good, does this show only but what is good and bad, and not what is needed to make all become one, or no more good, and no more bad.......all as perfect..... but then if there is perfect, does not that speak an opposite of imperfect, and WHY when one sees this be true, that the only religion for any human to follow that can ever lead to MORE knowledge be to follow the DESIRE of the heart, and not a law or rule of what be good or bad...... but then certainally one could see the fear that could be percieved even in this statment, as what about all that do good only for sparing themself some bad consequence..... would not if this religion that convince ones to try to do good to save themself from eternal damnation, or for a better eternity, if it were abolished, allow havoc to reign free...... so it is seen then that religion be not the problem, but rather the hearing of MORE, as the reason a man first believed such things be the question that when answered lead to MORE...... are not all things more each day, each plant, each human then the same.......it is a circle that lead one to one conclusion if followed unitl the end......there has to be MORE than what man has seen in his conscious days...... if EACH human have a moral code of good and bad, is this created by what each one has seen and experienced, or was there one already in place that percieved each thing as good and bad......... it had to be already in place, or no thought of good and bad would have entered the mind...... would one then think pain made the moral code of each first......want.....love.....fear.....this would lead to many unanswered questions........peace would one then think pain made the moral code of each first......want.....love.....fear.....this would lead to many unanswered questions........peace it truly does lead to many unanswered questions, yet many seek them on a daily bases. In the long run one must find their individual ways of living in peace. Everyone has a different idealogy and understanding of how to attain it. I have found mine and I hope others will find theirs. |
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two things:
- irrational beliefs were OK centuries ago. when people needed to experience extraordinary things in order to believe, and then they were not able to explain why they believe. It's even Ok when the believer is not educated in humanities, such the case of poor countries, like mine. Where you see people believing in things they can't explain. When it's not OK is when a person claims to be religious or have faith, and this person is educated, yet this person does not make the required research that transforms an irrational belief into a rational belief. - a very good reading for a person who is honestly interested in researching the logics in christianity would be SUMMA THEOLOGIAE (http://www.newadvent.org/summa/) by Thomas Aquinas. However, I have to admit that since he wrote like 800 years ago, if we read it under 21st. century logics of course there is going to be several flaws. The good thing about this work is that the author used the SCHOLASTIC METHOD which expose several topics ordered in an index of questions and developed logically according to the ages in which it was written. Then again this is a good reading even for non-believers who are honest in trying to know the other side of the coin. Such work of Aquinas does not have the intention to convert anybody at all, but to expose what we catholics consider as truth. |
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two things: - irrational beliefs were OK centuries ago. when people needed to experience extraordinary things in order to believe, and then they were not able to explain why they believe. It's even Ok when the believer is not educated in humanities, such the case of poor countries, like mine. Where you see people believing in things they can't explain. When it's not OK is when a person claims to be religious or have faith, and this person is educated, yet this person does not make the required research that transforms an irrational belief into a rational belief. - a very good reading for a person who is honestly interested in researching the logics in christianity would be SUMMA THEOLOGIAE (http://www.newadvent.org/summa/) by Thomas Aquinas. However, I have to admit that since he wrote like 800 years ago, if we read it under 21st. century logics of course there is going to be several flaws. The good thing about this work is that the author used the SCHOLASTIC METHOD which expose several topics ordered in an index of questions and developed logically according to the ages in which it was written. Then again this is a good reading even for non-believers who are honest in trying to know the other side of the coin. Such work of Aquinas does not have the intention to convert anybody at all, but to expose what we catholics consider as truth. Thank you for the information as I have heard of this author and even posted his name in one of the threads I posted in here as a reference. I will actually check out the website you offer and study it. It is good to see different aspects of belief systems. |
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