It's amazing just how silly absolute atheists can be, isn't it? :-)

Hey everyone,

Sorry to get too on topic (regarding the whole dating site thing) but...does anyone know SensuousLibra? She seems like a woman I would really like to get to know but she's only accepting messages from people within a certain age range....and I'm not in that range, unfortunately. She's from here in Missouri so I figured maybe someone here would know her.

I'm a dork....

Thanks, folks. :-D
David

"Split some wood, I am there.
Lift a stone,
you will find me there."

The above is from The Gospel of Thomas. Whether or not you accept it plays a huge role in how you believe in christianity.

If you accept it then, I assume, you believe that god was here before he/it created everything (since he/it is a part of everything and is to be found everywhere).

If you believe otherwise then I don't know what to think.

I have a feeling someone else or a whole gang of folks have already spanked you for this statement but....

Sure, the only human that has the power to make one quit drinking or doing drugs is the addict. However, a lot of addicts feel the need to subject themselves to a higher power. Who cares what you believe or why you believe it? If belief in a god/higher power works for that individual then that's what it takes.

This might be bad for my appearance (on my online profile, that is) but I'm what you'd call a binge drinker. My drinking doesn't affect (or dictate) my work or social life but, when I drink, I really drink. Thought about giving it up many times but it's not happened. Don't want it to happen. I love the many different beers available too much to give it up. So I know how hard it can be to give up something you "love".

Good luck to the OP and anyone else dealing with addiction and congrats to those who have been able to shake the monkey.

Has anyone here ever changed their mind? Either for arbitrary reasons or because they received new information that made them realize their previous belief was wrong?

If the answer is "Yes, I've changed my mind", then the whole "God can't change his mind" argument is invalid. If you've never, ever changed your mind then good for you. You can say "god" is wrong.

THANK YOU! :)

Your statement makes sense if Jesus wasn't sent here to teach by example. Jesus was supposed to have been god in the form of man, subject to all the temptations to which we are exposed. If this dude is here to teach you why something is wrong, which is more effective: Him being completely immune to it or him being susceptible to the temptation yet turning it down? The idea is that Jesus was supposed to have shown people that the things they want most, sex, drugs, and rock n' roll (figure of speech), are wrong. Wanting anything beyond what is absolutely necessary is detrimental to your spiritual health. It takes your mind off of what is most imperative.

Fear of death is a perfect example: In the Garden of Gethsemane, Jesus asked god why he had forsaken his son. Jesus obviously desired to live, even though he knew he was the son of god (if that's what you believe) and that he was heading toward some really sweet rewards. He refused satan in the desert because he knew that giving into mortal desires was "wrong", even though the idea of a bit of water and some bread sounded really good. But he had to show his disciples that it was wrong. If he had been able to refuse any of these things outright he would have been no example to man. How else was he to teach us the power of our own will?

Do you have children? If so, do you tell them something is wrong without explaining why it's wrong? Or do you lead by example?


See above. He had to show us how to overcome temptation.


That's what's called a redundancy. It doesn't invalidate the message he was trying to convey.


Sure, it does....if you don't confuse religion with belief. The way modern christianity is run it's hard to figure out what's right and what's wrong. "Can't see the forest for the trees" springs to mind.


Why? Because of what the bible says? Because of what you think the bible says? Because you think it's more socially acceptable to be an atheist?

Does it really matter if Jesus was really the son of god/part of the trinity? Did he not have a good message?

Yep. Mea culpa. I used a bad explanation. That's nothing new for me. I tend to get a bit frustrated when someone dismisses theories as "only ideas" and usually forget to explain things properly.

From what I have seen, and what I think I meant by "changed", is that most people (scientists) try to stay away from describing something as a law to lay-people because law seems like such an inflexible term...the argument then would be "Well, if this is a law, then why has it been changed so many times to fit the evidence?" Of course theories are "only ideas" but they're ideas backed up by evidence. Of course they're always open to revision. That's the beauty of science and the thing that anti-science religious folks have so much trouble understanding. Just because something isn't absolute doesn't mean it's wrong.

Anyway, I think I'm gonna back off from the science vs. religion stuff from here on out. Too frustrating for me.

Cheers (and thanks for the correction),
David

What? Like the belief in a god?

No, a scientific theory is as close to absolute fact as you can get. There's no way to prove it "right" because science is in the business of proving everything wrong, unlike religion, which is in the business of proving all their hair-brained ideas right (with the argument of "Since I can't figure it out, god musta dun(sic) it.").

Back to theory, the wording was changed to "theory" from "law" because our knowledge is always in flux. Our (well, anyone with an open mind, that is) understanding of things is always changing based on observable, testable events; not crackpot ideas about a big bearded dude in the sky.

Do you think that gravity isn't real because it's "only" a theory? What about germ theory?

Jesus Christ, don't they use text books in schools anymore?

I haven't read the rest of the thread but thought I'd reply to the first (possibly only?) response to my post since it was such a....good?....reply.

Where did you come up with this? This explanation is total BS. JC was trying to explain that NO ONE is without sin, therefore judgement is something that is reserved only for god. Since you have sinned you have no right to judge me for my sins. It's very clear-cut, unlike many other parts of the bible. If you believe otherwise I have serious doubts about your skills of comprehension.


Then why do so many xtians quote the whole "eye for an eye" thing, claim to be against gay marriage, bellow for the annihilation of anything that doesn't follow the "old law"?IF they were following only the teachings of christ, which is what is known as the new testament, they would be preaching a lot more tolerance.


But that was only according to old testament law. What happened to your statement that christians don't follow the old testament? JC was supposed to have been the lamb that saved all from sin and the punishment carried out by man for that sin. Am I wrong?

Wait a minute....after reading your response stating that Jesus was used to lure people away from god's word....are you Jewish? I have no problem with whatever religion you are but if you're Jewish it kind of makes my arguing the finer points of christianity impossible. You don't believe it so you'll never see the logic behind my arguments (same goes for me regarding the Jewish religion).

Thanks bearfan. :)

As to the above quote, I would suggest exercising mindfulness in all aspects of life, not just the few seconds before you tuck into a meal.

I have to admit that I only skimmed the thread but I think those viewing it, the ones who are interested, anyway, would do themselves good by reading "The Way of the Pilgrim". It's a great book on the subject of spirituality by an anonymous Russian author. It mainly teaches the idea of constant communication with "god".

Whether or not JC experienced everything we experience in our lifetimes is not the question; he experienced the temptation that we all experience. He was able to overcome that temptation. That, I think, is the main message of the bible: to recognize those things that are detrimental to your spiritual growth and to deny them. As weak-willed humans we tend to try to find a way to justify our weakness...and,unfortunately, we usually succeed.

I doubt any of that makes sense. It sort of doesn't to me but....

What happened to the saying "He who is without sin, let him cast the first stone."

I wish xtians would follow the New Testament (you know, the real teachings of Christ) instead of the old school Torah stuff more often.

Jesus was supposed to have died for OUR sins. OUR, meaning all of us. He didn't give free reign to the "real" xtians to judge anyone else on the way they are living.

Well, if you're all non-xtians I don't see any reason to let them loose. And I'm not lookin' for a fight. Just didn't want to say the wrong thing and get the whole site after me.

Well, I figured these were the kind of responses I would get. That's good.

Just be forewarned, I have the lions on very flimsy leashes. They're ready to go. :-)

Makes sense to me. :-D

Is this mostly a Christian site? I mean, are most of the members Christians? Hard-core-type Christians?

Really, I'm just curious. It'll keep me out of trouble if I know before I start posting willy-nilly. :-D

Cheers,
David